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Do we need to be baptized in order to be saved ?

The Liturgist

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Clearly what is found in the compilation of the inspired word of God is sufficient as it reveals all will be judged by it. (John 12:48)

The problem with your Nuda Scriptura concept, which is based on the idea of the sole sufficiency of Scripture, which is a different concept from the Sola Scriptura advocated by Luther, Cranmer, Calvin, Wesley, et al, is that in completely rejecting tradition, aside from disregarding the plain meaning of 1 Corinthians 11:2 and 2 Thessalonians 2:15 and Galatians 1:8-9, you also have no basis for saying what is and is not the inspired word of God, since that determination with regards to the New Testament was ultimately made by a fourth century bishop of Alexandria, a very pious and holy man who followed in the Apostolic tradition St. Paul was referring to, and even the identity of the four canonical Gospels was not established on an ecumenical basis for all orthodox Christians until the writings of St. Irenaeus slowly propagated through the persecuted Christian communities of the Roman Empire in the late second and early third century, so as late as the year 200 the Syriac Aramaic-speaking churches, which accounted for the majority of the geographic area of the church and most Christians of Jewish descent, were using an inadequate harmony of the four Gospels called the Diatessaron, compiled by a man named Tatian who later converted to Gnosticism and founded his own heretical sect (in the third century, the four Gospels were finally translated into Syriac, and then in the fourth century, the twenty two books that were the least controversial were translated, as mentioned before, but these lacked 2 John, 3 John, Jude, 2 Peter and Revelation. So it was only over the course of the late fourth and fifth centuries that the entire church embraced the canon proposed by St. Athanasius, which was subsequently adopted by the churches in Rome, Constantinople, Jerusalem and Antioch, and it took until the sixth century for this to be translated into Aramaic and other languages the church was serving.

Indeed, there was no Latin language translation of any of the Bible until the mid second century, and no definitive Coptic translation of the Bible and the liturgy until St. Cyril of Alexandria completed that project in the fifth century, in addition to preventing Nestorius and Pelagius from getting their novel and erroneous theology made official church doctrine, just as St. Athanasius of Alexandria had been instrumental in stopping Arius and Macedonius, who denied the Incarnation and Trinity, and the personhood of the Holy Spirit, respectively.

Which takes us to the most important point: from Galatians 1:8-9 it becomes clear that the Gospel was initially delivered orally until the canonical books were complete, and it continued to be preached to people for whom those books had not been translated, and this preaching included a specific canonical interpretation, a belief in doctrines such as Jesus Christ being God incarnate (from John 1:1-14) and part of the Holy Trinity, and having in His incarnation put on our humanity without change, confusion, separation or division (so ideas like that of Apollinarius, a fourth century heretic who taught that Christ had a human body but a divine mind and soul), or the Adoptionist idea that Jesus was a particularly righteous man who was made the Son of God by adoption at his baptism, were rejected, and these false Gospels, which St. Paul taught us to anathematize, were contrasted with the true Gospel, which informed the bishops of the early church and ultimately allowed St. Athanasius to define a canon the other bishops of the early church found acceptable, which is still used to this day by all Christian churches (and the validity of which was questioned only once, by Martin Luther, who effectively re-enacted in his writings and thought process the debates in the fourth century about some of the disputed books, and who considered omitting Jude and Revelation, which were absent from the Peshitta, along with James and Hebrews, the former never having been controversial in antiquity, but Hebrews was disputed because the authorship of it was not known with certainty - most attributed it to St. Paul, but it is written in a noticeably more elegant style and the author does not identify themselves, so indeed, even the belief that St. Paul wrote the Epistle to the Hebrews is a tradition).

Ultimately Martin Luther decided to keep these books, and did not consider adding any new books which had previously been omitted (although to be fair, by the sixteenth century those books were exceedingly obscure, and most would be recovered either from long-forgotten manuscripts in Greek, Egyptian and Syrian monasteries or through archaeological expeditions in the 19th and 20th century. However, the incident underscored how the collection of the books themselves, and what they mean, is a tradition, since other religions also accept the Bible as scripture but interpret it in radically different ways. For example, the New Church (Swedenborigans), Christian Science, the Jehovah’s Witnesses (who have lately published their own “translation” which is deliberately mutilated in order to support their neo-Arian heresy and other strange beliefs, such as their belief that our Lord was not crucified but hung from a “torture stake”), and the Mormons, Unitarians, and several other groups. Many of them have added allegedly inspired books such as Mary Baker Eddy’s “Science and Health: With Key to the Scripture” or the Book of Mormon, or modified Scripture in the case of the JWs or the Palmarians, but still others, such as the Unitarians, or the Shakers, or the Molokans and certain other apocalyptic sects from the Russian Empire like the Mutilators and Immolators and Hole-Worshippers did not change any texts at all, but rather managed to arrive at a spectacularly flawed theology from the same canonical scripture that we rely on.

Which returns us to tradition: it is tradition that gives us the Table of Contents for the New Testament that all Christians agree on (the contents of the Old Testament are disputed, with Anglicans, Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox and most Oriental Orthodox including some deuterocanonical books, and the Ethiopians, additional books, that are firmly rejected based on a comparison with the Masoretic text by some predominantly Reformed and Baptist Protestant churches, while others, such as the Lutherans, have an open canon and regard the use of these books or their disuse as a matter of adiaphora), and it is Tradition that provides us with a common interpretation of these books that all authentically Christian churches share, even if they disagree over some of the contents of the Old Testament, this interpretation being expressed in the Nicene Creed and in other statements of faith such as the Apostles Creed, the Athanasian Creed, the Lutheran Book of Concord, the various Calvinist Confessions (such as the Belgic, Heidelberg, Westminster and Dordt confessions), and also various ancient hymns that are of a creedal nature and which continue to be sung by all traditional churches, such as Te Deum Laudamus, Ho Monogenes and Haw Nurone (they have of course been translated into English and are sung in such, but are normally referred to by their Latin, Greek and Syriac names).
 
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The Liturgist

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Man's teachings and doctrines and practices every day contradict God and Jesus and the Bible.

Jesus Christ is God, together with His unoriginate Father and the Holy Spirit, one God in three persons, the Holy and Undivided Trinity.

And while it is true that the traditions of some heterodox groups like the Mormons absolutely contradict sacred Scripture, it is also the case that the traditions of Christian churches, such as the contents of the New Testament, allow for it to be preached, since much doctrine has always been a matter of tradition.

And this shared tradition, which expressed, for example, in the CF.com Statement of Faith, is what allows Lutherans, Evangelicals, Eastern Orthodox, Baptists, Mennonites, Congregationalists, Methodists, Presbyterians, Roman Catholics, Assyrians, Moravians, non-Denominational churches, Pentecostals and others to recognize each other as Christians and to engage in fellowship based on the knowledge that we worship the same God and were saved through his infinite love and the passion of the only begotten Son and Word of God, Jesus Christ, who put on our humanity and triumphed over death on the Cross with His glorious Resurrection, which is the central and defining moment of faith for Christians, a believe that Christ, having been crucified, rose from the dead, which is prophesied in the Old Testament, even in Genesis 1, and very clearly, for example, in the Psalm “Arise, O God, and let Thy enemies be scattered”, and indeed every aspect of the life and ministry of our Lord was foretold in Isaiah.
 
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Ain't Zwinglian

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In other words, you make your own commands and traditions.
That's exactly what the scripture is saying, which I am pointing out.
Thanks for clarifying.
Age of Accountability is a made made tradition. (Mark 7:13)
Children being :safe rather than saved" before the Age of Accountability is a man made tradition.....(Mark 7:13)
I am just clarifying this for you while being faithful to the Scriptures.
 
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The Liturgist

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We baptize infants because of the promises attached to baptism. No promises....no baptism..... is just water.
Baptists don't believe baptism has ANY PROMISES attached to it, and therefore you get the quotation above...baptism is just water.

We baptize infants as a remedy for original sin. They are born in a condition of sin.
Baptists don't believe children are born sinful....or in a condition of sin....they are considered "safe but not saved" until the age of accountability.....which of course is a man made doctrine (Mark 7:13). A sort of modified universalism.....more man made doctrine (Mark 7:13).

Indeed, and yet we who adhere to what the church always taught until the 16th century are accused of propagating traditions of men.

I don’t have a problem with most Baptists, I should add, because most Baptists don’t aggressively attack my faith. Indeed, I greatly respect Dr. Albert Mohler as a leading moral theologian, even though I disagree with him on sacramental theology. And Dr. Albert Mohler is a distinguished leader in the SBC, a denomination, which, like the LCMS, managed to escape the liberalism that took over other mainstream Protestant churches and which had begun to take over both the SBC and LCMS, and which would take over the ALC, LCA and in the case of Baptists, the Northern Baptist Convention, which became the “American Baptist Convention”, to the point where in terms of doctrine and praxis, they most closely resemble the United Church of Christ and the PCUSA, and the ELCA that resulted from the ALC-LCA merger and the Episcopal Church, UMC and the Moravians have strong connections.

At any rate, given that Dr. Mohler has dedicated his career to keeping the SBC on the straight and narrow path, he does not attack other Christians or engage in hostile negative proselytism. Thus I respect him, and Baptists like him, and indeed I have several Baptist friends on CF.com. Indeed I am descended from one of the early Baptist non-conformist settlers in British North America.
 
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Aaron112

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Indeed, and yet we who adhere to what the church always taught until the 16th century are accused of propagating traditions of men.
Isn't that the basic definition of 'traditions of men'. ? Accused or agreed, those who follow the traditions of men over God's Way are not in a very good position with God, no, not at all.
 
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Ain't Zwinglian

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All Christian water baptisms in the NT are administered through immersion. Burials do not involve sprinkling. As Paul explained:
Ain't buyin' what your sellin'! Acts 9:18, Acts 22:16, Luke 11:38, and Mark 7:4 CLEARLY demonstrate not all baptisms administered in the NT are immersion. Strong confirmation bias here.

As for sprinkling and burial baptism.... Romans 6 has nothing to do with the administration of baptism.

Critical to how Credobaptists justify “immersion only baptism” is specifically the word “buried.” It is used only twice in the NT and only by Paul. Normally immersionists will use the word “picture” to describe “burial” as going under the water.” And from the analogy of the “picture” of burial, come to the conclusion of the mode of immersion baptism only.

“To bury” refers to any process in which we place human remains in their final resting place.

We have to make a distinction between modern western and ancient mid-eastern burial practices. In the ancient middle east, it was common for prominent people to be buried in a tomb. The Egyptian pharaohs were buried in their pyramids. Abraham was buried in a cave. King David was buried in a tomb in Jerusalem. John’s the Baptist body was “buried” in a tomb. The raising of Lazarus was from a tomb. And Jesus was buried a tomb.

Jesus was not buried in the ground and immersed with dirt. The women in the morning didn’t go to the tomb of Jesus with shovels, picks, and a wheel barrow to dig up the body of Jesus. This is not a picture of immersion baptism. When credo’s state this is a picture of immersion baptism, they are confusing modern burial practices with ancient burial practices.

A distinction must be made between what baptism accomplishes (Romans 6) and how baptism is to be administered (All the texts in the Book of Acts showing examples of baptism). Romans 6 is not a text on how to administer baptism.

The plain text rule is we are united with Christ death, burial, crucifixion, and resurrection in each of our baptisms. This is God’s action to us. It is the benefit that God gives us in baptism and gives us the result of all of Christ’s work ….the forgiveness of sins.

United with Christ is the result of baptism, not the mode of it. How water is applied to the human body is not specifically addressed anywhere in Romans 6.
 
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Aaron112

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CoreyD

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This is, of course, a straw man argument.

Nobody has said "just sprinkle water on their head, and there[sic] are good.... they don't have to understand and be taught, nor be a disciple"

That's something you are making up.

Because here is what we who follow the biblical and Christian practice of baptizing our children actually believe:

"Raise a child in the right path and when he has grown he will not depart from it." - Proverbs 22:6

In our churches our children are taught. For it is the responsibility of the parents to teach their child in the things of faith, and they are part of God's Household of Faith, they are members of the Body of Christ, and are taught in the way of Christ. When the child is baptized the parents make a commitment, in front of the whole congregation, to raising their child as a Christian, to be a disciple of Jesus Christ. And we, the congregation, also pledge our commitment to the same thing. For our new baby brother or baby sister has gained an extended family among all the saints, and it is our obligation to be there for this child, as they grow.

In the Lutheran tradition our Confessions contain two Catechisms, the Small and the Large. The purpose of the Small Catechism is there for the express purpose for teaching children the simple matters of Christian faith: The Ten Commandments, the Apostles' Creed, the Lord's Prayer, the Sacraments, Prayer, Christian Duty, and the answering of questions pertaining to the faith. The Large Catechism is a more robust expansion, but the Small is there in order that parents and pastors may help guide children, new converts, and others in the elementary ways of Christianity. As the child grows, they shall learn more, be taught more, and as they hear the Word when it is preached they shall have their faith strengthened. And as they come to partake in the Sacraments, they shall appreciate the gifts they receive as they come to know more of the goodness and grace of our God and what He has done for us through His Son.

If a child is baptized, but the parents do not keep their committment, it is not the fault of the Sacrament, but of parental responsibility. If a parent, seeing their child needs medical care, refuses to bring their child to the doctor, it is not the doctor, nor the medicine, nor the medical community that is to blame--it is bad parenting.

Christian parents raise Christian children. This is the sacred and holy vocation of fatherhood and motherhood.



You are the one who would deny God's Word and Promise.

For it is written, "All who have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ." Galatians 3:27

So it is written. So it is true. The word of the Lord endures forever.

-CryptoLutheran
Babies are Christians?
I thought a Christian was a follower of Christ.
Has that definition been warped so badly out of place, today?
According to the Bible, a disciple of Christ is called a Christian. Not every living creature in a house where people identify as Christian. Acts 11:26
 
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CoreyD

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Age of Accountability is a made made tradition. (Mark 7:13)
Children being :safe rather than saved" before the Age of Accountability is a man made tradition.....(Mark 7:13)
I am just clarifying this for you while being faithful to the Scriptures.
Thank you.
Teaching man made traditions as commands of God, is a sin against God, and renders one's worship vain.
Mark 7:7 And in vain they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’

To be sure I understand you clearly...
Saying baptism is necessary for salvation, and infant baptism is a way for that child to gain salvation, is teaching as doctrines commandments of men.
Is that statement false?
Please explain.

Also, please explain how your earlier statements in post #182 does not suggest that the man made tradition is taught - a doctrine, or command of men.
We baptize infants because of the promises attached to baptism.
We baptize infants as a remedy for original sin
 
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The Liturgist

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Isn't that the basic definition of 'traditions of men'.

No, because the Church is the Body of Christ (Colossians 1:24 and Ephesians 1:22-1:23), created by Him (see Matthew 16:18 and 28:19, John 20-21 entire) and is guided by the Holy Spirit (see Acts ch. 1-2 entire) which we are grafted onto through Baptism (see also 1 Corinthians entire, particularly 1 Corinthians ch. 10 and 11) and which everyone agrees consists of all faithful Christians.

This is despite some considerable differences in ecclesiology between some denominations over how the Church is constituted and whether it is a singular organization like the Roman Catholic church or the Seventh Day Adventist church, or branches of the Apostolic church (a common Anglican, Old Catholic and Assyrian view) or is centered around the local church (the Baptist and Congregationalist view) or consists of all churches where the Word and Sacrament are rightly given (which is a very loose summary of the Lutheran view; my dear friends @ViaCrucis @MarkRohfrietsch and @Ain't Zwinglian can be more specific) or as many evangelicals believe, the church is invisible and consists of all believers. I myself like the Eucharistic ecclesiologies expressed by the Lutherans, Orthodox, Congregationalists and the Stone-Campbell movement (which is a variant of the Baptist Congregational polity.

But these divisions reflect traditions that have sprung up and divide us, although it is possible to reconstruct what the early church thought it was, which was a single unified entity, however, the dilemma is that permanent schisms resulted from interference between Charlemagne and others in the Roman Catholic Church, causing a schism with the Eastern Orthodox, which resulted in the Moravians who had been Orthodox until Czechia and Slovakia were annexed by Austria lamenting what they had lost, that other Slavic Christians still had, which was communion in both species of the body and blood, and thus they broke away, and while their leaders, St. Jan Hus and St. Jerome of Prague were executed (and are venerated as martyrs by the Eastern Orthodox Church of the Czech Lands and Slovakia), and were followed by Martin Luther who led the Christians of the German electorates of Saxony, Hannover and a few others, and some free cities of the Hansestic League, along with Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Iceland, and those Christians in Finland and the Baltic States who were not already Orthodox, as well as many of the Germans living in what are now Poland and Romania (the Waldeutsche).

Then the Calvinists and Zwinglians formed what became the Reformed churches in France, Switzerland, the Netherlands, the Electorate of Prussia in Germany, which controlled much territory, and also in Hungary, Romania and Scotland. The Waldensians, a French group with proto-Protestant leanings, who had been severely persecuted by the Italian state of Piedmont then fled to Switzerland, and were protected by the Calvinists. And the Church of England also left the Roman Catholic Church, initially because of King Henry VIII really wanting a divorce, but later Anglicanism became, for various reasons, the largest Protestant church, and one of the most respected, both among evangelicals and more traditional liturgical Christians, and the Methodists formed as an organization within Anglicanism which in the United States was forced to become a separate denomination due to conditions following the Revolutionary War.

So the net result of this is that there exist manmade schisms, which the churches I nave enumerated are working to heal, but it is a complex process. However, the churches I have just enumerated do agree on most issues of Patristics and essential Christian doctrine.

The same cannot be said for churches of the Radical Reformation, which include some of the Anabapists, Mennonites, Baptists, and historically included the Puritans, before they moderated their position and became the Congregationalists of the 18th, 19th and 20th century, of which a few survive, but most became part of the very revisionist United Church of Christ or the even more extreme United Church of Canada, and a minority in the late 18th century, except in Boston where it was at least half, including what had been the main Puritan seminary, Harvard University, apostasized and became Unitarians, denyimg the deity of Christ. And Unitarianism is a doctrine of man. As someone who worked to try to revive traditionalism in the United Church of Christ I particularly object to Universalism.

Likewise, many Restorationist churches, with the exception of groups such as the Evangelical Quakers Christian Church/Disciples of Christ, who are along with the somewhat extreme Churches of Christ descended from the Stone/Campbell movement, have refused to participate in ecumenical reconciliation. hpLikewise, while most Pietists ad Holiness Movement churches like the Wesleyans, Nazarenes, Salvation Army, Evangelical Free Church and Christian and Missionary Alliance have pursued reconciliation, such most Fundamentalist churches, with the exception of some Southern Baptist congregations, and many non-denominational churches and megachurches, insist on sticking to their differences, and have even introduced new reasons for division, and new theological errors. For example, the Prosperity Gospel movement in some Pentecostal megachurches. in addition to the major problems caused by theological revisionism and the “Social Gospel” and its offshoots such as Liberation Theology, Postmodern Theology, Process Theology, Queer Theology and Womanist Theology, the acceptance of which in several of the mainline Protestant churches such as the United Methodist Church, the PCUSA, the Episcopal Church and the United Church of Christ has resulted in massive losses of membership.

Likewise, while Roman Catholicism had improved greatly since the 16th century, to the point where a large number of Luther’s 95 Theses had been corrected, such as vernacular reading of scripture, vernacular liturgy and an end to the sale of indulgences, the recent flourishing of such revisionist movements, which had been largely suppressed by Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI after causing enormous controversy under Pope Paul VI, has resulted in Roman Catholicism suffering from some of the same maliase that plagues the mainline Protestant churches like the UMC, PCUSA, UCC, ELCA, Episcopal Church, etc, that I mentioned before, with severe loss of members except in traditionalist parishes such as those which use the Latin Mass, those comprised of former Episcopalians, and also the theologically conservative Eastern Catholic churches, which are very similar in terms of worship to the Orthodox and Assyrian churches.

It is not unreasonable to say that the largest and most entrenched traditions of men which threaten Christianity at present therefore are those of the Megachurches, the extreme sectarian minority among Reformed Christians, and especially those of the Prosperity Gospel and the various liberal theologies of the Social Gospel. I myself am unable to reconcile these teachings with Galatians 1:8-9.

Thus, while Mark 7:13 is clearly a criticism of Pharisees and what would become Rabinnical Judaism, if one were to apply it, it would be to sects which are either preaching another Gospel outright like Mormonism and Christian Science, or which are at risk of doing so in a repeat of what happened with thenUnitarians in the late 18th century, who based their theology on the worst excesses of the “Enlightenment”, and also those who seem to believe Christianity is about personal wealth, the Prosperity Gospel preachers.
 
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AveChristusRex

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Wasn't Jim Jones, David Koresh, and others all "protected by the Holy Spirit", according to them, and their following? They all are still men, and their "authority" does not invalidate God's word.
I feel that this response is rather emotionally driven, and I want to apologize if I made you upset with anything I had said, I admit my previous response did seem rather forced, and if any ill intent was applied on it then it is my greatest of apologies, from the heart of a pacifist. Though, in regard to what you stated, they were the founder of their own movement, not a successor of St. Peter, and thus given Apostolic Succession; there are many great and fine differences between these folks and the Papal Office.
 
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Ain't Zwinglian

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The first two are immersions
How is it possible for Paul to be immersed standing up in a house in Acts 9 and 22? That is a real duzzie!

Hermenuetically, we interpret a historical narrative using the plain text rule. Additionally, the meaning of ANY word in Scripture is only found in its context. Baptists and American Evangelicals commit the etymological or root fallacy in interpreting Scripture. They assume that the origin of a word of βαπτίζω is its true meaning. This is false assumption. The true meaning of ANY word is its current usage as found in the NT.

Baptists and American Evangelicals agree that certain ancient Greek words migrated into the NT and take on new meaning such as...σάρξ (flesh), ἀγάπηn (love), πίστιςm (faith), οὐρανόθενn (heaven), and θεός (God). Baptists and American Evangelicals agreethese words do not have the same meaning for a Greek pagan and a Christian. EXCEPT FOR THE WORD "βαπτίζω." Why? I don't know.

But when it comes to the usage of βαπτίζω in the NT, Credobaptists are most insistent the word can only mean immersion….taking their cue from the pagan Hellenists. Any interpreter worth his weight in salt, does not have to adhere to an etymological fixed meaning of any word, unless the context tells me to do otherwise.

To my knowledge, Baptists and American Evangelicals are the only ones to hold absolute etymological fixed meaning of only ONE word, and ONE word only....βαπτίζω. Why? I believe any reasonable person would question this way of interpreting Scripture. This absolute argument makes their argument suspect from the get go.

 
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Aaron112

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How is it possible for Paul to be immersed standing up in a house in Acts 9 and 22? That is a real duzzie!
Background preparation:

"Sometime later he married Agnes Randell, a fellow believer, and stayed for a time with her parents.

By this means and others, Foxe kept himself concealed for some time from the papist inquisitors. This continued from the reign of King Henry VIII, through the open and peaceful days of Edward VI, and into the reign of Queen Mary I, who brought back into England all of the Roman Catholic doctrines and the pope’s power. Knowing then what was to happen, Foxe and his family left England and traveled first to Strasbourg, France, then to Frankfurt, Germany, and then to Basel, Switzerland. There he found a number of English refugees who had fled England to avoid the cruelty of the persecutors, and there began work on his now famous book.
Foxe’s history of the martyrs starts with the first-century martyrs, including Jesus Himself and Stephen who was martyred about 8 years after the crucifixion.

The same hate generated against Stephen apparently brought great persecution to all who professed faith in Christ as the Messiah. Luke writes, “At that time a great persecution arose against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered throughout the regions of Judea and Samaria, except the apostles” (Acts 8:1). During that time, about two thousand Christians were martyred, including Nicanor, who was one of the seven deacons appointed by the Church (Acts 6:5).
James the son of Zebedee and Salome was the elder brother of the Apostle John. He was the first of the twelve apostles to be martyred (Acts 12:2). He was executed about A.D.44 by order of King Herod Agrippa I of Judea. His martyrdom may have been a fulfillment of what Jesus foretold about him and his brother John (Mark 10:39). The eminent writer, Clemens Alexandrinus, wrote that when James was being led to his execution, his extraordinary courage impressed one of his captors to such a degree that he fell on his knees before the apostle, asked his forgiveness, and confessed that he was a Christian too. He said that James should not die alone, whereupon they were both beheaded. About the same time, Timon and Parmenas, two of the seven deacons, were executed—one in Philippi and the other in Macedonia. Exactly ten years later, in A.D.54, the Apostle Philip is said to have been scourged, thrown into prison, and then crucified at Hierapolis in Phrygia.
Foxe's Book of Martyrs | Each week I feature a book that I consider a valuable resource. This week's feature is Foxe's Book of Martyrs by John Foxe, edited by Harold J. Chadwick. John Foxe was a 16th-century English historian best known for writing this book. It gives a detailed account of Christian martyrs throughout Western history. His book is about courageous men, women, and children who have been tortured and killed because of their confessions of faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. But, even more, it's a book about God's amazing grace that enabled them to endure persecutions and often horrible deaths. | Martyrs | Persecution | Christianity

Their deaths were followed by the deaths of Matthew, James the brother of Jesus, Matthias, Andrew, Mark, Peter, Paul, Jude, Bartholomew, Thomas, and Luke.

Of the Apostle John the author wrote:

The Apostle John, brother of James, is credited with founding the seven churches of Revelation: Smyrna, Pergamos, Sardis, Philadelphia, Laodicea, Thyatira, and Ephesus. It was from Ephesus, it is said, that he was arrested and sent to Rome where he was cast into a large vessel filled with boiling oil that did not harm him. As a result, he was released and banished by the Emperor Domitian to the Isle of Patmos, where he wrote the Book of Revelation. After being released from Patmos he returned to Ephesus where he died about A.D.98. He was the only apostle to escape a violent death.
The book also chronicles many general persecutions beginning under Emperor Nero. Christians were burned alive, fed to wild animals, beheaded, crucified, scourged, scorched, and subjected to every kind of torture imaginable. Many were women and children.

The book continues the history of Christian martyrdom through the Inquisition and the Reformation, telling the stories of John Wycliffe, John Huss, William Tyndale, Martin Luther, Archbishop Cranmer, and many others."
 
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Ain't Zwinglian

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Background preparation:

"Sometime later he married Agnes Randell, a fellow believer, and stayed for a time with her parents.


Foxe’s history of the martyrs starts with the first-century martyrs, including Jesus Himself and Stephen who was martyred about 8 years after the crucifixion.


Foxe's Book of Martyrs | Each week I feature a book that I consider a valuable resource. This week's feature is Foxe's Book of Martyrs by John Foxe, edited by Harold J. Chadwick. John Foxe was a 16th-century English historian best known for writing this book. It gives a detailed account of Christian martyrs throughout Western history. His book is about courageous men, women, and children who have been tortured and killed because of their confessions of faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. But, even more, it's a book about God's amazing grace that enabled them to endure persecutions and often horrible deaths. | Martyrs | Persecution | Christianity's Book of Martyrs | Each week I feature a book that I consider a valuable resource. This week's feature is Foxe's Book of Martyrs by John Foxe, edited by Harold J. Chadwick. John Foxe was a 16th-century English historian best known for writing this book. It gives a detailed account of Christian martyrs throughout Western history. His book is about courageous men, women, and children who have been tortured and killed because of their confessions of faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. But, even more, it's a book about God's amazing grace that enabled them to endure persecutions and often horrible deaths. | Martyrs | Persecution | Christianity

Their deaths were followed by the deaths of Matthew, James the brother of Jesus, Matthias, Andrew, Mark, Peter, Paul, Jude, Bartholomew, Thomas, and Luke.

Of the Apostle John the author wrote:


The book also chronicles many general persecutions beginning under Emperor Nero. Christians were burned alive, fed to wild animals, beheaded, crucified, scourged, scorched, and subjected to every kind of torture imaginable. Many were women and children.

The book continues the history of Christian martyrdom through the Inquisition and the Reformation, telling the stories of John Wycliffe, John Huss, William Tyndale, Martin Luther, Archbishop Cranmer, and many others."
Your reponse is a real duzzie and the whole CF community know it.
 
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Aaron112

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Your reponse is a real duzzie.
One small step toward truth -
you did not come to your conclusion all by your lonesome.
The false teachings/ doctrines/ practices were already being
introduced and then 'required' in the first few centuries.
Thus, the ones who stood for truth were the martyrs.
 
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Ain't Zwinglian

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One small step toward truth -
you did not come to your conclusion all by your lonesome.
The false teachings/ doctrines/ practices were already being
introduced and then 'required' in the first few centuries.
Thus, the ones who stood for truth were the martyrs.
Nonsensical
 
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Diamond72

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So we really need to be baptized in water ?
  • Baptism is often viewed as a symbol of spiritual cleansing and purification from sin. The water represents washing away the old life of sin and starting anew.
  • Acts 22:16: "And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name."
 
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