Do Most Protestants Disagree with the Notion of Free Will?

[liars_paradox]

It seems that according to most Protestant churches, they do disagree with the notion of "Free-Will". However, I haven't seen this with most Christian Protestant Church members. It seems that most people seem to agree with the notion that one can choose their own destiny, rather than God having chose it for us already.

But, maybe my understanding of things is wrong, and someone on here can correct it? Are you a protestant, and do you disagree with the notion of Free Will? If not, then what denomination are you from, specifically? What does your church say about the notion of Free Will and is your belief aligned with that of your church's?

 

[singpeace]

It seems that according to most Protestant churches, they do disagree with the notion of "Free-Will". However, I haven't seen this with most Christian Protestant Church members. It seems that most people seem to agree with the notion that one can choose their own destiny, rather than God having chose it for us already.

But, maybe my understanding of things is wrong, and someone on here can correct it? Are you a protestant, and do you disagree with the notion of Free Will? If not, then what denomination are you from, specifically? What does your church say about the notion of Free Will and is your belief aligned with that of your church's?

2 Peter 3:9
9. The Lord isn’t really being slow about his promise, as some people think. No, he is being patient for your sake. He does not want anyone to be destroyed, but wants everyone to repent.


1 Timothy 2:3-6
3. This is good and pleases God our Savior, 4. who wants everyone to be saved and to understand the truth. 5. For there is only one God and one Mediator who can reconcile God and humanity—the man Christ Jesus. 6. He gave his life to purchase freedom for everyone. This is the message God gave to the world at just the right time.


Hebrews 2:9
9. What we do see is Jesus, who was given a position “a little lower than the angels”; and because he suffered death for us, he is now “crowned with glory and honor.” Yes, by God’s grace, Jesus tasted death for everyone.


1 John 2:2
2. He himself is the sacrifice that atones for our sins—and not only our sins but the sins of all the world.

 

[CryptoLutheran]

The Historic Protestant churches (Lutherans and Reformed) do not believe that we have, in our natural will, the capacity to choose God and His righteousness.

Need to be careful by how we're defining "Free Will". In philosophy free will is placed as an antithesis of Determinism, that our actions are determined and beyond our control. In this sense, yes, we have free will.

Theologically, however, the natural will is anything but free, instead the will is fallen, held in bondage by sin. We need to be rescued from our plight, and that rescue comes from God who saves us by His grace.

I am not able to choose God or His righteousness, I'm a sinner enslaved by sin and death, I need a Savior which I have in Jesus.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[RosemaryDuncan]

I do believe we have free will but our choice is always away from God Psa 53 v2-3. We are slaves to sin John 8 v34 and the Devil doesn't help 2 Cor 4 v 4 but it is still choice, however deep. So we are free to sin but not free to save ourselves. But so wonderfully true that God overcomes us and rescues us and saves us by His grace and mercy.

 

[Zacman]

It seems that according to most Protestant churches, they do disagree with the notion of "Free-Will". However, I haven't seen this with most Christian Protestant Church members. It seems that most people seem to agree with the notion that one can choose their own destiny, rather than God having chose it for us already.

But, maybe my understanding of things is wrong, and someone on here can correct it? Are you a protestant, and do you disagree with the notion of Free Will? If not, then what denomination are you from, specifically? What does your church say about the notion of Free Will and is your belief aligned with that of your church's?

The vast majority of Protestants believe we have free will. It's how they justify sending the vast majority of mankind to a endless torture chamber they call hell.

The fact is, God brings us to him through his spirit. Some now in this life, (the few, elect etc) the rest through judgment after the resurrection.

Fire, chastisement, suffering, etc etc. are all methaphors used to describe the judgment which will result in every knee bowing and confessing Christ is Lord to the glory of the Father. Phil 2:8

Cheers,
Zac
P.S. free will is making a choice which isn't influenced by any outside source which of course is never the case

 

[Lee52]

You have asked a question that has plagued the Body of Christ down through the ages. Back in the early days of the church, there was Arminius and latter Calvin. Calvin theology is of predestination of the elect, Arminius is of predestination of all of humanity with free will.

Baptists are Calvinists, Wesleyan doctrine are Arminian theology.

The only way I know for a person to resolve this conflict within the Body of Christ, is this: "In as much as it is up to you, live in peace with all men."

John 3:16 says: "For God so love the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM should not perish, but have everylasting life."

To me, that is pretty all encompassing. Not everyone will choose to believe, but those that do, are saved by grace through Christ's substitutional sacrifice in our place for our sins.

And, choosing to believe is NOT works based salvation. It is merely accepting a free gift.

And yes, I am Wesleyan doctrine of Arminian theology.

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

Our Lutheran Theology is such that we believe that we have free will only to the extent that we can reject faith.

We have no free will to accept Christ; that is the work only of the Holy Spirit who "calls, gathers, and enlightens the whole Christian Church on earth" (from the Small Catechism on the third article of the Apostles Creed).

If we believe that we have free will to accept faith, then that means we have an active part in our own salvation; which, inturn, cheapens Christ's Sacrifice.

 

[Lee52]

Mark,
By stating that you have no free will to accept Christ's substitutional sacrifice on the cross for our sins is actually what does not make sense. IF, God, from the beginning of time predestined ONLY the ELECT and they have NO CHOICE, then WHY CRUCIFY CHRIST? They are predestined to be in Heaven, there is no reason to send God's Only Begotten Son to die a brutal-barbaric-agonizing death to pay for the sins of the world.

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son."

So, those who put on their faux humility in saying that making a choice to accept Christ's sacrifice on their behalf is "works based salvation" take pride, (though they usually deny the pride part in public), in the "fact" that they had no choice but to believe, because God chose them before they were born to be saved. I suppose you also do not have any part in perseverence in the faith. That too, is not of yourself, but only the Sovereign God is able to preserve you, through no part of yourself. So, why do you appreciate Christ's sacrifice? Only because God makes you appreciate it?

I will use the common argument I get from Calvinists with you on this: If I cannot choose to be saved, I cannot choose to be unsaved.

Be blessed,
Lee

Our Lutheran Theology is such that we believe that we have free will only to the extent that we can reject faith.

We have no free will to accept Christ; that is the work only of the Holy Spirit who "calls, gathers, and enlightens the whole Christian Church on earth" (from the Small Catechism on the third article of the Apostles Creed).

If we believe that we have free will to accept faith, then that means we have an active part in our own salvation; which, inturn, cheapens Christ's Sacrifice.

 

[ddhurley]

John 3:16 says: "For God so love the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM should not perish, but have everylasting life."

John 3:16 isn't an all inclusive statement, rather the opposite. It states that only the ones (whoever) who believe in him will not perish.

Only a saved person will believe, truly believe. In order to believe we have to have been given a new heart/a living soul, which will desire to seek & follow God.

Re 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

When a person is unsaved they are in the same condition as the people in Rev 3:17, how can a blind dead soul believe, it can't.

Lk 19:10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

Christ has to first give us a new regenerated soul, then we will follow Him.

Mk 2:22 And no man putteth new wine into old bottles: else the new wine doth burst the bottles, and the wine is spilled, and the bottles will be marred: but new wine must be put into new bottles.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

"It seems that according to most Protestant churches, they do disagree with the notion of "Free-Will"."

Only those that ascribe to the "Calvinist/Baptist/Reformed" paradigms.

"However, I haven't seen this with most Christian Protestant Church members."

Most "Church Members" couldn't care less about "Abstract Theological Paradigms". Whether they like the "Music Style" is probably more of a concern, generally. NEVER confuse the beliefs of a Church member with the "Official Denominational Position" of their organization.

"Are you a protestant."

Yup - I'm a "Free Range Charismatic" who's a member, and a deacon of an Assembly of God church in DeSoto, TX.

"And do you disagree with the notion of Free Will?"

I believe in "Free will - and when I got saved, it was my "FREE WILL" to do so - I COULD have just "walked away".

I also believe that in spiritual matters - INCLUDING SALVATION - God "Moves first", and therefore, there are TIMES when you can "Get in", and times when you CAN'T regardless of what your WILL is.

One can't really repent UNLESS he's been CONVICTED of His SIN by the Holy Spirit and drawn - and that "Conviction" is the Beginning of faith.

"What does your church say about the notion of Free Will and is your belief aligned with that of your church's?"

Fundamental Truths (Full Statement)
Assemblies of God (USA) Official Web Site

I don't have any particular PROBLEM with the AoG's position, nor any particular interest in it.

 

[The Beautiful Heresy]

No, I don't believe in Free will. There is no such thing at all. I know that is unbelievable to many who want to think they are in control.

Only God is in control. Only God.

 

[ChristianT]

No, I don't believe in Free will. There is no such thing at all. I know that is unbelievable to many who want to think they are in control.

Only God is in control. Only God.

So how then, do you tell people at micky d's or starbucks or the theatre what you want? Do you simply tell them, "Just give me what I was destined to eat," or, "Whichever movie G-d wants me to see," or "I want to eat/drink/watch [insert food/beverage/film title here]."?

I mean, I agree that G-d is in control. But to say that we don't have a choice in anything is well... lacking awareness.

I do believe in free will, as something G-d gives us as a way to truly love in a godly way, not forced by not having a choice to not love.

 

[The Beautiful Heresy]

So how then, do you tell people at micky d's or starbucks or the theatre what you want? Do you simply tell them, "Just give me what I was destined to eat," or, "Whichever movie G-d wants me to see," or "I want to eat/drink/watch [insert food/beverage/film title here]."?

I mean, I agree that G-d is in control. But to say that we don't have a choice in anything is well... lacking awareness.

I do believe in free will, as something G-d gives us as a way to truly love in a godly way, not forced by not having a choice to not love.

It is a bit too complex to get into without having to get into more complex topics.

I will just say that God gives us limited 'choice', but none of us have Free-Will.

With Free-will EVEN GOD HAS NO CLUE WHAT WILL HAPPEN NEXT.

 

[The Beautiful Heresy]

.

 

[The Beautiful Heresy]

So how then, do you tell people at micky d's or starbucks or the theatre what you want? Do you simply tell them, "Just give me what I was destined to eat," or, "Whichever movie G-d wants me to see," or "I want to eat/drink/watch [insert food/beverage/film title here]."?

I mean, I agree that G-d is in control. But to say that we don't have a choice in anything is well... lacking awareness.

I do believe in free will, as something G-d gives us as a way to truly love in a godly way, not forced by not having a choice to not love.

I don't think some understand what Free Will really is.

Most of what we know about God is something we were taught by someone else who told us we have to believe their views of God or.... God forbid we actually seek God for ourselves...Another topic, anyway.

Free Will takes away the knowledge of God.

Free Will takes away the power of God to interrupt or intervene in the affairs of man.

Free Will puts man in total control and God on the outskirts with his fingers crossed HOPING WE MAKE "RIGHT" CHOICES.

Free Will is an illusion.

There is a difference in God giving us choices and having Free Will.

Only God has Free Will.

God has orchestrated all of the events of the world from day one.

When you figure that out, you are halfway there.

 

[ChrisManuel]

I had been a christian 2 weeks when a calvinist comes along and talks me out of my salvation. You can't just ask Jesus to come into your heart, because you might not be the elect. 8 years of pure misery later at the very bottom of a barrel. God began to speak to me and drew me out of all the lies that calvinist had planted. You couldn't convince me that calvinism is right for all the money in the world. I am trying to keep this short but if anybody is seriously considering accepting calvinism, I would give you the strongest warning. It's a lie!!!!!!!

freedom project

 

[bbbbbbb]

I had been a christian 2 weeks when a calvinist comes along and talks me out of my salvation. You can't just ask Jesus to come into your heart, because you might not be the elect. 8 years of pure misery later at the very bottom of a barrel. God began to speak to me and drew me out of all the lies that calvinist had planted. You couldn't convince me that calvinism is right for all the money in the world. I am trying to keep this short but if anybody is seriously considering accepting calvinism, I would give you the strongest warning. It's a lie!!!!!!!

freedom project

I once attended a hyper-conservative Presbyterian (RPCNA) church in which there was an elderly gentlemen who had spent virtually his entire life as an adherent (a person who is not a member but who attends faithfully) of the church. When he was a child someone or something had convinced him that he could not and would not be counted among God's elect so there was no hope for him other than to try his best to avoid the worst of God's eternal punishment for him. I have rarely met anyone so disconsolately sad.

 

[ChrisManuel]

Yeah, I was there once. I cannot believe that was God's choice for me. To spend 8 years in doubt and unbelief meanwhile the enemy was tying me up in terrible bondage. I made the choice to walk away from faith. Today is a new day however and I am so blessed. And I don't mean just a little!

freedom project

 

[The Beautiful Heresy]

I had been a christian 2 weeks when a calvinist comes along and talks me out of my salvation. You can't just ask Jesus to come into your heart, because you might not be the elect. 8 years of pure misery later at the very bottom of a barrel. God began to speak to me and drew me out of all the lies that calvinist had planted. You couldn't convince me that calvinism is right for all the money in the world. I am trying to keep this short but if anybody is seriously considering accepting calvinism, I would give you the strongest warning. It's a lie!!!!!!!

freedom project

I love to hear how God removes the veils off of eyes.

The more you follow him and have a totally open heart to hear him speak to you outside of ALL you were ever taught, the more lies he will reveal to you.

The only denomination you need to follow is Christ.

It is finished.

 

[VolRaider]

You have asked a question that has plagued the Body of Christ down through the ages. Back in the early days of the church, there was Arminius and latter Calvin. Calvin theology is of predestination of the elect, Arminius is of predestination of all of humanity with free will.

Baptists are Calvinists, Wesleyan doctrine are Arminian theology.

The only way I know for a person to resolve this conflict within the Body of Christ, is this: "In as much as it is up to you, live in peace with all men."

John 3:16 says: "For God so love the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM should not perish, but have everylasting life."

To me, that is pretty all encompassing. Not everyone will choose to believe, but those that do, are saved by grace through Christ's substitutional sacrifice in our place for our sins.

And, choosing to believe is NOT works based salvation. It is merely accepting a free gift.

And yes, I am Wesleyan doctrine of Arminian theology.

United Methodist checking in here. Ditto what Lee said. However Lee, I think Southern Baptists are the only Calvinist-leaning Baptists. I think most other Baptists have a free-will belief - I could be wrong.