Does God Really Exist?

[pfrattali]

Do you doubt the existence of a Supreme Intelligent Being?

Think logically:

Are there not laws of conservation of Energy governing the universe? Remember, Energy cannot be created nor destroyed (#1 & #2 laws of thermodynamics). You can only change its state.
Through logic then, we can conclude that Energy had no beginning (cannot be created) and will never end (cannot be destroyed). In other words, ENERGY IS ETERNAL. Do you not think that ENERGY RULES then?


If you believe in the 'BIG BANG' then tell me, how did ENERGY 'appear' out of nowhere?

In fact, Energy can only happen as a result of vacuum or complete nothingness, of which there was no beginning. The vacuum causes Energy to flow. This flow has always been and will always be. No beginning, no end. The nothingness is also still there and will always be. Why? Because PURE ENERGY ITSELF IS INVISIBLE. Energy is what causes perception and conscious awareness. You cannot see Pure Energy itself, but you can observe its effects.
Energy holds the complete blueprint of ALL cause and effect of the entire Universe.


Did you ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, Energy in its purest form is intelligent/conscious? Do you have proof that it's not?
Thus God is PURE INTELLIGENT ENERGY, a PERFECT, UNIVERSALLY CONSCIOUS BEING without flaw.


What causes you to 'think', be 'intelligent', 'perceive reality', etc.? Is it not ENERGY? Do you agree that Energy allows for brain functions which eventually bring about intelligence and self-awareness in us ('I think, therefore I am')? Now ask yourself:

IF ENERGY IS NOT INTELLIGENT, HOW DO YOU SUPPOSE SOMETHING THAT IS NOT INTELLIGENT BRING ABOUT INTELLIGENCE ITSELF?

Does it not make logical sense that if SOMETHING is to bring about intelligence, IT would have to be intelligent also?
To say that something non-intelligent brings forth or creates 'intelligence' by random accident is absurd!

My proof here is common sense.


Now, since God is ETERNAL and we are created in His image, we are ETERNAL also. We are made of ENERGY too, are we not?
So if you decide you want nothing to do with God and His RULE of the Universe, then where will you spend eternity after your soul and spirit leave your mortal body? Is God going to receive you into His Presence? Wait a minute! You just said you didn't want anything to do with God!
I'll let you think about that one.



Energy has it's own set of laws and if we mess with those laws, we'll probably get burned! Energy is a two-edged sword. It can be beneficial to us, but it can also destroy us. It all depends on our attitude towards it.
If we as human beings are to live in peace and harmony with one another and with nature, should we not submit to these laws, the laws of the Creator? Should we not submit to God? Look at our society. Do we not have judges, laws, law enforcement, etc.? If we didn't, wouldn't there be chaos? If someone breaks the law, should they go unpunished? Should they not be charged or go to jail?


To sum it all up:

ENERGY = LIFE, LIGHT, REALITY, CONSCIOUS AWARENESS

ENERGY is ETERNAL

GOD is PURE ENERGY




Look around you, at all of nature.
Do you not see design? For every design there must be a Designer!
Do you not see programming in the complex makeup of DNA? For every program there must be a Programmer!



So why are we here? Why did God create us?
Simple. God wanted a family to enjoy. God is good and wants us to enjoy life with Him and with one another. Do you not suppose God loves you and cares for your well-being?


So why is this world full of problems?
Simple. Because most people have left God and want their own rule. They want to be their 'own god' and don't want the perfect rule of God.
They've taken prayer out of schools. They think they don't need God! But God is the 'Source' and if you separate yourself from the Source, you suffer decay and corruption. So mankind is now 'fumbling' around, so to speak, without God. God is allowing these problems in the world so that mankind can learn through 'experience'. God has already warned through 'words', but mankind will not listen to the 'Word of God'. The more stubborn a man is to listen to and obey God, the more painful the experience will be.

If you're a parent and you try to teach your children not to touch a hot stove, how would you do it? With 'words'. You warn them. If they don't listen to you, then what alternative is there? Your children will learn through 'experience'. They will touch the hot stove and get burned. They will think twice before doing it the next time.


Will these problems on planet earth go on forever?
Of course not. Read the last book of the Bible. It will tell you what will happen in the future. God is coming back to judge mankind and set things straight. This world will be restored by God. Either you submit to His Way or get out of the way!



"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God has shown it unto them. For the invisible things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His ETERNAL POWER and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified Him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man, and to birds, and four-footed beasts, and creeping things."
Romans 1:18-23




1 The fool has said in his heart,
“There is no God.”
They are corrupt,
They have done abominable works,
There is none who does good.

2 The LORD looks down from heaven upon the children of men,
To see if there are any who understand, who seek God.
3 They have all turned aside,
They have together become corrupt;
There is none who does good,
No, not one.
Psalm 14:1-3




"But without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that comes to God must believe that HE IS, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him." Hebrews 11:6

 

[AoDoA]

nothingness cannot create energy and is not a vacuum

you may want to check into the law of entropy:

The second law of thermodynamics is an axiom of thermodynamics concerning heat, entropy, and the direction in which thermodynamic processes can occur. For example, the second law implies that heat does not flow spontaneously from a cold material to a hot material, but it allows heat to flow from a hot material to a cold material. Roughly speaking, the second law says that in an isolated system, concentrated energy disperses over time, and consequently less concentrated energy is available to do useful work. Energy dispersal also means that differences in temperature, pressure, and density even out. Again roughly speaking, thermodynamic entropy is a measure of energy dispersal, and so the second law is closely connected with the concept of entropy.

Second law of thermodynamics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Physical energy is a part of the creation it is not the creator

 

[AoDoA]

The heat death is a possible final thermodynamic state of the universe, in which it has "run down" to a state of no thermodynamic free energy to sustain motion or life. In physical terms, it has reached maximum entropy. The hypothesis of a universal heat death stems from the 1850s ideas of William Thomson, 1st Baron Kelvin who extrapolated the theory of heat views of mechanical energy loss in nature, as embodied in the first two laws of thermodynamics, to universal operation.

The idea of heat death stems from the second law of thermodynamics, which states that entropy tends to increase in an isolated system. If the universe lasts for a sufficient time, it will asymptotically approach a state where all energy is evenly distributed. In other words, in nature there is a tendency to the dissipation (energy loss) of mechanical energy (motion); hence, by extrapolation, there exists the view that the mechanical movement of the universe will run down in time due to the second law. The idea of heat death was first proposed in loose terms beginning in 1851 by William Thomson, 1st Baron Kelvin, who theorized further on the mechanical energy loss views of Sadi Carnot (1824), James Joule (1843), and Rudolf Clausius (1850). Thomson’s views were then elaborated on more definitively over the next decade by Hermann von Helmholtz and William Rankine.

From the Big Bang through the present day and well into the future, matter and dark matter in the universe is concentrated in stars, galaxies, and galaxy clusters. Therefore, the universe is not in thermodynamic equilibrium and objects can do physical work.[11], §VID. The decay time of a roughly galaxy-mass (1011 solar masses) supermassive black hole due to Hawking radiation is on the order of 10100 years,[12], so entropy can be produced until at least that time. After that time, the universe enters the so-called dark era, and is expected to consist chiefly of a dilute gas of photons and leptons.[11], §VIA. With only very diffuse matter remaining, activity in the universe will have tailed off dramatically, with very low energy levels and very large time scales. Speculatively, it is possible that the Universe may enter a second inflationary epoch, or, assuming that the current vacuum state is a false vacuum, the vacuum may decay into a lower-energy state.[11], §VE. It is also possible that entropy production will cease and the universe will achieve heat death.[11], §VID.

Heat death of the universe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[wayseer]

Interesting - every time the matter of the evidence of God arises those engage inevitable fall into the trap of rationalism.

The concept of God is neither rational nor logical. When you begin to accept that reality you will also realize the futility of the exercise.

 

[AlAyeti]

Interesting - every time the matter of the evidence of God arises those engage inevitable fall into the trap of rationalism.

The concept of God is neither rational nor logical. When you begin to accept that reality you will also realize the futility of the exercise.

"Come, let us reason togther," says the Lord.

It is rational and logical to ask questions about God. The quest itself gives strong reasons that God exists.

Otherwise "death" and suffering would be of no concern at all. Literally.

 

[The-Doctor]

Interesting - every time the matter of the evidence of God arises those engage inevitable fall into the trap of rationalism.

The concept of God is neither rational nor logical. When you begin to accept that reality you will also realize the futility of the exercise.

Thats kind of the point of faith.

 

[Dark_Lite]

Did you ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, Energy in its purest form is intelligent/conscious? Do you have proof that it's not?
Thus God is PURE INTELLIGENT ENERGY, a PERFECT, UNIVERSALLY CONSCIOUS BEING without flaw.

Sorry, but that does not work. Just because we don't have proof of something does not mean that whatever you want to conclude is automatically true. This is a particularly interesting chain of logic though, even as far as these kind of things go. "Do you have proof that energy is not conscious? Thus, God is energy."

??? What?

 

[Brilliand]

Ah, this annoying concept of proof... I'm just starting to accept that it's OK to "prove" something without eliminating absolutely every possible way that it could be false. One thing that makes me hesitate in this is that "proof" is quite often meant as something quite absolute, something final that settles the question for all eternity... that's what mathematical proof is, but that kind of precision doesn't apply to reality, ever. Either you aren't talking about reality, or your "proof" is no more than a high likelihood that something is true.

"Prove it to me" is even more annoying... often that just means "convince me" with no regard to actual sound reasoning.

that kind of precision doesn't apply to reality, ever.

I'd better clarify this; "there are absolutely no absolutes" is an old joke, but that's almost what I mean here. Math achieves a mathematical level of precision through axioms - made-up rules that define the fantasy world. We can't do that with reality. So long as we don't make the rules, we can never know the rules with complete certainty. And yet, I'm completely certain of that... it follows, therefore, that I have made the rules as to what it will take to make me certain of something, and I have determined from these arbitrary rules of mine that I will never consider something certain unless it is true because I believe it. Hmm.

And yet, I find in a much less certain way that that is a very sensible way to view the matter... and also that acting certain is frequently a good idea when you merely suppose that you're probably right.

 

[wannabeadesigirl]

We don't necessarily have to define God through scientific logic. In fact, according to established scientific process, anything that cannot be proven through direct physical observation should be considered a theory. This is why I avoid conversations about Evolution and Intelligent Design: You can't concretely prove either created the world.
It's the same with God. I cannot physically prove with any of my five senses that God exists. However, that is what faith is about. Faith can't really be faith with proof.

 

[AoDoA]

Sorry, but that does not work. Just because we don't have proof of something does not mean that whatever you want to conclude is automatically true. This is a particularly interesting chain of logic though, even as far as these kind of things go. "Do you have proof that energy is not conscious? Thus, God is energy."

??? What?

 

[lawtonfogle]

Do you doubt the existence of a Supreme Intelligent Being?

Think logically:

Are there not laws of conservation of Energy governing the universe? Remember, Energy cannot be created nor destroyed (#1 & #2 laws of thermodynamics). You can only change its state.
Through logic then, we can conclude that Energy had no beginning (cannot be created) and will never end (cannot be destroyed). In other words, ENERGY IS ETERNAL. Do you not think that ENERGY RULES then?

Applying macro scale laws in micro scale situations where they have been some evidence they actually break down?

Not to mention we are ignoring the possibility of the multiverse.

In all honesty, the most I have ever seen 'proven' by one of these arguments (which normally have some bad premises, which are incorrect but accepted by the majority of the population) is the existence of something pre-universal. At best, you may have shown that the multiverse exist. But you cannot go any farther than that, because the very laws of physics change, and so does the basis of your argument.

 

[lawtonfogle]

Ah, this annoying concept of proof... I'm just starting to accept that it's OK to "prove" something without eliminating absolutely every possible way that it could be false. One thing that makes me hesitate in this is that "proof" is quite often meant as something quite absolute, something final that settles the question for all eternity... that's what mathematical proof is, but that kind of precision doesn't apply to reality, ever. Either you aren't talking about reality, or your "proof" is no more than a high likelihood that something is true.

"Prove it to me" is even more annoying... often that just means "convince me" with no regard to actual sound reasoning.

Agreed.

Not to mention the problem with what the tortoise said to Aristotle.

1. If a, then b.
2. a

Can we conclude 0. b?

No, because we require 3. If 1 and 2, then 0.

So given 1, 2, and 3, can we conclude 0?
No, because we require 4. If 1, 2, and 3, then 0.

So given 1, 2, 3, and 4, can we conclude 0?
No, because we require 5. If 1, 2, 3, and 4, then 0.


(You see how this gets old fast, no?)

 

[lawtonfogle]

We don't necessarily have to define God through scientific logic. In fact, according to established scientific process, anything that cannot be proven through direct physical observation should be considered a theory. This is why I avoid conversations about Evolution and Intelligent Design: You can't concretely prove either created the world.
It's the same with God. I cannot physically prove with any of my five senses that God exists. However, that is what faith is about. Faith can't really be faith with proof.

Um... what?

Science never gives facts, but theories are the best thing in science. You know, like theory of gravity? Also, science does not rely only on the five senses, but instead on a more general since of testability and repeatability to perform experiments, after which a theory in theorized to explain all possible data. But much like the old theory of gravity that said mass attracts mass, new evidence (gravity attraction of massless objects such as photons) can disprove a theory.

Granted, for something to be testable, we need to find a way to put it into one of the five senses, but that is where technology comes in (such as a thermometer.

 

[Brilliand]

Agreed.

Not to mention the problem with what the tortoise said to Aristotle.

1. If a, then b.
2. a

Can we conclude 0. b?

No, because we require 3. If 1 and 2, then 0.

So given 1, 2, and 3, can we conclude 0?
No, because we require 4. If 1, 2, and 3, then 0.

So given 1, 2, 3, and 4, can we conclude 0?
No, because we require 5. If 1, 2, 3, and 4, then 0.


(You see how this gets old fast, no?)

That problem exists only in language; when you move to the level of thoughts, you can justify both the language and the idea conveyed in the language - although this justification can't be verbalized (by verbalizing it, you would make it into circular reasoning - that is, using language to justify language).

Thoughts do not require justification because, as a point of practical fact, they are a prerequisite to all justification. Language has this attribute in some arenas, but notably not in the arena of introspection (which most philosophers consider the most important). With this consideration, is there any arena in which thought does not have this attribute? Yes, there is: the arena of engineering, in which the justification is in the tangible results.

 

[jellybean99]

Do you doubt the existence of a Supreme Intelligent Being?

Think logically:

Are there not laws of conservation of Energy governing the universe? Remember, Energy cannot be created nor destroyed (#1 & #2 laws of thermodynamics). You can only change its state.
Through logic then, we can conclude that Energy had no beginning (cannot be created) and will never end (cannot be destroyed). In other words, ENERGY IS ETERNAL. Do you not think that ENERGY RULES then?


If you believe in the 'BIG BANG' then tell me, how did ENERGY 'appear' out of nowhere?

In fact, Energy can only happen as a result of vacuum or complete nothingness, of which there was no beginning. The vacuum causes Energy to flow. This flow has always been and will always be. No beginning, no end. The nothingness is also still there and will always be. Why? Because PURE ENERGY ITSELF IS INVISIBLE. Energy is what causes perception and conscious awareness. You cannot see Pure Energy itself, but you can observe its effects.
Energy holds the complete blueprint of ALL cause and effect of the entire Universe.


Did you ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, Energy in its purest form is intelligent/conscious? Do you have proof that it's not?
Thus God is PURE INTELLIGENT ENERGY, a PERFECT, UNIVERSALLY CONSCIOUS BEING without flaw.


What causes you to 'think', be 'intelligent', 'perceive reality', etc.? Is it not ENERGY? Do you agree that Energy allows for brain functions which eventually bring about intelligence and self-awareness in us ('I think, therefore I am')? Now ask yourself:

IF ENERGY IS NOT INTELLIGENT, HOW DO YOU SUPPOSE SOMETHING THAT IS NOT INTELLIGENT BRING ABOUT INTELLIGENCE ITSELF?

Does it not make logical sense that if SOMETHING is to bring about intelligence, IT would have to be intelligent also?
To say that something non-intelligent brings forth or creates 'intelligence' by random accident is absurd!

My proof here is common sense.


Now, since God is ETERNAL and we are created in His image, we are ETERNAL also. We are made of ENERGY too, are we not?
So if you decide you want nothing to do with God and His RULE of the Universe, then where will you spend eternity after your soul and spirit leave your mortal body? Is God going to receive you into His Presence? Wait a minute! You just said you didn't want anything to do with God!
I'll let you think about that one.



Energy has it's own set of laws and if we mess with those laws, we'll probably get burned! Energy is a two-edged sword. It can be beneficial to us, but it can also destroy us. It all depends on our attitude towards it.
If we as human beings are to live in peace and harmony with one another and with nature, should we not submit to these laws, the laws of the Creator? Should we not submit to God? Look at our society. Do we not have judges, laws, law enforcement, etc.? If we didn't, wouldn't there be chaos? If someone breaks the law, should they go unpunished? Should they not be charged or go to jail?


To sum it all up:

ENERGY = LIFE, LIGHT, REALITY, CONSCIOUS AWARENESS

ENERGY is ETERNAL

GOD is PURE ENERGY




Look around you, at all of nature.
Do you not see design? For every design there must be a Designer!
Do you not see programming in the complex makeup of DNA? For every program there must be a Programmer!



So why are we here? Why did God create us?
Simple. God wanted a family to enjoy. God is good and wants us to enjoy life with Him and with one another. Do you not suppose God loves you and cares for your well-being?


So why is this world full of problems?
Simple. Because most people have left God and want their own rule. They want to be their 'own god' and don't want the perfect rule of God.
They've taken prayer out of schools. They think they don't need God! But God is the 'Source' and if you separate yourself from the Source, you suffer decay and corruption. So mankind is now 'fumbling' around, so to speak, without God. God is allowing these problems in the world so that mankind can learn through 'experience'. God has already warned through 'words', but mankind will not listen to the 'Word of God'. The more stubborn a man is to listen to and obey God, the more painful the experience will be.

If you're a parent and you try to teach your children not to touch a hot stove, how would you do it? With 'words'. You warn them. If they don't listen to you, then what alternative is there? Your children will learn through 'experience'. They will touch the hot stove and get burned. They will think twice before doing it the next time.


Will these problems on planet earth go on forever?
Of course not. Read the last book of the Bible. It will tell you what will happen in the future. God is coming back to judge mankind and set things straight. This world will be restored by God. Either you submit to His Way or get out of the way!



"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God has shown it unto them. For the invisible things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His ETERNAL POWER and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified Him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man, and to birds, and four-footed beasts, and creeping things."
Romans 1:18-23




1 The fool has said in his heart,
“There is no God.”
They are corrupt,
They have done abominable works,
There is none who does good.

2 The LORD looks down from heaven upon the children of men,
To see if there are any who understand, who seek God.
3 They have all turned aside,
They have together become corrupt;
There is none who does good,
No, not one.
Psalm 14:1-3




"But without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that comes to God must believe that HE IS, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him." Hebrews 11:6

Are you riding a horse in search of a horse? Trying to get out of debt with a credit card? Tell me if you know.

 

[daydreamergurl15]

Thats kind of the point of faith.

Hebrew 11:1

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not see.​

There are evidences to faith, it is logical and it is reasonable, people just have to expand your mind to understanding it and it begins with reading the bible with an open heart and God will take it from there.

 

[Archivist]

"God is dead."
--Nietzsche

"Nietzsche is dead."
--God

 

[lawtonfogle]

"God is dead."
--Nietzsche

"Nietzsche is dead."
--God

Care to explain what Nietzsche was even talking about when he said that? The majority of people who recognize that quote don't.

Here is a link.
God is dead - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"God is dead" never meant that Nietzsche believed in an actual God who first existed and then died in a literal sense. It may be more appropriate to consider the statement as Nietzsche's way of saying that the "God" of the times (religion and other such spirituality) is no longer a viable source of any received wisdom. Nietzsche recognizes the crisis which the death of God represents for existing moral considerations, because "When one gives up the Christian faith, one pulls the right to Christian morality out from under one's feet. This morality is by no means self-evident... By breaking one main concept out of Christianity, the faith in God, one breaks the whole: nothing necessary remains in one's hands."[1] This is why in "The Madman", a work which primarily addresses atheists, the problem is to retain any system of values in the absence of a divine order.
The death of God is a way of saying that humans are no longer able to believe in any such cosmic order since they themselves no longer recognize it. The death of God will lead, Nietzsche says, not only to the rejection of a belief of cosmic or physical order but also to a rejection of absolute values themselves — to the rejection of belief in an objective and universal moral law, binding upon all individuals. In this manner, the loss of an absolute basis for morality leads to nihilism. This nihilism is what Nietzsche worked to find a solution for by re-evaluating the foundations of human values. This meant, to Nietzsche, looking for foundations that went deeper than Christian values. He would find a basis in the "will to power" that he described as "the essence of reality."
Nietzsche believed that the majority of people did not recognize this death out of the deepest-seated fear or angst. Therefore, when the death did begin to become widely acknowledged, people would despair and nihilism would become rampant. This is partly why Nietzsche saw Christianity as nihilistic. He may have seen himself as a historical figure like Zarathustra, Socrates or Jesus, giving a new philosophical orientation to future generations to overcome the impending nihilism.

 

[jellybean99]

Like moths to a flame (or a bug zapper), people have a need to identify with something or someone greater than themselves.

YouTube - Will Smith: Ich bin Legende?

Nietzsche killed the strawman and Hitler took its place.

 

[Archivist]

Care to explain what Nietzsche was even talking about when he said that? The majority of people who recognize that quote don't.

Yes, I'm fully aware of what Nietzsche was writing about. However, I wasn't quoting Nietzsche, I was quoting the popular t-shirt.