Do you agree that christians should keep the 10 Commandments?

[Elder 111]

Please note the question being asked here. This is salvation by works and not redemption. This is self trust, not faith in God. We know that none have ever been able to keep the commandments according to Scripture. Check Ps 14:3, 53:3 since Paul hadn't come along to write Romans 3:10, 12, 23.

1. What are you saying here? That Jesus had to wait on Paul?
2. That Paul is greater than Jesus?
3. That Jesus, who is God, fail to do the right thing, or somehow was unable?To keep the ten commandments is to rely on self?

Paul made it clear that he was in the same position as you referred to in Ps. 53. He did not however blame the law, and far from it up held the 10 commandments as Jesus did. Rom 7
14For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

 

[Elder 111]

Love also allows us to forgive those who have faltered. Do I falter. yup I do. Do I go to my Father with my short comings. You bet I do. This is why I would rather have a loving relationship with my Father than a law between an untouchable judge. His love for me is complete and it is not if I do the law but because I am now born of His Spirit and He is my Father.

How come you going to your Father when you falter? How can that be? Falter how? By sinning? But that is a breaking of the law! If you do not regard the 10, if there is no ten how can it be broken?
Law and love can not co-exist? There was no love in the OT. No law in the NT. Did or do your parent love you? were there no "laws" of their own?

 

[Elder 111]

We are commanded to love God and Love our neighbors. This is the whole law summed up.

Absolutely! A summary not a replacement. Therefore that which it is a summary of is still in place. God's ten commandments including the Sabbath.

 

[Elder 111]

Do you mean the claim that all who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law."? That wasn’t me who said that, it was Paul. Galatians 3:10.

Everyone stumbles. That’s the point. The difference is that those of us who believe the Law was already fulfilled by Christ and therefore abolished (and I don’t think I need to share the verses which say this yet again) know that we stumble, this is why we’re not going to claim that we (let alone anyone else) are living in obedience to the Law. We are not so bold as to say that we are so sinless that we can obey the Law the only way it can be obeyed: Perfectly.

Just to state that the law is required for us, is claiming that we can obey the law perfectly? Why do you conclude that? Paul did not in Rom.7. You know you stumble? Why? Because you break the law? How should I know I covet except the law say Thou shall not covet: Paul.

 

[Elder 111]

I think the question is would one be following the law if they remembered/kept the sabbath?

Why would doing that which God requires not be an act of love?

 

[Elder 111]

No! Dogs nor sorcery aren't listed in the 10Cs. What does Gal 5:19-21 say? It lists adultery/fornication, murderers, idolatry, witchcraft and I think that heresies would be those that love and maketh a lie. And more that are works of the flesh also known as sin. I didn't find dogs though. So what are dogs?

Now Whose commandments are being talked about in verse 14? I reference John 15:10 to base the question. Then I would like to know what those commandments are. I base that request on I John 3:23.

The 10 Commandments. Even the ten commandments that are in the mercy seat in Heaven.Heb 9

 

[Lionroot]

I think the question is would one be following the law if they remembered/kept the sabbath?

Okay, lets just say "hypothetically " that remembering the Sabbath is an everlasting commandment. Would doing so show love to God or others?

 

[Elder 111]

Chaela and from Scrath seem to imply that the 10 commandments are abolished or removed because,

1. It is impossible to keep them.
2. Because they can not be kept, we are always guilty of breaking all of them.
3. The 10 does not and can not provide salvation.

Reply. Rom. 3
21But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
23For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Is was always known that it was impossible to keep the law. From Scrath pointed out from Ps. 53 and Paul made that clear in 23 above but the law still was. Son to use that as a reason for removal is flawed. Sinners we are breaking the law we will. just like Paul in Rom.7.
The fact that salvation is not in keeping the law is not new in verse 21 above Paul says that it is witnessed by the law and the prophets. Jesus is the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Why? Because all even from Adam are saved by Christ. The law exist then, salvation was the same then. why do we now have to remove the law? Jesus and Paul did not removed it. We are misapplying what they have said to make that point and when it is thought out it just can not make sense. No explanation given make sense. How can we by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit keep the 10 commandments,(not lying, stealing or adultery. God as our only God and all others) and advocated that the are not for Christians. How does that make sense? Faith or love can not solve this dilemma.
What I have found too is that those scriptures that support the law are ignored or some ridiculous explanation given that has nothing to with the text. Salvation is the same for all men, for all time, so is the 10 commandments, it is the standard of God's judgment. Those who did not asked for forgiveness for breaking the law would be condemned. Asking for forgiveness daily is the key not removing the law.

 

[Elder 111]

2 Thess. 2
1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

One of us fall into this category. Is it not that those who do not steal lie and commit adultery would not be of this category? That is reject the truth. If that is so then those who live in faith and the power of the Holy Spirit enabling them to keep the 10 commandments of God must also be the true children of God and those that live by the truth.

Would it be beneficial to God or satan for the 10 commandments to be removed? The first commandment would help. 3Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Who would dare cast their vote on God's side?

 

[cyberlizard]

it is amazing really, no one has any issues regarding the ongoing validity of 1,2,3,5,6,7,8,9,10 but almost every christian these days has a problem with #4.

i would like to know why that is, not from a theological PoV from people's personal viewpoints.

If most people on here are anything like me, they ignore the Sabbath as that is what everyone in their congregation does, and those before them. Most people never actually think about it for themselves. Why is this?


Steve

 

[MamaZ]

How come you going to your Father when you falter? How can that be? Falter how? By sinning? But that is a breaking of the law! If you do not regard the 10, if there is no ten how can it be broken?
Law and love can not co-exist? There was no love in the OT. No law in the NT. Did or do your parent love you? were there no "laws" of their own?

Anything done without faith is sin. To know to do good and not do good is sin. I am a parent. I understand what you are trying to say . Even if my children do not commit adultry or steal or kill does not make them righteous. Only one way to righteousness and that is Christ. A person can go through out life not stealing. Does that make them saved?

 

[from scratch]

How come you going to your Father when you falter? How can that be? Falter how? By sinning? But that is a breaking of the law! If you do not regard the 10, if there is no ten how can it be broken?
Law and love can not co-exist? There was no love in the OT. No law in the NT. Did or do your parent love you? were there no "laws" of their own?

Why is Romans 5:13 and Gal 3:19 ignored? Sin was berode the law according to both. That means that the law isn't required to sin. Transgression and sin are the same thing.

Gal 3:19 also shows the law is finished as does Luke 16:16.

 

[from scratch]

1. What are you saying here? That Jesus had to wait on Paul?
2. That Paul is greater than Jesus?
3. That Jesus, who is God, fail to do the right thing, or somehow was unable?To keep the ten commandments is to rely on self?

I find it interesting that the questions before me concern only Paul. I certainly understand that Paul is a severe problem for some. If my wording is checked I mentioned Paul as additional and not primary support for my statement.

When the commandments are kept to prove something such as being the referred to in Rev 22:14 it is bragging and gloating as in having a trump card. The 10 Cs won't secure eternal life for anyone. The rich young ruler found this out personally with a conversation with God in the flesh in real time before a crowd. And yes keeping the 10 Cs as proof of love to God is being self reliant and not trust in God. But it is said that we trust God to help us keep the 10 Cs. I ask who has done that? These days everyone that I know does business on the sabbath wilfully and with intent. It is now not called sin because we wish to do so and must justify ourselves. If it was sin then it is sin now.

I find it interesting that my post that was quoted didn't include this comment which was the next 2 sentences in tha paragraph - Jesus gave the foolish man the correct answer he ask for. The answer was to do the impossible.

The focus and intent of my post was to show that keeping the 10 Cs aren't the key to eternal life. In my post this was taken from I highlighted a part of the verse that was quoted showing self effort as the motive for keeping the 10 Cs. Scripture clearly shows this is impossible even without citing Paul. I gave Ps 14:3, 53:3 as my basis for such a claim and was only addressed about throwing in Paul for good measure. Why? Paul says essentially the same thing as Ps 14:3 and 53:3.

 

[from scratch]

Absolutely! A summary not a replacement. Therefore that which it is a summary of is still in place. God's ten commandments including the Sabbath.

So does a summary always include everything? Seeing Jesus never said to keep the sabbath, I don't understand how or why that would in included in such a summary.

 

[from scratch]

Just to state that the law is required for us, is claiming that we can obey the law perfectly? Why do you conclude that? Paul did not in Rom.7. You know you stumble? Why? Because you break the law? How should I know I covet except the law say Thou shall not covet: Paul.

If one commits adultery are they faithful to their spouce?

 

[from scratch]

The 10 Commandments. Even the ten commandments that are in the mercy seat in Heaven.Heb 9

I must be getting old and feeble. I couldn't find a reference to the mercy seat in heaven in Hebrews 9. I don't find tha Ark of the Covenant there either.

 

[from scratch]

Okay, lets just say "hypothetically " that remembering the Sabbath is an everlasting commandment. Would doing so show love to God or others?

Hypothetically, but not in reality.

 

[Rajni]

[FONT=&quot]Chaela and from Scrath seem to imply that the 10 commandments are abolished or removed because,[/FONT]

1. [FONT=&quot]It is impossible to keep them.[/FONT]
2. [FONT=&quot]Because they can not be kept, we are always guilty of breaking all of them.[/FONT]
3. [FONT=&quot]The 10 does not and can not provide salvation.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I’m saying they’re fulfilled and then abolished because Jesus and Paul respectively state that ([/FONT][FONT=&quot]Ephesians 2:15 and Colossians 2:14[/FONT][FONT=&quot])[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Reply. Rom. 3
21But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
23For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Amen!!!! You got it!! [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Is was always known that it was impossible to keep the law.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Then perhaps the original post in this thread might have been better phrased as “Do you agree that Christians are unable to keep the 10 Commandments?” rather than “Do you agree that christians should keep the 10 Commandments?” The “should” is very misleading as it presumes that we are able to do so by God's standards (perfection).[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The fact that salvation is not in keeping the law is not new in verse 21 above Paul says that it is witnessed by the law and the prophets. Jesus is the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Why? Because all even from Adam are saved by Christ. The law exist then, salvation was the same then. why do we now have to remove the law?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]We don’t have to remove the law, especially since there is no longer anything to remove (Jesus took care of it all), but we don’t have to focus on whether or not Christians “should” be keeping it, a question which automatically suggests a certain expectation that they are required to and are even able to do so. It’s a non-question, I guess is what I’m saying.[/FONT]
.

 

[Rajni]

[FONT=&quot]Just to state that the law is required for us, is claiming that we can obey the law perfectly? Why do you conclude that?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Just to state that the law is required for us is to blatantly disregard (numerous times, now) [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Ephesians 2:15 and Colossians 2:14.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Paul did not in Rom.7. You know you stumble? Why? Because you break the law? How should I know I covet except the law say Thou shall not covet: Paul.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The law is very helpful in providing us with information as to what God would like us to do. At least, this is what I thought before coming across Jeremiah 8:8.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]But to rely on it for one’s righteousness or salvation is the problem. Not only that, but those who claim to obey the law tend to boast in that, when Ephesians 2:8-9 specifically states that we have nothing in which to boast.[/FONT]

 

[Rick Otto]

The 10 commandments are in my bible.
I keep them there.
Actually, I'm busier trying to keep the greatest two.