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Do children pay for the sins of the parents?

Discussion in 'Covenant Theology' started by curious mike, Apr 7, 2018.

  1. curious mike

    curious mike Active Member

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    I had created a thread on this on one forum, can't remember which but the end result was NO God does not punish the children for the sins of the parent.

    However, I just came across this which is suggesting otherwise?

    And it was the word of the Lord to Elijah the Tishbite saying:

    "Have you seen that Ahab is submissive to me? Because he has humbled himself before Me, I will not bring the disaster in his days; in the days of his son I will bring the disaster on his house."
     
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  2. 1stcenturylady

    1stcenturylady Spirit-filled follower of Christ Supporter

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    Exodus 20:
    4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
     
  3. curious mike

    curious mike Active Member

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    Yes that was the scripture which had sparked my question but not understanding this part. The words "for those who hate me" also confuses me for we all sin but we don't hate God so why would he punish our Kids for our sins? Also that scripture I think was only referencing the worshipping of other Gods and not us making mistakes.
     
  4. 1stcenturylady

    1stcenturylady Spirit-filled follower of Christ Supporter

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    Anything that means more to us than God is an idol. One thing that comes to mind that is passed down generationaly is witchcraft. When children see spirits, somewhere in their ancestry the door was opened. Addictions can be passed on also.
     
  5. LaSorcia

    LaSorcia Amarone in Riedel Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    Yes but in Jeremiah 31: it says:
    29 “In those days people will no longer say,

    ‘The parents have eaten sour grapes,
    and the children’s teeth are set on edge.’

    30 Instead, everyone will die for their own sin; whoever eats sour grapes—their own teeth will be set on edge.
     
  6. 1stcenturylady

    1stcenturylady Spirit-filled follower of Christ Supporter

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    I just noticed something I forgot to ask. When you say "we all sin," have you never learned that Jesus was manifest to take away our sin, and in Him there is no sin? 1 John 3:5
     
  7. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

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    Life is very complex. It could be said that my dad was evil, and therefore the Lord will punish me by causing me to be very poor. But even though I am very poor, the Lord can make me very happy. In other words, no, the Lord will not punish one person because of what somebody else did, even though it might appear otherwise.
     
  8. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    1Ki 22:51 Ahaziah the son of Ahab began to reign over Israel in Samaria the seventeenth year of Jehoshaphat king of Judah, and reigned two years over Israel.
    1Ki 22:52 And he did evil in the sight of the LORD, and walked in the way of his father, and in the way of his mother, and in the way of Jeroboam the son of Nebat, who made Israel to sin:
    1Ki 22:53 For he served Baal, and worshipped him, and provoked to anger the LORD God of Israel, according to all that his father had done.


    Ahaziah practiced idolatry just as his father had. If Ahaziah had humbled himself before the Lord, would the God have denied him? I don't think so.
     
  9. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Every time the Israel got into worshiping pagan gods they got into trouble, like the Assyrian and Babylonian captivities. The Babylonian captivity was 70 yrs.. Considering the young age that people got married, three or four generations could have been born in those 70 yrs.
     
  10. 1stcenturylady

    1stcenturylady Spirit-filled follower of Christ Supporter

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    True
     
  11. icxn

    icxn Bραδύγλωσσος αἰπόλος μαθητεύων κνίζειν συκάμινα

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    This is more of a prophecy than a deferred chastisement. Ahab's son, Ahaziah did evil in the sight of the Lord (1 Kings 22:52) and paid for his sins accordingly.

    In Deut 24:16 it is stated clearly:

    Parents are not to be put to death for their children, nor children put to death for their parents; each will die for their own sin.

    The quote from Exodus 20:5 posted above that states "...visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me..." has a different interpretation. If not, then scripture contradicts itself and that is not possible.
    What is the interpretation then? Not a literal one. What gives it away, if you pay close attention, is the fact that it says up to the 3rd and 4th. Does that mean the 1st and 2nd generation are not punished? No, you would say, that doesn't make sense, it probably means all generations up to the 4th. Fine, then, why didn't the text say up the 4th? That would be the normal way to express what you suggest, why mention the 3rd? So, how are we to interpret it then? Someone with the gift of knowing the mysteries of scripture (1 Cor. 13:2) can answer that. Such was St. Maximus the Confessor (among other Church Fathers) who interpreted the above as follows:

    The first generation of sin is the thought or temptation to sin. The second generation is the desire to sin that is born when we fail to deal with the temptation but before our will actually concends to commit the sin. The third generation is the surrender of the will and the fourth the action of sinning.

    God doesn't punish us for the thoughts or even the desire to sin, 1st and 2nd generation, but only when we surrender our will and commit the sin in action, 3rd and 4th generation.​
     
  12. BukiRob

    BukiRob Newbie

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    See the problem is that mankind does hate G-d Romans makes that plainly clear. For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God’s law; indeed, it cannot.

    The great struggle is the war against the OLD man who all of our walks keeps trying to assert its will over that of the Father's will. Yeshua is the pattern of how we are to walk with G-d.

    Are you not a descendant of Adam? Was his sin imputed to you? G-d can and DOES punish in this way.

    There is increasing evidence that criminal behavior is associated with certain genes being activated and this can be passed down through the father or mothers DNA.
     
  13. thecolorsblend

    thecolorsblend If God is your Father, who is your Mother?

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    Julian Lennon said he grew up seeing his father John only on infrequent occasions. On several of those occasions, John was verbally abusive. He was always neglectful. Much later, in December 1980, John was shot to death. A son buried his father, filled with a strange mixture of grief, confusion, abandonment, anger and resentment.

    Julian was once quoted saying that he refuses to get married or have children until he believes he understands how to be a better father than the lousy one he had.

    Yes, sins of the father can be paid by the children.
     
  14. bugkiller

    bugkiller Well-Known Member

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    For some sins, most definitely. I do not think those sins are what you have in mind. I certainly suffer for sins of my parents. That is not open for discussion. I harbor no ill will toward them. What they did was in ignorance.

    bugkiller
     
  15. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    Was just having a similar discussion on another board. I have a book by a Rabbi which briefly mentions "the collective nature of sin". Here are some verses for this notion.

    Jos 22:18 But that ye must turn away this day from following the LORD? and it will be, seeing ye rebel to day against the LORD, that to morrow he will be wroth with the whole congregation of Israel.

    Jos 22:20 Did not Achan the son of Zerah commit a trespass in the accursed thing, and wrath fell on all the congregation of Israel? and that man perished not alone in his iniquity.

    The discussion concerned intentional sins and sins of ignorance. But none the less, I think it would apply to this discussion of Children as well. I think it concerns our humanity in our carnality. Isreal under Mosaic law is a carnal collective (genealogical). But spiritual Children do not necessarily follow in the sins of their parents. Same was true in ancient Israel.
    But the day of atonement was the one day in the year that was strictly for atonement of the nation as whole. Which were sins commited in ignorance.
    I think Paul spoke as a member of the carnal collective here.
    14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
    15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
    16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
    17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
    18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
    19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
    20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
    21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
    22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
    23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law
     
  16. Lady Bug

    Lady Bug Let's get real Supporter

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    Are we talking about suffering the guilt, or the consequences? I can definitely understand suffering the consequences but not the guilt. I have experience in this regarding my parents...sometimes I just wish God would stop making me suffer for what my parents did but it doesn't look like that's going to stop.
     
  17. childeye 2

    childeye 2 Well-Known Member

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    I believe that God cares for us and He therefore warns us of directions that are detrimental to our wellbeing. I therefore believe that our children will share the consequences of sins made by their parents, just as our children will benefit as a consequence of the Parent's faithful heeding of God's loving instruction.
     
  18. curious mike

    curious mike Active Member

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    Very well put. I am still puzzled though why this happens only to some people? I know some parents who have committed great sins and some who sin continuously yet their kids and them are fine.
     
  19. Blade

    Blade Veteran Supporter

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    If one is going to live by the law one does all 613 laws. There are also promises in His word over 7k. If we before Christ were living I would say YES...but Christ has come. I do not pay for the sins of my parents. Nor do I receive any of the sicknesses that they had. You know when that Doctor asks you about did your parents have such and such and then how YOU can also have it? That which the Doc said is NOT what the WORD says. I brake that chain in JESUS name. Sorry ..well not sorry..nothing.. but nothing make it past the blood of Christ Jesus.

    This was for those in the wilderness. And its clear in the OT some of the verses were about idols and another was clear we do not pay. Yet to me SOME things have not changed. Well where one man took something so ALL of Israel would have to suffer. Is not this the way its for us now? If one member sins it can effect the whole body. We see so many different groups. God does not. Its ONE body..just many tents lol
     
  20. Lady Bug

    Lady Bug Let's get real Supporter

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    that's a good question. unfortunately for me I am not one of the people who turned out fine from my parents' sins...it doesn't make sense, some parents' kids do not grow up suffering the way I am now.
     
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