Did God Create Evil?

[OldWiseGuy]

Amen. Evil=calamity, in many cases. Lot's of poor translation choices by early bible scholars.

 

[wezcountry]

Isaiah 45:7 says God creates calamity. The NASB renders it best. Calamity is opposite to peace as evil is opposite to good. Isaiah 45:7 makes more sense if calamity is used.

All synonyms for calamity.

Regarding Lamentations 3:38, the NASB renders it as:

Is it not from the mouth of the Most High
That both good and ill go forth?

God creates calamity, but evil (as in influence) was manifested in Satan.

Why would God create Satan if He knew Satan would fall? Because He wanted to use Satan to do His perfect will. And indeed, He does and has been doing so. Evil may be subservient to Satan but Satan is subservient to God.

For what better punishment is there other than having the one who did not want Him to rule over him do His work? Satan is at enmity with God, but is subservient to God.

This cannot be true. I have seen suffering first hand in Africa, 1990s Romania, working in a psychiatric hospital etc, and we can all see the horror that so much of the world experiences. This I assume to be the work of satan. How on earth can you say then that satan is carrying-out God's perfect will?

 

[Jpark]

This cannot be true. I have seen suffering first hand in Africa, 1990s Romania, working in a psychiatric hospital etc, and we can all see the horror that so much of the world experiences. This I assume to be the work of satan. How on earth can you say then that satan is carrying-out God's perfect will?

Scripture such as Jeremiah 18:7-10, Jonah 3:10, and 2 Chronicles 7:13-14 depict God as the initiator of calamity. Isaiah 45:7 plainly states that God creates calamity.

Job 37, especially verse 13 ("Whether for correction, or for His world, or for lovingkindness, He causes it to happen.), demonstrates that only God has control over nature.

Job 2:3 attributes the calamity Job suffered to God:

"...although you incited Me against him to ruin him without cause."

Job 1:11 says "But put forth Your hand now and touch all that he has; he will surely curse You to Your face."

In context:

Job 1:10 "Have You not made a hedge about him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land.

Job 1:10 brings to mind Isaiah 45:7.

Job 1:12 Then the LORD said to Satan, "Behold, all that he has is in your power, only do not put forth your hand on him." So Satan departed from the presence of the LORD.

So what happened to Job was that God sent the calamity (like in Jeremiah 18:7-10, Jonah 3:10, and 2 Chronicles 7:13-14) or Satan was temporarily delegated authority over nature, likely the former.

Luke 13:1-5 and John 9:2-3 show that suffering is not the result of sin or hereditary sin and the aforementioned Scriptures show that suffering is not the work of Satan, but suffering is for conviction, repentance, and for God's glory.

Concerning conviction, Deut. 24:16 " Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin.

So suffering can be a reminder from God to take responsibility for a misdeed and repent of it.

Luke 13:1-5 shows that suffering is not the result of sin or hereditary sin, but the result of not repenting. God basically wants people to take responsibility for their sins.

John 9:2-3 shows that suffering can also be for God's glory, "that the works of God might be displayed in" someone. That is why I see things like euthanasia and abortion as depriving people of opportunity to receive healing. Of course, it is not ethical to let someone suffer...

Anyways, furthermore, if Satan does works that are not within God's perfect will, then why is he depicted in the OT as a fallen angel subservient to God? Why are his fallen angels doing the will of God (1 Kings 22:19-22, 2 Cor. 12:7)?

Finally, consider Mark 5.

In other instances, Jesus casts out demons without difficulty. He even casts out the demon that His disciples couldn't cast out (Mark 9:18-19; 25-26).

But here, He has difficulty with the demon, (Mark 5:8 for He had been saying to him, "Come out of the man, you unclean spirit!"). It isn't until He learns the name (Mark 5:9) of the demon that the demon is afraid (Mark 5:10 And he began to implore Him earnestly not to send them out of the country.).

Clearly, this was a example for His believers, how to cast out demons without the Spirit of God or the blood of Jesus or the authority of His name.

So Satan and his fallen angels do the will of God. Their works must be within God's will; that is why they ask for permission (Luke 22:31) or are spoken to before they can do anything. In fact, their unwillingness to act until given the permission demonstrates that they are obedient to God. They are only at enmity with God in desire, not deeds. Why do they obey God? Because they fear Him (James 2:19) and have to.

 

[wezcountry]

Scripture such as Jeremiah 18:7-10, Jonah 3:10, and 2 Chronicles 7:13-14 depict God as the initiator of calamity. Isaiah 45:7 plainly states that God creates calamity.

Job 37, especially verse 13 ("Whether for correction, or for His world, or for lovingkindness, He causes it to happen.), demonstrates that only God has control over nature.

Job 2:3 attributes the calamity Job suffered to God:

"...although you incited Me against him to ruin him without cause."

Job 1:11 says "But put forth Your hand now and touch all that he has; he will surely curse You to Your face."

In context:

Job 1:10 "Have You not made a hedge about him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land.

Job 1:10 brings to mind Isaiah 45:7.

Job 1:12 Then the LORD said to Satan, "Behold, all that he has is in your power, only do not put forth your hand on him." So Satan departed from the presence of the LORD.

So what happened to Job was that God sent the calamity (like in Jeremiah 18:7-10, Jonah 3:10, and 2 Chronicles 7:13-14) or Satan was temporarily delegated authority over nature, likely the former.

Luke 13:1-5 and John 9:2-3 show that suffering is not the result of sin or hereditary sin and the aforementioned Scriptures show that suffering is not the work of Satan, but suffering is for conviction, repentance, and for God's glory.

Concerning conviction, Deut. 24:16 " Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin.

So suffering can be a reminder from God to take responsibility for a misdeed and repent of it.

Luke 13:1-5 shows that suffering is not the result of sin or hereditary sin, but the result of not repenting. God basically wants people to take responsibility for their sins.

John 9:2-3 shows that suffering can also be for God's glory, "that the works of God might be displayed in" someone. That is why I see things like euthanasia and abortion as depriving people of opportunity to receive healing. Of course, it is not ethical to let someone suffer...

Anyways, furthermore, if Satan does works that are not within God's perfect will, then why is he depicted in the OT as a fallen angel subservient to God? Why are his fallen angels doing the will of God (1 Kings 22:19-22, 2 Cor. 12:7)?

Finally, consider Mark 5.

In other instances, Jesus casts out demons without difficulty. He even casts out the demon that His disciples couldn't cast out (Mark 9:18-19; 25-26).

But here, He has difficulty with the demon, (Mark 5:8 for He had been saying to him, "Come out of the man, you unclean spirit!"). It isn't until He learns the name (Mark 5:9) of the demon that the demon is afraid (Mark 5:10 And he began to implore Him earnestly not to send them out of the country.).

Clearly, this was a example for His believers, how to cast out demons without the Spirit of God or the blood of Jesus or the authority of His name.

So Satan and his fallen angels do the will of God. Their works must be within God's will; that is why they ask for permission (Luke 22:31) or are spoken to before they can do anything. In fact, their unwillingness to act until given the permission demonstrates that they are obedient to God. They are only at enmity with God in desire, not deeds. Why do they obey God? Because they fear Him (James 2:19) and have to.

Based on your bible references etc your argument sounds very credible, which, if the bible is 'true', makes God seem even worse than I imagined. You're basically saying that the incredible suffering that people experience in the world today is the work of satan or demons who have been given permission or have been instructed by God, to do so.

 

[Jpark]

You're basically saying that the incredible suffering that people experience in the world today is the work of satan or demons who have been given permission or have been instructed by God, to do so.

No, they can also be the work of God Himself. You shouldn't neglect that.

1 Cor. 12:6 (Codex Sinaiticus) and there are diversities of operations, and the same God who works all things in all.

So it should be "You're basically saying that the incredible suffering that people experience in the world today is the work of God or the work of satan and his demons who have been given permission or have been instructed by God, to do so."

In response to your assertion,

The suffering gives one opportunity to repent. If there was no suffering, there would be lack of repentance and no one would depend on God or consider Him. Which brings to mind Genesis 3. If there was no curse, man would not repent, depend on God, or consider Him. They would carry out their desire of self-rule and autonomy from God and never come to Him.

 

[wezcountry]

No, they can also be the work of God Himself. You shouldn't neglect that.

1 Cor. 12:6 (Codex Sinaiticus) and there are diversities of operations, and the same God who works all things in all.

So it should be "You're basically saying that the incredible suffering that people experience in the world today is the work of God or the work of satan and his demons who have been given permission or have been instructed by God, to do so."

In response to your assertion,

The suffering gives one opportunity to repent. If there was no suffering, there would be lack of repentance and no one would depend on God or consider Him. Which brings to mind Genesis 3. If there was no curse, man would not repent, depend on God, or consider Him. They would carry out their desire of self-rule and autonomy from God and never come to Him.

Firstly just to be clear, I am not here on a wind-up, I am genuinely thinking through these issues and what they mean for me individually.

Back to your reply: this, if true, is incredibly shocking and I would never want anything to do with a god who acts like this nor a religion where this thinking is part of the package. For example, would the case of babies being born into starvation be an example of 'the opportunity to repent'? Also, if this were true why is the suffering so unevenly distributed around the world? Someone born in the West could get through life with practically no suffering: someone born in Chechnia or North Korea or Pol Pot's Cambodia or any other of those god-forsaken hell-holes face it on a minute-by-minute basis. Frankly I don't believe it. God has created people in his image (right?) to know him and love him (right?). How then can any of the suffering we see be part of his plan?

Unless he is a sadist?

 

[Scottish Knight]

Isaiah 45:7 clearly states that God Himself says He created evil. /debate

This was the subject of the sermon yesterday evening. Rather than giving a summary I'll just post the link to the sermon. It was really helpful to me to understand this - . Here's the link to the audio - (Dr Bruce Ware, 16 January, pm)

http://www.charlottechapel.org/what-we-do/sunday-services/service-information?service_id=12259http://www.charlottechapel.org/

 

[.Iona.]

Without having read the other pages, just answering the OP - If God is said to have created everything, then that would mean everything. If He is capable of creating a Hell to torture people in for eternity, then it is safe to say that He is also capable of creating the rest of the evil in the world.

 

[he-man]

Back to your reply: this, if true, is incredibly shocking and I would never want anything to do with a god who acts like this nor a religion where this thinking is part of the package. Frankly I don't believe it. How then can any of the suffering we see be part of his plan?Unless he is a sadist?

Because they are like Balaam and his doctrine or teaching, his way of life was the dominant pagan religion of the time, just as Protestantism is the dominant religion of our time.

Balaam later tells the Midianites, "Get the Israelites involved in idolatry and whoredom with the women of Moab."

I Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

James 4:1-2 From whence come wars and fightings among you? Come they not hence even of your lusts that war in your members?

James 4:2-4 You lust, and have not: you kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: you fight and war, yet you have not because you ask not. You ask, and receive not, because you ask amiss, that you may consume it upon your lusts.

You adulterers and adulteresses, know you not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? Whosoever therefore will be a friend of the word is the enemy of God.

Gen 3:1-7 For God does know that in the day you eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and you shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Genesis 6:5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them: and behold, I will destroy them with the earth.
Ezekiel 7:23, "Make a chain, for the land is filled with crimes of blood, and the city is full of violence."

Proverbs 15:3: The eyes of the Lord are in every place, keeping watch on the evil and the good.
21: For the ways of man are before the eyes of the Lord, and He ponders all his paths.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Without having read the other pages, just answering the OP - If God is said to have created everything, then that would mean everything. If He is capable of creating a Hell to torture people in for eternity, then it is safe to say that He is also capable of creating the rest of the evil in the world.

Eternal torment is for the demons, spirit beings that cannot 'die'. Eternal DEATH is for unrepentant humans, who can. So there is no eternal torture for man.

 

[bling]

Firstly just to be clear, I am not here on a wind-up, I am genuinely thinking through these issues and what they mean for me individually.

Back to your reply: this, if true, is incredibly shocking and I would never want anything to do with a god who acts like this nor a religion where this thinking is part of the package. For example, would the case of babies being born into starvation be an example of 'the opportunity to repent'? Also, if this were true why is the suffering so unevenly distributed around the world? Someone born in the West could get through life with practically no suffering: someone born in Chechnia or North Korea or Pol Pot's Cambodia or any other of those god-forsaken hell-holes face it on a minute-by-minute basis. Frankly I don't believe it. God has created people in his image (right?) to know him and love him (right?). How then can any of the suffering we see be part of his plan?

Unless he is a sadist?

This comes up a whole lot with agnostics and atheists I talk with.
You have to understand the objectives, to understand anything and everything else. The objectives compel the results and even God.

You are actually wondering why a Loving God would not put all humans in a Garden of Eden type situation without satan or the tree of knowledge.
Sin actually has a purpose.

If the objective was for humans “not to sin” and live with God here on earth forever then we would all be in a Garden type situation without the tree of knowledge, satan and without “sex” (sex gets in the way since it is a cause of competition) or we could all be just paired up.

The problem is God wants us to be like He is (God’s Love is compelling Him to create beings that can Lo First: Try this out for why God created man: God’s Love compelled Him to create beings that could Love like He Loves.
This Godly type Love is the real issue since it cannot be just instinctively given to us (robotic love) and it cannot be forcible given to us ( Love or I torture you) for that would not be Loving on God’s part and the love that was forced on us would not be Godly type Love.

Man’s objective is thus to obtain and grow this Godly type Love to fulfill the mission (statement) of Love God and secondly others with all our heart, soul, mind, and energy.

This Godly type Love is defined by Jesus’ words and deeds (you can also use 1 Cor 13 and 1 John 4).

God is doing and allowing all He can to help those that are just willing to accept His help fulfill their objective. That Christ to go to the cross, satan to roam the earth, tragedies of all kind, hell, evil, and even sin.

God is not trying to trying to get us to do something, but is trying to give us the most powerful force in all universes if we will just accept the gift as it was given (charity). Having Godly Love is having the most powerful force in all universes.

Understanding the Adam and Eve story without believing they are real people:

1. Man was made as best as man could be made to fulfill his objective and is described by God as very good. Man is not “perfect” like Christ, because he is a made being and Christ was not made. A&E become the best human “representatives” we could have. God did not mess up.

2. Man is here on earth to obtain and grow Godly type Love so he can Love God and others with all his heart, soul, mind, and energy. Christ has always had Godly type Love so He did not have to obtain it. God and Christ will do all they can to help willing individuals fulfill their objective.

3. Godly type Love is defined best by Christ’s words and deeds. It is not instinctive or that would be robotic type Love and it cannot be forced (love me or I shot) on man or that would not be man’s Love. This “Love” has to be the result of a moral decision on man’s part with likely alternatives (the perceived pleasures of sin for a season).

4. If A&E had obtained Godly type Love they would have obeyed “…if you Love me you will obey me…” God was Loving them with Godly Love but they did not accept that Love as it was given (unconditionally and undeserving).

5. In the Garden before they sinned there was no reason for A&E to humble themselves enough to accept charity (a free undeserving gift). People do not like to take charity and A&E before sinning had done nothing wrong, so as extremely good children they could expect their Father to love them as any good parent would love good children and they would love a wonderful parent as any good children would love a wonderful parent. Unfortunately that is not Godly type Love.

6. The tree and satan being in the Garden, provided a way for A&E and us to see they did not have Godly type Love and were not accepting God’s Love as it was given.

7. The whole Garden situation (which we sometimes think is where a Loving God should put us all) shows A&E and all the rest of us that it is a lousy place to fulfill our objectives and points out the advantages of being where: Christ does go to the cross, satan is around, tragedies happen, heaven, hell and sin.

8. God did not create humans to get something from them, but to give the greatest gift He could give to them (which is also the greatest power in the universe since it compels God to do all He does). In order for this transaction of giving and receiving to take place the gift must be received by the receiver of the gift as a gift or the transaction does not take place.

9. The way this world is and all the history leading up to this world is the best arrangement for those that are or will desire and/or wanting God’s Love, to accept His Love.

The problem is not sin (unforgiven sin is a huge problem), because God will forgive our sins which helps us to Love. God hates sin, but does allow it so we can more easily accept His Love. The problem is not knowing that God exists, since a very small amount of faith is needed to help humans and knowledge of there being a God would only upset those that do not want the Christian God. The problem is our fulfilling our objective.

God is doing all He can to help willing individuals fulfill their objective. That “all” includes allow Christ to go to the cross, satan to roam the earth, tragedies of all kind, hell, heaven and even sin.

 

[Jpark]

Firstly just to be clear, I am not here on a wind-up, I am genuinely thinking through these issues and what they mean for me individually.

Back to your reply: this, if true, is incredibly shocking and I would never want anything to do with a god who acts like this nor a religion where this thinking is part of the package. For example, would the case of babies being born into starvation be an example of 'the opportunity to repent'? Also, if this were true why is the suffering so unevenly distributed around the world? Someone born in the West could get through life with practically no suffering: someone born in Chechnia or North Korea or Pol Pot's Cambodia or any other of those god-forsaken hell-holes face it on a minute-by-minute basis. Frankly I don't believe it. God has created people in his image (right?) to know him and love him (right?). How then can any of the suffering we see be part of his plan?

Unless he is a sadist?

I didn't say suffering was always for repentance. It can also be for God's working in a person's life (John 9:2-3). Those born into starvation have the opportunity to experience God's presence in their lives.

The only thing that prevents His intervention in their lives is the world's overprotectiveness, worldwide rejection of Him.

Only worldwide genuine repentance will result in God's active intervention in all parts of the world.

Genuine repentance and reformation is the answer since wars are caused by wrong motives (James 4:1-3) and "natural" disasters, famine, and plagues are caused by God (2 Chronicles 7:13-14) to get people to repent. And when I say people, I don't mean everyone. I mean certain people such as 1 nation. Anyways, the world is like it is today because man has a unclean heart (Matt. 15:18-20).

 

[he-man]

Eternal torment is for the demons, spirit beings that cannot 'die'. Eternal DEATH is for unrepentant humans, who can. So there is no eternal torture for man.

You say "spirit beings that cannot 'die"?

You must have missed the verse that says, "Only God has immortality!

Besides the fact that there are NO demons/spirit beings.

"the penalty is not eternal" it is eternal everlasting destruction!

2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

9 Who shall pay a penalty of everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

The "LAKE OF FIRE" is simply "the second death" of everlasting destruction.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

 

[Emmy]

Dear wezcountry. God is Love, and God created everything Good, and God said so Himself. Adam and Eve were with God in the Garden of Eden and they were Good. But when the Serpent/Tempter came, they could not resist, although they were Good. They believed a Liar, and were banished from Eden. On Earth they became worse, selfish and without Love. The Love God wants from all of us is selfless and beneficial. Adam and Eve and all who came after, moved farther and farther away from God, and sank deeper and deeper into sin and transgression. In time Jesus came, and showed Mankind that God is their Heavenly Father, and wants us, (mankind) back again. God`s Holy Law demanded the usual payment for sin, BUT there was no-one left without sin, to be able to pay the debt we owed. Jesus gave His Blood to set us free, He died that we might live, and He did it because He loves us: He is our Saviour. Jesus also told us to learn to love: God with all our hearts, with all our souls, and with all our minds. Also to love our neighbour as we love ourselves. Jesus will give us His Love and Joy to share with each other, and the Holy Spirit will empower us with His Love. Jesus told us to "ask and ye will receive," and God will forgive us our sins as we will forgive those who sin against us. All this because God loves us. Can you really believe that God created evil, wezcountry? God loves us, and Jesus is waiting to lead us back to God again. The Bible will tell you more in detail. I say this with love, and send greetings. Emmy, sister in Christ.

 

[cf4rc]

Did God Create Evil?

God did not create evil, per se, but He did create Lucifer who became of evil intent not being content as a cherubim protecting the mercy seat of Christ but instead wanting to sit in it. The first sin was his sin of pride which was also the first sin ever comitted in all God's creation. He wanted to be as God even then! This is evil!

I believe God creates all things perfectly (Genesis 1:1) so even He had never seen or experienced evil or sin until that time. And, He cast Lucifer and a third of the angels who followed his lead out of heaven to the earth.
Genesis 1:2; the earth was (Strong's H1961; (Qal) to become, come to pass; became) without form (H8414; a place of confusion, chaos and danger) and void (H922; of darkness, emptiness; void of the light of God).

In Genesis 3:1 all the sudden evil, the serpent, Lucifer and Satan was on earth and in the garden! We know what happened after that...
So, I guess it can be said God created evil from the standpoint that He created Lucifer who in turn became evil.
Luv...God Bless All...rc

 

[he-man]

Did God Create Evil?

God did not create evil, per se, but He did create Lucifer who became of evil intent not being content as a cherubim protecting the mercy seat of Christ but instead wanting to sit in it. The first sin was his sin of pride which was also the first sin ever comitted in all God's creation. He wanted to be as God even then! This is evil!

I believe God creates all things perfectly (Genesis 1:1) so even He had never seen or experienced evil or sin until that time. And, He cast Lucifer and a third of the angels who followed his lead out of heaven to the earth.
Genesis 1:2; the earth was (Strong's H1961; (Qal) to become, come to pass; became) without form (H8414; a place of confusion, chaos and danger) and void (H922; of darkness, emptiness; void of the light of God).

In Genesis 3:1 all the sudden evil, the serpent, Lucifer and Satan was on earth and in the garden! We know what happened after that...
So, I guess it can be said God created evil from the standpoint that He created Lucifer who in turn became evil.
Luv...God Bless All...rc

Do you follow what has already been posted?

Reading Isa 14:4, "That you shall take up this proverb against the **king of Babylon,** and say, How has the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!", it becomes clear that this is the king of Babylon and his nation that is being spoken of here.

While this mythological information is available to scholars today via translated Babylonian cuneiform text taken from clay tablets, it was not as readily available at the time of the Latin translation of the Bible.

Thus, early Christian tradition interpreted the passage as a reference to the moment Satan was thrown from Heaven. Lucifer became another name for Satan and has remained so due to Christian dogma and popular tradition.
Christian teaching about the Devil - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[cf4rc]

Did God Create Evil?
Do you follow what has already been posted?

I believe so...my first input on the subject stayed on the original question...and was answered with my opinion derived, I will admit, with little study on the subject.

It seems to me that you, and a few others, may have strayed somewhat from the original question and subject of that question...or maybe time has just brought out deeper and more diversified answers to the question...

But, through my short study I believe my answer is biblically sound even though I could easily be wrong on my reference to 'Lucifer' being the name used pertaining to the origin of evil in the first heaven age. It is used only once in the KJV bible in Isaiah 14:12. So, thank you for the enlightenment on this possible mistake...I will look into this further as it is an interesting subject.

Even Ezekiel 28:11-19 which I believe is the best description and characterization of Satan only calls him "king of Tyre" and "cherub" in a number of ways. But, we know Ezekiel is speaking of Satan before his fall from grace through his sin of pride.

I am new at this as I am a new member to CF and it is enjoyable to see so many people having a chance to share with others, hopefully, with an open mind and heart while we all seek the truth of what "God Said" in His Word rather than only believing what 'the traditions of man' now far too often teach as the truth when at times they are not the truth and will mislead us.

This I have learned after diligent study on some of the bible, especially on the prophetic teachings on these times in which we now live: that we must use a concordance and lexicon in the original Hebrew and Greek languages to come to understand what "God Said". All other translations can and I believe will far to often mislead us and take us away from the truth if we blindly accept them as the inerrant word of God. They are absolutely not inerrant as translated.

I always try to remind myself that Jesus nor the prophets ever spoke or wrote a single word in english, for example. We tend to read and think of what we have read from the standpoint of our own language. This can be a big mistake!

OOPS! Now I have strayed...anyway, let us all be thankful for this forum where the Word is discussed with such great fervor. God Bless to you and yours...rc

 

[cf4rc]

Well, Marco4, you have the right to your opinion as all the rest of us and my opinion on your post is that it seems evident that you either don't believe in the Word of the Christian faith or simply have just given no time to the study and understanding of it.

As far as I can understand if you believe in the Christian bible you must believe the first verse of the bible. Genesis 1:1; In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. ALL things, including lucifer, are encompassed within that verse because it includes the heavens which means everything that we know of that He has created and even things of which we have no knowledge of that God created.

I'm not meaning to be harsh or judgmental but what you said is of great concern to me as a Christian man. By the way, some are convinced, even if not you or others who feel as you do. Please do me and yourself a favor and read Matthew 13:14-17.

Thanks for your input...love and God Bless You...rc

 

[elman]

Well, Marco4, you have the right to your opinion as all the rest of us and my opinion on your post is that it seems evident that you either don't believe in the Word of the Christian faith or simply have just given no time to the study and understanding of it.

As far as I can understand if you believe in the Christian bible you must believe the first verse of the bible. Genesis 1:1; In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. ALL things, including lucifer, are encompassed within that verse because it includes the heavens which means everything that we know of that He has created and even things of which we have no knowledge of that God created.

I'm not meaning to be harsh or judgmental but what you said is of great concern to me as a Christian man. By the way, some are convinced, even if not you or others who feel as you do. Please do me and yourself a favor and read Matthew 13:14-17.

Thanks for your input...love and God Bless You...rc

However in the beginning God declared it all good. God created man with the propensity for good and evil and man created evil, when man chose to not love.

 

[elman]

How could God created Good without creating Evil

People try to explain no the devil made it but that is just nonsense

God created up and down, left and right, light and dark

Just because a shadow is created it doesnt mean it was intended for people to dwell there. But it exists to allow people to choose

I think there was a time when God was alone and God is good. At that time no evil existed. I think the way evil came into existence is God create man with the ability to love or not love and when man chose not to love, that resulted in the creation of evil.