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Did Paul have Stigmata?

Lulav

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stigmata, singular stigma, in Christian mysticism, bodily marks, scars, or pains corresponding to those of the crucified Jesus Christ—that is, on the hands, on the feet, near the heart, and sometimes on the head (from the crown of thorns) or shoulders and back (from carrying the cross and scourging).
Also includes the bleeding from these sites.

St. Francis of Assisi was the first recorded stigmatic.

Or was he?

Galatians 6:17 From now on let no one cause me trouble, for I bear the marks of Jesus on my body.

Greek word - Stigmata

According to the Roman Catholic Church,
the presence of stigmata is a sign of mystical union with the suffering of Christ,
and a genuine stigmatic must have lived a life of heroic virtue

"Francis was purportedly visited by a seraph who produced upon his body the five wounds of Christ."
 

RDKirk

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No i believe this is saying he is bearing scars from beatings and stonings he had received. So like the Messiah he also bears scars.
I also believe Paul's continuing eye problems (spoken of in his letter to the Galatians) were a result of his being blinded on the road to Damascus.
 
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d taylor

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What i have wondered about this stigmata is, Jesus nails went through His wrist not through the actual palm part of the hand. So why would people bleed from their palms and not the wrist, if they are bearing The Christ wounds.
 
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Lulav

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No i believe this is saying he is bearing scars from beatings and stonings he had received. So like the Messiah he also bears scars.
Then how would that be differnet from anyone else who had scars. To say "the marks of Jesus on my body" is specific.
 
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Lulav

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What i have wondered about this stigmata is, Jesus nails went through His wrist not through the actual palm part of the hand. So why would people bleed from their palms and not the wrist, if they are bearing The Christ wounds.
Because it's a heresy. and not through the top of the foot as seen in many paintings.

Like this
1674277121437.png
Not like this
1674277204645.png
 
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d taylor

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Then how would that be differnet from anyone else who had scars. To say "the marks of Jesus on my body" is specific.
Jesus had more than just nail piercing marks and a spear stabbing wound. He, Jesus was beaten beyond recognition of being human.
NKJV
Just as many were astonished at you,
So His visage was marred more than any man,
And His form more than the sons of men;

CJB
Just as many were appalled at him,
because he was so disfigured
that he didn’t even seem human
and simply no longer looked like a man,
 
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d taylor

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Lulav

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Jesus had more than just nail piercing marks and a spear stabbing wound. He, Jesus was beaten beyond recognition of being human.
NKJV
Just as many were astonished at you,
So His visage was marred more than any man,
And His form more than the sons of men;

CJB
Just as many were appalled at him,
because he was so disfigured
that he didn’t even seem human
and simply no longer looked like a man,
Yes, of course, but I think the 'major ones' that are easily recognizable was what he meant.
 
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RileyG

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No i believe this is saying he is bearing scars from beatings and stonings he had received. So like the Messiah he also bears scars.
I agree wtih this comment.
 
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Benjamin Müller

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I read a book called Entangled Minds by Dean Radin; the most basic explanation is that all of humanity is quantumly entangled and that's his explanation for psychic phenomena. But after reading it, it got me wondering if Christians, through the Holy Spirit, are quantumly entangled, so to speak to God the Father and Jesus Christ.

In quantum mechanics, two particles that are quantumly entangled will behave the same despite distance. So if one particle changes, so will the other. However, God is spirit and cannot change; the only thing that can change is us. So my elementary way of thinking is that the Holy Spirit acts like a quantum umbilical cord and entangles us to God, allowing us to change.

Christ is spirit; his physical body which bore the marks of scourging and persecution is gone. He is sitting in glory at the Father's right hand. Churches that show a dead Christ on a cross, I believe, are using Satanic imagery. Christ is not dead on a cross; he is alive, ruling and in full power and glory.

Paul would not bear the marks of a wounded and dead Christ. If we go by quantum mechanics, he would be entangled to the spirit not the physical. And so having the Holy Spirit, he would be full of power and wisdom and knowledge. Able to speak with authority as a prince of the gospel. Christ is the Son of God, the Most High and so is a prince (or king), himself. And we are joint heirs with Christ--shall rule as kings and priests.

God seals His people with a mark. So to have the mark of Christ would be to have the Holy Spirit; but with the Holy Spirit comes persecution because the world cannot receive it. Matt. 10:22-25; John 15:18-21; 2 Tim 3:12

He doesn't bear the actually scars of the scourging or crucifixion of Christ, but rather his own beatings, stripes, and stonings for being an Apostle of Christ. For if they persecuted me, they'll persecute you.
 
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Lulav

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I read a book called Entangled Minds by Dean Radin; the most basic explanation is that all of humanity is quantumly entangled and that's his explanation for psychic phenomena. But after reading it, it got me wondering if Christians, through the Holy Spirit, are quantumly entangled, so to speak to God the Father and Jesus Christ.

In quantum mechanics, two particles that are quantumly entangled will behave the same despite distance. So if one particle changes, so will the other. However, God is spirit and cannot change; the only thing that can change is us. So my elementary way of thinking is that the Holy Spirit acts like a quantum umbilical cord and entangles us to God, allowing us to change.
That is indeed interesting to contemplate. I was meditating years ago on the relationship between the Father the son and the Holy Spirit which is separate but not. I believe that the LORD gave me a picture to understand as I am very visual in learning things. He told me to think of it this way. Like a strand of DNA

1674802276508.png

The Father is the one strand, The Son the other, the Holy Spirit connects the two and together they are ONE.



Christ is spirit; his physical body which bore the marks of scourging and persecution is gone. He is sitting in glory at the Father's right hand.

Gone where? Matter does not disappear, it may change form but it is not 'gone'
I think we must rely on what the words spoken by Messiah say.



How about here, the Risen Messiah

19Then, the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst, and said to them, “Peace be with you.” 20When He had said this, He showed them His hands and His side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord.
24Now Thomas, called the Twin, one of the twelve, was not with them when Jesus came. 25The other disciples therefore said to him, “We have seen the Lord.”

So he said to them, “Unless I see in His hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and put my hand into His side, I will not believe.”
26And after eight days His disciples were again inside, and Thomas with them. Jesus came, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, “Peace to you!” 27Then He said to Thomas, “Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing.”

28And Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!”


Revelation 5 also has this picture

1And I saw in the right hand of Him who sat on the throne a scroll written inside and on the back, sealed with seven seals. 2Then I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, “Who is worthy to open the scroll and to loose its seals?” 3And no one in heaven or on the earth or under the earth was able to open the scroll, or to look at it.​
4So I wept much, because no one was found worthy to open and read the scroll, or to look at it. 5But one of the elders said to me, “Do not weep. Behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has prevailed to open the scroll and to loose its seven seals.”​
6And I looked, and behold, in the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as though it had been slain,

Churches that show a dead Christ on a cross, I believe, are using Satanic imagery. Christ is not dead on a cross; he is alive, ruling and in full power and glory.

:amen: Yes, it is either that or a helpless babe in a manger. The death is preached, the image of one who is helpless, torn, beaten, scourged and could not get down from the cross.

What needs to be preached is not the Cross but of the Risen LORD YESHUA!

Paul would not bear the marks of a wounded and dead Christ.
"From now on let no one cause me trouble, for I bear the marks of Jesus on my body."

He is specific here, he does not say the marks are because of preaching and teaching about him, that is why the Stigmata came to mind.
If we go by quantum mechanics, he would be entangled to the spirit not the physical. And so having the Holy Spirit, he would be full of power and wisdom and knowledge. Able to speak with authority as a prince of the gospel. Christ is the Son of God, the Most High and so is a prince (or king), himself. And we are joint heirs with Christ--shall rule as kings and priests.
I can't quite agree with that.
God seals His people with a mark. So to have the mark of Christ would be to have the Holy Spirit; but with the Holy Spirit comes persecution because the world cannot receive it. Matt. 10:22-25; John 15:18-21; 2 Tim 3:12
He said Marks - plural, not mark. None of the others say anything about this mark.
He doesn't bear the actually scars of the scourging or crucifixion of Christ, but rather his own beatings, stripes, and stonings for being an Apostle of Christ. For if they persecuted me, they'll persecute you.
'The marks of Christ' to me means the marks of crucifixion, isn't that what Paul preached, Christ crucified?

"But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;"​
"O foolish Galatians, who has bewitched you, that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ has been evidently set forth, crucified among you?"​
", I came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God. For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.”​
 
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Benjamin Müller

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The marks of Christ' to me means the marks of crucifixion, isn't that what Paul preached, Christ crucified?
This is only one element; the gospel that was being preached was the Gospel of the Kingdom of God. The crucifxion; death and resurrection are important markers in the gospel but not the only thing. By submitting unto death, Christ qualified to be King of King and Lord of Lords; and by His resurrection we have life and hope in resurrection. The gospel is that he's coming back to set up His Father's kingdom to rule the nations, and the increase to His government there shall be no end.
 
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