Did Jesus create his mom?

[Godistruth1]

What do you think?

 

[ewq1938]

What do you think?

No. He created the natural process of how all things re-populate. He doesn't create everything individually/personally.

 

[Godistruth1]

No. He created the natural process of how all things re-populate. He doesn't create everything individually/personally.

Did Jesus send holy ghost to Mary so he could be born to die to forgive the original sin he created in first place?

 

[ewq1938]

Did Jesus send holy ghost to Mary so he could be born to die to forgive the original sin he created in first place?

Original sin doctrine is a false doctrine.

 

[Not David]

God does not create sin nor evil.

 

[St_Worm2]

What do you think?

While we are a long way down the line from our progenitors, and we are no longer created directly by God (but are instead, begotten by our parents), there is still a sense of His personal and intimate involvement in our coming to be. For instance, David tells us:

Psalms 139
13 You formed my inward parts;
You wove me in my mother’s womb.
14 I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
Wonderful are Your works,
And my soul knows it very well.
15 My frame was not hidden from You,
When I was made in secret,
And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth;
16 Your eyes have seen my unformed substance;
And in Your book were all written
The days that were ordained for me,
When as yet there was not one of them.​

And St. John has this to say about everything in creation (see v3 in particular):

John 1
1 IN the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 He was in the beginning with God.
3 All things came into being by Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.​

But none of us are "created" by God in the same way that our first parents were.

Yours and His,
David

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Muslims make fun of Christian theology. Meanwhile they freak out if you step through a door with the wrong foot.

http://www.inter-islam.org/Lifestyle/leavinghouse.html

The point is that if your religion is equally silly, don't go this route. Perhaps go with facts and evidence and try to show how those things are on your side. Silly or not, if the facts support your position, then you're right. But I've not seen you present any facts. Thread after thread of nonsense pretty much.

 

[98cwitr]

No. He created the natural process of how all things re-populate. He doesn't create everything individually/personally.

I think Scripture may contradict that narrative:

Deuteronomy 32:6
Do you thus repay the Lord, you foolish and senseless people? Is not he your father, who created you, who made you and established you?

Isaiah 43:1
[ Israel's Only Savior ] But now thus says the Lord, he who created you, O Jacob, he who formed you, O Israel: “Fear not, for I have redeemed you; I have called you by name, you are mine.

Revelation 4:11
“Worthy are you, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they existed and were created.”

Isaiah 49:5
And now the Lord says, he who formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob back to him; and that Israel might be gathered to him— for I am honored in the eyes of the Lord, and my God has become my strength—

 

[98cwitr]

God does not create sin nor evil.

Isaiah 45:7

 

[RaymondG]

Yes, Christ, the creator of all things, without whom there was not any thing made that was made....

 

[ewq1938]

Again, I think this is a reference not to literal hands on making people in the womb but the process God created that runs automatically in creatures bodies. It's like a man making a machine that makes donuts. He can speak in a symbolic way that he has formed/made all these donuts but it was accomplished via the machine he made.

I think Scripture may contradict that narrative:

Deuteronomy 32:6
Do you thus repay the Lord, you foolish and senseless people? Is not he your father, who created you, who made you and established you?

Isaiah 43:1
[ Israel's Only Savior ] But now thus says the Lord, he who created you, O Jacob, he who formed you, O Israel: “Fear not, for I have redeemed you; I have called you by name, you are mine.

Revelation 4:11
“Worthy are you, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they existed and were created.”

Isaiah 49:5
And now the Lord says, he who formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob back to him; and that Israel might be gathered to him— for I am honored in the eyes of the Lord, and my God has become my strength—

 

[Not David]

Isaiah 45:7

I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things (NIV).
"God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone" (James 1:13)
"God is light, and in Him there is no darkness at all" (1 John 1:5).
"God is not the author of confusion" (1 Corinthians 14:33)

 

[ewq1938]

I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things (NIV).

That is not what the verse says in the Hebrew.

 

[Not David]

That is not what the verse says in the Hebrew.

Can you tell me exactly what does it say?

 

[ewq1938]

Can you tell me exactly what does it say?

Yes but it's a bit complex because one must understand aspects of Hebrew grammar:

Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Here God says he creates evil. But what kind of evil? Literal evil or turmoil/calamity?

H7451
ra? ra^a^h
rah, raw-aw'
From H7489; bad or (as noun) evil (naturally or morally). This includes the second (feminine) form; as adjective or noun: - adversity, affliction, bad, calamity, + displease (-ure), distress, evil ([-favouredness], man, thing), + exceedingly, X great, grief (-vous), harm, heavy, hurt (-ful), ill (favoured), + mark, mischief, (-vous), misery, naught (-ty), noisome, + not please, sad (-ly), sore, sorrow, trouble, vex, wicked (-ly, -ness, one), worse (-st) wretchedness, wrong. [Including feminine ra’ah; as adjective or noun.]

Masculine form means- evil
Feminine form means- adversity, affliction, bad, calamity

Essentially the word means literal evil when it's in the masculine form, or can mean "turmoil or calamity" if it's in the feminine form. In the masculine form it can mean natural evil or moral evil. God is fully moral so the evil God creates is not morally evil but is known as "natural evil" which means something bad mainly from the perspective of those receiving the evil from God. Example: When God rained fire from heaven on Sodom, the people would consider that receiving evil from God because burning to death is painful. They deserved this fate so it was not morally evil to kill them in this sense.


Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Which form is this EVIL in in this verse?



First you go here and see the word and what form it's in.

http://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/Hebrew_Index.htm

Then click on Isaiah 45, then scroll to verse 7.

So, it is in the masculine form meaning it can only mean evil, nothing else.

The masculine form can be seen here (it is one character shorter than the feminine form):

http://biblehub.com/lexicon/isaiah/45-7.htm


To know how to tell feminine from masculine you go here:

http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Grammar/Unit_Four/Feminine_Nouns/feminine_nouns.html




Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

And thus we know for a fact that God is stating he creates literal evil since this word is in the masculine form and can only mean literal evil.



God does create darkness, I've seen no one challenge that. I see God creating darkness in the exact same way that he creates evil.

God used light and darkness, and repeated that by using peace and evil so I see the first two being equal to the second two in comparison.

So, if someone wants to change evil into something more *easy* to swallow or accept, then they also have to change darkness by the same logic. If God can create darkness (and we know he is speaking figuratively not only literally) then He can also create literal evil in whatever form he sees fit for the need.

The other issue is light and darkness and peace are all nouns but Ra/evil is an adjective. A word such as calamity is a noun. God intentionally used an adjective as opposite of a noun when using peace vs evil. If someone tries to suggest replacing the adj of evil with a noun such as calamity they are altering what God originally intended to be used.


This is a common argument on this subject but it's flawed logic. Here God uses evil in opposition to peace, and light in opposition to darkness. It doesn't matter if we think they are not perfectly balanced. If God wanted to say calamity he would have used the feminine form or had used the Hebrew word for calamity:

Deu 32:35 To me belongeth vengeance, and recompence; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come upon them make haste.


H343
???
'e^yd
ade
From the same as H181 (in the sense of bending down); oppression; by implication misfortune, ruin: - calamity, destruction.

The longer one is the feminine form.

 

[Not David]

Yes but it's a bit complex because one must understand aspects of Hebrew grammar:

Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Here God says he creates evil. But what kind of evil? Literal evil or turmoil/calamity?

H7451
ra? ra^a^h
rah, raw-aw'
From H7489; bad or (as noun) evil (naturally or morally). This includes the second (feminine) form; as adjective or noun: - adversity, affliction, bad, calamity, + displease (-ure), distress, evil ([-favouredness], man, thing), + exceedingly, X great, grief (-vous), harm, heavy, hurt (-ful), ill (favoured), + mark, mischief, (-vous), misery, naught (-ty), noisome, + not please, sad (-ly), sore, sorrow, trouble, vex, wicked (-ly, -ness, one), worse (-st) wretchedness, wrong. [Including feminine ra’ah; as adjective or noun.]

Masculine form means- evil
Feminine form means- adversity, affliction, bad, calamity

Essentially the word means literal evil when it's in the masculine form, or can mean "turmoil or calamity" if it's in the feminine form. In the masculine form it can mean natural evil or moral evil. God is fully moral so the evil God creates is not morally evil but is known as "natural evil" which means something bad mainly from the perspective of those receiving the evil from God. Example: When God rained fire from heaven on Sodom, the people would consider that receiving evil from God because burning to death is painful. They deserved this fate so it was not morally evil to kill them in this sense.


Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Which form is this EVIL in in this verse?



First you go here and see the word and what form it's in.

http://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/Hebrew_Index.htm

Then click on Isaiah 45, then scroll to verse 7.

So, it is in the masculine form meaning it can only mean evil, nothing else.

The masculine form can be seen here (it is one character shorter than the feminine form):

http://biblehub.com/lexicon/isaiah/45-7.htm


To know how to tell feminine from masculine you go here:

http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Grammar/Unit_Four/Feminine_Nouns/feminine_nouns.html




Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

And thus we know for a fact that God is stating he creates literal evil since this word is in the masculine form and can only mean literal evil.



God does create darkness, I've seen no one challenge that. I see God creating darkness in the exact same way that he creates evil.

God used light and darkness, and repeated that by using peace and evil so I see the first two being equal to the second two in comparison.

So, if someone wants to change evil into something more *easy* to swallow or accept, then they also have to change darkness by the same logic. If God can create darkness (and we know he is speaking figuratively not only literally) then He can also create literal evil in whatever form he sees fit for the need.

The other issue is light and darkness and peace are all nouns but Ra/evil is an adjective. A word such as calamity is a noun. God intentionally used an adjective as opposite of a noun when using peace vs evil. If someone tries to suggest replacing the adj of evil with a noun such as calamity they are altering what God originally intended to be used.


This is a common argument on this subject but it's flawed logic. Here God uses evil in opposition to peace, and light in opposition to darkness. It doesn't matter if we think they are not perfectly balanced. If God wanted to say calamity he would have used the feminine form or had used the Hebrew word for calamity:

Deu 32:35 To me belongeth vengeance, and recompence; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come upon them make haste.


H343
???
'e^yd
ade
From the same as H181 (in the sense of bending down); oppression; by implication misfortune, ruin: - calamity, destruction.

View attachment 240247 View attachment 240248

The longer one is the feminine form.

View attachment 240249

I repeat this verse "God is light, and in Him there is no darkness at all".
Saying that God created evil is doubting that God creates good.

 

[ewq1938]

I repeat this verse "God is light, and in Him there is no darkness at all".
Saying that God created evil is doubting that God creates good.

That doesn't make any sense. God says he creates evil (not the original creator of it)...no human can argue against it.

 

[Hazelelponi]

To answer the OP; Yes.

 

[Barney2.0]

Did Jesus send holy ghost to Mary so he could be born to die to forgive the original sin he created in first place?

There are different understandings or inherited sin in Western/Eastern philosophy. All essentially have the same definition albeit with different terms. God didn’t create original/ancestral sin, Adam did with his own mistake which God allowed to take place as to teach a life lesson to Adam. Humans were not created with the tendency to sin or a sinful nature, one mistake and decision caused that. God forgave Adam of his mistake and spared his life aswell as the lives of his descendants, but the effects and consequences of Adam’s sin still continued in his descendants, so God sent down the law of Moses as a temporary solution until the right time could happen and conditions would be perfect for him to fix the solution himself.

 

[Barney2.0]

Mary is the earthly mother of Jesus not his real mother.