Do All Baptists Believe In Once Save Always Saved

[Bluelion]

Much of why I wrote my reply. We seem to be OBLIGATED to include people who SAY THEY ARE SAVED in all verses that assure that God will preserve the people He gives to Jesus Christ to redeem, be adopted, etc.

If the LORD does not know them, because they are NONE OF HIS, there is a terrible day coming when all this error will be rectified, and there will be the restitution of all things. (Acts 3:21)


I have no problem with John 6, and this opinion about people who refuse to go far enough with God, but turn back, is not covered in verses about what Jesus will do for His own. I gave verses that state this plainly.

The problems come when someone picks and chooses which verses they will believe. We must accept the truth of ALL the Bible, or none of it. If we insist on rejecting significant passages because they are not aligned with our doctrine, we must answer to God about that.

.

you convict yourself

 

[lismore]

OSAS is tied in with salvation by grace. By the grace of God alone are we saved, works has zero to do with it.

16 It does not, therefore, depend on human desire or effort, but on God’s mercy (Romans 9:16)

God's mercy. How could anyone who has believed the gospel believe other than OSAS?

 

[PrincetonGuy]

I always thought that this was a Calvinist belief but a few days ago I found out that it's also a Baptist belief.

The question is do all Baptist adhere to OSAS?

The large majority of Baptists today believe in one of the many different doctrines of OSAS. Two of the oldest beliefs can be traced all the way back to the Protestant Reformation and are known, respectively, as “The Preservation of the Believer” and “The Perseverance of the Believer.” Some of the more recent doctrines of OSAS taught in our Baptist churches date back to around 1845 or later and teach various forms of Millennial Exclusionism. My Baptist denomination is one of the largest Baptist denominations in the United States, and it leaves the issue up to the individual members to decide for themselves what to believe.

 

[faroukfarouk]

Romans 8.38-39

 

[PrincetonGuy]

\How could anyone who has believed the gospel believe other than OSAS?

The very large majority of Christians believe other than OSAS. Perhaps you should ask some of them that question. Here are some of the Scriptures that they might share with you:

Apostasy

Described
Deu_13:13; Heb_3:12
Caused by persecution
Mat_24:9-10; Luk_8:13
Caused by worldliness
2Ti_4:10
Guilt and punishment of
Zep_1:4-6; Heb_10:25-31; Heb_10:39; 2Pe_2:17; 2Pe_2:20-22
Cautions against
Heb_3:12; 2Pe_3:17
Shall abound in the latter days
Mat_24:12; 2Th_2:3; 1Ti_4:1-3
See Antichrist
Unclassified scriptures relating to
General references
Deu_32:15; 1Ch_28:9; Isa_1:28; Isa_65:11-16; Jer_17:5-6; Eze_3:20; Eze_18:24; Eze_18:26; Eze_33:12-13; Eze_33:18; Mat_13:20-21; Mar_4:5-17; Luk_8:13; Mat_24:10; Mat_24:12; Luk_11:24-26; Joh_15:6; Act_7:39-43; 1Co_9:27; 2Th_2:3; 2Th_2:11-12; 1Ti_4:1-2; 2Ti_3:1-9; 2Ti_4:3-4; Heb_6:4-8; Heb_10:26-29; 2Pe_2:1; 2Pe_2:15; 2Pe_2:17; 2Pe_2:20-22; 2Pe_3:17; Jud_1:4-6
See Backsliders; Reprobacy
Instances of:
Israelites
Ex 32; Num 14
Saul
1Sa_15:26-29; 1Sa_18:12; 1Sa_28:15; 1Sa_28:18
Amaziah
2Ch_25:14; 2Ch_25:27
Disciples
Joh_6:66
Judas
Mat_26:14-16; Mat_27:3-5; Mar_14:10-11; Luk_22:3-6; Luk_22:47-48; Act_1:16-18
Hymenaeus and Alexander
1Ti_1:19-20
Phygellus and Hermogenes
2Ti_1:15
See Backsliders, Backsliding of Israel

(Source: Nave’s Topical Bible)

 

[Avid]

Calvinists do not believe in OSAS we believe in perseverance of the saints. OSAS is a heresy. Far too many think that because they once, as a child, made a profession of faith and were baptized they are now forever saved no matter what they do. Therefore they live profligate lives and have no interest in the things of God. If you confront them with their sin they will tell you that they are saved and honestly think that they are...

This has been a major concern of mine, and I spend a lot more time than I like trying to tell people this.

So many are convinced that they are right on the 5th point of Calvinism because of the OSAS error. They shrug at the thought of any Christian actually persevering for a day, but are confident that they HAVE DECIDED, or GOT SAVED, or ACCEPTED CHRIST.

Press on...

 

[BlackSheepBaptist]

Unless you're a member of a General or Freewill Baptist church (which might be hard to find in Oklahoma), it's pretty difficult since OSAS is almost a defining doctrine for the rest of the Baptist family, especially the Southern Baptists.

I wish that statement was true, but the Southern Baptist Convention's International Mission Board has recently voted David Platt as its new president, and if you're at all familiar with his work you know he is a far cry from a OSAS advocate!

 

[yungjah]

Since we are on the topic of someone being saved by grace, a Baptist once told me she doesn't believe it is mandatory to be baptize? What's your take on this matter?

I know the bible clearly stated that one should be born again to enter the kingdom.

 

[yungjah]

Since we are on the topic of someone being saved by grace, a Baptist once told me she doesn't believe it is mandatory to be baptize? What's your take on this matter?

I know the bible clearly stated that one should be born again to enter the kingdom.

 

[Bluelion]

Since we are on the topic of someone being saved by grace, a Baptist once told me she doesn't believe it is mandatory to be baptize? What's your take on this matter?

I know the bible clearly stated that one should be born again to enter the kingdom.

baptism is not being born again that happens at accepting Jesus. Baptism is expressing that faith a sign of the New Convent like circumcision.

 

[yungjah]

For some strange reason I am lost again. lol. I know we all have different ways to express ourselves. You said baptism is not being born again, that happens at accepting Jesus.

Let me interpret what you mean. Are you saying one must accept Jesus as Lord and Savior before baptizing?

If so, I understand that. But the question still remain. Is it mandatory to be baptize in this present age?

Because there are alot of persons who think that being saved is enough to acknowledge that they have accepted Christ. Most refuse to baptize even if they are aware of John 3:3-7.

 

[yungjah]

For some strange reason I am lost again. lol. I know we all have different ways to express ourselves. You said baptism is not being born again, that happens at accepting Jesus.

Let me interpret what you mean. Are you saying one must accept Jesus as Lord and Savior before baptizing?

If so, I understand that. But the question still remain. Is it mandatory to be baptize in this present age?

Because there are alot of persons who think that being saved is enough to acknowledge that they have accepted Christ. Most refuse to baptize even if they are aware of John 3:3-7.

 

[KnowHisJoy77]

Calvinists do not believe in OSAS we believe in perseverance of the saints. OSAS is a heresy.

It isn't once saved always saved, saved no matter how we live, nor is it eternal security, though it is very close to the truth, but perseverance of the saints which is that all true believers persevere in the tenor of their lives to the end.

wow this is news to me...I thought the three ( OSAS, eternal security and perseverance of the saints) were all the same, and in my observations and understanding, the problem were individuals abusing the grace and living in sin giving bad testimony around..

The great thing about the Word of God is that as you read and the Holy Spirit guides you to all Truth, you end up knowing that you know and have certainty inside ourselves what we believe. I knew nothing about the Bible when I came to the faith, but that I was a, sinner in terrible state and in need of a Savior. At 33 years old I know I truly was blind when came to the light. I was born again in a Pentecostal church but as I started reading meditating learning from my Bible things became so clear and I positioned myself believing because that was I believe and embrace the texts saying, without any theologians help, but by the Holy Spirit. I understood I was secure in Jesus Christ and sealed by the Spirit adopted by Father and there is no way I could lose my salvation, and if I backslide I would return and if not returning is because I never belong or was born again in reality. Its very simple. Well at least these things settled in my heart mind. We sure can be born in a denomination and do not embrace some of their beliefs and interpret Scriptures differently. The best thing is listen to Paul and be like Bereans and prayfuly examine Scriptures by ourselves with Holy Spirit help.

I consider myself born again, Protestant, embrace Calvinists solas because it is what the Scriptures teach me and attend a southern Baptist Church that I love ♥

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

For some strange reason I am lost again. lol. I know we all have different ways to express ourselves. You said baptism is not being born again, that happens at accepting Jesus.

Let me interpret what you mean. Are you saying one must accept Jesus as Lord and Savior before baptizing?

If so, I understand that. But the question still remain. Is it mandatory to be baptize in this present age?

Because there are alot of persons who think that being saved is enough to acknowledge that they have accepted Christ. Most refuse to baptize even if they are aware of John 3:3-7.

Baptism is not necessary to salvation. But its like a wedding ring for marriage. You don't have to put on a wedding ring to be married . . . but if your prospective fiance says no I don't want to wear a ring, you might wonder, why not?

Baptism is the same way. You can merely trust Jesus for the salvation, turn your sins over to Him . . that's all it takes. But Jesus wants you to follow Him in baptism. Of course, if you're dying and making a deathbed conversion to Christ, baptism doesn't matter. Or if you're stranded on a tropical island and the water is being rationed . . . hey, baptism can wait.

If you join the Salvation Army, they don't even bother with EVER baptizing anybody. They will get to go to heaven based on trusting Christ as Savior.

 

[yungjah]

So in concluding your view, it is not mandatory to be baptize. Thanks for your input. Let see what others have to say about this.

 

[corinth77777]

What about whenever Jesus said there are those who say "Lord, Lord," yet He will say to them, "Turn away from me you wicked, I never knew you?" There are a lot of hypocrites who do not behave like Christians even though they bear Christ's name.


Just because you are a Christian does not mean you will be spared the great white seat of Judgment. We will all be called to account for our actions.

Did you read the full chapter?

For he is talking about fasle prophets....by their fruit you should know them

 

[Avid]

There are things that are said commonly that have no basis in scripture. This is why it is important for you to learn these things from the Bible, and not only from what you heard.

Acts 17
11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
​

I have discussed these things with people who mistake common cliche' statements for scripture. These statements were published regularly about 250 years ago in a periodical called "Poor Richard's Almanac," edited by Ben Franklin. So the following are not part of Bible scripture:

• God helps those who help themselves.
• Cleanliness is next to Godliness.
• God works in mysterious ways, His wonders to perform.
• Penny wise, and pound foolish.

Regardless of whether there is any amount of truth in these or not, they are not scripture, and are not from the Bible.

... Are you saying one must accept Jesus as Lord and Savior before baptizing?

There are not any places in scripture that require or even suggest that we can "Accept Christ as our Savior." We can receive the gift of God, the gift of salvation, but this idea of accepting Christ is not scriptural.

We are told this is meant to be the same as receiving Christ according to the scriptures, but as we hear what people say, we find they think they can listen to a sermon, or read a pamphlet, and ACCEPT CHRIST as their Savior. They will decide to be right with God, and go to Heaven to be in His abode. Cain DECIDED that what he offered before God was sufficient. He was not accepted, and this brought out his true self. He murdered his brother, Abel, who had pleased God.

The scriptural terminology is to BELIEVE and be BAPTIZED. More specifically, Philip found that he should qualify that with, "... If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest... " (Acts 8:37) Having gotten Simon the Sorcerer to say he believed, but finding his heart was not right with God, Philip was more specific with the "...man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians..." "And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God."

Acts 2
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
​

So the answer is you must be baptized, and you may be baptized if you believe with all your heart. To do this requires repentance from dead works. (Heb.6:1-2) Repentance requires a good confession of how we really are sinful. More on that in a minute.

There are things that people can do all day long that mean very little, but, in the right circumstance, when done according to God's command, have a spiritual benefit. A person can eat unleavened bread and follow that with unleavened "wine" after every meal. It is only when this is done by Christians who are remembering how Jesus Christ did this before His crucifixion (in a solemn setting,) that it is counted by God as honoring Jesus' sacrifice for our sins.

... But the question still remain. Is it mandatory to be baptize in this present age?

In the scriptures, there are a number of places that say we must believe and be Baptized. The act of being under water is not what will cleanse the soul. That may get the dirt off the outside, but God must wash the sins away.

I Peter 3
21 ¶ The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

I John 1
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

James 5
16 Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.
​

So we see the answer of a good conscience toward God is that we confess our sins one to another. This is taken by one particular religion to mean something else, but it is required. Specifically, we are to find someone we can trust, and confess those things we have done. Typically, if the sins were done publicly, this should be a public confession. If the sins were private sins, they should be confessed privately..

... Because there are alot of persons who think that being saved is enough to acknowledge that they have accepted Christ. Most refuse to baptize even if they are aware of John 3:3-7.

Any who would refuse to be baptized may find that God does not accept them.

Matthew 10
32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Acts 2
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22
16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
​

If anyone thinks he can be saved, and NOT have his sins washed away in the obedient act of baptism, he will likely be surprised to find that the LORD would, also, deny him before the Father in Heaven.
.

 

[corinth77777]

There are things that are said commonly that have no basis in scripture. This is why it is important for you to learn these things from the Bible, and not only from what you heard.

Acts 17
11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
​

I have discussed these things with people who mistake common cliche' statements for scripture. These statements were published regularly about 250 years ago in a periodical called "Poor Richard's Almanac," edited by Ben Franklin. So the following are not part of Bible scripture:

• God helps those who help themselves.
• Cleanliness is next to Godliness.
• God works in mysterious ways, His wonders to perform.
• Penny wise, and pound foolish.

Regardless of whether there is any amount of truth in these or not, they are not scripture, and are not from the Bible.

There are not any places in scripture that require or even suggest that we can "Accept Christ as our Savior." We can receive the gift of God, the gift of salvation, but this idea of accepting Christ is not scriptural.

We are told this is meant to be the same as receiving Christ according to the scriptures, but as we hear what people say, we find they think they can listen to a sermon, or read a pamphlet, and ACCEPT CHRIST as their Savior. They will decide to be right with God, and go to Heaven to be in His abode. Cain DECIDED that what he offered before God was sufficient. He was not accepted, and this brought out his true self. He murdered his brother, Abel, who had pleased God.

The scriptural terminology is to BELIEVE and be BAPTIZED. More specifically, Philip found that he should qualify that with, "... If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest... " (Acts 8:37) Having gotten Simon the Sorcerer to say he believed, but finding his heart was not right with God, Philip was more specific with the "...man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians..." "And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God."

Acts 2
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
​

So the answer is you must be baptized, and you may be baptized if you believe with all your heart. To do this requires repentance from dead works. (Heb.6:1-2) Repentance requires a good confession of how we really are sinful. More on that in a minute.

There are things that people can do all day long that mean very little, but, in the right circumstance, when done according to God's command, have a spiritual benefit. A person can eat unleavened bread and follow that with unleavened "wine" after every meal. It is only when this is done by Christians who are remembering how Jesus Christ did this before His crucifixion (in a solemn setting,) that it is counted by God as honoring Jesus' sacrifice for our sins.


In the scriptures, there are a number of places that say we must believe and be Baptized. The act of being under water is not what will cleanse the soul. That may get the dirt off the outside, but God must wash the sins away.

I Peter 3
21 ¶ The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

I John 1
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

James 5
16 Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.
​

So we see the answer of a good conscience toward God is that we confess our sins one to another. This is taken by one particular religion to mean something else, but it is required. Specifically, we are to find someone we can trust, and confess those things we have done. Typically, if the sins were done publicly, this should be a public confession. If the sins were private sins, they should be confessed privately..


Any who would refuse to be baptized may find that God does not accept them.

Matthew 10
32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Acts 2
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22
16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
​

If anyone thinks he can be saved, and NOT have his sins washed away in the obedient act of baptism, he will likely be surprised to find that the LORD would, also, deny him before the Father in Heaven.
.

It all sounds a bit ticky tacky to me...legalistic..like a referee calling a foul..on a person that barely touches a persons hand..."to accept Jesus Christ" has meaning...that someone believes..and it dont matter public or private..What matters is what God sees in the heart. Maybe the person who didnt get baptized..shows his deeds before man all the time in other ways. God accepts people where they are...Everyone does not have to have the same level of understanding. Maybe the person made a different connection that it was calling on the name of the lord..that washed his sins away.scipture state..confession of the mouth is onto salvation. IF ONE BELIEVES AND IS RIGTEOUS....AS FATHER ABRAHAM..AND ONE CONFESSION SAVES THEM...AND IF NO ONE CaN SAY jesus is Lord except by the holy spirit..isnt God who saves? Belief is away of accepting salvation and confession confirmation of what one believes..but dare be a person who has no voice?...Even if that scripture..of washing away sins was interpreted to mean in water baptism.....you would have to account for many other scripture that announce..salvation in a different way.....like be washed (baptized) calling on his name....it was the calling on his name. BAPTISM WAS ALWAYS A WAY IN SHOWING YOU ACCEPTED A PARTICULAR TEACHING. ACTS 2..IS ALSO WHAT PETER SAID TO "THEM".Since repentance and forgiveness are preached in his name. Then Baptism is what is done showing you have accepted the preaching message........in all instances people got baptized because they believed.....and since Abraham was declared rightros by faith..and therefore was circumcised....since the man who said he saw water and wanted to be baptized first made a confession that he believed we begin to see...a pattern...

 

[Avid]

... Then Baptism is what is done showing you have accepted the preaching messagr.

If ACCEPTING is anything, then your statement here shows baptism is required.
.

 

[corinth77777]

If ACCEPTING is anything, then your statement here shows baptism is required.
.

Then the thief on the cross u r saying was baptized.
Are u suggesting that all scripture aftrr the preached word..ssy it just like Peter?
Was Paul ever Baptized..?