Do you believe in Hell and why?/why not?

[schpoogie]

I am about to engage in some serious studying.

First subject: Hell.

The conventional idea of Hell is a place of eternal punishment for those who don't accept Jesus.
This is something that I find hard to accept. I'm interested in people's opinions and texts from the Bible...or suggestions on what I should study

 

[PaladinValer]

I am about to engage in some serious studying.

First subject: Hell.

The conventional idea of Hell is a place of eternal punishment for those who don't accept Jesus.
This is something that I find hard to accept. I'm interested in people's opinions and texts from the Bible...or suggestions on what I should study

Well, hell exists, and it is a place, but it is also a state of relationship and it is also a choice.

No one is in hell; the idea that we zip right off to heaven or hell is pop theology that has no basis in orthodoxy. Otherwise, there is absolutely no point to the Second Coming of Christ, the Resurrection, or the Final Judgment. Since no one has yet been Judged, no one is there.

The other issue is what is heaven? Heaven too is a place but it is also a state of relationship. God's Kingdom exists everywhere; even beyond the confines of the finite. That is truly where heaven "proper" is. However, the Church is also the Kingdom of God; a foretaste of what heaven is like.

When Christ comes again and we are resurrected and judged, the finite shall be transfigured and saved. Heaven and Earth shall be as one; a New Heavens and Earth. The physical, we must understand, is not opposed to the spiritual; it is good, real, and not at all lesser (Genesis 1). Indeed, God the Son Incarnated and was made flesh as Jesus and it is Jesus who Ascended and returned, uniting flesh and blood in the most amazing and incomprehendable way to grace and power.

What then of hell? Well, hell is for those who choose not to live love and reject God. They too will be resurrected, but whereas others will live everlastingly enjoying God's Full Presence in a transfigured creation, they who are Judged as unworthy will live as they choose to: an everlasting life of rejection of the Eternal despite it being all around them. That is the most painful thing anyone could possibly think of: to be devoid of love and yet surrounded by Love Eternal. That is far worse than any "hellfire" anyone could conjure up.

That's hell.

 

[Emmy]

Dear schpoogie. There is Heaven and Hell, God`s Kingdom is Heaven, and Satan resides in Hell. Followers of Christ will return to God and Heaven, and those who want to go their own way will end up in Hell. Hell for those who do not want to return to God and Heaven, is a place in Outer Darkness, without God`s Love or Light. Where there can be heard loud wailing,and gnashing of teeth.
I believe it, because God does not force or coerce us in any way. There is no other way, Heaven or Hell, we have the choice. I say this with love, schpoogie. Greetings from Emmy, your sister in Christ. P.S. God is Love, and Satan and his followers, run away from Love: Love is anathema to them.

 

[Jase]

I am about to engage in some serious studying.

First subject: Hell.

The conventional idea of Hell is a place of eternal punishment for those who don't accept Jesus.
This is something that I find hard to accept. I'm interested in people's opinions and texts from the Bible...or suggestions on what I should study

Nope. Doesn't exist in the Old Testament or Judaism, and doesn't make sense in the New Testament.

Hell is an invention of the Catholic Church to gain converts. That's not to say I don't believe in punishment, but it's not the eternal torture chamber sadism proposed by modern day Conservatives.

 

[Arglez]

If the man wants to study, give him somewhere to go in the Bible. Don't just say what you think or believe. Sigh. The internet is so sad sometimes.

Here's some verses that describe hell or the "pit" or whatever. Look at their contexts. Some of them are less important or useful than others. Figure out with Holy Spirit and the opinions of people who come here with Biblically supported arguments what you believe. Bless your studies!

Matthew 25:41; Revelation 9:2; Revelation 9:11; Matthew 8:12; Revelation 14:10; Revelation 14:11; Matthew 25:46; Romans 2:5; Revelation 21:8; 2 Thessalonians 1:9; Mark 3:29

After starting there, it's probably a good idea to read through the gospels and see what Jesus had to say about hell and judgment then go read Revelation. The facts are that we don't really have enough info to make a tidy definitive doctrine about it.

There's just enough mystery to leave room for discussion, which is why you have some people who believe that hell is simply a place of fire where people go for their final punishment before their soul is completely destroyed, some people believe hell is an eternal torment in a physical sense (by fire or some kind of pain), some people believe hell is an eternal torment in an emotional or spiritual sense (by loneliness or emptiness), and some people don't believe there's such a place at all for humans to go (it's just for demons to be punished).

In my opinion, the one thing that you can be certain about "hell" is that universalism (the idea that everyone will go to heaven) doesn't line up with Jesus' teachings. But that's enough of my opinions. Listen to God for yourself through his Word and Holy Spirit's guidance.

I love you and hope your studies are fruitful!

 

[MrPolo]

Hell is an invention of the Catholic Church to gain converts.

In what year was it invented?

 

[Timothew]

I am about to engage in some serious studying.

First subject: Hell.

The conventional idea of Hell is a place of eternal punishment for those who don't accept Jesus.
This is something that I find hard to accept. I'm interested in people's opinions and texts from the Bible...or suggestions on what I should study

I don't accept the conventional idea of Hell which you've descibed.
The wages of sin is death, not everlasting torture. Romans 6:23.

 

[Timothew]

In what year was it invented?

It developed over time. Why don't you reseach this yourself? It is very interesting.

Here's a place to start:
Amazon.com: The History of Hell (9780156001373): Alice K. Turner, Donadio & Olson: Books

 

[Osage Bluestem]

HELL

by R.C. Sproul

We have often heard statements such as “War is hell” or “I went through hell.” These expressions are, of course, not taken literally. Rather, they reflect our tendency to use the word hell as a descriptive term for the most ghastly human experience possible. Yet no human experience in this world is actually comparable to hell. If we try to imagine the worst of all possible suffering in the here and now we have not yet stretched our imaginations to reach the dreadful reality of hell.
Hell is trivialized when it is used as a common curse word. To use the word lightly may be a halfhearted human attempt to take the concept lightly or to treat it in an amusing way. We tend to joke about things most frightening to us in a futile effort to declaw and defang them, reducing their threatening power.
There is no biblical concept more grim or terror-invoking than the idea of hell. It is so unpopular with us that few would give credence to it at all except that it comes to us from the teaching of Christ Himself.
Almost all the biblical teaching about hell comes from the lips of Jesus. It is this doctrine, perhaps more than any other, that strains even the Christian’s loyalty to the teaching of Christ. Modern Christians have pushed the limits of minimizing hell in an effort to sidestep or soften Jesus’ own teaching. The Bible describes hell as a place of outer darkness, a lake of fire, a place of weeping and gnashing of teeth, a place of eternal separation from the blessings of God, a prison, a place of torment where the worm doesn’t turn or die. These graphic images of eternal punishment provoke the question, should we take these descriptions literally or are they merely symbols?
I suspect they are symbols, but I find no relief in that. We must not think of them as being merely symbols. It is probable that the sinner in hell would prefer a literal lake of fire as his eternal abode to the reality of hell represented in the lake of fire image. If these images are indeed symbols, then we must conclude that the reality is worse than the symbol suggests. The function of symbols is to point beyond themselves to a higher or more intense state of actuality than the symbol itself can contain. That Jesus used the most awful symbols imaginable to describe hell is no comfort to those who see them simply as symbols.
A breath of relief is usually heard when someone declares, “Hell is a symbol for separation from God.” To be separated from God for eternity is no great threat to the impenitent person. The ungodly want nothing more than to be separated from God. Their problem in hell will not be separation from God, it will be the presence of God that will torment them. In hell, God will be present in the fullness of His divine wrath. He will be there to exercise His just punishment of the damned. They will know Him as an all-consuming fire.
No matter how we analyze the concept of hell it often sounds to us as a place of cruel and unusual punishment. If, however, we can take any comfort in the concept of hell, we can take it in the full assurance that there will be no cruelty there. It is impossible for God to be cruel. Cruelty involves inflicting a punishment that is more severe or harsh than the crime. Cruelty in this sense is unjust. God is incapable of inflicting an unjust punishment. The Judge of all the earth will surely do what is right. No innocent person will ever suffer at His hand.
Perhaps the most frightening aspect of hell is its eternality. People can endure the greatest agony if they know it will ultimately stop. In hell there is no such hope. The Bible clearly teaches that the punishment is eternal. The same word is used for both eternal life and eternal death. Punishment implies pain. Mere annihilation, which some have lobbied for, involves no pain. Jonathan Edwards, in preaching on Revelation 6:15-16 said, “Wicked men will hereafter earnestly wish to be turned to nothing and forever cease to be that they may escape the wrath of God.” (John H. Gerstner, Jonathan Edwards on Heaven and Hell [Orlando: Ligonier Ministries, 1991], 75.)
Hell, then, is an eternity before the righteous, ever-burning wrath of God, a suffering torment from which there is no escape and no relief. Understanding this is crucial to our drive to appreciate the work of Christ and to preach His gospel.
Summary

1. The suffering of hell is beyond any experience of misery found in this world.
2. Hell is clearly included in the teaching of Jesus.
3. If the biblical descriptions of hell are symbols, then the reality will be worse than the symbols.
4. Hell is the presence of God in His wrath and judgment.
5. There is no cruelty in hell. Hell will be a place of perfect justice.
6. Hell is eternal. There is no escape through either repentance or annihilation.

Biblical passages for reflection: Matthew 8:11-12, Mark 9:42-48, Luke 16:19-31, Jude 1:3-13, Revelation 20:11-15.



Link: R.C. Sproul on Hell

 

[B-74]

When i think of Hell...

Jude 1:22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
Jude 1:23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

Mt 13:41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
Mt 13:42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth

Mt 13:40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world

Joh 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned

 

[MrPolo]

It developed over time. Why don't you reseach this yourself?

Surely you can articulate the answer without selling me a book. Give me a point of origin. When did the Catholic Church invent hell?

 

[B-74]

Maybe we don't know exactly what hell is, but we all can agree that no one wants to go there, or see others go there..

 

[ViaCrucis]

I am about to engage in some serious studying.

First subject: Hell.

The conventional idea of Hell is a place of eternal punishment for those who don't accept Jesus.
This is something that I find hard to accept. I'm interested in people's opinions and texts from the Bible...or suggestions on what I should study

Yes, I believe in Hell. However, I don't think we can say much about it dogmatically. I lean closer to the ancient view that Hell is less location and more condition. St. Isaac, for example, speaks of Hell as the torment of love, to be in the immediate presence of God who loves all unconditionally, one may either experience such love as an overwhelming joy or as an overwhelming misery. For one who has committed sin after sin against one who is all-loving and always benevolent, to be in the presence of such love is torture. Consider when you betray a dear friend, and are then invited to his or her house, invited to their table and to share in their generosity--the guilt, the torment, the remorse of having betrayed them is visceral. Such is Hell according to St. Isaac and many of the Eastern and ancient Fathers. Utter remorse in the presence of One who is perfect and unflinching love, compassion and kindness.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ALoveDivine]

I would say i'm agnostic on the issue of Hell. However, I lean more toward the annihiliationist position, for scriptural reasons.

He will not always accuse, nor will he harbor his anger forever; - Psalm 103:9

For his anger lasts only a moment... - Psalm 30:5

Such statements seem to confirm that though God gets rightfully angry and executes wrath, this aspect of him is temporary. This seems to me to conflict with the idea of never-ending angry execution of wrath.

Also, the destiny of sinners is desribed throughout the bible in terms of destruction or perishing, which clearly connote annihilation.

But the wicked will perish: The LORD's enemies will be like the beauty of the fields, they will vanish--vanish like smoke. - Psalm 37:20

But all sinners will be destroyed; the future of the wicked will be cut off. - Psalm 37:38

When the storm has swept by, the wicked are gone,
but the righteous stand firm forever. - Proverbs 10:25


The Proverbs passage in particular establishes an essential contrast. The wicked will be gone, or no more, while the righteous will stand forever.


I think Gods anger and wrath are awesome and terrifying, and that it will be a nightmare being a sinner in the hands of an angry God. But ultimately, the wrath of God will last but a moment, though his love will endure forever.


Though Jesus clearly uses the term eternal to refer to the destiny of both the wicked and the righteous, this can easily be understood as referring to consequence, not duration. Our redemption is eternal not only in that we will live forever with Christ (this duration only applying to the redeemed), but also in the sense that once we have been redemeed we are not lost, ie it is never reversed. In the same way the "eternal punishment" or "eternal destruction" of the wicked is eternal in the sense that it is not taken back and can never be reversed; it is final. This DOES NOT plainly mean that punishment is eternal in duration, especially when cross-referenced with the scriptures I posted above, which clearly describe the destiny of sinners as destruction.



Further the bible makes the case that God alone is immortal.


God, the blessed and only Ruler, the King of kings and Lord of lords, 16 who alone is immortal - 1 timothy 6:15-6:16



God alone is immortal, we do not have immortal souls. I see no compelling biblical evidence to believe that every soul is inherently immortal. God sustains all life, likely including the continued existence of your very soul. The only way for a human soul to attain immortality is by receiving eternal life through the grace of God in Jesus Christ. The souls of the wicked are described by Jesus himself as being destroyed.

Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. - Matt. 10:28

To conclude it seems to me that the scriptures plainly teach eternal life for the redeemed and irreversible destruction, preceeded by punishment according to degree and magnitude of sins, for the lost. However I am not at all dogmatic in this view, I could very certainly be wrong. Yet like all peripheral points of theology I don't think its essential that we swing one way or the other on this issue.

 

[omanid]

The Bible says God chose those to be saved before the world was made (written in the Book of Life)

 

[granpa]

anyone with fear of heights can tell you that the lake of fire is a real phenomenon.

 

[Timothew]

Surely you can articulate the answer without selling me a book. Give me a point of origin. When did the Catholic Church invent hell?

Surely you can check a book out of the library all by yourself.

Here's another hint. There were a lot of fanciful ideas about the underworld in the middle ages, they built on one another and became more and more outlandish. Dante put some of these into Inferno. The current idea of hell is from Dante, not the Bible.

According to the Bible, the wages of sin is death not eternal torment.

 

[Whisper of Hope]

Surely you can articulate the answer without selling me a book. Give me a point of origin. When did the Catholic Church invent hell?

I'm interested in knowing that as well. Can such a claim be backed up with actual facts and not just personal opinion?

 

[Cain Spencer]

I have never believed that people who enter hell actually suffer. I think it's just lack of Gods presence.

 

[B-74]

I have never believed that people who enter hell actually suffer. I think it's just lack of Gods presence.

I believe hell may possibly be separation from God. All good comes from God, even to those who don't love Him, so hell would be the loss of everything good. That is the worst suffering imaginable. Have you ever felt like God was no where to be found and there was no hope, just emotional pain and suffering, loneliness, despair, deep depression? I have but God delivered me from it. But what if there wasn't a God to save me?

That is just a taste of hell. No thanks, i don't want to see the real thing.