Do you think I'll go to "hell"? (moved from Theology)

[SilentStatus]

I do not believe in any religion. As hard as I have tried to be a christian, I have ultimately discovered that I cannot force myself to ignore the overwhelming doubts. No offense, but I find that basing my life around a book that claims life started with a talking snake is just too far fetched and unrealistic for me.

However, despite my rejection of religion, I do believe in a higher power. I believe there is enough evidence around me on earth to conclude that some type of creator exists. I do not claim to be certain of this, but my gut feeling is that there is some being out there greater than human life. In addition to this, I give an honest effort to show good morals in my life.. and even though I dont believe that God knows me individually, I do pray a few times a week. I do this for the off-chance that god is listening. My prayers consist of asking for forgiveness for any actions that he would not approve of... whatever they might be. I also always offer the highest level of gratitude for allowing me to live even if he does not know or care about my individual well-being. I believe the oppurtunity to live is worth... well this.. I sometimes ask the higher power to honor me with presence in heaven if it does exist. I do not, however, ask the god for favors in my own life because i dont believe god intervenes in human affairs.


So, out of curiosity, would you say that I'm the type to burn in hell for eternity? Oh yes, I forgot to include that I do drink alcohol regularly, I do smoke pot occasionally, and I have a habit of smoking cigarettes. I'm not sure if that would effect your opinion.

Despite the fact that I strongly disagree with your beliefs, I am very curious to discover what people of faith think about my fate. Any thoughts will be appreciated.

 

[lenpettis74]

I do not believe in any religion. As hard as I have tried to be a christian, I have ultimately discovered that I cannot force myself to ignore the overwhelming doubts. No offense, but I find that basing my life around a book that claims life started with a talking snake is just too far fetched and unrealistic for me.

However, despite my rejection of religion, I do believe in a higher power. I believe there is enough evidence around me on earth to conclude that some type of creator exists. I do not claim to be certain of this, but my gut feeling is that there is some being out there greater than human life. In addition to this, I give an honest effort to show good morals in my life.. and even though I dont believe that God knows me individually, I do pray a few times a week. I do this for the off-chance that god is listening. My prayers consist of asking for forgiveness for any actions that he would not approve of... whatever they might be. I also always offer the highest level of gratitude for allowing me to live even if he does not know or care about my individual well-being. I believe the oppurtunity to live is worth... well this.. I sometimes ask the higher power to honor me with presence in heaven if it does exist. I do not, however, ask the god for favors in my own life because i dont believe god intervenes in human affairs.


So, out of curiosity, would you say that I'm the type to burn in hell for eternity? Oh yes, I forgot to include that I do drink alcohol regularly, I do smoke pot occasionally, and I have a habit of smoking cigarettes. I'm not sure if that would effect your opinion.

Despite the fact that I strongly disagree with your beliefs, I am very curious to discover what people of faith think about my fate. Any thoughts will be appreciated.

I appreciate your honesty and have been where you are. As a christian I believe that the only way to heaven is through a belief in Jesus as our savior who paid the price of our sin by death on a cross and resurrection. Belief in a "higher power" will profit you nothing unfortunately. I would encourage you to learn as much as you can about the person of Christ. The reason I say this is because it is the only necessity for salvation, talking snakes, creation vs. evolution, etc, while interesting, will do nothing for our respective salvation. There is overwhelming evidence that Jesus existed as a person and did what the bible claims he did, and only a fringe element of debunked authors still try to claim he never existed. The bible is a very accurate source of information, and I would encourage you to read the book of John, then Romans, then Matthew. For non-biblical accounts of Jesus, read into Josephus or Pliny the younger. There are several others, but those will give you a great start.

As for your 'vices', I too drink occasionally, I smoked pot before I was saved, and gambled, etc. I think none of these things are evil unless you are addicted to them. Addiction is a form of idolatry (anything you put before God) and is a rather serious sin. I would refer you to Romans 14, though many Christians may disagree.

Good luck in your spiritual journey and God bless you.

 

[packermann]

I do not believe in any religion. As hard as I have tried to be a christian, I have ultimately discovered that I cannot force myself to ignore the overwhelming doubts. No offense, but I find that basing my life around a book that claims life started with a talking snake is just too far fetched and unrealistic for me.

Being a Christian is not basing a life around a book, but around a Person, the Lord Jesus Christ. Some Christian take the first three chapters of Genesis literally, and some take it symbolically. Even C.S. Lewis, whom any Christians admire, did not interpret the first three chapters literally. So I would not let a talking snake keep you from being a Christian.

This is the minimum that any Christian must believe from the first three chapters of Genesis:

1. God created everything
2. Mankind is made in the image of God, and therefore apart from other creatures in the world, is able to have a relationship with God
3. God created man and woman to have special intimacy with each other and to populate the earth.
4. There is a positive Evil in the world that has thwarted God’s plan for mankind, that God will ultimately overcome by a descendant of the woman, who we know later to be Jesus Christ.

However, despite my rejection of religion, I do believe in a higher power. I believe there is enough evidence around me on earth to conclude that some type of creator exists. I do not claim to be certain of this, but my gut feeling is that there is some being out there greater than human life. In addition to this, I give an honest effort to show good morals in my life.. and even though I dont believe that God knows me individually, I do pray a few times a week. I do this for the off-chance that god is listening. My prayers consist of asking for forgiveness for any actions that he would not approve of... whatever they might be. I also always offer the highest level of gratitude for allowing me to live even if he does not know or care about my individual well-being. I believe the oppurtunity to live is worth... well this. . I sometimes ask the higher power to honor me with presence in heaven if it does exist. I do not, however, ask the god for favors in my own life because i dont believe god intervenes in human affairs.


So, out of curiosity, would you say that I'm the type to burn in hell for eternity? Oh yes, I forgot to include that I do drink alcohol regularly, I do smoke pot occasionally, and I have a habit of smoking cigarettes. I'm not sure if that would effect your opinion.

Despite the fact that I strongly disagree with your beliefs, I am very curious to discover what people of faith think about my fate. Any thoughts will be appreciated.

I myself am a Catholic, so I would like to give you my Catholic viewpoint.
The Catholic Church teaches that the normative way that God saves a person is through Jesus Christ though His Church. But the Catholic Church also teaches what it calls the “invincibility of ignorance”. If a person sincerely believes that Jesus Christ is not God, or that the Catholic Church is not God’s only, true church, then he can still make it to heaven, by God’s mercy. It is not up for us to judge.

Do not misunderstand me. The Catholic Church is not letting you off the hook! Only God knows how sincere your heart is. God may judge that you deep down knew that Jesus was the way, but you were not willing to give up your own lifestyle in order to serve him and others through him.

God does not call us just to pray to Him. Sure, that is part of having a relationship with Him. But there is more to it than that. It also means loving Him with your whole heart, you whole mind, and your whole soul. Part of loving Him includes obedience. It does not means that must give up drinking or even smoking, as long as it is done in moderation. It probably means giving up pot, since the whole purpose of pot is to mess up your mind, and we must give our whole mind, heart, and soul to God. But obedience means more than that. It means walking in love and humility. It means forgiving those who in your past have hurt you. It means seeking to return a curse with a blessing. It means caring for the sick and the poor. It is praying more for others, even if the others despise you, than to pray for yourself. In other words, it is living the Sermon of the Mount. It is denying yourself and putting God and others before yourself.

This is a totally supernatural way to live! We cannot of our own live this way. Believe me, I tried. This why God has given His Church, with his sacraments. The sacrament are not end in themselves, but are means to and end. The end is to have the power to be holy, to be saintly, to love God and others more than yourself. The greatest sacrament is the Eucharist, where we actually receive Jesus Christ is a mystical but a very real way – so that we have the power of the living Christ living in us.

I am trying to say that Christianity is more than not doing this or that, but a union with Christ, and that from that union to have the power to love Him and others.

 

[KWCrazy]

No offense, but I find that basing my life around a book that claims life started with a talking snake is just too far fetched and unrealistic for me.

You know, for more than five years I've been challenging people to come up with a scientifically valid theory of the origins of life that can't be disproved with a sixth grade science book. So far, nobody has even come close. It depends on what you think is far fatched. To believe in the origination of life in the ABSENCE of a God is absolutely ludicrous in my opinion. Certainly, many of the events depicted in the Bble violate natural law, but they have at their source a God who is above natural law. All other "scientific" explanations require that you believe in something that is disproved by the very science that puts forward the suppositions.

I do believe in a higher power.

So do I. I call Him God.

...even though I dont believe that God knows me individually, I do pray a few times a week. I do this for the off-chance that god is listening.

Obviously, then, you believe in God. You simply have not found Him.

I do not, however, ask the god for favors in my own life because i dont believe god intervenes in human affairs.

If you want to see real power, try to not pray for yourself, but always for somebody else. Spend some time reading God's word and pray that He reveals His truth to you. Seek God, and you will find Him.

Ultimately, God will convict your heart or Christ will remove your sins. The answer does not lie with religion. All religions are flawed because all men are flawed. God, however, is perfect. The answer lies in faith in God, Religion is only the formal method that sinners use to worship God.

 

[hedrick]

Most Christians (Catholics and the more liberal end of Protestants) are unwilling to judge other people. We have explicit statements by Jesus that tell us that. I think you are in a dangerous position. In the end God insists on renewing all people. Those whose relationship with God doesn't allow them to be renewed may be in trouble. I don't think hell is torture imposed by God. I think it's something that is inevitable when people who can't accept his grace meet up with his overwhelming holiness. What should be a great experience becomes destruction.

However I am not going to say that you are definitely damned. I don't know you or your relationship with God. That's between you and him. I don't know exactly how God is going to judge people, or what provision he may have made for people who aren't explicitly Christian but may have somehow accepted him spiritually. I say only that there is a serious danger.

 

[emmauk007]

Is anything more than faith needed in order to gain salvation?

Eph. 2:8, 9, RS: “By grace [“undeserved kindness,” NW] you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God—not because of works, lest any man should boast.” (The entire provision for salvation is an expression of God’s undeserved kindness. There is no way that a descendant of Adam can gain salvation on his own, no matter how noble his works are. Salvation is a gift from God given to those who put faith in the sin-atoning value of the sacrifice of his Son.)

Heb. 5:9, RS: “He [Jesus] became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him.” (Italics added.) (Does this conflict with the statement that Christians are “saved through faith”? Not at all. Obedience simply demonstrates that their faith is genuine.)

Jas. 2:14, 26, RS: “What does it profit, my brethren, if a man says he has faith but has not works? Can his faith save him? For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead.” (A person does not earn salvation by his works. But anyone who has genuine faith will have works to go with it—works of obedience to the commands of God and Christ, works that demonstrate his faith and love. Without such works, his faith is dead.)

Acts 16:30, 31, RS: “‘Men, what must I do to be saved?’ And they [Paul and Silas] said, ‘Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.’” (If that man and his household truly believed, would they not act in harmony with their belief? Certainly.)

Does the Bible indicate whether the dead experience pain?

Eccl. 9:5, 10: “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all . . . All that your hand finds to do, do with your very power, for there is no work nor devising nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol,* the place to which you are going.” (If they are conscious of nothing, they obviously feel no pain.) (*“Sheol,” AS, RS, NE, JB; “the grave,” KJ, Kx; “hell,” Dy; “the world of the dead,” TEV.)

Ps. 146:4: “His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts* do perish.” (*“Thoughts,” KJ, 145:4 in Dy; “schemes,” JB; “plans,” RS, TEV.)

Does the Bible indicate that the soul survives the death of the body?

Ezek. 18:4: “The soul* that is sinning—it itself will die.” (*“Soul,” KJ, Dy, RS, NE, Kx; “the man,” JB; “the person,” TEV.)

“The concept of ‘soul,’ meaning a purely spiritual, immaterial reality, separate from the ‘body,’ . . . does not exist in the Bible.”—La Parole de Dieu (Paris, 1960), Georges Auzou, professor of Sacred Scripture, Rouen Seminary, France, p. 128.

“Although the Hebrew word nefesh [in the Hebrew Scriptures] is frequently translated as ‘soul,’ it would be inaccurate to read into it a Greek meaning. Nefesh . . . is never conceived of as operating separately from the body. In the New Testament the Greek word psyche is often translated as ‘soul’ but again should not be readily understood to have the meaning the word had for the Greek philosophers. It usually means ‘life,’ or ‘vitality,’ or, at times, ‘the self.’”—The Encyclopedia Americana (1977), Vol. 25, p. 236.

What sort of people go to the Bible hell?

Does the Bible say that the wicked go to hell?

Ps. 9:17, KJ: “The wicked shall be turned into hell,* and all the nations that forget God.” (*“Hell,” 9:18 in Dy; “death,” TEV; “the place of death,” Kx; “Sheol,” AS, RS, NE, JB, NW.)

Does the Bible also say that upright people go to hell?

Job 14:13, Dy: “[Job prayed:] Who will grant me this, that thou mayst protect me in hell,* and hide me till thy wrath pass, and appoint me a time when thou wilt remember me?” (God himself said that Job was “a man blameless and upright, fearing God and turning aside from bad.”—Job 1:8.) (*“The grave,” KJ; “the world of the dead,” TEV; “Sheol,” AS, RS, NE, JB, NW.)

Acts 2:25-27, KJ: “David speaketh concerning him [Jesus Christ], . . . Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell,* neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.” (The fact that God did not “leave” Jesus in hell implies that Jesus was in hell, or Hades, at least for a time, does it not?) (*“Hell,” Dy; “death,” NE; “the place of death,” Kx; “the world of the dead,” TEV; “Hades,” AS, RS, JB, NW.)

 

[2ndRateMind]

The idea that God would condemn an individual to eternal torment because they don't subscribe to socially approved metaphysics would be laughable if it were not responsible for so much bloodshed. Go your own way, guard your integrity, and when you need God, be sure that He will answer to the heart that seeks Him.

Best wishes, 2ndRateMind.

 

[stranger]

I guess we all heard the supposed NDN cliche.. 'white man speak with forked tongue of snake' ... it reflects the ongoing lies told to many minorities in the USA ... it is symbolic that snakes talk and lie , and there seems little basis for believing it is any different in the scripture ... Satan is described by countless names in scripture , they cannot all be literal ...

Acts 2:31 ... spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, ...

There is no problem in 'going to hell' as the above scripture proves , Jesus went to hell for three nights stay , he called it a 'sleep' in death ...

The many go by the broad way through destruction in death , only the few by the narrow way, but Jesus says that countless many are saved [Rev 7:9-10] ,not just the few who are first at his return.

Jesus trial was in life , that is where we can and do suffer... as Solomon points out, we know nothing in the 'sleep' of death

Ecclesiastes 9:5 ... the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

The spirit returns to God at death [because it is His , he gave it] , the body returns to dust which is where it came from too... the life ['soul'] is no more because the spirit is what moves us , gives us our soul, our life in the body.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Genesis 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Note: Man was not a soul until the spirit entered the body , the soul is created ,not immortal , it is the spirit that is immortal , the soul is just the life in the body, and that ends in death [or in translation - Hebrews 11:5]

The spirit is God's and so is indestructible , immortal , the body is destructible and mortal ... we most make the mistake of identifying with our body , but God says , and Jesus showed us that the spirit can breathe life into a new body in resurrection , we do not need this body and we most have another life in the flesh after death.

But life after death is not the end of the story, as Jesus says, many are saved after death [and all they were sinners in this life ]

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

[synger]

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Moving this thread from Theology Staff Discussions to Exploring Christianity. Please be aware of the new forum's specific rules (FSGs).

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[solarwave]

I have come to believe that things are not so black and white as to be able to say you will or wont go to hell. I think it is much down to your heart and what your truelly believe and why. I believe non-christians can go to heaven because of ignorance but who still tryed their best to be good and follow whatever higher power they do. But this is not an excuss to simply carry on living the same life when you think christianity might be right. God sees your heart.

And to do with the talking snake I and many other christians dont take it as a literal story. The bible is about Gods relationship with man, not a science book.

 

[aiki]

I do not believe in any religion. As hard as I have tried to be a christian, I have ultimately discovered that I cannot force myself to ignore the overwhelming doubts. No offense, but I find that basing my life around a book that claims life started with a talking snake is just too far fetched and unrealistic for me.

I had doubts, too, but they propelled me toward God, not away from Him. As I searched to find a reasonable, rational basis for my faith I discovered that being a Christian was the most sensible thing I could be.

By the way, the Bible doesn't say that life began with a talking snake. Life began with God; the snake came later. And, no offense, but I find balking at talking snakes but believing in a God you don't know rather like "straining at a gnat, but swallowing a camel."

However, despite my rejection of religion, I do believe in a higher power. I believe there is enough evidence around me on earth to conclude that some type of creator exists. I do not claim to be certain of this, but my gut feeling is that there is some being out there greater than human life.

How is going with your gut more rational that believing in a talking snake? Going with your gut is among the least rational things you can do.

In addition to this, I give an honest effort to show good morals in my life.. and even though I dont believe that God knows me individually, I do pray a few times a week. I do this for the off-chance that god is listening. My prayers consist of asking for forgiveness for any actions that he would not approve of... whatever they might be.

Why do any of these things? Why be moral? Why pray? Why ask for forgiveness? Apparently, you have no idea who God is, or what He is like, or what He may or may not want from you. Essentially, you are doing all these things on the vague feeling that there might be a God. I don't understand why someone who has so many profound doubts about God carries on as you describe. Your behaviour in this regard seems superstitious and irrational.

I sometimes ask the higher power to honor me with presence in heaven if it does exist. I do not, however, ask the god for favors in my own life because i dont believe god intervenes in human affairs.

How do you know whether or not God intervenes in human affairs? You aren't even sure if He exists! The inconsistency in your thinking is pretty flagrant here.

So, out of curiosity, would you say that I'm the type to burn in hell for eternity? Oh yes, I forgot to include that I do drink alcohol regularly, I do smoke pot occasionally, and I have a habit of smoking cigarettes. I'm not sure if that would effect your opinion.

All of us are the "type to burn in hell." Except for Jesus Christ, there has never lived a person who didn't deserve hell. But this isn't just what I say, this is what the Bible says. "There is none righteous, no, not one" and "for all have sinned and come short of God's glory" are biblical declarations that imply that all of mankind deserves eternal punishment in hell. Fortunately, God has made it possible for us to escape getting what we deserve. This way of escape is through Jesus Christ, the "lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world." The "wages of sin is death," the Bible tell us, "but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."

Make no mistake, there is eternal punishment awaiting those who die without faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour. Jesus said, 'And fear not them who kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both body and soul in hell." (Matt. 10:28)

Peace.

 

[christianmomof3]

SS, do you believe in hell?
Are you worried that you might go there?
I am glad that you pray.
It does not bother me that you don't believe in religion.
Ask God to reveal Himself to you.
He will.
I am praying for you.

 

[FutureAndAHope]

Mal 3:14-17 "You have said, 'It is futile to serve God. What did we gain by carrying out his requirements and going about like mourners before the LORD Almighty? But now we call the arrogant blessed. Certainly the evildoers prosper, and even those who challenge God escape.'" Then those who feared the LORD talked with each other, and the LORD listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the LORD and honored his name. "They will be mine," says the LORD Almighty, "in the day when I make up my treasured possession. I will spare them, just as in compassion a man spares his son who serves him.

The one who serves, and obeys the LORD will be saved.

Luk 13:23-28 Someone asked him, "Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?" He said to them, "Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, 'Sir, open the door for us.' "But he will answer, 'I don't know you or where you come from.' "Then you will say, 'We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.' "But he will reply, 'I don't know you or where you come from. Away from me, all you evildoers!' "There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but you yourselves thrown out.

Enter through the narrow door of Christ, else you will be cast out into the place of weeping and gnashing of teath.

Rev 20:14-15 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Mat 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

Mat 5:29 If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.

Luk 12:5 But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him.

2Pe 2:4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment;

Mat 13:40-42 "As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Mat 18:8 If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire.

Mat 25:41 "Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

Heb 10:26-27 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.

Rev 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Luk 16:23-25 And in Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am in anguish in this flame. But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and Lazarus in like manner evil things: but now here he is comforted, and thou art in anguish.