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chilehed

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Anyone ever found anything of value from such folks?
Only a reminder that the Dunning-Kruger effect means me too.

The haven't the slightest idea about
  • what it means to do research
  • how statistics works
  • how to recognize the validity of any experiment
  • how to recognize the validity of any experimental conclusion
  • how to not rip a valid conclusion totally of context and force it into a context that does not apply.
  • what the fancy scientific paper they read even means, much less what its significance is.
I had someone the other day yammering hysterically about how "out of 140,000 test subjects, 1,200 died within a year"; when I pointed out that that's a 0.8% death rate which is identical to the US annual death rate for 2019 he just started yammering about something else that was equally absurd.

This is a disease which has a robust arrogance at its core, and it's incredibly resistant to treatment.
 
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tas8831

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At best, it's very familiar from the paranormal world.

'Yes, yes, I know what the scientific consensus is, but look at this one study from Warsaw with a marginally significant result that has never been replicated. This means something!'
Ha!
 
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tas8831

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The OP Title reminds me of Potholer54's most recent video.
The one about sea level rise? That guy has way too much patience
I love his take-downs of Crowder.
 
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tas8831

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I see it so often on this site, "Vaccines killed 400 people." oh give us the data, "I'm not going to do your work."
Yup. Classic - I do sometimes wonder if they use that out because at some level, they know that their sources are garbage.
 
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tas8831

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Ayup.
 
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tas8831

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Paranoia, too.
Classic.
Curious - did you read the OP?
I detailed but one instance of my 'doing my own research' to check out a claim made by one of the 'do your own research' crowd.
I left out the part where I had asked my relative to show that the things I had presented debunking her claims were in error. Her response was to merely re-assert her original claims.
Because I know that my relative had NO FRIGGIN CLUE about the actual material that I had presented, which means that she did not understand the bit that she had copy-pasted in the first place, and only presented it because it was from a conspiracy nut page that she already "trusted."

'Independent journalists'? Like who - Tim Poole? The guy who, when visiting Sweden to "investigate" the perils of socialism, almost literally said "And you're a socialist, right?" every few sentences when taking to people?
Sheryl Atkisson? The genius that claimed the GUBMINT was deleting her 'research' files from the bottom to the top of each page, one character at a time because she didn't realize that her backspace key was stuck?
The clowns that claim viruses are not even real, that they are actually a symptom of disease caused by unhealthy lifestyles, and not the cause of them? That they are cellular debris, yet cannot how it is that bacteria, which are but a single cell, create "cellular debris" due to their unhealthy lifestyles, since they also have viruses that infect them?

Its funny - when I'm asked to support a claim, I present evidence. When conspiracy nuts/creationists are asked to present evidence, they hem and haw, post youtube videos (that they can neither understand now explain), make assertions and claim they are facts, etc.

Sorry - in the end, it seems like you're just one of them.
 
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loveofourlord

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Yup. Classic - I do sometimes wonder if they use that out because at some level, they know that their sources are garbage.

it's not even, "YOUR WRONG!!!."it's okay I want to see the evidence to be sure it's real their response YOU QUESTIONING ME!!!
 
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loveofourlord

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RIGHT....that's why it's often the guy making unsubstantiated claims to try to show that climate change is false, or that vaccines kill or some other nonsense that if true we would ACTUALLY want evidence, not just baseless claims. When we see this it's usually some person attacking or going after something with no evidence.
 
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tas8831

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Which is why I suspect none of them actually produce any evidence when asked - they don't know what counts as evidence.
 
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tas8831

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Many people here just deny everything which is opposing their views no matter how waterproof your proofs are.
I suspect you are projecting.
Had you considered the possibility that your sources are not what they are claimed to be?
 
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tas8831

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Indeed, and it is a shame on many levels.
 
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AV1611VET

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Which is why I suspect none of them actually produce any evidence when asked - they don't know what counts as evidence.
One of my favorite comebacks to someone claiming they don't have any evidence to support a Biblical event is: "keep looking."

If you can't find any, then:
  1. consider that no evidence was generated
  2. consider that the evidence was removed for legitimate reasons
  3. wait until your technology is sufficiently advanced to detect evidence
  4. make sure you're not misinterpreting or overlooking something that would count as evidence
Don't give up the ship prematurely.
 
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SkyWriting

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First you need to agree with them. Then continue listening and asking for more information and continue to agree - non-specifically. After you have gained their trust as a comrade, then you can slowly alter their perception on non-major points. Major points of reference can take years to turn around and you have to let those happen naturally.

This is all assuming you love them. If you don't love them then they are not the problem.
 
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Ophiolite

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Anyone ever found anything of value from such folks?
Yes. They have allowed me to practice being patient and they have provided justification for my continued use of blood pressure medicaiton.
 
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Opdrey

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If I may, for a moment: when someone claims to do their own research they take on the mantle of a researcher. And, sadly, researchers know that their primary job is to ALWAYS be able and willing to produce their research. They write endless papers about every jot and tittle of their research.

So when someone says "do your own research" when they are questioned they are NOT ACTING LIKE A REAL RESEARCHER. Since a real researcher wouldn't say that.

It is people just wanting to PLAY scientists rather than BE scientists.
 
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