Divorce

[b&wpac4]

Marriage is an inherently religious institution that has been nationalized improperly by the state. King Henry VIII wanted to divorce, and was upset that the Pope wouldn't allow him, so he nationalized the Catholic Church and created the Church of England. Ever since, the state has been meddling in marriage and regulating it when they never should have gotten involved.

Marriage existed in China and other places that Christianity didn't even have so much of a foot in the door at the time it was going on.

 

[OphidiaPhile]

Marriage is an inherently religious institution that has been nationalized improperly by the state. King Henry VIII wanted to divorce, and was upset that the Pope wouldn't allow him, so he nationalized the Catholic Church and created the Church of England. Ever since, the state has been meddling in marriage and regulating it when they never should have gotten involved.

Marriage existed before religion as a whole and far before Christianity, you are the ones trying to monopolize it as your own. The first true religion was Zoroastrianism and marriage existed before that so no you do not get to claim marriage as a religious entity.

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[True_Blue]

Marriage existed in China and other places that Christianity didn't even have so much of a foot in the door at the time it was going on.

I said religious, not Christian.

 

[b&wpac4]

I said religious, not Christian.

Yes, but you specifically mentioned the Pope.

 

[True_Blue]

Marriage existed before religion as a whole and far before Christianity, you are the ones trying to monopolize it as your own. The first true religion was Zoroastrianism and marriage existed before that so no you do not get to claim marriage as a religious entity.

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I've read a lot on Zoroastrianism--the data that it was an ancient religion is sketchy at best. In the last couple decades, studies of Zoroastrianism seem to have taken on a life of their own among the academic university types.

I don't particularly care which religions have the institution of marriage. My point is that fundamentally, marriage is not a state or governmental institution.

 

[OphidiaPhile]

I've read a lot on Zoroastrianism--the data that it was an ancient religion is sketchy at best. In the last couple decades, studies of Zoroastrianism seem to have taken on a life of their own among the academic university types.

I don't particularly care which religions have the institution of marriage. My point is that fundamentally, marriage is not a state or governmental institution.

And my point is that fundamentally it is not a religious one.

 

[CCGirl]

History of same sex marriage through the ages

 

[Andreusz]

Marriage is an inherently religious institution that has been nationalized improperly by the state.

This is complete nonsense. Marriage existed before Christianity became the official religion of the Roman empire. It exists in non-Christian cultures. It is Christians who tried to change the definition of marriage by making it a religious rite.

 

[Andreusz]

My point is that fundamentally, marriage is not a state or governmental institution.

ANcient Roman marriage was essentially secular.

 

[LJSGM]

He is right in that marriage is a religious function. It is a belief system in and of it's self, shaped by the religion that a person holds.

 

[OphidiaPhile]

He is right in that marriage is a religious function. It is a belief system in and of it's self, shaped by the religion that a person holds.

Marriage has always been a secular concept that was hijacked by the church.

 

[LJSGM]

Marriage has always been a secular concept that was hijacked by the church.

Humans are the only animals that have marriage. Probably one of the only ones that has true monogamy.

It is one thing to stay with you SO for a long time, it is another to believe that you are married, and what that means to you is shaped by your religion

 

[OphidiaPhile]

Humans are the only animals that have marriage. Probably one of the only one that has true monogamy.

It is one thing to stay with you SO for a long time, it is another to believe that you are marriage, and what that means to you is shaped by your religion

There are many other species that have shown to be far better at monogamy than humans are and according to evolutionary research we are not hard wired for monogamy. And you have no way of knowing if other animals have marriage or not.

 

[LJSGM]

There are many other species that have shown to be far better at monogamy than humans are and according to evolutionary research we are not hard wired for monogamy. And you have no way of knowing if other animals have marriage or not.

What is marriage to you then?

What do you believe it is?

In order to determine if animals have marriage

 

[OphidiaPhile]

What is marriage to you then?

What do you believe it is?

In order to determine if animals have marriage

Many animal species are completely monogamous and never mate again if their partner dies. I highly doubt I could ever be monogamous though.

 

[LJSGM]

Many animal species are completely monogamous and never mate again if their partner dies. I highly doubt I could ever be monogamous though.

So, to you marriage = monogamy or one sexual partner for the rest of it's life?

That is a belief then because many would disagree that that is the only thing involved in marriage.

 

[OphidiaPhile]

So, to you marriage = monogamy or one sexual partner for the rest of it's life?

That is a belief then because many would disagree that that is the only thing involved in marriage.

Each marriage should be what the two people involved make it, as for animal species that are monogamous there may well be far more to it but until such time as we can communicate with them we will have no real idea. And generally the higher vertebrate forms are more likely to not be monogamous just as we are are not programmed for monogamy.

 

[LJSGM]

Each marriage should be what the two people involved make it, as for animal species that are monogamous there may well be far more to it but until such time as we can communicate with them we will have no real idea. And generally the higher vertebrate forms are more likely to not be monogamous just as we are are not programmed for monogamy.

No, marriage is not monogamy. It might be monogamous, although in some cultures it is polygamous.

Therefore marriage is more then just sex. It is a belief.

 

[OphidiaPhile]

No, marriage is not monogamy. It might be monogamous, although in some cultures it is polygamous.

Therefore marriage is more then just sex. It is a belief.

And how do you know what another species believes about their relationship or why does it matter what two people use to quantify their marriage. If I get married it will be for financial purposes only and yet it is still a marriage.

 

[LJSGM]

And how do you know what another species believes about their relationship or why does it matter what two people use to quantify their marriage. If I get married it will be for financial purposes only and yet it is still a marriage.

I'm sorry about offending you about what I said about animals.

But, you do agree then that it is a belief, for you said "what another species believes about their relationship."