Did God commend or approve Rahab's lie?

[RDKirk]

Yes, I held to this view before and it was my initial means to resolve the situation involving Rahab. My old position was that the OT saint used a tactic called the "art of war" and they were not lying in the tradition sense of breaking God's commands that says, "Ye shall... neither deal falsely, neither lie one to another." (Leviticus 19:11). I am not charting out into new territory and seeking out an alternative explanation on these things (based on what Scripture says as a whole). Maybe I will revert back to my old view on this point. But I would like to look at these portions of Scripture with a fresh pair of eyes or from a new angle (But yet holding to the truth of what God's Word says).

"Ye shall... neither deal falsely, neither lie one to another."

He's talking to the Israelites as a group, a unique group, a "peculiar people." When God speaks of their relations with other people, He explicitly includes or excludes those other people.

In this case, God is making a command about how Israelites are to relate to Israelites. He gives them many commands with the intention of maintaining order and civility among them and always keeping open the path to reconciliation. This is a command for Israelites dealing with Isrealites. They are not at war with one another, and thus always owe each other the truth.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Can I add that God himself uses deception in certain circumstances.

1 Kings 22:

“Therefore hear the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on His throne, and all the host of heaven standing on His right hand and on His left. 20And the LORD said, ‘Who will entice Ahab to march up and fall at Ramoth-gilead?’

And one suggested this, and another that. 21Then a spirit came forward, stood before the LORD, and said, ‘I will entice him.’

‘By what means?’ asked the LORD. 22And he replied, ‘I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouths of all his prophets.’

‘You will surely entice him and prevail,’ said the LORD. ‘Go and do it.’ 23So you see, the LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouths of all these prophets of yours, and the LORD has pronounced disaster against you.”

 

[Dave L]

What do you say?

In the following, God approves of lying.
“And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left. And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramoth-gilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner. And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.” 1 Kings 22:19–23 (KJV 1900)

 

[Philip_B]

There is a certain robustness in a number of the Biblical accounts where ethical issues are not as straightforward as we might fancifully imagine they should be. Many of the hero's are seemingly flawed one way or another. It reminds us that the account is about the goodness and the perseverance of God with a flawed humanity, rather that a moral tale where the outcomes are always straightforward.

I see Rahab as the account of yet another instance of this robustness. Of course someone like Joseph Fletcher would find this account somewhat supportive of his general thesis.

Our heroes have blemishes and our villains have virtues. God does not only love nice people.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I would like to see you invent such literary devices in a real life or death situation where you must save others quickly ;-)

I was the one who came up with these words.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

In the following, God approves of lying.
“And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left. And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramoth-gilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner. And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.” 1 Kings 22:19–23 (KJV 1900)

There is a difference between permitting something to take place by free will agents, and approving of what those free will agents are doing. God permitting what lying spirits do does not mean God agrees with lying itself. God permits evil spirits to do all sorts of bad things, but that does not mean he agrees with their sinful actions. God is able to use bad things that exist currently in his creation within His greater plan for good.

Anyways, I would encourage you to check out this article here (By Apologetics Press):

Did God Approve of Rahab's Lie?

 

[Dave L]

There is a difference between permitting something to take place by free will agents, and approving of what those free will agents are doing. God permitting what lying spirits do does not mean God agrees with lying itself. God permits evil spirits to do all sorts of bad things, but that does not mean he agrees with their sinful actions. God is able to use bad things that exist currently in his creation within His greater plan for good.

Anyways, I would encourage you to check out this article here (By Apologetics Press):

Did God Approve of Rahab's Lie?

Just sayin'

Do you deceive robbers by playing your radio or TV while away?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Can I add that God himself uses deception in certain circumstances.

1 Kings 22:

“Therefore hear the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on His throne, and all the host of heaven standing on His right hand and on His left. 20And the LORD said, ‘Who will entice Ahab to march up and fall at Ramoth-gilead?’

And one suggested this, and another that. 21Then a spirit came forward, stood before the LORD, and said, ‘I will entice him.’

‘By what means?’ asked the LORD. 22And he replied, ‘I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouths of all his prophets.’

‘You will surely entice him and prevail,’ said the LORD. ‘Go and do it.’ 23So you see, the LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouths of all these prophets of yours, and the LORD has pronounced disaster against you.”

I do not see deception (in every case), or being in disguise or hidden as the same thing as lying. At the battle of AI, the Lord tells Joshua a battle tactic that deceives the enemy. This is not really a lie in the traditional sense where somebody says something that is not truthful.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Just sayin'

Do you deceive robbers by playing your radio or TV while away?

No. But if I were to do so, it would not be lying because leaving my TV on does not necessarily mean I have to be home just because the TV is on. Maybe I want the TV on when I am not home to comfort my pet dog, or maybe I want to hear the Word of God on my TV playing when I come home. But even if such intentions were not there. There are a ton of reasons why my TV could be left on and it does not mean I am lying to thieves. There are not words on my house saying, "Dear thieves, I am home watching TV. So please go away." (In which case, it would be a lie if I was not home). There are a number of reasons why people can leave their TV on while they are not home and it does not mean it has to relate to keeping thieves away. That's my point. People think that you can lie by showing a situation that is deceptive. Sure, King David faking his sanity was a lie. For he was being putting forth a behavior that he was not in line with who he really was in reality. In such a case in Scripture, God does not speak to his actions on this matter. In fact, God is absent in this particular part of Scripture when He did this action. Sometimes the Bible records sins even done by men of God, but it does not mean God approves of their sins. Surely this is why we all need God's grace indeed (Not as a means to justify sin, but as a means to fight and battle against sin).

 

[Dave L]

No. But if I were to do so, it would not be lying because leaving my TV on does not necessarily mean I have to be home just because the TV is on. Maybe I want the TV on when I am not home to comfort my pet dog, or maybe I want to hear the Word of God on my TV playing when I come home. But even if such intentions were not there. There are a ton of reasons why my TV could be left on and it does not mean I am lying to thieves. There are not words on my house saying, "Dear thieves, I am home watching TV. So please go away." (In which case, it would be a lie if I was not home). There are a number of reasons why people can leave their TV on while they are not home and it does not mean it has to relate to keeping thieves away. That's my point. People think that you can lie by showing a situation that is deceptive. Sure, King David faking his sanity was a lie. For he was being putting forth a behavior that he was not in line with who he really was in reality. In such a case in Scripture, God does not speak to his actions on this matter. In fact, God is absent in this particular part of Scripture when He did this action. Sometimes the Bible records sins even done by men of God, but it does not mean God approves of their sins. Surely this is why we all need God's grace indeed.

Was it a sin to slaughter the Canaanites?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Was it a sin to slaughter the Canaanites?

No. I perfectly understand that there is a difference between murder, and God commanding the OT saint to take life in war time. Is this the same for lying? Is lying during war time not lying in the traditional sense? I cannot fully answer that at this time. I am still seeking the truth out on this matter. I did once believe that one could lie as a tactic during war time in the OT. Now, I am not so sure about that.

 

[1213]

Did God commend or approve Rahab's lie?

Please show where is that in the Bible, I didn’t yet find it.

 

[Carl Emerson]

There is a difference between permitting something to take place by free will agents, and approving of what those free will agents are doing. God permitting what lying spirits do does not mean God agrees with lying itself. God permits evil spirits to do all sorts of bad things, but that does not mean he agrees with their sinful actions.

Where does the passage say the spirit was evil?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Where does the passage say the spirit was evil?

Wel, by default logic, a lying spirit suggests that it is an evil one.

But if you need a verse to confirm such a truth, then here is one:

"Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it." (John 8:44).​

Take the letter "d" out of the word "devil" and ya got the word "evil."

 

[RDKirk]

There is a certain robustness in a number of the Biblical accounts where ethical issues are not as straightforward as we might fancifully imagine they should be. Many of the hero's are seemingly flawed one way or another. It reminds us that the account is about the goodness and the perseverance of God with a flawed humanity, rather that a moral tale where the outcomes are always straightforward.

I see Rahab as the account of yet another instance of this robustness. Of course someone like Joseph Fletcher would find this account somewhat supportive of his general thesis.

Our heroes have blemishes and our villains have virtues. God does not only love nice people.

God absolutely approved of the Hebrew midwives. God Himself explicitly provided the lie to Moses, and God himself called on a spirit to lie to Ahab.

 

[Carl Emerson]

How does you logic stand when God clearly has destroying angels (Ps 78:49 and 1 Chron 21:15)

Yes Satan is a destroyer.

So just because we know Satan is the father of lies, does not mean God's angels can not be sent to deceive.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Please show where is that in the Bible, I didn’t yet find it.

People seem to think this way based on a misunderstanding on James 2:25.

"Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?"
(James 2:25).​

They think this verse is saying that God was in agreement with Rahab's lie towards the guards about the location of the men of God because they think that her sending the guards out another way is implied in the lie to the guards (When it is not). They are two different things.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Did God commend or approve Rahab's lie?

God uses people to move His agenda. Bathsheba, wife of Uriah the Hittite; became one of the wives of King David and the mother of King Solomon yet David murdered Uriah in order to clear the path for our King, Jesus Christ of Nazareth. God did not commend David and I am sure He did not commend Rahab yet it was a necessary step.
Be blessed and stay healthy.

 

[throughfiierytrial]

Hebrews 11:31:
By faith the prostitute Rahab, because she welcomed the spies, was not killed with those who were disobedient.
This is our base...remembering Abraham lied to the Pharaohs and Isaac also lied to the Pharaoh...Jacob and his mother tricked Esau who was godless.These were OT times (something also to consider).
NT says...
Matthew 10:16-17:
“I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves. Be on your guard; you will be handed over to the local councils and be flogged in the synagogues.

Jesus did not offer lies but rather asked shrewd questions in reply...He offered no reply at times before Pilate.
Better to imitate His actions than any other.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

How does you logic stand when God clearly has destroying angels (Ps 78:49 and 1 Chron 21:15)

Yes Satan is a destroyer.

So just because we know Satan is the father of lies, does not mean God's angels can not be sent to deceive.

God allowing the enemy to deceive, or to fit in God's plan to eradicate an enemy of His people does not equate with God approving of the lying itself.

In other words, there is God's permissive will (those decisions He makes in regards to allowing free will agents to do things that do not align precisely with the good qualities or His pure holy good character as God), and there is God's perfect will (where choices are made that fit neatly God's good character and holiness), like God making a decision that He knows will lead a man of God to do something righteous and good.

Some Christians have tried to argue against this but they do so not fully understanding what these two things actually mean in relation to God's holiness. God surely does not approve of evil or doing evil things. God cannot sin. But surely sin is in our world and He allows (permits) sin to take place (Which is outside His holy and perfect character). God also exercises his perfect will like sending Jesus to the cross. There are some permissive decisions by God in this perfect will. God permits evil men to carry out this perfect will plan of Jesus dying on the cross for man's sins. In a way they both converge. On one hand, Jesus fulfills the perfect will of God, and on the other hand, God permits the evil men to exist to carry out the mission of Jesus for our redemption. To say so otherwise is to argue that God decreed evil and sin, and that's just nonsense. God is good (Mark 10:18), and there is no darkness in God (1 John 1:5).

So the situation of God using an evil spirit in an already sin filled world to destroy one of His enemies is in the realm of God's permissive will because God does not exactly want anyone to perish but that all should come to repentance. But seeing that this bad guy did not want to repent, and or believe, God allowed for an evil angel to eventually lead to the death of this bad guy. But God would have preferred he repented (i.e. God's perfect will).

Basically any decision that involves something stained with sin and God having to deal with sinful men is God's permissive will. Whenever a righteous action is done by Jesus, or His people, that is God's perfect will being put forth. God does not sin. He is holy. So what God permits does not mean that is His highest or perfect will for others (Who seek to resist Him).