Dispensational Proposition #2

[GLJCA]

Dispensational Proposition #2



2) The Church does not fulfill or take over any of Israel's promises or purposes.



The second proposition follows logically from the first. If we were to understand Israel as simply the unbelieving nation and the church as believers, or if we were to regard them as two completely separate bodies of believers, then we could assume this second proposition to be true. If however the believers in the OT Israel and the NT believers are one body, then it would make sense that the promises to the one might be fulfilled in the other.



When we turn to the scriptures, we see that promises originally made to the literal nation of Israel are in fact being fulfilled today in the church.



The Abrahamic covenant was initially fulfilled by the physical descendants of Abraham, but it has its true fulfillment in Jesus Christ and the church. It will have its ultimate fulfillment in the new heavens and the new earth.

Dispensationalists argue that the Abrahamic Covenant has never been fulfilled completely by the physical descendants of Abraham. Is that true?



Scripture teaches us several things about the fulfillment of the Abrahamic covenant. God has already fulfilled the promises He made specifically to Abraham, that He would make Abraham a great nation (Gen.12:2). Was not Israel a great nation in history?

God promised Abraham that his descendants would be as the dust of the earth. In Chronicles 1:9 Solomon prays, "Now, O Lord God, Thy promise to my father David is fulfilled, for Thou hast made me king over a people as numerous as the dust of the earth". Abraham was promised that his descendants would be as the stars of that heavens (Gen 15:5). This was also fulfilled (1 Chron.27:23)

God promised that his seed would possess the land of Palestine and more (Gen 12:7; 13:15). Look at Gen 15:18 and compare it to 1 Kings 4:20. Joshua 21:43-45 explicitly declares that all the land that God promised to Israel was given to them.



In the NT we discover something more. We learn that in the ultimate sense Jesus Christ is the Seed of Abraham (Gal 3:16) We learn that all who are in Christ are also Abraham's seed and coheirs of the promises made to Abraham (vs 29) We also learn that the promise has been expanded. It no longer includes only the terrain from the Euphrates to Egypt. It now includes the entire world (Romans 4:13) We will not only inherit Palestine as coheirs with Christ we will inherit the earth. (Matt 5:5)



The New Covenant is perhaps the clearest example of a promise made to national Israel that is now being fulfilled in and by the Church. The fact is that the New Covenant was promised to Israel in Jeremiah 31:31. Since Israel was cut off of the covenant, the true Church is fulfilling those promises.

During the Last Supper Jesus links the institution of the New Covenant to His coming death on the cross (Luke 22:20)

Paul the apostle declares that he himself is a servant of the new covenant.(2 Cor 3:4-6).

In Hebrews we find undeniable proof that the New Covenant is being fulfilled by the church in this age (Heb 7:22, 8:6-13;9:15;10:14-18,29;12:22-24) These scriptures aren't teaching that the New Covenant is something that is in the future. They are teaching that Jesus is the mediator of the New Covenant NOW.



The promises made to literal, physical Israelites were fulfilled by a literal physical Israelite, Jesus Christ, the Messiah. He is the Seed of Abraham.



What Dispensationalism fails to grasp is that through the union with Christ, all who are His by faith have become members of His body. Therefore all who are in Him by faith, whether Old Testament believers or New Testament believers, are co-heirs of the promises and the covenants. The covenantal promises do not require a future fulfillment by national Israel in order for God's Word to be true. The promises are now being fulfilled by the true seed of Abraham, Jesus Christ (Gal 3:16). They are also being fulfilled in and by all who are united to Christ by faith. (Gal 3:29). In Him all of God's promises find their fulfillment (2Cor 1:20). The church through union with Christ shares in these promises.

GLJCA

 

[Markea]

One of the huge problems with CT in this respect is that they will readily apply the PROMISES concerning Israel to the church of God..

BUT NOT THE CURSES...

Slight disconnect there imo..

 

[JMWHALEN]

Replacement theology-the body of Christ inherits the land!

"explicitly declares that all the land that God promised to Israel was given to them."

My comment: Where is your land?= "The word means what I say it means"(the queen to Alice "in Wonderland")=everlasting =temporary!



"And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing..." Genesis 12:2
"And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel." Ex. 19:6

"Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name: If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD." Jeremiah 31:35-37

"And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all." Ez. 37:22

'And I will make her that halted a remnant, and her that was cast far off a strong nation: and the LORD shall reign over them in mount Zion from henceforth, even for ever." Micah 4:7

Daniel is a summary of God's ultimate promise to restore the kingdom to Israel-the consumation. The period of days that occur during the last of the "70 weeks" include the resurrection of Daniel. When was he resurrected? The days of Daniel 12 were still future in the Lord Jesus Christ's day, since he referred to the abomination of desolation as still future in Mt. 24:15, and he specifically refers us to Daniel. The events were still future when Paul wrote 2 Thes. 2:3,4. Again, the events of Daniel 12 concerning the abomination of desolation were still future when the Lord Jesus Christ spoke, and the specific days relating to those events were numbered. Daniel was promised to be resurrected at the end of those days in which the abomination of desolation is in place. The article modifying "days", "the", is the article of the previous reference. The "days" of verse 13 refers to the days discussed in the previous verses-Chapter 12 "a time of trouble"="Jer. 30:7="/"at that time thy people" /"seal the book, even to the time of the end"=the end of the Great Trib, when the LORD God will make good on the covenental promises given to the JEWS(thy people"), including LAND:

The time of Jacob's trouble "pre-figured in Gen. 32:7:
"Then Jacob was greatly afraid and distressed..."


"For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it. And these are the words that the LORD spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah. For thus saith the LORD; We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness?Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble, but he shall be saved out of it." Jeremiah 30:4-7

This was not fulfilled in A.D. 70, as the Jews were driven out of the land, scattered, not saved, and fled in terror. This is future.


"and to seal up the vision and prophecy" 9:24
" ...., shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end..." 12:4

"And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end." 12:8-10

"...Many shall be purified....but the wise shall understand..." 12:10/" When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand.." Mt. 24:15 =Future!

"to shut up" means to cause a cessation or to completely fulfill. Thus, the vision and the prophecy are to be completely fulfilled. When was he resurrected? This is a reference to all visions and prophecies recorded in the Holy Bible, and all were revealed to the Jews, and all of it is sealed up in Israel. Daniel was commanded to seal up the book of prophecy until the time of the end, which was not at the cross, which was not at A.D. 70, meaning when the Jews would be returned to the LAND, and have it as their inheritance="stand in thy lot"(12:13).

"Jesus told the Jews in Matt 12 that the Kingdom was to be taken from them and given to a nation that is bringing forth the fruits required." This is "the little flock"-Jews, "the kingdom church". Does "a nation of priests" sound familiar?=Jews! See my post on the fact that the body of Christ is never referred to as a "nation of priest".The gospel of the kingdom: a kingdom, a king, and LAND. Not the Body of Christ. This has not happened-it will. The LORD God will fulfill the promises made to the Jews=Romans 11:25-29, 15:8...... =a kingdom, a king, land:

"...as the days of heaven upon the earth...." Deut. 11:21

"to a nation"? The body of Christ is never referred to as such(see my previous article), and our sphere of blessing is the heavenlies, not on earth=land! A kingdom=LAND, or "class dismissed". This is a promise to Jews!

The Genesis 12 Everlasting Covenant
-Genesis 17:7,19

That necessarily includes Resurrection.

Land-the land promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and Jacob's descedants: Gen. 13:17, 15:7,17:8, 26:3, 28:13; Heb. 11:8,9.

Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob die without receiving the promised land: Heb 11:13; Gen. 25:8, 34:29, 49:33; Acts 7:5

The land is specifically promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (and Jacob's descendents, including Daniel), and that they died without receiving that promised land.

The Land Promise is repeated or referred to more than any other promise: Genesis 12:7, 13:15, 13:17,15:7, 15:18, 26:3, 28:3-4.

Thus, we must come to one of several conclusions:

1. No Power: God did not have the power to fulfill the promise. Not likely! God introduced Himself to Abraham and Jacob in the following manner: "....I am Almighty God....." Gen. 17:1, 35:11.

2.God Changed His Mind: Nope! Acts 15:18, Malachi 3:6

3. God had a hidden, deeper, or higher goal than His literal promise. The real meaning of the land promise would be revealed after the death, burial, and resurrection, at Penntecost. Nope! The "spiritual goals" God has for us do not replace, reduce, or contradict the literal promises of God. This spiritualizing of Scripture has introduced the heresy of "Replacement" theology.

In the RESURRECTION God will fulfill the land promise exactly as written by raising up from the dead Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob(and Daniel and.................). This conclusion alone honors the promises of God and the faith of Abraham. When Abraham died, he had not received the promised land!(nor did Daniel!) In the resurrection,he and his faithful descendants will inherit the land exactly as promised.

"By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance(my emphasis-in the resurrection, as confirmed in Daniel 12:13=his "lot=his land inheritance in a resurrected body), obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went." Hebrews 11:8

In Matt 22:31 & 32 the Lord Jesus Christ, speaking to unbelieving Sadducees, connects God and Abraham to prove/confirm the doctrine of the resurrection.

"But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living"(resurrection-my emphasis).

Daniel 12:13: "But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest(in death), and stand in thy lot at the end of the days"(in resurrection attain the land inheritance-my emphasis).

Matt 8:11: "And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven"(resurrected in the land of "the kingdom of heaven"-my emphasis).

Daniel 2:44: " And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom(my emphasis-a kingdom is set up by force=a violent, sudden event with great force, while the body of Christ is being "built up"=a gradual, process-1 Cor. 3:9-11, Col. 2:7, Eph. 2:20-22), which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever."

No one can sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, unless they are raised from the dead.

unto Eternal life:
An everlasting covenant between GOD and Abraham demands everlasting life, an everlasting possession of the promised land to Abraham and his descendants demands the resurrection and everlasting life.

These facts of an everlasting covenant between God and Abraham, Gen.17:7 and the promise of an everlasting possession of the land given to Abraham(Gen 17:8), are the biblical foundation for our belief in the resurrection and eternal life, and the eternal inheritance of the Lord Jesus Christ Christ and the Jewish saints.

God will be faithful. The Romans 15:8 promise to the circumcision will happen, and this includes the land inheritance.

In Christ,

John M. Whalen

 

[GLJCA]

One of the huge problems with CT in this respect is that they will readily apply the PROMISES concerning Israel to the church of God..

BUT NOT THE CURSES...

Slight disconnect there imo..

Well I have said in the past and I will say again that in the covenant we are blessed when we obey but we the curses of the covenant are valid also if we disobey. We see this in the Jews being cut out of the covenant and the kingdom given to another nation who produces fruit.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Warnings of curses are given all through the New Testament just like they were in the Old Testament, but they largely go unheeded by Christians today.

GLJCA

 

[GLJCA]

Replacement theology-the body of Christ inherits the land!

"explicitly declares that all the land that God promised to Israel was given to them."

My comment: Where is your land?= "The word means what I say it means"(the queen to Alice "in Wonderland")=everlasting =temporary!

"And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing..." Genesis 12:2
"And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel." Ex. 19:6

"Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name: If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD." Jeremiah 31:35-37

"And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all." Ez. 37:22

'And I will make her that halted a remnant, and her that was cast far off a strong nation: and the LORD shall reign over them in mount Zion from henceforth, even for ever." Micah 4:7

Daniel is a summary of God's ultimate promise to restore the kingdom to Israel-the consumation. The period of days that occur during the last of the "70 weeks" include the resurrection of Daniel. When was he resurrected? The days of Daniel 12 were still future in the Lord Jesus Christ's day, since he referred to the abomination of desolation as still future in Mt. 24:15, and he specifically refers us to Daniel. The events were still future when Paul wrote 2 Thes. 2:3,4. Again, the events of Daniel 12 concerning the abomination of desolation were still future when the Lord Jesus Christ spoke, and the specific days relating to those events were numbered. Daniel was promised to be resurrected at the end of those days in which the abomination of desolation is in place. The article modifying "days", "the", is the article of the previous reference. The "days" of verse 13 refers to the days discussed in the previous verses-Chapter 12 "a time of trouble"="Jer. 30:7="/"at that time thy people" /"seal the book, even to the time of the end"=the end of the Great Trib, when the LORD God will make good on the covenental promises given to the JEWS(thy people"), including LAND:

The time of Jacob's trouble "pre-figured in Gen. 32:7:
"Then Jacob was greatly afraid and distressed..."


"For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it. And these are the words that the LORD spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah. For thus saith the LORD; We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness?Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble, but he shall be saved out of it." Jeremiah 30:4-7

This was not fulfilled in A.D. 70, as the Jews were driven out of the land, scattered, not saved, and fled in terror. This is future.


"and to seal up the vision and prophecy" 9:24
" ...., shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end..." 12:4

"And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end." 12:8-10

"...Many shall be purified....but the wise shall understand..." 12:10/" When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand.." Mt. 24:15 =Future!

"to shut up" means to cause a cessation or to completely fulfill. Thus, the vision and the prophecy are to be completely fulfilled. When was he resurrected? This is a reference to all visions and prophecies recorded in the Holy Bible, and all were revealed to the Jews, and all of it is sealed up in Israel. Daniel was commanded to seal up the book of prophecy until the time of the end, which was not at the cross, which was not at A.D. 70, meaning when the Jews would be returned to the LAND, and have it as their inheritance="stand in thy lot"(12:13).

"Jesus told the Jews in Matt 12 that the Kingdom was to be taken from them and given to a nation that is bringing forth the fruits required." This is "the little flock"-Jews, "the kingdom church". Does "a nation of priests" sound familiar?=Jews! See my post on the fact that the body of Christ is never referred to as a "nation of priest".The gospel of the kingdom: a kingdom, a king, and LAND. Not the Body of Christ. This has not happened-it will. The LORD God will fulfill the promises made to the Jews=Romans 11:25-29, 15:8...... =a kingdom, a king, land:

"...as the days of heaven upon the earth...." Deut. 11:21

"to a nation"? The body of Christ is never referred to as such(see my previous article), and our sphere of blessing is the heavenlies, not on earth=land! A kingdom=LAND, or "class dismissed". This is a promise to Jews!

The Genesis 12 Everlasting Covenant
-Genesis 17:7,19

That necessarily includes Resurrection.

Land-the land promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and Jacob's descedants: Gen. 13:17, 15:7,17:8, 26:3, 28:13; Heb. 11:8,9.

Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob die without receiving the promised land: Heb 11:13; Gen. 25:8, 34:29, 49:33; Acts 7:5

The land is specifically promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (and Jacob's descendents, including Daniel), and that they died without receiving that promised land.

The Land Promise is repeated or referred to more than any other promise: Genesis 12:7, 13:15, 13:17,15:7, 15:18, 26:3, 28:3-4.

Thus, we must come to one of several conclusions:

1. No Power: God did not have the power to fulfill the promise. Not likely! God introduced Himself to Abraham and Jacob in the following manner: "....I am Almighty God....." Gen. 17:1, 35:11.

2.God Changed His Mind: Nope! Acts 15:18, Malachi 3:6

3. God had a hidden, deeper, or higher goal than His literal promise. The real meaning of the land promise would be revealed after the death, burial, and resurrection, at Penntecost. Nope! The "spiritual goals" God has for us do not replace, reduce, or contradict the literal promises of God. This spiritualizing of Scripture has introduced the heresy of "Replacement" theology.

In the RESURRECTION God will fulfill the land promise exactly as written by raising up from the dead Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob(and Daniel and.................). This conclusion alone honors the promises of God and the faith of Abraham. When Abraham died, he had not received the promised land!(nor did Daniel!) In the resurrection,he and his faithful descendants will inherit the land exactly as promised.

"By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance(my emphasis-in the resurrection, as confirmed in Daniel 12:13=his "lot=his land inheritance in a resurrected body), obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went." Hebrews 11:8

In Matt 22:31 & 32 the Lord Jesus Christ, speaking to unbelieving Sadducees, connects God and Abraham to prove/confirm the doctrine of the resurrection.

"But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living"(resurrection-my emphasis).

Daniel 12:13: "But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest(in death), and stand in thy lot at the end of the days"(in resurrection attain the land inheritance-my emphasis).

Matt 8:11: "And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven"(resurrected in the land of "the kingdom of heaven"-my emphasis).

Daniel 2:44: " And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom(my emphasis-a kingdom is set up by force=a violent, sudden event with great force, while the body of Christ is being "built up"=a gradual, process-1 Cor. 3:9-11, Col. 2:7, Eph. 2:20-22), which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever."

No one can sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, unless they are raised from the dead.

unto Eternal life:
An everlasting covenant between GOD and Abraham demands everlasting life, an everlasting possession of the promised land to Abraham and his descendants demands the resurrection and everlasting life.

These facts of an everlasting covenant between God and Abraham, Gen.17:7 and the promise of an everlasting possession of the land given to Abraham(Gen 17:8), are the biblical foundation for our belief in the resurrection and eternal life, and the eternal inheritance of the Lord Jesus Christ Christ and the Jewish saints.

God will be faithful. The Romans 15:8 promise to the circumcision will happen, and this includes the land inheritance.

In Christ,

John M. Whalen

Oh here we go. Every time Dispys get into a discussion with someone who doesn't believe like them they throw out the Replacement Theology card.

I will say this one time and one time only. Please read carefully. Gentiles did not replace Israel in the Covenant. The Gentiles were grafted into Israel and joined in with the believing Jews that were already in the olive tree. There is no replacement there. There have been as many Gentile branches cut off of the olive tree since the first century as there were Jewish branches. You may remember Aninias and Saffira, and Simon the sorcerer just to name a couple.

Dispys love to bring up that accusation but it doesn't fit.

Where is my land? Look around you. The land promise was expanded to the whole world in Romans 4:13. We are told to Go into all of the world and preach the gospel. The meek shall inherit the earth not just a little bitty piece of land in the Middle East.

"And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel." Ex. 19:6

1Pe 2:9 But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Peter told these Christians who were in the body of Christ, the Church, that they were a chosen generation, a holy nation. Isn't it interesting that the Church is called the same thing that Israel was called in the OT?

The seed of Israel has never ceased from being a nation before God because even when the kingdom was taken from the nation of Israel, the seed of Israel which is the remnant of God still remained a nation before Him. Remember not all of the branches were cut out of the olive tree only the unbelieving ones.

It is late and I will have to finish this tomorrow.

GLJCA

GLJCA

 

[Markea]

Well I have said in the past and I will say again that in the covenant we are blessed when we obey but we the curses of the covenant are valid also if we disobey. We see this in the Jews being cut out of the covenant and the kingdom given to another nation who produces fruit.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Warnings of curses are given all through the New Testament just like they were in the Old Testament, but they largely go unheeded by Christians today.

GLJCA

I don't believe that I have ever met a 'reformed' brother who didn't believe in eternal security.. and so your reply here seems to indicate just that.. ie, that you believe that a Christian can lose their salvation.

We know that Israel was cut off.. so do you believe that members of the body of Christ can be cut off..? ie, those who have been sealed with the Spirit of promise which is the earnest of their inheritance until the redemption..?

 

[JMWHALEN]

Oh here we go. Every time Dispys get into a discussion with someone who doesn't believe like them they throw out the Replacement Theology card.

I will say this one time and one time only. Please read carefully. Gentiles did not replace Israel in the Covenant. The Gentiles were grafted into Israel and joined in with the believing Jews that were already in the olive tree. There is no replacement there. There have been as many Gentile branches cut off of the olive tree since the first century as there were Jewish branches. You may remember Aninias and Saffira, and Simon the sorcerer just to name a couple.

Dispys love to bring up that accusation but it doesn't fit.

Where is my land? Look around you. The land promise was expanded to the whole world in Romans 4:13. We are told to Go into all of the world and preach the gospel. The meek shall inherit the earth not just a little bitty piece of land in the Middle East.


1Pe 2:9 But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Peter told these Christians who were in the body of Christ, the Church, that they were a chosen generation, a holy nation. Isn't it interesting that the Church is called the same thing that Israel was called in the OT?

The seed of Israel has never ceased from being a nation before God because even when the kingdom was taken from the nation of Israel, the seed of Israel which is the remnant of God still remained a nation before Him. Remember not all of the branches were cut out of the olive tree only the unbelieving ones.

It is late and I will have to finish this tomorrow.

GLJCA

GLJCA

___
According to The Holy Bible, the land in dispute, upon which the Palestinians wish to form a state, was granted to Israel, not you. Because the LORD God has granted the land to Israel, the ownership is theirs, not yours. God's stated intention is that the regathered Israel would "dispossess" other peoples from the land designated for them. (Isaiah 54:2-3). Anyone even vaguely familiar with the covenants between the LORD God and Israel should understand that the land grants that God unilaterally conveyed upon Israel are an integral part of those covenants. This same land is being contended for by other parties who are in opposition to God’s declared intentions-the Arabs(Ishmael's family, Essau's family...............). Israel will be "...the chief of the nations..."(Jer. 31:7), on earth. on their land promised to them, not you, unconditionally by the LORD God. And replacement theology, like the actors of Islam, hold hands in this doctrine-they only disagree as to whose land it is.
The culmination of God’s redemptive plan, both spiritual and physical, i will only occur in conjunction with the spiritual restoration and physical rejuvenation of Israel. This is one of the primary themes of the prophets, stated over and over in the Holy Bible. Without an appreciation for the significance of the role Israel will play in the future, one cannot properly begin to grasp God’s prophetic program, as replacement theology demonstrates.

The Messiah, the Christ, had appeared, and all that had been written about Him would certainly be fulfilled, and all the covenants the LORD God made with the Jews, including the land covenant, "the promises made unto the fathers"(Romans 15:8), not the body of Christ, will be fulfilled. The Holy Bible is replete with many depictions of the LORD God’s rule over all the world from Jerusalem, with the Jews as "the chief of the nations"(Jer. 31:7), a rule of justice and goodness and peace, were at the forefront of Jewish thought when the Lord Jesus Christ appeared. When the heralds of the "good news", which is "the gospel of the kingdom", proclaimed that the Kingdom was at hand, that could only mean one thing: the King was here, the Lord Jesus Christ,and it was time for Israel to assume her role as the "chief of the nations", on earth, on a land promised to her, not the body of Christ, with the King of Israel ruling over her and the world.

As we know, all was not immediately fulfilled in His first appearance. But without question all of these prophecies will be fulfilled in His second appearance, and all covenants will be fulfilled shortly thereafter. The Lord Jesus Christs' close acquaintances understood this, asking Him just before He departed from them, "Lord, wilt at this time restore again(emphasis mine) the kingdom to Israel?"(Acts 1:6) These "unlearned and ignorant men"(Acts 4:13)men clearly understood that the fulfillment of the Kingdom and the restoration of Israel to the place of world preeminence are intimately connected events, and yet many self-acclaimed "religious experts", such as those in the Replacement Theology camp, do not, as intellectual manure is shoveled out at many seminaries,or, more aptly "cemetaries." Their fallacious arguments are refuted based on a literal reading of the Scriptures. But they continue their over-spiritualization of the Holy Bible, and thus, "the Church" inherits the land.
David was King of Judah and over all of Israel. Mary was promised that the Lord Jesus Christ would "reign over the house of Jacob for ever..."on "...the throne of his father David" (Lk. 1:32,33). David’s throne was not in heaven but in Jerusalem. David never ruled from heaven, nor will the Lord Jesus Christ rule over Israel restored to her land from heaven, but from earth. The body of Christ will reign in the heavenlies, and has NO LAND INHERITANCE.

"Where is my land? Look around you. The land promise was expanded to the whole world in Romans 4:13. We are told to Go into all of the world and preach the gospel. "

My comment: Romans 4:13 is an analogy, a spiritual application of the doctrine that just as Abraham and his seed will obtain the promise to be "heir of the world"=land by faith in the RESURRECTION, the body of Christ obtains salvation by this same principle-faith. The passage confirms that Abraham and his descendents will inherit the land by faith-resurrected bodies in the millennial kingdom. You have no part in this land inheritance.

"But, The LORD liveth, that brought up the children of Israel(my emphasis) from the land of the north, and from all the lands whither he had driven them: and I will bring them again into their land that I gave unto their fathers"(my emphasis). Jer. 16:15

The meek that shall inherit the earth are Jews, not you. Again, the old "all scripture is written to me" mind set:

"Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth." Mt. 5:5

"Thy people(emphasis mine-Israel, not the body of Christ) also shall be all righteous: they shall inherit the land for ever(my emphasis), the branch of my planting, the work of my hands, that I may be glorified"(my emphasis-for the glory of God-the purpose). Is. 60:21/Psalms 37:9,11,22,29,34

"not just a little bitty piece of land in the Middle East."

My comment: Read the OT-this is not just a "a little bitty piece of land in the Middle East". This includes not only Israel, but most of the land the Arabs presently control! Of course, to a replacement advocate, "the word means what I say it means"(the Queen to "Alice in Wonderland").


"1Pe 2:9 But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Peter told these Christians who were in the body of Christ, the Church, that they were a chosen generation, a holy nation. Isn't it interesting that the Church is called the same thing that Israel was called in the OT?"

My comment: Not written to the body of Christ.

And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel." Exodus 19:6:
" But ye shall be named the Priests of the LORD: men shall call you the Ministers of our God: ye shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves" Is. 61:6
"And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, saith the LORD." Is. 66:21
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" Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the STRANGERS(emphasis mine) scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,..." 1 Peter 1:1
(Strangers are Jews- Genesis 23:4, Lev. 25:23,Psalms 39:12, Hebrews 11:13, 1 Peter 2:11)
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"YE(emphasis mine, referring to Jews of 1:1) also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ." 1 Peter 2:5

"But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people.......(see Deut. 7:6"holy people", Deut. 14:2"holy people...peculiar people...above all the nations that are upon the earth", Deut. 26:18,19 "peculiar people...above all nations...holy people") 1 Peter 2:9

"And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father..." Rev. 1:6

"And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall REIGN ON EARTH(emphasis mine-Revelation 1:1 addressed to "his servants", a clear reference to Jews, the "children of Israel are servants" per Lev. 25:55, Hebrews 3:5-the body of Christ is never said to "reign on earth"-we are to reign in the heavenly places)

"... but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years." Rev. 20:6

Nowhere in Paul's epistles are members of the Body of Christ referred to as "priests", "kings", or "a holy nation". The Body of Christ is not a mediatorial body. In this "dispensation of the grace of God"(Eph. 3:2), there is "...one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus...."(1 Tim. 2:5), and his priesthood is in heaven, not on earth(Hebrews 8:4,5), and not after the law(Hebrews 7:14-28), but of the order of Melchisadec(Hebrews 5-7), not Levi. There WAS(past tense-in the future, the priesthood of Ex. 19:5,6 will be fulfilled ) only one earthly priesthood divinely appointed-the priesthood after the order of Levi "according to the law"(Hebrews 7:5,8:4) in "time past"(Gal. 1:13, Heb. 1:1).

One of the functions of the priesthood was access to God the Father. We now have access through the Lord Jesus Christ(Romans 5:1-2; Eph. 2:13,18;3:10-12). Members of the Body of Christ are "ambassadors"(2 Cor. 5:20),"ministers"(1 Cor. 3:5,4:1; 2 Cor. 6:4, 11:23; 1 Tim. 4:6), "stewards of the mysteries of God"(1 Cor. 4:1), "soldiers"(Philippians 2:25, 2 Tim. 2:3,4), but are never identified as "priests", "kings", nor will we "reign on earth"(Eph. 1:3,20; 2:6; Philippians 3:20; Col. 1:12,13; 1 Thes. 2:12; 2 Cor. 5:20).

And nowhere is the Body of Christ referred to as a "holy nation", or "a chosen generation". The term "holy nation" in scripture is reserved for Israel alone-she alone was chosen and "set apart"(the meaning of "holy") by the LORD God for His use from other nations:Ex. 11:7, 19:5,6; 33:16; Lev. 20:24; Numbers 23:9;Deut. 7:6,14:32,26:19;2 Sam. 7:23;1 Kings 8:53;Psalms 106:4,5, 135:4. And there is only one "chosen generation"('genos'='race' in context)-Israel: Is. 43:20,21, 44:1,2;Psalms 106:5.





In Christ,

John M. Whalen

 

[JM]

Israel: An Unbelieving People

Consider: http://www.ncbf.net/steve/nation_of_israel.html (this is a non dispensational link)

 

[GLJCA]

I don't believe that I have ever met a 'reformed' brother who didn't believe in eternal security.. and so your reply here seems to indicate just that.. ie, that you believe that a Christian can lose their salvation.

We know that Israel was cut off.. so do you believe that members of the body of Christ can be cut off..? ie, those who have been sealed with the Spirit of promise which is the earnest of their inheritance until the redemption..?

You have still not met a Reformed brother that doesn't believe in eternal security. I believe that those who are ordained to eternal life will be saved. They will persevere in the faith until the end. Those sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise will by all means inherit eternal life.

On the other hand there are many that you alluded to the other day that are sitting in the pews at church, that have been baptized into the covenant that will not go to heaven. Just as there were those in the OT such as those who came out of Egypt. They were baptized in the Red Sea, they drank from the Rock that was Christ, they ate manna from heaven, which was a shadow of Christ, the bread of heaven. They fell away and died in the wilderness and God refused to allow them to enter into His rest. These people will fall away in unbelief and since they do fall and die in that fallen state we know that they were not ordained to eternal life. They are the ones that had the outward sign of the covenant but did not have the inward sign.

1 Cor 15:1-2 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
Paul was not just trying to scare them. He was giving them a warning that if they don't keep in memory what he had preached to them that they could possibly fall away. Why else would Paul tell a group of believers that they could fall away? I mean what other scenario would he tell them this?

Heb 2:1 Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let [them] slip. 2 For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward; 3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard [him];

Escape what? Escape the just recompense of reward, ie. the curse of the covenant. In the covenant there are rewards and there are curses. One is rewarded for obedience and faith, and yet one is cursed for disobedience and unbelief.

Col 1:21-23 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in [your] mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight: If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and [be] not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, [and] which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

All these warnings are there for a purpose. The warnings are speaking to covenant members to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling for it is God who is working in them to will and to do of His good pleasure. It is all about God not man.

GLJCA