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AnswersinHovind wrote:
Wow, what a cogent and convincing evidence based point!
It's almost as detailed as Girlee's
Why do creationist points so quickly degrade to simply plugging one's ears and saying "la la la la, I can't hear you! la la la la"?
I guess "Nope." is easier to type.
Oh, and on a side note, are most readers familar with the convicted criminal and creationist, Kent Hovind? The facts speak for themselves. His bio is here: Kent Hovind - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Papias
Please read threads before posting in them. Discussion has already addressed your issue.
No. it did not.
You do not understand, and you do not ask question. So, forget it.
First - dice 6 ripe tomatoes (approximately 1 cup)
Second - dice 1/2 yellow or white onion (approximately 1/3 cup)
Third - dice 6 jalapenos (less if you cannot stand the heat)
Fourth - combine all diced ingredients into a bowl
Fifth - add to the diced ingredients the following spices:
1/4 tsp garlic
1/4 tsp salt
1/4 tsp ground black pepper
1 tbsp cilantro
Now mix all ingredients well and place in refrigerator
I took 1/4 tsp garlic, 1/4 tsp salt, 1/4 tsp ground black pepper, 1 tbsp cilantro and put that in a bowl
I diced 1/2 yellow or white onion and I also diced 6 ripe tomatoes as well as 6 jalapenos
Before I put the salsa into the refrigerator I mixed everything well
True, "dice" is in the present tense, but it's only present relative to the verb "said" which is in the past tense.First, I said, "dice 6 ripe tomatoes."
Second, I said, "dice 1/2 yellow or white onion."
Third, I said, "dice 6 jalapenos."
Hot salsa! Now there's something we can agree on!
Genesis 1 is still past tense reported though; it's more like this:
True, "dice" is in the present tense, but it's only present relative to the verb "said" which is in the past tense.
You are correct, Genesis 1 is in past tense so I should have made my example to be that way also, so your rearrangement makes it mesh better. Did you notice though that there is no specific order mentioned in Genesis 2 in some translations but there is in others, my question is why? I found that most translations tend to say basically the same thing, but there are parts where they diverge especially in some OT writings. I do know that the OT scriptures were amended following the second Babylonian exile, and I am pretty sure that is where Genesis 1 came from which is a whole other story.
This is one of those cases where the @1.2% (If I remember correctly) significant differences comes into play.
I would not put too much emphasis on the differing opinions of translations. The problem with translations is that Hebrew and English are so different, that you have to interpret some things and take a couple liberties just for the text to make sense. And in some cases, the translators add words or alter verb tenses to try and make it readable. Here is an example from Genesis 2:8
NIV "Now the LORD God had planted a garden in the east"
NASB "The LORD God planted a garden toward the east"
"Now" and "had" have been entirely added to the text in the NIV to try and reconcile the order difference of creation from Genesis 1. In the NASB translation, which has a more acurate rendering of the verb tense, the story seems to imply that the garden was planted after man was made (the same is true where God forms the beasts later in the chapter), so the NIV adds those words to make it seem as though it was a past event, and not happening at that moment in the story, to help the reader reconcile the two stories.
Genesis 2:19 NASB said:Out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the sky, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called a living creature, that was its name.
You are on to something there, what you have noticed is our English translations trying to express a Hebrew construction called the waw consecutive, used in Hebrew to express a sequence of events. It uses the Hebrew letter waw וַ which means 'and' and attaches it to the start (right hand side) of a verb in the perfect or imperfect tense. These usually turn up in translations as 'and..' 'then..' 'so...' However this is not a foolproof way of identifying the construction. Translations are not always consistent in translating the waw consecutive, and you can also get 'and' when the waw is attached to a noun.Upon reading many different translations on Genesis 2 I noticed that some include order
modifiers and some do not. What I mean by order modifier are words like "now", "then", "first" and so on. Let me
try to explain the importance in a way that will show the importance of the use of those words.
That seems to reinforce my point though, the NASB seems to have far fewer order specifiers in the account, here is an example
Genesis 2:19 NASB said:Out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the sky, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called a living creature, that was its name.
In that verse, is there a specific order mentioned in regards to creation, and is there a specific time in regards to how long before they were named? That verse serves two functions; it states that God formed the creatures (from the dust) and that God gave Adam authority to name each creature.
You are on to something there, what you have noticed is our English translations trying to express a Hebrew construction called the waw consecutive, used in Hebrew to express a sequence of events. It uses the Hebrew letter waw וַ which means 'and' and attaches it to the start (right hand side) of a verb in the perfect or imperfect tense. These usually turn up in translations as 'and..' 'then..' 'so...' However this is not a foolproof way of identifying the construction. Translations are not always consistent in translating the waw consecutive, and you can also get 'and' when the waw is attached to a noun.
In Gen 2:19 the NASB actually omits the first waw consecutive, which you can see in the
NLT So the LORD God formed...
RSV So out of the ground the LORD God formed...
KJV And out of the ground the LORD God formed...
I had a quick look in the passage and I have highlighted the waw consecutives I have found.
Gen 2:18 Then the LORD God said, "It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him."
19 So out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the heavens and brought them to the man to see what he would call them. And whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name.
20 And the man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper fit for him.
As you can see, the english translation often separates the waw from the verb. I also ran into the problem of waw consecutives not being translated, the ESV I used missed out on the one I highlighted in verse 20, but you will see it if you check other translations.
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