Do Christians Have Power Over Sin?

[DevotiontoBible]

So you can't actually mention at least one particular point where I lack biblical support?

It's more like, where do I start? You string a long philisophical points that have unrelated Biblical ideas making your own strange doctrine. Try supporting your ideas with Scripture please.

 

[JeCrois]

What the h*** are you talking about? If you're not going to answer anything sensible, don't post at all. Don't throw dirt at me like an offended kindergarten kid.

Whoa....the world uses that kind of language....how bout you give me a break from the world so I can come into these forums and see a little piece of heaven?

Thanks

 

[DevotiontoBible]

OK, I'll explain it once more:

1. Accusation is from the devil.
2. Your reaction to that accusation is YOUR OWN.
3. An emotion isn't a very good guide. It would be better to let God decide your behaviour, for example.

Again, stop lying about me. I have never said what you are claiming I said.

I asked you to show where in the Bible we get "feelings" of accusation from the devil. You provided none. I showed from Rom 2:15 it is God, not the devil, who enlightens man's conscience and this is where the feelings of accusation originate. On the other hand, you are telling people these feelings are from the devil and need to be ignored. You are teaching people to violate their conscience.

 

[GodsChild07]

Have all Christians been given the power to overcome sin in their lives?

If not, why not?

If so, then why do christians still commit sin?

Peace...

It goes back to what I have been saying about the difference between carnal and spiritual believers. Carnal believers have very little ability to overcome sin. That means that they are able to overcome some sin, but very little. Spiritual believers, as they grow in their spiritual walk, become closer to God. And the closer to God that they get, the less they sin. Can we overcome all sin? Maybe. I have found that there are little things that we do that I considered to be sin, in the past. But as I grew and matured in a spiritual relationship with him, I found that there are many trivial things that may cause us guilt, but God doesn't have a problem with them. Why? Because our free will can cause us to make incorrect choices. And free will is part of our design. Making mistakes is a product of our design, and God understands that. Also, there are many believers who go through guilt over things that pop into their heads. I learned that we do not have any control over our spontanious thoughts. We do not plan to think something. It is when we dwell on, or act on those thoughts that we sin.

 

[dkbwarrior]

You know what else Paul said?

That everything that is not of faith, is SIN. It's actually SIN, especially AFTER you've already been sanctified and bought and redeemed by Christ, to go back to trying to fix it yourself. HE begun a good work in you, and HE will complete that work. You began in faith, and you're supposed to continue in faith.

The problem is, you're not actually overcoming sin by this reliance on yourself. You can't do it, it will never happen. If it worked, we should see at least a few christians around who could honestly testify of the sins they've conquered. But we never hear that, not unless they're lying, or fooling themselves.

No, each and every time we hear a REAL, powerful, TRUE testimony, it's always about the power of GOD. Not our abilities.

Your attempts to resist sin will be as futile as the amount of effort you put into it. It is in and through and by CHRIST we RECEIVE victory, not by ourselves.

I have never freed myself of one single sin, and neither have you. Because you have never ever been able to do that. You, like the rest of us, needed a miracle, and we still need miracles every single day.

The struggle against sin is really the struggle against our own pride, because we always want to do God's work. But as Paul says, we can't boast of anything but our weakness. It's in our weakness that HE becomes strong.

Awesome flippin post.....

 

[dkbwarrior]

"even our faith".... what does that mean?

Do you really want me to do a study on faith?

Even our faith. The Word of God produces faith in us when the Holy Spirit quickens it to us in the form of revelation. When this happens, the faith of God is released in us, and through our confession and the inward confidence this imparts, victory is manifested in our lives.

It is almost impossible to explain, but it happens without even any real effort on our part, other than the effort of putting our attention on Him and His Word.

Peace...

 

[holo]

It's more like, where do I start? You string a long philisophical points that have unrelated Biblical ideas making your own strange doctrine. Try supporting your ideas with Scripture please.

OK, here's the post in question:

Amen, and all this is possible through Christ, and only through Christ.

I could list sin after sin and problem after problem that I've just... lost and left behind and walked all over and cast off me. And I couldn't take credit for a speck of an inch of an iota of it. I tried to be a christian for years, trying to go by all these suggestions and "encouragements" to "stand firm against sin" etc etc... to NO EFFECT WHATSOEVER. Nobody around me got any better at it, either. It simply doesn't work. It's the same principle at work as when Paul talks about the law (with all its GOOD commandments) and says that it's simply powerless.

Discipline doesn't work.
Dedication doesn't work.
Re-dedication doesn't work.
"Accountability partners" don't work.
"WWJD" doesn't work.
Vows and promises don't work.
Zeal doesn't work.
Getting a hold of yourself doesn't work.

In short, YOU don't work, and you never will. There's absolutely NOTHING that you have in you that can or will conquer sin. You will never ever make it.

The grace of God, however, does work. Grace is free, anyone can come and get it. But you can only benefit from it to the degree that you LET GO of your own strength and STOP trying to do what God does best. Jesus said to DENY yourself and DIE. Daily. Dead men don't struggle. It can be a struggle to stay dead, though...

"It is only possible through Christ" - 1 Corinthians 15:57
But thanks be to God! He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

About the law being powerless:
1. Romans 8:3
For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man

About the list of tactics that don't work, well, that's what I've seen and experienced. Have you seen or experienced otherwise? If victory is a gift, as the bible says, how can it also be the product of, say, a person's zeal?

About you having nothing in yourself to overcome sin... well, if you did, you wouldn't have needed Christ in the first place.

About the grace of God being better than our strength:
2 Corinthians 12:9
But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ's power may rest on me.

About denying yourself and dying:

Colossians 2:20
Since you died with Christ to the basic principles of this world, why, as though you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules:

Romans 7:4
So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ

Romans 6:11
In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus.

Romans 6:8
Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him.

Mark 8:34
Then he called the crowd to him along with his disciples and said: "If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me.

When you take up a cross, it's not because you're going to walk around with it. You're supposed to DIE on it

 

[holo]

I asked you to show where in the Bible we get "feelings" of accusation from the devil. You provided none. I showed from Rom 2:15 it is God, not the devil, who enlightens man's conscience and this is where the feelings of accusation originate. On the other hand, you are telling people these feelings are from the devil and need to be ignored. You are teaching people to violate their conscience.

OK. Once more.

WE DO NOT GET FEELINGS FROM THE DEVIL. I HAVE NEVER SAID THAT. I HAVE SAID REPEATEDLY THAT YOUR FEELINGS ARE FROM YOURSELF.

If somone offends you, they aren't giving you a feeling of anger. You are giving yourself that feeling. The feeling of anger is YOUR OWN emotional response to their offense. Do we agree on that?

Now, when the devil accuses you, YOUR EMOTIONAL RESPONSE may be a feeling of guilt. So again, accusations come from the devil, emotions come from yourself.

And yet again, I have never told anyone to violate their conscience. I have said that emotions aren't a reliable guide. If you believe that emotions ARE a reliable guide, I'm all for debating that. But don't put words in my mouth.

 

[JimfromOhio]

Do you really want me to do a study on faith?

Even our faith. The Word of God produces faith in us when the Holy Spirit quickens it to us in the form of revelation. When this happens, the faith of God is released in us, and through our confession and the inward confidence this imparts, victory is manifested in our lives.

It is almost impossible to explain, but it happens without even any real effort on our part, other than the effort of putting our attention on Him and His Word.

Peace...

"......even our faith...."

We are overcomers by the act of believing, which results in our new birth. The essential ingredient in the life of the overcomer is faith thorugh Jesus Christ. The Christian's victory is based on the reality that Jesus Christ is who He claimed to be. The SOURCE of faith is Jesus Christ therefore, only the Holy Spirit can help us.

Faith itself don't help us however faith in Christ helps us.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

About you having nothing in yourself to overcome sin... well, if you did, you wouldn't have needed Christ in the first place.

Where does the Bible say this. I have provided ample, and can provide more, Scriptures that say it is up to us to stop sinning. This is one of the main thrusts of your argument and you have squat to support it.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

About the list of tactics that don't work, well, that's what I've seen and experienced. Have you seen or experienced otherwise? If victory is a gift, as the bible says, how can it also be the product of, say, a person's zeal?

Again, you provide no Scripture but only so called experience to contradict the express Word of Roman 6:12,13. What rule of interpretation are you folllowing that say peoples experiences override Scripture? This is one of the main thrusts of your argument and you have squat to support it.

 

[holo]

About you having nothing in yourself to overcome sin... well, if you did, you wouldn't have needed Christ in the first place.

Where does the Bible say this. I have provided ample, and can provide more, Scriptures that say it is up to us to stop sinning. This is one of the main thrusts of your argument and you have squat to support it.

OK, so what is it then, that you have in you, that is able to overcome sin? And if you have that ability, what do you need Jesus for?

The only way to stop sinning is to trust in Christ. If there was any other way, Christ died for nothing.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

About the law being powerless:
1. Romans 8:3
For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man

The Bible says the law is powerless but that has nothing to do with a regenerated man who is no longer under the law with sin has his master. You are talking about people who are not born again. Are you born again? If you are then you should obey the moral aspects of the law and stop sinning.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

OK, so what is it then, that you have in you, that is able to overcome sin? And if you have that ability, what do you need Jesus for?

The only way to stop sinning is to trust in Christ. If there was any other way, Christ died for nothing.

I have the ability to stop sinning because I trust Christ.

 

[holo]

Again, you provide no Scripture but only so called experience to contradict the express Word of Roman 6:12,13. What rule of interpretation are you folllowing that say peoples experiences override Scripture? This is one of the main thrusts of your argument and you have squat to support it.

"Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness."

Um, am I saying anthing that contradicts those verses?

And IS your experience different than mine?

 

[holo]

The Bible says the law is powerless but that has nothing to do with a regenerated man who is no longer under the law with sin has his master. You are talking about people who are not born again. Are you born again? If you are then you should obey the moral aspects of the law and stop sinning.

The law isn't for the righteous man.

The righteous man isn't supposed to live according to rule or some sort of "moral aspect" of anything, but according to who he IS in Christ, and who CHRIST IS, in him. According to the Spirit, not the letter.

The reason I'm nice to people, for example, has nothing at all to do with any law or any moral code. It has only to do with the fact that Christ is in me and I am in Him.

However, there was a time when I thought of myself as a sinner, and therefore applied the law to myself. Then I experienced that the law is indeed the power of sin - the more I tried to live up to the law, the worse the bondage to sin.

 

[holo]

I have the ability to stop sinning because I trust Christ.

Then I think we agree

 

[dkbwarrior]

"......even our faith...."

We are overcomers by the act of believing, which results in our new birth. The essential ingredient in the life of the overcomer is his faith. The Christian's victory is based on the reality that Jesus Christ is who He claimed to be. The SOURCE of faith is Jesus Christ therefore, only the Holy Spirit can help us.

Faith itself don't help us however faith in Christ helps us.

The source of faith is the Gospel, the Word of God. But of course, Jesus is the Word of God. There is no faith outside of God or His Word, only fear. The gospel is the power of God, it contains the Faith of God.

Words are containers, they hold information (dna one could say, like in a seed), and they hold the power of faith, (life one could say, like in a seed). Thats why Jesus analogy of the Word being the seed is so appropriate.

Gods Words are seeds, they contain within themselves the desired data and neccesary power to bring themselves to pass.

But God gave us a free will. He wont make us get saved. He wont make us overcomers. He wont make us get healed. He wont make you become rich. He wont make you have favour. You have to recieve the seed of the Word of God, the promises for each of these things and believe them in your heart and confess them with your mouth.

Praise be to God. The race doesn't go to the strong, nor to the wise, but to them that believe...

Peace...

 

[JimfromOhio]

The source of faith is the Gospel, the Word of God. But of course, Jesus is the Word of God. There is no faith outside of God or His Word, only fear. The gospel is the power of God, it contains the Faith of God.

Words are containers, they hold information (dna one could say, like in a seed), and they hold the power of faith, (life one could say, like in a seed). Thats why Jesus analogy of the Word being the seed is so appropriate.

Gods Words are seeds, they contain within themselves the desired data and neccesary power to bring themselves to pass.

But God gave us a free will. He wont make us get saved. He wont make us overcomers. He wont make us get healed. He wont make you become rich. He wont make you have favour. You have to recieve the seed of the Word of God, the promises for each of these things and believe them in your heart and confess them with your mouth.

Praise be to God. The race doesn't go to the strong, nor to the wise, but to them that believe...

Peace...

Like you said..."Gods Words are seeds". The source of faith is Christ through the Holy Spirit. It is important to understand that our hearts are the state of our "flesh". Our flesh search for pleasure, pride, passions and selfish motives. Our hearts are like a garden with beautiful flowers and plants. As with all gardens, the hearts must be kept free from weeds and insects. To expect the fruits and flowers bloom in an untended heart is to misunderstand completely the processes of God's Grace. 2 Timothy 3:10 You, however, know all about my teaching, my way of life, my purpose, faith, patience, love, endurance.

Spiritually, the Holy Spirit, the eternal Spirit of God,who dwelled in Jesus Christ, who empowers us, Who is the source of our life in Christ, and Who is poured out on those who believe as the guarantee of redemption. Christ dwells in our hearts which "Christ in you, the hope of glory" (Colossians 1:27) is the burning core (or source) of our Christian faith. Faith is inside us which is Holy Spirit lead only when we submit in obedience. In Ephesians 5:18 where the present tense of the verb in Greek means: "Keep on being filled with the Spirit".

Focusing on faith in terms of efforts is not biblical. What is biblical is using faith through the Holy Spirit. Without the Holy Spirit, we are nothing, even our own faith.

 

[GodsChild07]

I have the ability to stop sinning because I trust Christ.

Then why is it you are not saying "I have stopped sinning because I trust Christ"? Why is it you continue to sin when you have the self proclaimed ability to stop?