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  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Do Non-Messianic Jews Go To Hell?

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LuxPerpetua

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This is my one and only post on this thread.

Read:
1 John 1:9: "Anyone who claims to be in the light but hates his brother is still in the darkness."

I suppose you could argue over the meaning of "brother," but before you do, read:
1 Peter 2:11-12: "Dear friends, I urge you, as aliens and strangers in the world, to abstain from sinful desires, which war against your soul. Live such good lives among the pagans that, though they accuse you of doing wrong, they may see your good deeds and glorify God on the day he visits us."

Judging from this verse, I don't think God ever wants us to rationalize violence on our own. It is love that leads others to Him, who is the source of love.

As far as the original question of this post, here is a good verse:
1 John 2:22-23: "Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist--he deinies the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also." Then again: "This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world" (1 John 4:2-3).

I've read the Koran, and this text is very adamant that Jesus was not divine, only a human prophet (although they reject His teachings and all of the New Testament, for that matter, even though Islam claims to be a progression from Christianity). You can draw your own conclusions from this, but remember that none has authority but God in these matters.

As far as apostasy, read this verse prayerfully, please:
2 Peter 2:20-22: "If they have escaped corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning. It would have been better for them not to have known the way of rightwousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them. Of them the proverbs are true: "A dog returns to its vomit," and, "A sow that is washed goes back to her wallowing in the mud." This is echoed in Hebrews 6:4-6.

I need not go into all of the passages in the New Testament that talk about Jesus as the only way to salvation since no one can live a perfect life under God's law--which is the only alternative for salvation.

***
Whatever you do in your own personal walk in faith, do it prayerfully and mindfully. God's commandment is to love the world as He does so that others can be brought to Him through you. "Those who live by the sword will die by the sword." Hmmm.
 
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Mr. Mephisto

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Warrior Monk said:
For me he does.

You know a tree by the fruit that it bears.


But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. (Mat 18:6)

"So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple area, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables." (John 2:15)


In the first quote you supplied, Matthew 18, Jesus is using a figure of speech known as the hyperbole. He obviously never intended anyone to castrate themselves, or bore out their own eyes.

"To hang a millstone about a man's neck, and drown him in the sea, was the punishment then reckoned the most appalling, and which was inflicted on the most atrocious malefactors. When our Lord alludes to this punishment, we are enabled to perceive how dear and precious those persons are in the sight of God, who are mean and despised in the eyes of the world." - Calvin

Secondly, please provide proof that Jesus offered personal injury when He cleansed the temple. The passage does not indicate the Jesus actually whipped anyone.


And I suppose damning God-fearing Jews to lakes of fire and sulfur for eternity is also a non-violent act.

These Jews "...walk according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience... fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind... by nature the children of wrath, even as others." Eph. 2

All in Adam die, all in Christ shall be made alive. These "God-fearing Jews" that you mention have not been reborn in Christ; God has imputed Adam's sin to them as well.

As for eternity, only Christians have eternal life. "For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
 
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