Do you believe that Jesus Christ will return in your lifetime??

[NothingIsImpossible]

Do I believe He will return in my lifetime? Yes. Will He? I don't know. I ignore what conspiracies say, I ignore what pastors say... I ignore everything really. While many have said He is coming back in the past, they didn't go by prophecies.

I go by my own view on what the bible says. In the case of the prophecies before His return, alot of the last ones have been fulfilled in my life. There is very little left now. Granted maybe another 100 years could pass. To Him there is no time. One thing most agree on is 1,000 years to long. 500 years is to long. They tend to agree it could be today or within the next (up to) 300 years. I think if its not in my lifetime then it will be in my kids lifetime (when I have some). Though I'd prefer my lifetime I don't have to die and also so I don't have to watch my wife die (if she dies first).

That aside I can just feel it. Like evil is becoming more and more common in the world. Christianity is becoming less accepted.

 

[Geralt]

blessed is he who do not see (or know) and yet believe.

 

[Stillicidia]

.

 

[Kenny'sID]

No one knows the day or hour so why do people act like they know when he is returning?

No, we don't know the day or the hour, but we do know the season, as we have been given all kinds of information concerning the end times and signs concerning it.

That in mind, I think it's very possible the return could be in my lifetime, or soon thereafter. Things are just about ripe for the pickn'.

 

[Super Kal]

No, Jesus didn't return in the first century. I never said he did. All I said was he SAID he'd return in the first century.

my post was not directed at you.

it was a simple statement made to preterists here who believe He did return in the 1st century. there are too many problems with believing that he returned in 70AD at the fall of Jerusalem... like tribulation we have never seen before, nor will we ever seen again... a man who can literally walk on water and heal the sick... things like that...

 

[Super Kal]

No, we don't know the day or the hour, but we do know the season, as we have been given all kinds of information concerning the end times and signs concerning it.

That in mind, I think it's very possible the return could be in my lifetime, or soon thereafter. Things are just about ripe for the pickn'.

very true... while Jesus did say no oen knows the day or the hour, He never did say no one would know the week, or the month, or the year...

in fact, in 1 Thessalonians 5:4, Paul says "for you, brethren, are not in darkness to be overtaken like a thief..."

 

[stephen583]

Well people have predicting the return of Jesus for years. No one knows the day or hour so why do people act like they know when he is returning?

"No one but God knows the Day, or the Hour" (Matthew 24:36) ? You are citing a verse that should be taken as an affirmation of God's divine knowledge, and trying to use it as a "disclaimer" instead. I would direct you to another verse that addresses God's secrets in particular.

"SURELY THE LORD GOD WILL DO NOTHING, BUT HE REVEALETH HIS SECRET UNTO HIS SERVANTS THE PROPHETS" (AMOS 3:7).

As has been pointed out in numerous posts in this thread already, we have the testimony of Jesus Christ, which is the Spirit of Prophecy, the prophecies of the Apostle fathers, and the prophecies of the Old Testament, which clearly describe the times and the events which surround the Apocalypse. It has also correctly been stated, as Christians we are NOT supposed to ignore, or be ignorant of these warnings, so that time overtakes us "like a thief in the night", and we are found "unworthy to escape" what is coming.

It's also obvious from the number of comments in this thread that council us to "ignore and dismiss" these prophecies, that false doctrine is now pandemic in the Church. We were warned by the Apostle Paul this would also be a sign of the END, (2 Timothy 4:3).

 

[Kenny'sID]

That aside I can just feel it. Like evil is becoming more and more common in the world. Christianity is becoming less accepted.

And that's what I think it all rests on...how bad or lacking in believers the world is. We are only here as a filtration process so God can test us and see who's truly on his side...no other real purpose to this age. Once most of the believers have either died out or converted away from God, there really is no more point to the whole thing.

300yrs? maybe... I think probably less simply because just in the last 60 or so years things have gone down hill by leaps and bounds when it comes to unbelief. This time of great education, another end time sign we are told about, is causing men to lean unto their own understanding, something we were warned not to do, and the "we're too smart now to believe that nonsense" attitude is fast convincing people to take God out of the picture. Then we have the TV/internet to push it all on people. Even some Christians are falling for evolution and eventually there will be nothing left of even God...and no reason for God to continue it.

If things go as they have been, another 50yrs, if not less, could easily wrap things up, or actually, it could happen just about any time now. Not a prophesy scholar, but there can't be a whole lot more to be fulfilled in order to leave things open for the end to happen.

 

[Deadworm]

St. Truth, you are learning at a young age that evangelical apologists give dangerously simplistic answers to bafflingly complex questions. At your age, I saw through these evasive tactics and almost lost my faith because of them, especially when I read that Jesus' erroneous prediction in Matthew 10:23 was a key reason why famed philosopher Bertrand Russell was an atheist. See his book, "Why I Am Not a Christian." What kept me from total renunciation of my faith was an electrifying spiritual experience that I recount in my thread "Speaking in Tongues and Spirit Baptism" in the "Spiritual Gifts" section of this site.

Here is my interpretation of 2 of the problematic sayings of Jesus in question:
(1) "Truly I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom (Matthew 16:28)."

The scholarly consensus is that Mark is a source for both Matthew and Luke. So Matthew 16:28 edits Mark 9:1, which reads:

"Truly I say to you, there some standing here who will not taste death until the kingdom of God has come with power."

Matthew construes "kingdom of God has come with power" to mean "the Son of Man coming in His kingdom." But how did Mark interpret his phrase? Scholars answer this question by pointing to the unusual time reference "6 days later" in 9:2. Mark usually connects sections of his Gospel with the word "immediately." Why would Mark suddenly inform us of the exact length of time between Jesus' prediction and the Transfiguration? The standard scholarly answer is this: for Mark, it took just 6 days for the kingdom to come in power, when Moses and Elijah returned from God's kingdom to converse with Jesus on the Mount of Transfiguration.

If this is Mark's understanding, does it fully capture Jesus' original intent in Mark 9:1? Scholars doubt this because of the phrase "will not taste death until," which seems to point to an event further away than just 6 days. Perhaps, Jesus' understanding about the future was limited by His humanity and His consequent lack of omniscience, so that He wasn't clear about exactly what events His resurrection would usher in. If so, one might interpret Mark 9:1 to mean that in one sense the kingdom of God came in power through the Transfiguration; in another sense, its unique power manifested itself through the outpouring of the Holy Spirit on the Day of Pentecost (Acts 2).

(2) Matthew 10:23 rests in the midst of a Q section that preserves Jesus' missionary instructions to His disciples. Matthew is only interested in the 12, not in the 72 others who supported their mission. Q (from the German "quelle," meaning "source,)" is basically a collection of sayings of Jesus used by Matthew and Luke, but not by Mark or John, and is akin the Coptic Gospel of Thomas, which consists of 114 sayings of Jesus. Q seems to be the sayings collection that circulated west of the Jordan River, whereas the Gospel of Thomas is the sayings collection that circulated east of the Jordan.

We have already discussed how Matthew changes a reference to the coming kingdom into a reference to the coming Son of Man. Matthew seems to have made a similar insertion in 10:23, perhaps under the influence of his M source (Jesus material unique to Matthew). Consider, then, how 10:23 seems to be a reworded interpretation of Luke 10:1:

"Truly I tell you, you will not have gone though all the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes (Matthew 10:23)."
"After this, the Lord appointed 70 others to go on ahead of Him into every town and place, where He Himself was about to come (Luke 10:1)."

In Luke 10:1, Jesus is commissioning an advance party of disciples to promote his message in preparation of a teaching tour by Jesus Himself. not in preparation for Jesus' Second Coming at His Parousia! We must consider the possibility that Matthew misunderstands his Q source to refer to Jesus' Second Coming. But it is also possible that Matthew means something like this: "When they persecute you in one town, flee to the next," because I want you to cover as much ground as possible to give people a heads up that I'm coming to visit them soon. so that a good audience can be gathered throughout Judea and Galilee.

St. Truth, this series of reflections illustrates a discipline called redaction criticism, i. e., a study of the editorial changes Gospels make in their sources and the reasons for those changes.

 

[Stillicidia]

St. Truth, you are learning at a young age that evangelical apologists give dangerously simplistic answers to bafflingly complex questions. At your age, I saw through these evasive tactics and almost lost my faith because of them, especially when I read that Jesus' erroneous prediction in Matthew 10:23 was a key reason why famed philosopher Bertrand Russell was an atheist. See his book, "Why I Am Not a Christian." What kept me from total renunciation of my faith was an electrifying spiritual experience that I recount in my thread "Speaking in Tongues and Spirit Baptism" in the "Spiritual Gifts" section of this site.

Here is my interpretation of 2 of the problematic sayings of Jesus in question:
(1) "Truly I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom (Matthew 16:28)."

The scholarly consensus is that Mark is a source for both Matthew and Luke. So Matthew 16:28 edits Mark 9:1, which reads:

"Truly I say to you, there some standing here who will not taste death until the kingdom of God has come with power."

Matthew construes "kingdom of God has come with power" to mean "the Son of Man coming in His kingdom." But how did Mark interpret his phrase? Scholars answer this question by pointing to the unusual time reference "6 days later" in 9:2. Mark usually connects sections of his Gospel with the word "immediately." Why would Mark suddenly inform us of the exact length of time between Jesus' prediction and the Transfiguration? The standard scholarly answer is this: for Mark, it took just 6 days for the kingdom to come in power, when Moses and Elijah returned from God's kingdom to converse with Jesus on the Mount of Transfiguration.

If this is Mark's understanding, does it fully capture Jesus' original intent in Mark 9:1? Scholars doubt this because of the phrase "will not taste death until," which seems to point to an event further away than just 6 days. Perhaps, Jesus' understanding about the future was limited by His humanity and His consequent lack of omniscience, so that He wasn't clear about exactly what events His resurrection would usher in. If so, one might interpret Mark 9:1 to mean that in one sense the kingdom of God came in power through the Transfiguration; in another sense, its unique power manifested itself through the outpouring of the Holy Spirit on the Day of Pentecost (Acts 2).

(2) Matthew 10:23 rests in the midst of a Q section that preserves Jesus' missionary instructions to His disciples. Matthew is only interested in the 12, not in the 72 others who supported their mission. Q (from the German "quelle," meaning "source,)" is basically a collection of sayings of Jesus used by Matthew and Luke, but not by Mark or John, and is akin the Coptic Gospel of Thomas, which consists of 114 sayings of Jesus. Q seems to be the sayings collection that circulated west of the Jordan River, whereas the Gospel of Thomas is the sayings collection that circulated east of the Jordan.

We have already discussed how Matthew changes a reference to the coming kingdom into a reference to the coming Son of Man. Matthew seems to have made a similar insertion in 10:23, perhaps under the influence of his M source (Jesus material unique to Matthew). Consider, then, how 10:23 seems to be a reworded interpretation of Luke 10:1:

"Truly I tell you, you will not have gone though all the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes (Matthew 10:23)."
"After this, the Lord appointed 70 others to go on ahead of Him into every town and place, where He Himself was about to come (Luke 10:1)."

In Luke 10:1, Jesus is commissioning an advance party of disciples to promote his message in preparation of a teaching tour by Jesus Himself. not in preparation for Jesus' Second Coming at His Parousia! We must consider the possibility that Matthew misunderstands his Q source to refer to Jesus' Second Coming. But it is also possible that Matthew means something like this: "When they persecute you in one town, flee to the next," because I want you to cover as much ground as possible to give people a heads up that I'm coming to visit them soon. so that a good audience can be gathered throughout Judea and Galilee.

St. Truth, This series of reflections illustrates a discipline called redaction criticism, i. e., a study of the editorial changes Gospels make in their sources and the reasons for those changes.

Do you think complexity is the way of God, or simplicity?

Why do you assume a short answer is the wrong one?

 

[mark kennedy]

Well people have predicting the return of Jesus for years. No one knows the day or hour so why do people act like they know when he is returning?

I believe Christ could return any second but we get a seven year tribulation before that day comes. Do I think it will be in our life time? Well, that's a tricky question but I suspect that Israel being back in the land is a major fulfillment of prophecy. I must admit in my early years of study on the subject I dabbled in date setting, I hardly think it's anything we can nail down but I have my musings on the subject. Bear in mind, I am speculating here, but here is one possibility I dare say doesn't qualify as a proof text but I sometimes wonder:

The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away. (Psalm 90:10)
​

Israel became a nation in 1948 so if, and I know it's a big if, it is prophetic and the birth of the nation of political Israel starts some kind of a clock, this might be the case. Seventy years would be 2018, so the return of Christ would be between 2018 and 2028. If you allow for the seven year tribulation then the start of the tribulation would be between 2018 and 2021. I can tell you how you will know if it has commenced:

And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see. And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer. (Rev. 6:1,2)
​

The way I get it this guy they call the Antichrist pops out when the first seal is opened. He starts a bloody rampage, this appears to be his opening campaign.

While I was thinking about the horns, there before me was another horn, a little one, which came up among them; and three of the first horns were uprooted before it. This horn had eyes like the eyes of a human being and a mouth that spoke boastfully. (Dan. 7:8)
​

I don't think you are going to have any trouble identifying this guy, the blasphemy and blood shed is a dead give away.

It opened its mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven. (Rev. 13:6)
​

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[civilwarbuff]

Scholars tell us that scribes in the second century AD modified the verse by eliminating the words that show Jesus's Second Coming and they merely left the words that speak of Jesus sitting on the right hand of God on a cloud of heaven. They removed any mention of the imminent coming of Jesus. If I may repeat the words of one of the scholars: "There was no mention by them [the Second Century scribes] of an imminent appearance of One who, in fact, never came."

Citations please.....

 

[Stillicidia]

.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Why does this always happen on so many threads in CF. I came here hoping to see some good Christian arguments but all I see is mere preaching and absolutely no rebuttals. It's the same on the other threads where Christians debate with atheists. The inevitable conclusion I can draw is we Christians really have no logical foot to stand on. That's sad but my policy is to seek the truth and to accept it whatever its outcome. I would have loved to see my religion winning a logical debate but it looks like I was expecting too much.

It is not our fault if you don't understand scripture. If you don't know what something means, ask.....no one will make fun of you.....

 

[civilwarbuff]

my post was not directed at you.

it was a simple statement made to preterists here who believe He did return in the 1st century. there are too many problems with believing that he returned in 70AD at the fall of Jerusalem... like tribulation we have never seen before, nor will we ever seen again... a man who can literally walk on water and heal the sick... things like that...

Yeah, if this is the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth I wanna talk to the manager cuz I got complaints....

 

[Stillicidia]

.

 

[NothingIsImpossible]

we get a seven year tribulation before that day comes.

Which then turns into the question of what do you believe in terms of His return? Do you believe we are taken up right away? Or later after His return? For those who believe we don't go up right away, it may not happen in their generation since they believe there are many years after His return before we go up still.

 

[mark kennedy]

Which then turns into the question of what do you believe in terms of His return? Do you believe we are taken up right away? Or later after His return? For those who believe we don't go up right away, it may not happen in their generation since they believe there are many years after His return before we go up still.

I tend to favor a post tribulation rapture but the pretrib scenario isn't without merit. I've always loved Dispensationalism and I really have no problem with a pretribulation rapture, in fact, I'm totally in favor of it. However I think there is ample reason to believe that the church will go through the Tribulation. I guess I've never been convinced one way or the other.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[eternalspring7]

Signs of the end times have been unfolding gradually for generations. The way I see it, the build up to the return of Jesus Christ is in full swing. I prefer not to live my life with unrealistic anticipation of the 'event' of Christ's Second Coming.

Since the Bible tells us that it will happen, then it will happen when it will happen. Our duty as Christians is to be prepared (not necessarily to anticipate).

 

[Radrook]

Sincerity does not nullify the negative effects which such self-assured proclamations can have on those who naively take them for indisputable God revealed certainties.
Crucial life opportunities might be neglected, standards of education lowered, and the quality if life reduced drastically.

The very young are especially susceptible since they have the tendency to see an eternity of time ahead of them with no prospect of death in their future. Such ones in old age will tend to constantly berate themselves for lost opportunities.

My son was one who neglected his education based on such expectations and wound up mindlessly flipping greasy burgers at a famous fast food place. Of course quality of life plummeted as I had warned. Such bitter experiences are totally unnecessary if one would simply listen to Jesus when he tells us that concerning the exact day and hour no-one knows.