Could final Elijah = Moshiach ben Ephrayim?

[DennisTate]

If so... then there is a possible connection to the Cyrus type of Isaiah 45

Isaiah 45:4
and Isaiah 45:5
to my thinking mean that this political leader who will prepare the way for the rebuilding of the Jerusalem Third Temple and / or the Ezekiel chapter 40 - 48 cannot be Messiah Yeshua - Jesus only..... because I believe that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus knew the Ancient of Days the Father extremely well?!

Thus saith Jehovah to his anointed, to Cyrus, whose right hand I have holden, to subdue nations before him, and I will loose the loins of kings; to open the doors before him, and the gates shall not be shut: 2 I will go before thee, and make the rough places smooth; I will break in pieces the doors of brass, and cut in sunder the bars of iron; 3 and I will give thee the treasures of darkness, and hidden riches of secret places, that thou mayest know that it is I, Jehovah, who call thee by thy name, even the God of Israel.

4 For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel my chosen, I have called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.

5 I am Jehovah, and there is none else; besides me there is no God. I will gird thee, though thou hast not known me; 6 that they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none besides me: I am Jehovah, and there is none else.

 

[DennisTate]

I do believe that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus is the ultimate Cyrus type which I believe can be seen in the way that he has been dealing with people in this time period who have a brush with death...... a near death experience......and feel loved in spite of being non- Jews or non- Christians.

But I see a need for a political fulfillment of Isaiah chapter 45 and a man named Eporu Ronald Alfred has written an insightful article on that topic.

I quote it in full here in post #1:
Do you believe a massive Holy Spirit tsunami is coming?

 

[Ken Rank]

If so... then there is a possible connection to the Cyrus type of Isaiah 45

Isaiah 45:4
and Isaiah 45:5
to my thinking mean that this political leader who will prepare the way for the rebuilding of the Jerusalem Third Temple and / or the Ezekiel chapter 40 - 48 cannot be Messiah Yeshua - Jesus only..... because I believe that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus knew the Ancient of Days the Father extremely well?!

Thus saith Jehovah to his anointed, to Cyrus, whose right hand I have holden, to subdue nations before him, and I will loose the loins of kings; to open the doors before him, and the gates shall not be shut: 2 I will go before thee, and make the rough places smooth; I will break in pieces the doors of brass, and cut in sunder the bars of iron; 3 and I will give thee the treasures of darkness, and hidden riches of secret places, that thou mayest know that it is I, Jehovah, who call thee by thy name, even the God of Israel.

4 For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel my chosen, I have called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.

5 I am Jehovah, and there is none else; besides me there is no God. I will gird thee, though thou hast not known me; 6 that they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none besides me: I am Jehovah, and there is none else.

I would tend to think not. I believe that Yeshua came as Mashiach ben Yosef, messiah the son of Joseph... i.e. the suffering servant. When he returns it is as the conquering King, or mashiach ben David (Messiah son of David). The first coming he did the work necessary for all and began the call into the nations for Ephraim. When he returns he will assemble all of His Israel as one bride after putting down her enemies.

 

[DennisTate]

I would tend to think not. I believe that Yeshua came as Mashiach ben Yosef, messiah the son of Joseph... i.e. the suffering servant. When he returns it is as the conquering King, or mashiach ben David (Messiah son of David). The first coming he did the work necessary for all and began the call into the nations for Ephraim. When he returns he will assemble all of His Israel as one bride after putting down her enemies.

Good reply indeed.... but the relationship that the first century Messianic Jewish community had with the Rabbinic Jews until the time of the destruction of the Temple is interesting isn't it?

"The Sacrificial System Will Continue

One of the most perplexing ideas to students of Scripture is the idea that God intends that the annual feasts, along with animal sacrifice, will continue into the Millennium. Many Christians who have studied the prophetic portions of Zechariah 14, Isaiah 66, and Ezekiel 40 - 48, which clearly describe these Millennial worship ordinations, are confused by the idea. They ask, "Didn't the sacrifice of Christ eliminate animal sacrifices forever?"

............"Only the complete sacrifice of Jesus could ever totally atone for our sins. However, God clearly demanded the sacrifices from Adam to Christ. Those sacrifices were acts of obedience to the direct command of God, as well as acknowledgements of one's own personal sinfulness and need for God's forgiveness. Animal sacrifices covered the sins of the people temporarily until the prophesied Messiah would come and offer Himself once and for all as the necessary atonement for sin. If animal sacrifice can never atone for sin, why would God allow Israel to resume such sacrifice in the Third Temple, prior to Armageddon, and then demand that Israel continue such sacrifice in the Millennium? There are two reasons why I believe this is true."

First, the early Jewish - Christian Church continued to offer sacrifices in the first century.".......



.......Second, New Testament writers used the legal sacrificial system to illustrate very important points concerning Christ's sacrifice on the Cross.......

..... These examples of the way early Jewish believers used God's law to teach great love when He sacrificed His only Son on the cross will be repeated during the Millennium." (Grant R. Jeffrey, Messiah, War in the Middle East and the Road to Armageddon, page 317, 318 and 319)

 

[Ken Rank]

Good reply indeed.... but the relationship that the first century Messianic Jewish community had with the Rabbinic Jews until the time of the destruction of the Temple is interesting isn't it?

Definitely. But one of the things that we don't understand in the modern (western) church is that the early messianic Jews and what we would now call Orthodox Jews, continued to fellowship together. We have ample evidence in Acts with hints in other books as well as extra biblical time period references that reveal this as being true. The problem is, we get the impression from the gospels that all Jews were Pharisees and Sadducees and that they were all bad. Not true... a relatively small amount of Jews were Pharisees and then there were two schools of them with one receiving the brunt of Yeshua's rebukes. The Sadducees were the priests (and civil elite) and again, were a small minority. Point being, that great schism we see in parts of the NT, is out of context. The messianic and orthodox, if you will, weren't as divided as we are raised to believe.

 

[DennisTate]

Definitely. But one of the things that we don't understand in the modern (western) church is that the early messianic Jews and what we would now call Orthodox Jews, continued to fellowship together. We have ample evidence in Acts with hints in other books as well as extra biblical time period references that reveal this as being true. The problem is, we get the impression from the gospels that all Jews were Pharisees and Sadducees and that they were all bad. Not true... a relatively small amount of Jews were Pharisees and then there were two schools of them with one receiving the brunt of Yeshua's rebukes. The Sadducees were the priests (and civil elite) and again, were a small minority. Point being, that great schism we see in parts of the NT, is out of context. The messianic and orthodox, if you will, weren't as divided as we are raised to believe.

Truly well said.....

John 8:31

Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

Jhn 12:11

Because that by reason of him many of the Jews went away, and believed on Jesus.

Act 14:1

And it came to pass in Iconium, that they went both together into the synagogue of the Jews, and so spake, that a great multitude both of the Jews and also of the Greeks believed.

Act 17:5

But the Jews which believed not, moved with envy, took unto them certain lewd fellows of the baser sort, and gathered a company, and set all the city on an uproar, and assaulted the house of Jason, and sought to bring them out to the people.

 

[DennisTate]

Speaking of Moshiach ben Ephrayim/ Messiah son of Joseph????????????

Trump Hints at Becoming King of Israel

President Trump as an actor playing the role of a modern metaphorical King Cyrus of Israel could fit with the Yair Davidiy writings on Moshiach ben Ephrayim.

Israel has developed astonishing mega-scale desalination technology that has the potential to actually begin stabilization of the climate but it is difficult to sell us Canadians on a Carbon Tax considering that we produce less than two percent of global atmospheric carbon dioxide.

New Mexico biologist Carl Cantrell has put forward an alternative theory on stabilization of the climate that President Trump could use to cause a boom in the economy of Israel, Australia, California and much of the Middle East.

.....

"So how is our problem of continental drying causing global warming? It all has to do with vegetation and sunlight. When sun light hits a plant, it causes a process which we call photosynthesis where the energy from the sun light creates oxygen for us to breathe, water for us to drink, and is stored as sugar for plants and animals to use. When the same sun light hits the soil, all of its energy turns into heat and is radiated back into the atmosphere.. ."

"Therefore, the less vegetation you have on the planet, the more sunlight is being turned into heat and the warmer the planet becomes...."

"Just take a look at any satellite picture of the earth showing heat and you will see that our deserts are the warmest spots on the planet by far. More heat is being generated by just one of the top four or five deserts than by all of our cities combined.... "

"The truth is that you can do more to decrease global warming by just reducing the average temperature for the Sahara Desert by one or two degrees than if we humans completely quit using fossil fuels and returned to the cave…."

"So, how would you start working to resolve this problem? Easy, cool the deserts and get some vegetation growing on them as soon as possible. But the method is much more complex than that. You have to use the prevailing trade winds in relation to the deserts to get the best results as quickly as possible and it will be extremely expensive…."

"Then we build desalination plants along the coast near these water sheds and pipe water to the tops or ridges of the water sheds…"

"We need to start working on this as soon as possible because, if the planet reaches a point to where it is warming faster than our technology can possibly stop or reverse this warming trend, then our planet is lost and all life will cease to exist on this planet within a relatively short period of time. We will need to start with the largest and hottest deserts because cooling them will have the greatest benefit in the least time (Global Warming II by biologist Carl Cantrell)."

 

[DennisTate]

I would tend to think not. I believe that Yeshua came as Mashiach ben Yosef, messiah the son of Joseph... i.e. the suffering servant. When he returns it is as the conquering King, or mashiach ben David (Messiah son of David). The first coming he did the work necessary for all and began the call into the nations for Ephraim. When he returns he will assemble all of His Israel as one bride after putting down her enemies.

I admit that I could be wrong about this......
but at this time I lean heavily toward a final Elijah who could even play a huge role in setting the stage politically and even economically for the rebuilding of the Jerusalem Third Temple and / or the Ezekiel 40
to Ezekiel 48 temple complex?????