Did the US blow up the Nord Stream Pipeline?

[Pavel Mosko]

There are two likely suspects between Russia and the US (or some of their allies operating on their behalf). In this country it often is depicted as a likely Russian attack. I somewhat considered this myself in terms of Russia getting mad that countries like Sweden were joining NATO and increasing the amount of hostile troops on it's border, or maybe even as some kind of false flag by the Russians to blame the US...

But there is a lot more reason to believe that the US or one of it's allies was behind it as this video mentions.

1) Biden himself made a threat against the pipeline before the Ukrainian war happened. see the little video linked in the next post.


2) As many pointed out the Russians had already cut Europe off threatening their winter and causing heating prices to spike. The pipeline gives them leverage by virtue of existing as a way of rewarding compliance if Europe changes its mind. Besides this Putin for decades has been more a cold and calculating leader than an emotional one. (It is interesting that Europeans, especially your average German actually believes the US did it or was behind it. )


3) Blowing up the pipeline would be a good way of locking the European union in the arrangement.


4) I personally could see how doing this would be another way of pushing "Green Energy" that the elite seem bent on doing regardless of the cost to create their New World Order.


5) Their are personal financial interests at work as far as the elite trying to buy up assets in Ukraine and even Russia for pennies on the dollar. (Russia is not the only country that has "oligarchs".) I have mentioned before that the push to expand NATO eastward does not make sense from a stand point of national interest. If the US funds a huge chunk or NATO why would you keep expanding and increasing you liability? How exactly does this benefit the US?


6) I believe doing so would help Biden politically. Biden is extremely unpopular right now, if he could win this war he could claim one solid accomplishment of defeating "the worst genocidal leader since Hitler" or some other similar campaign slogan.


7) Doing #6 for nakedly political reasons normally would be extremely risky, but Biden has evaded other scandals from the FBI, News media, and Social media running interference and even preemptively censoring and suppressing stories on his behalf, so why should this be any different?

 

[Pavel Mosko]

Biden vaguely promises "to bring an end to Nord Stream II" on Feb 7.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/FVbEoZXhCrM


I got say blowing up the pipeline is a very Sun Tzu move from the stand point of the US. Normally we would be afraid of environmental problems like oil spills, but by virtue or Russia cutting off the pipeline for a few months to punish Europe that eventually actually frees the hand of the US to blow it up and remove it's leverage power!

 

[Fantine]

What you say sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

 

[Brother-Mike]

I've heard other opinions too, such as various proxies of the US, or even Mossad who likely have the capability of a complex operation like this. My vote at this point is that all bets are valid (but I'd put the Russians well below the US as candidates).

To discount any options at this point as "conspiracy theory" is to display a remarkable naïveté and lack of historical awareness that's, sadly, a good part of the reason why the war in Ukraine happened and continues.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Any time I hear anyone mention anything about "New World Order" I think of one of two things:

WCW and the NWO from the late 90's
Conspiracy theories

 

[Dave G.]

Meanwhile Israel sits on billions of cubic ft of natural gas. Just saying, not ruling anyone out, follow the money and who might benefit from a blown up pipeline. They sit in the wings ready to sell to Europe and it just so happens the opposing source of energy gets cut off.. My understanding is this would happen through Egypt, Israel getting the raw source income Egypt the mark up .

But far be it from me to actually know anything. Except this could spark Russia against Israel which sprouts another whole set of theories theologically/prophecy etc.

 

[Halbhh]

There are two likely suspects between Russia and the US (or some of their allies operating on their behalf). In this country it often is depicted as a likely Russian attack. I somewhat considered this myself in terms of Russia getting mad that countries like Sweden were joining NATO and increasing the amount of hostile troops on it's border, or maybe even as some kind of false flag by the Russians to blame the US...

But there is a lot more reason to believe that the US or one of it's allies was behind it as this video mentions.

1) Biden himself made a threat against the pipeline before the Ukrainian war happened. see the little video linked in the next post.


2) As many pointed out the Russians had already cut Europe off threatening their winter and causing heating prices to spike. The pipeline gives them leverage by virtue of existing as a way of rewarding compliance if Europe changes its mind. Besides this Putin for decades has been more a cold and calculating leader than an emotional one. (It is interesting that Europeans, especially your average German actually believes the US did it or was behind it. )


3) Blowing up the pipeline would be a good way of locking the European union in the arrangement.


4) I personally could see how doing this would be another way of pushing "Green Energy" that the elite seem bent on doing regardless of the cost to create their New World Order.


5) Their are personal financial interests at work as far as the elite trying to buy up assets in Ukraine and even Russia for pennies on the dollar. (Russia is not the only country that has "oligarchs".) I have mentioned before that the push to expand NATO eastward does not make sense from a stand point of national interest. If the US funds a huge chunk or NATO why would you keep expanding and increasing you liability? How exactly does this benefit the US?


6) I believe doing so would help Biden politically. Biden is extremely unpopular right now, if he could win this war he could claim one solid accomplishment of defeating "the worst genocidal leader since Hitler" or some other similar campaign slogan.


7) Doing #6 for nakedly political reasons normally would be extremely risky, but Biden has evaded other scandals from the FBI, News media, and Social media running interference and even preemptively censoring and suppressing stories on his behalf, so why should this be any different?

Thinking about Russia's real aim/goal, it makes sense Russia might have done it. Here's why.

Germany stopped Nord2 itself, already, in March. 100% stopped.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/31/the...s-abandoned-after-russia-invaded-ukraine.html

So, that was way back in March... And Putin lost some leverage there...

So, he looked for more leverage, with the remaining main gas pipeline Nord Stream 1.

So, Putin tried slowing gas in Nord 1, stopping it temporarily for maintenance, warning Europe, etc....

Finally, over time, Russia's advance stalling out, ended....Putin is getting more desperate....

So, he did this, a month ago:

NordStream 1:
Russia has cut off gas supplies to Europe indefinitely.

• Russia claims punitive economic sanctions imposed by the West are responsible for the indefinite halt to gas supplies via Europe’s main pipeline.
• It represents the clearest indication yet that the Kremlin is seeking to force Europe to lift the economic measures in order for Moscow to turn the taps back on ahead of winter.
• “This latest move has significantly increased the risk that Europe may not get further gas flows through Nord Stream 1 for the whole winter,” analysts at energy consultancy Rystad Energy said in a research note.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/09/06/energy-crisis-why-has-russia-cut-off-gas-supplies-to-europe.html

So, now there is only a flow to far Southeast Europe/Hungary, through TurkStream.

But, even shutting NordStream 1 probably won't work for Putin's real aim.

Let's consider that: his real aim.

Putin's feeling for how he wants the world to be is always threatened while democracy is around, because it threatens to end Putin...

Europe is almost entirely democracies that are fully working, the real thing -- actual democracy. Which Putin had way too much taste of in 2011 in the Russian protests.... (the same kind of protests he'd watched end other governments in all sorts of other countries, including Russia once, along with all of the Iron Curtain nations, etc., happening again: Rally Defying Putin’s Party Draws Tens of Thousands (Published 2011))

And now, today, Europe mostly realizes this is an existential struggle for democracy itself to survive vs. the manipulation, power and control by autocracy from Russia, since Russia has been doing many things that have gradually come to light to fund groups and to manipulate European elections and political parties to try to make democracy itself begin to fail, become less and less viable. To try to replace democracies with friendly autocracies.

Europe now knows/realizes this, generally....

So, Europe will have trouble with sharply higher gas prices (5-6 time higher at the moment, but also likely to come down it's projected...) -- it will be hard for Europe, sure, but I think they realize those bigger stakes, so they won't stop supporting Ukraine even if they have to set their most of their thermostats down to 50F or such...

The really big support is from the U.S. and and to a lesser extent from a few other nations like the U.K. Those nations aren't going to give up on Ukraine....

So, Putin doesn't really have as much leverage as he'd like. But...he is desperate.

Because it's clear to everyone he is losing, and there's no clear way to avoid it.

Here's why: Russians don't really have strong motivation to kill Ukrainians-- especially not truly huge mass murder in the hundreds of thousands or millions which would cause Russia itself to erupt in rebellion against Putin, so massive nuclear strikes won't do it (it wouldn't take Ukraine, but would just make Putin's position a lot more dangerous to him, internally).

But Ukrainians do have strong motivation to be free of Russian control and brutality and they will certainly not give up fighting for their lives and freedom and land.

So, maybe the U.S., but it makes more sense Russia. It fits more pieces better it's Russia. If the U.S., it's not nearly enough, since Nord 1 could be restarted at will.

Still, it's plausible to build up reasons to see either nation as the actor there. But, it helps Russia more at the moment I think because the Russian goal is for European people to demand their governments end the sanctions. That's not going to happen I think, because too many people see Putin for what he is, his real actions, laid bare to see.

 

[BobRyan]

There are two likely suspects between Russia and the US (or some of their allies operating on their behalf). In this country it often is depicted as a likely Russian attack.

I don't think the U.S. has much of an incentive to do it - since it weakens both the NATO countries and Russia instead of "Just Russia". However Russia has already been trying to blackmail Europe with shutting it down so they clearly see the shut down as a threat to Europe that they are willing to make.

Norway, Poland and other EU countries are now more focused on the gas pipeline from Norway...

A month ago

NordStream 1:
Russia has cut off gas supplies to Europe indefinitely.

• Russia claims punitive economic sanctions imposed by the West are responsible for the indefinite halt to gas supplies via Europe’s main pipeline.
• It represents the clearest indication yet that the Kremlin is seeking to force Europe to lift the economic measures in order for Moscow to turn the taps back on ahead of winter.
• “This latest move has significantly increased the risk that Europe may not get further gas flows through Nord Stream 1 for the whole winter,” analysts at energy consultancy Rystad Energy said in a research note.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/09/06/energy-crisis-why-has-russia-cut-off-gas-supplies-to-europe.html

So, now there is only a flow to far Southeast Europe/Hungary, through TurkStream.

But, even shutting NordStream 1 probably won't work for Putin's real aim.

Let's consider that: his real aim.

Putin's feeling for how he wants the world to be is always threatened while democracy is around, because it threatens to end Putin...

Europe is almost entirely democracies that are fully working, the real thing -- actual democracy. Which Putin had way too much taste of in 2011 in the Russian protests.... (the same kind of protests he'd watched end other governments in all sorts of other countries, including Russia once, along with all of the Iron Curtain nations, etc., happening again: Rally Defying Putin’s Party Draws Tens of Thousands (Published 2011))

And now, today, Europe mostly realizes this is an existential struggle for democracy itself to survive vs. the manipulation, power and control by autocracy from Russia, since Russia has been doing many things that have gradually come to light to fund groups and to manipulate European elections and political parties to try to make democracy itself begin to fail, become less and less viable. To try to replace democracies with friendly autocracies.

Europe now knows/realizes this, generally....

So, Europe will have trouble with sharply higher gas prices (5-6 time higher at the moment, but also likely to come down it's projected...) -- it will be hard for Europe, sure, but I think they realize those bigger stakes, so they won't stop supporting Ukraine even if they have to set their most of their thermostats down to 50F or such...

The really big support is from the U.S. and and to a lesser extent from a few other nations like the U.K. Those nations aren't going to give up on Ukraine....

So, Putin doesn't really have as much leverage as he'd like. But...he is desperate.

Because it's clear to everyone he is losing, and there's no clear way to avoid it.

Here's why: Russians don't really have strong motivation to kill Ukrainians-- especially not truly huge mass murder in the hundreds of thousands or millions which would cause Russia itself to erupt in rebellion against Putin, so massive nuclear strikes won't do it (it wouldn't take Ukraine, but would just make Putin's position a lot more dangerous to him, internally).

But Ukrainians do have strong motivation to be free of Russian control and brutality and they will certainly not give up fighting for their lives and freedom and land.

So, maybe the U.S., but it makes more sense Russia. It fits more pieces better it's Russia. If the U.S., it's not nearly enough, since Nord 1 could be restarted at will.

Still, it's plausible to build up reasons to see either nation as the actor there. But, it helps Russia more at the moment I think because the Russian goal is for European people to demand their governments end the sanctions. That's not going to happen I think, because too many people see Putin for what he is, his real actions, laid bare to see.

 

[Thomas White]

Putin is under pressure from a crumbling economy. Russians want the pipeline to be restored to full operation. Now that it has been blown up, there is less pressure on Putin to ease tensions because the pipeline can't be restored. In addition, he can use it as propaganda to fuel distrust of the West. With the way the war has turned, he needs that propaganda to save face. He needs a target that will anger the Russian people.

 

[iarwain]

Could be Russia, could be US, could be someone else. I certainly don't know. But Biden did say he would put an end to it if Russia invaded Ukraine, and that is not a conspiracy theory.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

What you say sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

There was a conspiracy to sabotage the Nordstream pipeline. That cannot be doubted. The question, then, is not whether we believe in a conspiracy theory, but which conspiracy theory we believe in.

The US certainly has opportunity and motive. I see no reason to rule it out as a possibility at this point. It certainly seems more plausible than the Russians taking out their own pipeline they invested so much of their resources into building…

 

[Ray Glenn]

Putin is under pressure from a crumbling economy. Russians want the pipeline to be restored to full operation. Now that it has been blown up, there is less pressure on Putin to ease tensions because the pipeline can't be restored. In addition, he can use it as propaganda to fuel distrust of the West. With the way the war has turned, he needs that propaganda to save face. He needs a target that will anger the Russian people.

Please read first: Why the Russian economy keeps beating expectations

The absolute worst thing anyone can do is to recite the US Main Street Media.

If there is a coming economic collapse in Russia ....it hasn't started yet. Russia doesn't blindly follow the myth of climate change. He's making billions on the plight of the foolishness of the European Union putting their future in the hands of the Russians. Handled correctly, Russia could place themselves to be the next king while the falling German economy loses it's place. Russia is the wealthiest country in the world regarding raw material wealth. Our fault? Depending of people with the worst degrees in universites telling us what is real.

 

[Brother-Mike]

Please read first: Why the Russian economy keeps beating expectations

The absolute worst thing anyone can do is to recite the US Main Street Media.

If there is a coming economic collapse in Russia ....it hasn't started yet. Russia doesn't blindly follow the myth of climate change. He's making billions on the plight of the foolishness of the European Union putting their future in the hands of the Russians. Handled correctly, Russia could place themselves to be the next king while the falling German economy loses it's place. Russia is the wealthiest country in the world regarding raw material wealth. Our fault? Depending of people with the worst degrees in universites telling us what is real.

Can't disagree with any of your points, other than to quibble a bit with Russia's economic positioning (i.e. I consider it essentially a vassal-state, given it's GDP is about the same as Florida or Italy, while still possessing the raw material you mention).

Still, you're thinking outside The Narrative, so unfortunately I am going to have to give you a yellow-card penalty and sentence you to one week of CNN

PS. if I really put on my fancy tin-foil hat, the one with the little bells and fly-tassles, it would be tempting to see this entire charade as a concerted effort between the US and Russia to destroy Europe (i.e. wipe out what's left of EU energy capability after years of klimate kool-aid, when the dust settles the US and Russia can divide and economically conquer the carcass, etc). China's already a dead-man walking, so this just sort of fast-forwards to a post-EU collapse world order that isn't that far off from pre-'89 geopolitics. The "Great Reset" is just a hard-boot back to stable, everyone-knows-who-their-enemies-are Cold War dualities.

 

[Ray Glenn]

Can't disagree with any of your points, other than to quibble a bit with Russia's economic positioning (i.e. I consider it essentially a vassal-state, given it's GDP is about the same as Florida or Italy, while still possessing the raw material you mention).

Still, you're thinking outside The Narrative, so unfortunately I am going to have to give you a yellow-card penalty and sentence you to one week of CNN

PS. if I really put on my fancy tin-foil hat, the one with the little bells and fly-tassles, it would be tempting to see this entire charade as a concerted effort between the US and Russia to destroy Europe (i.e. wipe out what's left of EU energy capability after years of klimate kool-aid, when the dust settles the US and Russia can divide and economically conquer the carcass, etc). China's already a dead-man walking, so this just sort of fast-forwards to a post-EU collapse world order that isn't that far off from pre-'89 geopolitics. The "Great Reset" is just a hard-boot back to stable, everyone-knows-who-their-enemies-are Cold War dualities.

Challenging without regard to their positioning. Russia is not involved in the Green act of economic suicide. Europe has painted themselves into that corner. Let's consider my statement Green Suicide. Europe is two years in front of the US in terms of Green Suicide. We'll touch on that then look at the myth of economic realities concerning Russia. Their currency value climbed as a result of the gas and oil selling due to immediate needs of Europe. That need will increase this winter, it will not decrease. Where exactly did that demand originate ? The US. Biden war on fossil fuels. Biden forced Germany and the European Union into the hands of Russia. Another myth of the sanctions and glorified positions of US based companies ....My favorites ...McDonald's, Burger King, KFC all positioned themselves to be self sacrificing to the whims of anti Russia invasion of Ukraine ..... Why are they still operating in Russia?

The US News Media convinced the nation that all those frachises closed for the glory of the New World Order in a shining example of self sacrfice ......They are still operating in an economy that is not crashing daily .... sad but true. In spite of a mismanged war effort .....Russia is on solid ground economically ....the true accounts of economic news prevails ....

Russia disagrees with the New Green Deal. China nods their collective heads and continues to open new coal plants each month. India reopened their coal mines for power production ....The only fools in the hunt are Europe and North America ...

Russia's problem? Exactly what I predicted and what the US must not follow either. Position your conventional forces to be incapable of winning a ground war. That forces leadership to consider the use of tactical nukes. otherwise lose 40-60 thousand more troops as a sacrifice ..


Hahahha ....Please don't send to the CNN funny farm ....I had a night stay at the Airport Hilton in Chicago. I was on the phone with our marketing secretary ....CNN was on ...I was actually looking down at the terminal. I commented, "Something is wrong ....everyone is leaving the terminal and gathering on the far end of the parking area outside the building. Planes are not unloading now, they are parked nose to tail along the tarmac. The airport has actually closed down."

Later that night ...Fox reports that a passenger had cleared the departing gate, turned and ran back in past security ...They never found the passenger. CNN reported that a bomb threat had occured ....there never was a bomb threat. The following morning, I was arriving to board my plane on my orginal flight and was stopped by CNN for an interview ....'For what exactly? I have no knowledge about what happened and could care less about what you as a network want to make up about the incident." They didn't bother to interview me ....didn't fit the narrative.

 

[The Barbarian]

What you say sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

In fact, intelligence agencies have determined that Russian assets touted the story and are spreading it on social media in the US. In fact, Putin himself came up with the conspiracy theory:

TBILISI/LONDON, Sept 30 (Reuters) - Russian President Vladimir Putin on Friday blamed the United States and its allies for blowing up the undersea Nord Stream pipelines,
Putin accuses West of blowing up pipelines as Europe steps up vigilance

 

[John Owen]

It is totally a conspiracy theory.

 

[Quasiblogo]

Whatever underwater vessels were used, could they have been a sort of seaborne black ops--so that no nation could have been blamed if the vessel(s) had been destroyed or caught in the process of committing sabotage? Perhaps a nation or nations(s) funded a mercenary type of operation in order to manipulate the economic order to certain ends.

 

[David_S42]

There are two likely suspects between Russia and the US (or some of their allies operating on their behalf). In this country it often is depicted as a likely Russian attack. I somewhat considered this myself in terms of Russia getting mad that countries like Sweden were joining NATO and increasing the amount of hostile troops on it's border, or maybe even as some kind of false flag by the Russians to blame the US...

But there is a lot more reason to believe that the US or one of it's allies was behind it as this video mentions.

1) Biden himself made a threat against the pipeline before the Ukrainian war happened. see the little video linked in the next post.


2) As many pointed out the Russians had already cut Europe off threatening their winter and causing heating prices to spike. The pipeline gives them leverage by virtue of existing as a way of rewarding compliance if Europe changes its mind. Besides this Putin for decades has been more a cold and calculating leader than an emotional one. (It is interesting that Europeans, especially your average German actually believes the US did it or was behind it. )


3) Blowing up the pipeline would be a good way of locking the European union in the arrangement.


4) I personally could see how doing this would be another way of pushing "Green Energy" that the elite seem bent on doing regardless of the cost to create their New World Order.


5) Their are personal financial interests at work as far as the elite trying to buy up assets in Ukraine and even Russia for pennies on the dollar. (Russia is not the only country that has "oligarchs".) I have mentioned before that the push to expand NATO eastward does not make sense from a stand point of national interest. If the US funds a huge chunk or NATO why would you keep expanding and increasing you liability? How exactly does this benefit the US?


6) I believe doing so would help Biden politically. Biden is extremely unpopular right now, if he could win this war he could claim one solid accomplishment of defeating "the worst genocidal leader since Hitler" or some other similar campaign slogan.


7) Doing #6 for nakedly political reasons normally would be extremely risky, but Biden has evaded other scandals from the FBI, News media, and Social media running interference and even preemptively censoring and suppressing stories on his behalf, so why should this be any different?

I agree with all your 7point. It just proves how genius Biden is. With one move Biden unite Europe, help the “green Energy”, give elite like me to buy up assets in Ukraine and Russia for pennies and same time help his new campaign slogan “ Defeat the worst genocidal leader since Hitler” . Oh I can’t wait to vote for him in 2024. He is Genius! Do you support him too like me ?

 

[The Barbarian]

Russian agents and their assets are continuing to promote the idea that the U.S. damaged the pipeline. Europeans are apparently not buying it, although the far right in the U.S. continues to support Russia.