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Digital Cameras

superjsuh

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hi, Anyone familiar with lots of digi cams? I'm looking to buy a camera that I can print good quality pictures .. I want something cheap though maybe in the $75-$150 range. Someone suggested buying off of ebay, maybe a canon powershot a60 or a70.. but i'm not sure! This camera will most likely be used for taking pictures of family members and such.. or maybe when we travel. Any suggestions?
 

MTC

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To be honest, if you buy a really cheap camera, you'll just end up wanting a better one and spending more money in the long run. Trust me on that.

I would not buy off of eBay, and I would make sure to get a reputable brand, IE Canon, Nikon, Fujifilm, Panasonic. Also, make sure to check out the retailer you buy it from. There are a lot of places that sell the camera for much less and do not include anything with it.

If you want really good quality pictures, I'd make sure to get a 6 MP or higher. And I would recommend the Canon PowerShot A540. $188 from Walmart.com.
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4698942

If you are absolutely adamant about your budget and don't want to spend any more than $150, perhaps the Olympus FE120 or if you can settle for 5 MP and slightly poorer image quality, the Canon PowerShot A530.

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4698943
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=5238360
 
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superjsuh

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To be honest, if you buy a really cheap camera, you'll just end up wanting a better one and spending more money in the long run. Trust me on that.

I would not buy off of eBay, and I would make sure to get a reputable brand, IE Canon, Nikon, Fujifilm, Panasonic. Also, make sure to check out the retailer you buy it from. There are a lot of places that sell the camera for much less and do not include anything with it.

If you want really good quality pictures, I'd make sure to get a 6 MP or higher. And I would recommend the Canon PowerShot A540. $188 from Walmart.com.
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4698942

If you are absolutely adamant about your budget and don't want to spend any more than $150, perhaps the Olympus FE120 or if you can settle for 5 MP and slightly poorer image quality, the Canon PowerShot A530.

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4698943
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=5238360
Thanks for the suggestion :)
 
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DragnGT

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I had a powershot a70 for my first digi cam. It was EASY to use and I liked it alot. But I think it's easy to say that you need atleast a 5mp camera to do good prints. It's a bit over kill if you look at them on the computer (depending on your screen resolution).
 
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superjsuh

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I had a powershot a70 for my first digi cam. It was EASY to use and I liked it alot. But I think it's easy to say that you need atleast a 5mp camera to do good prints. It's a bit over kill if you look at them on the computer (depending on your screen resolution).


Yeah I was thinking about that.. I do want to have bigger prints available.. but darn, most of the 4+MP cameras are EXPENSIVE! but I do agree witht he previous post.. I had bought a kodak camera 2 or 3 years ago.. and then I wanted to upgrade within less than a few months lol.. so i don't want to be stuck in that situation again
 
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TexasCatholic

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That being said, the nicer Kodaks are hard to beat, especially for a novice, to create high quality pictures. I agree on the megapixel count, though, I think 4.0megapixel will create plenty of sharp images for 4x6 prints. I prefer shooting at higher resolutions so I can crop things without losing the ability to print.

I use an 8.0 megapixel Konica-Minolta DiMage A200, which is my 2nd digicam. My first one was a cheap Kodak 2.0 megapixel and the very reason I bought a new camera was I had some POTENTIALLY great shots ruined by a sub-par camera. Spend the extra money and you won't be sorry at all!

Of course, now that I have an $800 high-end digital, i've hit the "ceiling" and the only way to go now is to a digital SLR... Whew, it's a crazy ride :) Someone load me a couple of thousand bucks, please :D

-Michael
 
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TexasCatholic

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Case in point, here's an image I took of the Cathedral Basilica of St. Louis with my 2.0 megapixel camera:

CLICK HERE

And here is the same church taken at a later date with my 8.0 megapixel Konica Minolta:

CLICK HERE

Note, these are both severely shrunken down images, but even at these low resolutions, you can see that the QUALITY of the camera and lense are EXTREMELY important.

I will say this only once: CAMERAS WITH SMALL, COMPACT LENSES TAKE WORSE PICTURES THAN CAMERAS WITH BIG LENSES. :) There, I said it. I dont' care if it's 16.0 megapixels, if it's an ultra-slim that fits in your shirt pocket, the pics are gonna be junk.

-Michael
 
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superjsuh

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Case in point, here's an image I took of the Cathedral Basilica of St. Louis with my 2.0 megapixel camera:

CLICK HERE

And here is the same church taken at a later date with my 8.0 megapixel Konica Minolta:

CLICK HERE

Note, these are both severely shrunken down images, but even at these low resolutions, you can see that the QUALITY of the camera and lense are EXTREMELY important.

I will say this only once: CAMERAS WITH SMALL, COMPACT LENSES TAKE WORSE PICTURES THAN CAMERAS WITH BIG LENSES. :) There, I said it. I dont' care if it's 16.0 megapixels, if it's an ultra-slim that fits in your shirt pocket, the pics are gonna be junk.

-Michael

Thanks for sharing the pics.. That is a nice camera you have! especially for the price! LOL.. are you a professional photographer or, is this just a hobbie?

I don't know if anyone understand my problem.. but I've had a kodak 2.0 megapixel camera, and then I had a fujifilm 2.0 mp camera.. I liked the quality of the fujifilm better, for some reason.. the kodak just seemed like it took 'disposable' camera pictures.. I had to use flash alot with the kodak, and I'm not a flash person lol.. I want a camera that takes good quality pictures.. also mykodak seemed to deform the pictures.. making them seem wider than normal.. Maybe it was just me lol..

eh, I don't think i'll ever buy a digital SLR LOL too pricey, unless I go into photography. But it would be nice to have one.. the pictures are priceless.
 
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MTC

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I wouldn't say that all "pocket-size" digicams take bad pictures. But; an SLR or a point and shoot with a longer lense (Powershot S3, Cybershot S2, etc.) will be far better. Case in point, here are two pictures from Wyoming of roughly the same thing. The first was taken with my 4 MP Fuji A360, and the second with my dad's 10 MP Canon XTI.

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n283/cmanmt/Wyoming/DSCF1479.jpg

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n283/cmanmt/Wyoming/IMG_0140.jpg


The picture taken with the Fuji isn't neccesarily bad, but the higher MP's and better lense of the XTI make it look horrible.
 
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TexasCatholic

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Thanks for sharing the pics.. That is a nice camera you have! especially for the price! LOL.. are you a professional photographer or, is this just a hobbie?
....
eh, I don't think i'll ever buy a digital SLR LOL too pricey, unless I go into photography. But it would be nice to have one.. the pictures are priceless.

I'm a total amateur hobbyist who's looking to become a better hobbyist with time. My next camera will definitely be a dSLR, probably a Canon in the affordable range.

You're right about the better quality cameras. But keep in mind, Kodak makes a vast line of cameras. Their low end ones don't even resemble their midrange or high end ones. I myself don't want a Kodak, as they don't make consumer-level SLRs, but I bought a Kodak 4.0 megapixel for my wife a couple of Christmases ago. It takes good pictures over and over, if you are mainly taking fairly family pictures and such.

From what you say, though, about not liking to use flash, it sounds like a high-end "prosumer" or a dSLR is your cup of tea, because you can crank them to 800 or 1600 ISO, require less light, no flash, and still get clear pictures. You just cannot, cannot, cannot do this with any low end camera. Even my DiMage A200 8.0megapixel takes very grainy pictures at ISO 800. I would use 400 ISO only for pics I intend to make into 4x6 prints (max) or publish on the web. Whereas, with a Canon Rebel XT or XTi, you can take ISO 1600 shots, no flash, and get clear low-noise pictures that are suitable for 8x10's if you want....and never say you'd never want one... you just don't know what picture is going to turn out great until you look at them later :)

If I had known about the need for high ISO capability, I would have probably held out for a dSLR from the beginning, but I really didn't understand the NEED for this until after I shot a couple of thousand pics. I kept trying to stay at ISO 200 or lower for clarity and kept getting blurry shots due to slow shutter speeds.... Once I figured out that cranking the ISO fixed this, I was dismayed at the digital noise. The only way to fix that is to get a dSLR. You can get a Canon Rebel XTi setup with a basic lense for under $1,000 and even if you leave it on "auto" you will take better pictures than most people have EVER taken.

Barring that option, I'd look at the high-end of the regular digitals (non-SLR) if you are sure you want to rarely use the flash. The latest one from Sony is great, but again, expect to spend $600-800.

It's well worth it, though. Once you get just one nice series of gorgeous pictures, you'll happily take every point-and-shoot piece of pocket junk and throw it right in the trash! Imagine how great all your old pics would have been with the right camera :)

Now, that all said, here's a couple of examples of what you can do with a high-end non-dSLR, e.g. the DiMage A200 (discontinued) or perhaps one of the current Nikon, Canon or Sony's. FULL 8mp images.

HIPPO AT ST. LOUIS ZOO IN 2005

GLASS KISSES AT TEXAS RENAISSANCE FEST THIS WEEKEND

Caveat: the image of glasses was taken at ISO 400 w/ no flash, but I had to use an image noise reducer (Neat Image freeware) to get the "glass" smooth image you see here... But, if you want to avoid an SLR, there's your ticket :)

Good luck,

Michael
 
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superjsuh

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I'm a total amateur hobbyist who's looking to become a better hobbyist with time. My next camera will definitely be a dSLR, probably a Canon in the affordable range.

You're right about the better quality cameras. But keep in mind, Kodak makes a vast line of cameras. Their low end ones don't even resemble their midrange or high end ones. I myself don't want a Kodak, as they don't make consumer-level SLRs, but I bought a Kodak 4.0 megapixel for my wife a couple of Christmases ago. It takes good pictures over and over, if you are mainly taking fairly family pictures and such.

From what you say, though, about not liking to use flash, it sounds like a high-end "prosumer" or a dSLR is your cup of tea, because you can crank them to 800 or 1600 ISO, require less light, no flash, and still get clear pictures. You just cannot, cannot, cannot do this with any low end camera. Even my DiMage A200 8.0megapixel takes very grainy pictures at ISO 800. I would use 400 ISO only for pics I intend to make into 4x6 prints (max) or publish on the web. Whereas, with a Canon Rebel XT or XTi, you can take ISO 1600 shots, no flash, and get clear low-noise pictures that are suitable for 8x10's if you want....and never say you'd never want one... you just don't know what picture is going to turn out great until you look at them later :)

If I had known about the need for high ISO capability, I would have probably held out for a dSLR from the beginning, but I really didn't understand the NEED for this until after I shot a couple of thousand pics. I kept trying to stay at ISO 200 or lower for clarity and kept getting blurry shots due to slow shutter speeds.... Once I figured out that cranking the ISO fixed this, I was dismayed at the digital noise. The only way to fix that is to get a dSLR. You can get a Canon Rebel XTi setup with a basic lense for under $1,000 and even if you leave it on "auto" you will take better pictures than most people have EVER taken.

Barring that option, I'd look at the high-end of the regular digitals (non-SLR) if you are sure you want to rarely use the flash. The latest one from Sony is great, but again, expect to spend $600-800.

It's well worth it, though. Once you get just one nice series of gorgeous pictures, you'll happily take every point-and-shoot piece of pocket junk and throw it right in the trash! Imagine how great all your old pics would have been with the right camera :)

Now, that all said, here's a couple of examples of what you can do with a high-end non-dSLR, e.g. the DiMage A200 (discontinued) or perhaps one of the current Nikon, Canon or Sony's. FULL 8mp images.

HIPPO AT ST. LOUIS ZOO IN 2005

GLASS KISSES AT TEXAS RENAISSANCE FEST THIS WEEKEND

Caveat: the image of glasses was taken at ISO 400 w/ no flash, but I had to use an image noise reducer (Neat Image freeware) to get the "glass" smooth image you see here... But, if you want to avoid an SLR, there's your ticket :)

Good luck,

Michael


Michael thanks for your suggestions.. nice pictures btw, never seen glass kisses before :)
 
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sfs

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The megapixel count only matters for making larger prints, or for cropping aggressively. 3-4 megapixels should be plenty for making good 5x7's (maybe 8x10's), and 6 megapixel is plenty for 8x10's. Here is a picture I cropped to well under 1 megapixel (from a 3.2 Mp Canon PowerShot A75 -- nothing fancy); I wouldn't want to print a 5x7 from it, but it would be fine for a 4x6 or for web use. As others have said, lens quality matters more than megapixels.

Personally, I would never consider the higher-end non-DSLRs -- if you're going to sink that kind of money into a camera, there's just so much more potential in an SLR.
 
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TexasCatholic

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I can't really disagree, since I am now wishing I had gone for a Canon Rebel XT instead. Though, the lense quality in the high-end non-dSLRs is quite good. An equivalent lense for an SLR will run a thousand dollars or more by itself. See for instance the Carl Zeiss lenses on some of the nice Sony Cybershots like the H5 (or the lense on the now defunct Konica Minolta A2 or A200). Those aren't a bad choice in the $400-600 range. You really will have to spend $1200-1500 to get into a basic dSLR and all the necessary accessories. For most people, this type of camera will produce pictures better than they ever imagined they could take.... and that's on Auto settings!

Also, there are areas where a dSLR simply cannot do some of the things you can do with a high-end digital. For instance, swivel screens (shoot pics from over your head or down on the ground), live image and exposure preview, movie mode, wide and zoom all-in-one with no extra cost (for instance, my camera does 28mm to 200mm with no add-on lense and many do more than this), as well as some nifty other things like wireless picture transfer.

But, alas, a dSLR does shoot faster, clearer at higher ISOs, and is expandable/changeable with lenses. But it's not for everyone and most people wouldn't even utilize the extra capabilities and would, in fact, benefit more from the neato features that come on the higher end consumer digitals. As much as I'm not a huge fan of buying a non-traditional brand of camera, the Sony Cybershots pretty much wipe the floor with the other ones when it comes to great pictures with zero knowledge and skills.

-Michael
 
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