Dilemma

[Gwen'sMom]

Hi everyone, I haven't posted in a while but I have been looking at the posts. Here is what's happening with me:
I haven't been to church in a while. I started attending a small Corps with my 3 year old daughter. I had her dedicated back in December. Everything has been ok except for a couple of things. Since our Corps is so small we only have a tiny brass band and no Songsters. I just adore music and the sound of a choir (I went to a larger Corps a long time ago but only for a while). I even want to become a Soldier and be a Songster and I have made it known that I want to be a Soldier. They told me that I would have to become an adherant first and I had no problem with that but since it's a small church they seem to want to wait until they get more people who want to join. I really feel left out. Honestly, I just don't feel like going anymore and I have been absent for the last few weeks. I feel guilty about going to a larger Corps. Everyone has been so nice to me but is it possible that this Corps isn't serving my needs?

 

[mac8]

Hi

Warmest blessings. I am sorry you are having a difficult time.

I was also put through a very long period of delay and uncertainty and found it difficult and distressing.

I resolved it by signing privately, in the company of a couple of trusted and close friends. It did not make me a member of TSA, but it marked before God my understanding of what he was calling me to, and my intention to make myself accountable for that.

In doing so I accepted the littlest and smallest place, one of not even 'existing' in the church. And there is nothing wrong with that.

We had a celebration. If you have not already been through soldier preparation classes you should at least go through carefully the materials that are available publically. There are packs here and there available, and they are terrific. I also got the DVD's A Cause to Die For, and went through that, and did a course on evangelism and mission, so I had some idea beginning on how to live out my life as an invisible salvationist.

I never looked back. When I finally was enrolled with the army's countersignature, I found it a difficult experience because I had been hurt quite badly by then, but I am getting over the whole thing a couple of years later, and love this precious part of the body of Christ very much. I relocated, and being in a new corps also helped very much.

The church messes up sometimes, but God loves it, and us, to bits. :0)

Warmest blessings
Mac8

 

[Gwen'sMom]

Hi mac, thanks for your response. I have purchased and read Salvationism 101 from http://www.armybarmy.com/estore/ which covers the doctrines, the disciplines, and the distinctives of Salvationism and I am about to purchase Salvationism 201. Could it be true that a smaller Corps just doesn't have the time or resources to teach soldiership training? I don't want to be pushy or they might think I am weird but I want them to know how interested I am. But should I feel obligated to stay with this Corps just because my daughter was dedicated there?

 

[mac8]

Hi :0)

I believe in good communication! So it's all in order to be clear and remind people now and again that you are waiting for classes - your CO or the lay leader who will be responsible. I don't know anything about musical sections in the army,being almost totally unmusical! I can share other aspects of finding avenues of service if that's helpful? Sorry if it isn't!

I don't think anyone can tell you whether to stay or move to another corps. A new corps will want you to wait a period while they get to know you anyway so you may well find that you are frustrated in being unable to serve within their church framework for even longer.

Re finding your place of service. I would remind the corps warmly from time to time you are available if needed but accept graciously if they can't find a place of service for you. There is a whole world out there needing to hear the gospel and be reached with the practical and heart love of Christ, and so there is no shortage of work - even for a lone parent who works long hours. I've been there! You just have to be patient and search out what you can give and where. Let it feel little in the eyes of the church and the world, be comfortable with its smallness but be passionate to do it beautifully for God. Just think creatively and know that what you ARE is usually more important than what you DO.

Virtually as soon as I came back to Christ, and long before the corps had got to know me or trust me as a new Christian, I went out and found a situation where I could do some listening, gentle sharing of the gospel, and so on. I had to search around, but one opening led to another. I began in cyberspace in the first instance, going in to chat rooms, listening and sharing the gospel only with those who made clear they wanted to hear it. I let them tell me their bad news often at some length before I asked them if they would like to hear my good news, and then did it very gently. That led from one thing to another, and discipleship, and so on. One opening appeared on line, became a face-to-face opening, I did appropriate training (in faith accompaniment) , moved on to the next stage, did a course in urban church planting , and so on. I hunted for simple and cheap courses and ways of networking locally so I could find where I could be useful. I now have a fairly clear sense of what I can and cannot do with some confidence. As soon as it was necessary I found someone to be accountable to and have always worked in a framework somewhere.

So that was my approach. Not to wait for the army to find me something to do, but with my Articles of War in front of me, looking at it and wondering what does this mean I go out and do in my neighbourhood today? I listened to people, and one of the most important things was finding someone I felt could be a mentor and talk things over with. I try to be aware of what the other churches are doing and fit in nicely, and be conscious of what church endeavours have been tried and failed in a locality before as that also saves reinventing the wheel.

Salvationists need pioneering spirit, and enormous patience and sensitivity to cultural context, and graciousness with the wider church, which can be rigid and slow to deal, with but also a fund of years of experience to draw on. Over on the blog called slightlyirregular ( http://www.joenoland.blogspot.com/ ) commissioner Noland says:The goal must not be just to endure and survive; rather it must be to foster a culture within TSA that is vibrant, fresh, fearless, innovative and liberating (free from suppression).

Regarding finding a place where the worship really moved me, I gave up. It wasn't happening. I just decided to go to where I could be useful and learn to be with God deeply at home. And then, guess what? I landed up in a small corps here in Penzance where the music really rocks. :0) and I feel more moved in worship down here than I ever thought possible in a church setting. So be prepared that as you give something up for God, he is waiting to respond with yet more blessing!

Sorry if all of this is irrelevant, but I'm not sure how to picture your situation!
Warmest blessings
Mac8/Eleanor

 

[Gwen'sMom]

Hi Mac, I want to thank you for the time you have taken to help me. I have been speaking to our Sgt Mjr and he has started Adherency classes. I have missed 2 but I can still join. He never got my new phone number, that's why I didn't get a call! But if I had been attending our Sunday services I would have known (shame on me). I agree with you when you mentioned that going to a new Corps will only delay me becoming a member, at least here I am known to them. I'm very excited to know that I am on my way to becoming a Soldier soon one day. I truly know that it's what God is calling me for. It's something that I can't stop thinking about. Anyway our Sgt Mjr is going to give me the stuff they have been reading so I can get caught up. I prayed about this situation and everything turned out well, I'm so happy!!

 

[mac8]

Warmest blessings! :0)

The church usually gets there in the end if you are patient.

Eleanor
Sister under private vows

 

[OoraneeosMuse]

Gwen's Mom,

I am very blessed to hear of your earnest desire to be all the Lord is calling you to, VERY AWESOME! I think the most important issue before all things is our attitude "to go" and in this our Most Holy King is very, very touched and blessed. I have served Him faithfully for 10 years and I can honestly say you've touched His heart to tears of joy that you would wish to serve Him and offer your daughter to Him and His kingdom.
I wish to encourage you if I can in reminding you of a faithful son of God who waited his whole life to fulfill his mission, each day paticently waiting, praying, reading the Word and seeking his Father's face. Finally his day came and he started his service unto the Lord and effected many lives for the kingdom. He waited on his Father's timing in all that he did and God's perfect will was done, if it wasnt' for him I wouldn't have known God and become a Christian. The world knows this boy who became a mighty man of God as Jesus Christ...

Whatsoever we do, may we do it as unto the Lord,

William
oomuse.com/teachings.htm

 

[Gwen'sMom]

There is no better feeling in the world knowing that I may have please God with my decision to serve him. Just a couple of years ago only material things made me happy and I was so spoiled. I was missing out on SO MUCH

 

[Gwen'sMom]

There is no better feeling in the world knowing that I may have please God with my decision to serve him. Just a couple of years ago only material things made me happy and I was so spoiled. I was missing out on SO MUCH. I feel so privledged to be able to expose my daughter to the love of Jesus at an early age.

 

[Gwen'sMom]

Sorry for the double post. My finger slipped!!

 

[mac8]

Hi

I am glad things are working out. I liked what William said about waiting on God, but I think I approach it with a particular understanding. Nouwen shared in some of his writings that waiting is an active, not a passive process. I feel that if we are waiting on God for something, as we often have to, we need to ensure that that active process is a positive one.

So if I am waiting on God to open a door in a particular ministry, I don't sit there doing nothing, I try other doors patiently and if getting nowhere, I most definitely get on with something else for the kingdom. I would feel that if I was sitting there doing nothing I was not being faithful to my soldier's covenant. Even if the only thing I can do is prayerwalk the neighbourhood I will do that faithfully, and look for other avenues to open up. I feel that keeps me faithful to my covenant of service to God as a soldier and opens the way for God to show me in a practical way if in fact he wants me to take another route.

In terms of waiting for 'validation' in some form, such as church membership and so on, I feel again that this should be a very active process. I encourage people to be honest and open about where they are, celebrate what has happened so far in their growing faith and commitment, and affirm it any way they can. Every time I'm feeling discouraged about my vocation I make a commitment renewal and celebrate with friends and family! It is about going back to the covenant and saying yes, again and again, and celebrating it's life-giving ways of framing our spiritual journey. In a way it is about protecting our inner lives from the outward structured church, which can sometimes do usually unintentional, (but sometimes unavoidable) violence to us. We need to treat each other's inner lives as gently as possible, and also our own! So necessary waiting on God needs to be active and somehow made utterly positive, affirming every scrap of what God is saying in a spiritual journey sense but not in the sense of getting obsessed with a particular practical detail that you just may have wrong. Feel free to come back and disagree! I'm no expert here!

Warmest blessings
Eleanor
Sister under private vows
Penzance

 

[BoazB]

Hi. Greetings to you all. What OoraneeosMuse and Mac8 said is very true. I want to strongly endorse what Mac8 said about not waiting passively, but being active in waiting:

Whatever activities there are, try and be involved, even if they are not the ones that you are aiming at. This will show your seriousness, and make the guys sit up and take notice.

Don't just leave being Salvation Army to Corps... Try and get to Roots if you can. This will show more opportunities. This should also put you in touch with friends, and friends for your daughter. If yiou ever do move to another Corps, it will most likely be to where your daughter's, or your own friends are. And above all... enjoy where the Lord is taking you. Ask Him to open up new avenues in the corps for you.

Every blessing
BoazB

 

[Gwen'sMom]

I am learning so much from everyone who has responded. The waiting process is frustrating at times but I am also finding it necessary to fully appreciate what you have been waiting on.
I need to know more about Roots.

 

[BoazB]

Hasve a look under www.rootsonline.org
That should give you info. Don't use the above as a link, because I don't think it will work, but use your own internet search engine.

 

[OoraneeosMuse]

Gwen'sMom & All,

This thread is very powerful, from the roots up. Knowing that with each new day we start a new life in the Lord for His mercies are new every morning. I LOVE what mac8 said about being open and honest about what we are thinking and feeling, a quality all but lost in today's "plastic smile", "everything is great" type of communications. If I may, I'd like to encourage again in being an imitator of the Lord (1Cor 11:1). I am VERY glad that mac8 and BoazB has encouraged us all in active waiting, a quality that I'm very confident the Lord was as He waited for "His Ministry" to come to time. While He was "in wait" He fulfilled the ministry that we are all commanded to, the reconciliation of man to God. This command is summed up in Mat 28 and Mark 16 to "go unto all the world". Jesus as a youth was found in the temple persuading all who would listen in the things of His Father, to the relief of His earthly parents after being "lost" by them for days. He knew 'His ministry' was on the way yet but in the mean time He would fulfill His and all of our "general ministry", to go and preach the kingdom of heaven is at hand. Now to do this, we are not in the "eyes of the church" so to speak as this is done with our neighbors, work mates, school mates and so on and there will be very few "treasures on earth" for fulfilling this command but your rewards in heaven will be massive. ALL ministries are in SUPPORT of reconciling mankind to God and are secondary in priority to the Lord. I can speak in all confidence that there will never be a more important ministry for any of us than to go to the highways and bi-ways to "bring in" the harvest. Our Lord commanded us, not to pray for intercessors, Sunday school teachers, bus drivers or even pastor/leaders (not to say that praying for these is wrong but secondary in priority) but for HARVESTERS that the harvest/souls/people who where going to hell and are now on the path of righteousness may be brought to the support ministries to be trained for the work of the ministry. You see, as we are seeing in most corps/churches that numbers are dropping to dangerous levels because the support ministries are NOT fulfilling their primary function, the bringing in of the harvest.
With that said, I believe as you "wait on the Lord" for the fulfillment of your secondary ministry to let nothing stop you from fulfilling your primary ministry, showing the love of the Lord via acts of "the good Samaritan" which is loving the Lord with all your mind and stuff and by this seeing the lost come to Christ. The Lord is for you and with you with ALL excitement as you step into His primary plan for all of our earthly lives, the reconciliation of mankind to God.

2Co 5:18 Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation,
2Co 5:19 that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.
2Co 5:20 Now then, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were pleading through us: we implore you on Christ's behalf, be reconciled to God.
2Co 5:21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

Blood and Fire, Blood and Fire!

William

 

[Gwen'sMom]

Hasve a look under www.rootsonline.org
That should give you info. Don't use the above as a link, because I don't think it will work, but use your own internet search engine.

Hey http://www.rootsonline.org/ this worked! Thanks