Desolation

[PolskiKrol]

The old guy I always talk about was giving his testimony. He talked about a series of miracles that changed him from being a devout atheist to what I consider a great Catholic. He had several encounters with and even , after which he resovled to follow the and lead a holy life. He often felt the love of Jesus very real in the room.

But soon, he felt , no longer feeling the love of Christ in his life. He no longer appeared to the old guy, or let him feel His love as intimately as He had on the road to his conversion (pronouns are fun). The old guy suddenly said to himself, "This is silly, how can there be a God?" But immediatly went DOH! , and talked to a for help. The priest said that what the old guy was expirienceing a common thing called desolation, in which a person does not physically or emotionally "feel" the love of Christ, despite good confesions and sacraments. Still not convinced, he traveled along the slippery slope of atheism once again. After several years God appeared to him again and sent him back on his way.

The old guy's story isn't unique. A lot of saints' stories are filled with feeling Christ's love as a nessecity and reward, but then they feel isolated, and only have great moments with God when another person's conversion is in order, or that example will help others on their way.

Like Saul, who persecuted the early Church until Jesus appeared to him. Then left him alone.
Or St. Dominic, whose own soul was in order, but Mary had to appear to him to stop the Albergisians (sp?) heresy.
ect.

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It just seems to me that if God loves us so intimately, He'd want to express it, rather than keeping to Himself until your relationship with Him is in jeopardy.

I mean, I love my girlfriend and I want her to know that. I don't just keep to myself until she starts to fall away from our relationship! I want to spend as much reasonable time with her as I can and show her how much I love her. Don't you think that someone who sacrificed His only son would give His love to us as more than just a recruiting tactic? Why would He desolate the few souls that love Him, and love the many souls that desolate Him?

PS- (I know, I KNOW, we cannot exist without His love, that He does love us, but my question is why does He chose to desolate devout followers?)
Has anyone else felt apart from His love? Why does He choose to do this?

 

[ZooMom]

He doesn't leave us. He's always right where we left Him. Faith is believing without seeing. We are called to faith. Just as a shepherd watches his flock with care and keeps them together, he really only has to 'get in their face' when one wanders off.


Peace be with you.

Sandy

 

[thereselittleflower]

It is called the Dark Night of the Soul . . or Divine Darnkess.


Why?

Because we must die to ourselves . . .


Do you remember that Christ on the Cross cried

My God, My God, why hast though forsaken me?


God has told us His ways are not our ways - as the heavens are above the earth, so are His ways above our ways . . . . .He does this out of a love for us that we have nothing to compare to in natural human relationships.

Read Job . . . (but when you do, try reading it this way . . Read the beginning, then after Job is stricken and his "friends" show up, read only what Job says .. ignore what his friends say, then when the 4th friend shows up read that and everything else to the end)





May I recommend that you read St. John of the Cross . . The Dark Night of the Soul. . .


When God does this to a soul, it is to give this soul something deeper of Himself that God, in His divine wisdom knows cannot be received by this soul any other way . . .

It is a great blessing to experience this . . it is terrible while one goes through it . . But while one is in this darkness, when God seems to no longer exist, when it seems that His presence is absent from the very atoms of the universe, He is actually closer to you than ever before. . . .




Peace in Him!

 

[Benedicta00]

Mother Theresa and St Theresa of Lisueax also experienced this dark night. It's all part of our purification and our transformation into what Christ redeemed to us to be.

 

[Carrye]

And at three o'clock Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lema sabachthani?" which is translated, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" (Mk 15:34)

Did the Father truly forsake/abandon Jesus, or did it just feel like it?

 

[PolskiKrol]

He doesn't leave us. He's always right where we left Him//He does love us

Please read the OP BEFORE you reply.

did it just feel like it?

Yes, it just felt like it. Which is what I said, care to address the question?

His ways are not our ways

So basically we don't know WHY He does it. So what do you guys think on His timing? I mean like WHEN He chooses the Dark Night? Not that we can understand His will, but from your expirience and what you've heard, when does the Dark Night usually occur and in what circumstances?

 

[Carrye]

Please read the OP BEFORE you reply.

Yes, it just felt like it. Which is what I said, care to address the question?

First, I'm going to assume that you're speaking in charity.

God's love is absolutely not a recruiting tactic. If that were so, He would not need to love us after we were "recruited". Our love and obedience to Him is something that He deserves because we are creatures and He is our Creator. It's not something that He needs, but something that is owed to Him.

This desolation is not a punishment. It is often experienced by the holiest of saints. Closeness with God does not preclude darkness.

 

[Benedicta00]

So basically we don't know WHY He does it. So what do you guys think on His timing? I mean like WHEN He chooses the Dark Night? Not that we can understand His will, but from your expirience and what you've heard, when does the Dark Night usually occur and in what circumstances?

He does it when he sees fit for our spiritual good. If God did not with draw himself from us we would never grow in our love for him and others. It’s like the spoiled child who always wants what she wants from daddy, If daddy didn’t put his foot down and finaly say no a few times the child would never grow up.

Also we are being weaned off the milk as children. To grow in holiness and perfect love we need to stop relying on feelings and emotions. God is with us when we feel him and when we don’t. Through the dark night we learn this, that feelings come and go and can run high and low. We have to rely on what we know and not what we feel. We chose to love God with all our hearts soul mind etc. We don’t love him because it’s feels good. It’s all about growing in perfect love of God- training us this way is his gift to us. It’s all about growing up and growing in holiness and love so God can bring us to the next level.

 

[thereselittleflower]

Please read the OP BEFORE you reply.

Yes, it just felt like it. Which is what I said, care to address the question?

So basically we don't know WHY He does it. So what do you guys think on His timing? I mean like WHEN He chooses the Dark Night? Not that we can understand His will, but from your expirience and what you've heard, when does the Dark Night usually occur and in what circumstances?

The delima you are running into here is that not everyone who will respond to you has experienced this ..in fact, I think most have not . . .so if someone thinks this is the result of one leaving God, it is because this may be the only way they can conceive of this happening . .

Those who have been through a Dark Night know this is not the case . . it is not something one has done to 'leave' God . . It is not something that is within one's power at all . . .


It is something that God does, in His Divine wisdom, and there is no way of anticipating it . . . It just suddenly happens when God so chooses to grace a soul in this manner . . .


If the soul has nothing with which to understand such an experieince, it can be absolutely devestating and terrifying . . . One can easily beleive that they have truly lost their salvation with no hope . . It is like being thrown into the deepest darkest pit you can imagine, it is as though God has removed Hismelf from the very atoms of your body . . . this is not the desert, the dryness of spirit many experience . . this is Darkness . . . You can be brought to the very end of yourself . . to the very brink . .. but God has never abandoned you for one second though you have no knowledge of it at the time . ..


God does not really abandon you . . . but for all intents and purposes experientially, it is as though He has for all eternity . ..


For who, when and under what cirucmstances it is not possible to say . . this is somthing God keeps to Himself . . But it only happens when God deems the time to be right . .


It is a great Grace. . . . .


Again .. I recommend St John of the Croos . .The Dark Night of the Soul . . .





Peace in Him!

 

[Maximus]

Anybody here besides me ever see the film The Chosen or read the book (by Chaim Potok)?

Rent the film or get the book. Watch or read with this thread in mind.

It's a good one.

 

[thereselittleflower]

Anybody here besides me ever see the film The Chosen or read the book (by Chaim Potok)?

Rent the film or get the book. Watch or read with this thread in mind.

It's a good one.

I am sorry . . I have seen the film, I don't see the connection . .. What do you see it having to do with this subject?


Peace in Him!