Jade Margery
Stranger in a strange land
If more christians thought like you, we wouldn't have this problem.
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Care to explain this a little more? I don't see how anything we've learned cannot be attributed to God. Maybe some scientists don't attribute it to him, but science just seems to be the art of discovering God's constructive side, rather than his spiritual one.
Well, of course knowledge is a threat to the belief in god. Ever heard the phrase "God of the Gaps"?
As science fills in the holes in our knowledge base, things that were once attributed to god are then explained through natural phenomena. The bigger science grows, the smaller god gets - or so it seems.
Care to explain this a little more?
I don't see how anything we've learned cannot be attributed to God.
Maybe some scientists don't attribute it to him, but science just seems to be the art of discovering God's constructive side, rather than his spiritual one.
If more christians thought like you, we wouldn't have this problem.
Science can't touch God;
science makes models that correspond to reality but can never claim they are reality.
Hence Newton can give an equation for gravity yet claim to know nothing of what causes gravity or how the attraction works, other than that he can predict the magnitude and direction of the force.
Nonetheless, the claim that God exists is a scientific one as soon as you step away from deism - which, being a Christian, you presumably do. Prayer, for instance, is alleged to be, among other things, an appeal to God to induce an effect in the world. Well, that's a testable claim, meaning God is at least partially susceptible to scientific scrutiny.Science can't touch God; science makes models that correspond to reality but can never claim they are reality. Hence Newton can give an equation for gravity yet claim to know nothing of what causes gravity or how the attraction works, other than that he can predict the magnitude and direction of the force.
Prayer, for instance, is alleged to be, among other things, an appeal to God to induce an effect in the world. Well, that's a testable claim, meaning God is at least partially susceptible to scientific scrutiny.
An interesting sidebar: For the life of me, I can't remember the details of the study or who published it, but there was research done and data gathered on the effects of prayer. A number of hospital patients were studied - some who recieved prayer for healing, and some who did not, and the results of the study were quite interesting. The patients who were prayed for did far worse than those who recieved no prayer.
Only if they knew they were being prayed for, though. Among the ones who didn't know whether they were being prayed for, the prayer had no effect.
I remember that as well. Apparently the stress of it all did more harm than good. Social pressure doesn't really do much good to the body...An interesting sidebar: For the life of me, I can't remember the details of the study or who published it, but there was research done and data gathered on the effects of prayer. A number of hospital patients were studied - some who recieved prayer for healing, and some who did not, and the results of the study were quite interesting. The patients who were prayed for did far worse than those who recieved no prayer.
Science can't touch God; science makes models that correspond to reality but can never claim they are reality. Hence Newton can give an equation for gravity yet claim to know nothing of what causes gravity or how the attraction works, other than that he can predict the magnitude and direction of the force.
On the contrary. Saying something is "supernatural" is just the religionist's way of hiding the fact that he or she is relying upon magic. Science doesn't allow for a "supernatural" explanation because that would mean the explanation was beyond the natural. Outside of nature. Unable to be studied. Something that complies with this does not exist. Once we have seen it, become aware of it, then whatever it is it has become a part of this universe. And it is, by definition, natural. We can study it, we can study those who saw it. You desperately WISH that there was a "supernatural" realm where your gods could hide. If there was your deity would have to stay there because if it interacted with this universe then it would be a PART of this universe as as such no longer "supernatural".
An interesting sidebar: For the life of me, I can't remember the details of the study or who published it, but there was research done and data gathered on the effects of prayer. A number of hospital patients were studied - some who recieved prayer for healing, and some who did not, and the results of the study were quite interesting. The patients who were prayed for did far worse than those who recieved no prayer.
Interesting. How does one measure "positive intention" objectively to make a research worth reading?Have a read of the 'Intention Experiment' by Lynne McTaggart. It seems prayer has little effect but positive intention does. And the difference is, prayer without positive intention i.e just the words without meaning can actually have an adverse effect. Worth a read.
Well, I'd say there's the same amount of data. What that data serves as evidence for is different.
I'll absolutely admit that science is subject to change and open to overturning. But that's a strength, not a failing.
Here's a thought, ask your average Christian if they can prove (even to themselves) that God exists, or whether they accept His existence by faith.
For one, Science says there is no effect, without a greater cause. So given a void to start, and the result being infinite amount of space, matter, and complexity
then the cause must have been even bigger.
Even if this cause and effect idea of yours is absolutely true, that's proof of a cause, at best. Not proof of God being that cause.So that's the proof. Cause and effect.
Somehow I doubt that science operates with concepts like "great/greater".For one, Science says there is no effect, without a greater cause.
For one, Science says there is no effect, without a greater cause.
We all create higher powers that we bow down to because we find them to be worthy of our respect. Science freely admits to being subject to the winds of change and open to overturning at any point. It's just amazing that it keeps any integrity at all. I'm not saying it has none. Only that so few admit it's failings.
So you don't see that your always wrong if you happen to interpret the data incorrectly? _________
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