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Coping :with leaving a cult

hannabanana

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I was born into The Twelve Tribes community which after I left I have really come to know as a cult. I left shortly after I turned 18 leaving all of my friends that I grew up with in the community and also my parents. Even though I know that some of the practices that went on in the community are not right and some of the ways of living were not right I still struggle everyday. First, leaving my parents there is really tugging on my heart. I feel like I have disappointed them in so many ways. I still love them so much. Also since being out from the Twelve Tribe community I have been living with my grandparents who have really been guarding me closely because well up to a year and a few months ago I have never experience much in the world. This has left me with hardly any friends.

Even though I doubt I will ever return to the community I still feel convicted everyday of leaving. It was my entire life for 18 years. All I ask for is prayer that God will lead me in the right direct and give me wisdom for what is in store for me in the future.

Thank You, Hanna
 

Johnnz

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You face a very big adjustment. A long involvement with them will take a lot of rethinking and adjustment. A large part of your identity, relationships, what you know and understand took place there. You will now need to develop some very different insights and identity. If you can find some good friends your own age that will help. But you will face that tug on and off and sometimes very strongly for quite some time, even years.

Bless you
John
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hannabanana

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Thank You and yes I have been away from the community since June 2008 and let me tell you there is not a day that goes by that I don't think I made the wrong choice. Right now my support sytem is my Grandparents whom I live with right now and also an Aunt & Uncle and my two cousins. I have not really developed any real friends yet as I am still trying to adjust to how different things are here.
 
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bluelime2

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I grew up in a church that had what many would describe as some 'culty' thinking and God has brought some scriptures to my attention regarding it that might be of help you.

Matt 12:46-49 While Jesus was still talking to the crowd, his mother and brothers stood outside, wanting to speak to him. Someone told him, "Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you." He replied to him, "Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?" Pointing to his disciples, he said, "Here are my mother and my brothers.

And also in conjunction with Matt 10:35-37 For I have come to turn " 'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law- "Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me;

One of the attributes that people often use to describe 'cults' is a structure set up that causes people to 'follow' christ through them. That they alone know how to interpret the bible 'correctly' before God, and if you don't agree with their interpretation, you're a heretic and rejected by God himself.

That's a very dangerous attitude to have as a christian, and yet a suprising amount of christian groups carry it to some degree or other. It comes from submitting to an authority figure before submitting to God himself. So someone has placed themselves directly between you and God to interpret him to you (and consequently sort of 'own' you in the process.)

The bible also says in Matt 23:8-10 "But you are not to be called 'Rabbi,' for you have only one Master and you are all brothers. And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. Nor are you to be called 'teacher,' for you have one Teacher, the Christ.

In otherwords don't do this. Don't allow a human being to be between you and God in a spiritual teacher/master/father sense (the word Rabbi in the original means master/great one.)

So no one is supposed to have that place in our life - only God himself.

There definatly is a place for authority, spiritual teaching and fathering/mentoring within christianity, but it is never BETWEEN God and us.

And to be honest I've struggled over where the line is on this one myself for years.

I think the problem behind it all, is that the modern day church at large isn't based on the structure given in the new testament. Whenever people choose to ignore Gods instructions and example in a matter, theres going to be consequences.

Hope that helps.

God also challenged me recently (that's the beauty of making God alone your master and giving him your life to follow him directly - you get a two-way relationship with him through his holy spirit that you cant' get any other way) on my loyalty to family over loyalty to my spiritual family. The example christ gave us was that our loyalty to God himself and his family comes first. However when you've been told that one group and one group alone are that spiritual family then this sort of thing can become confusing. But that isn't what God himself says in the bible. And his opinion is the only one that matters in the end. To reject that is to disobey him.

Love him first and you can't go wrong. But forgiveness is essential in getting free from any hold and emotional damage done to us through other christians and family (again speaking from my own experience) - and that's regardless of how genuine and well meaning they might have been.

We all sin and we all make mistakes. If someone runs over you with a truck, you're still dead whether they meant to do it or not. We need to forgive everyone who's hurt us, in any way, shape or form or the bible tells us that God won't forgive us our own sins (Matt 18)

And also - something I've also gotten revelation on recently, is that following a human being before God through our own fear or desire for love and acceptance is actually idolatry (and something I've certainly been very guilty of in my life at times).
God isn't a hard taskmaster, he tells us that his 'yoke is easy and his burden is light' and it truly is. But he does have to be first in our lives and we need to be following him personally before we truly are a 'christian'.

God bless and all the best with your journey into healing. No christian group is perfect, but the more one ignores the actual instructions given in the bible, the more twisted and damaging it can be - even when it's filled with some of the most genuine, and well meaning people you know.

People can be genuine but still genuinely wrong. Realising that really helped me in my healing process.

All the best with it


Sherri



PS. Another scripture I found really helpful in understanding 'culty' sort of thinking is 'all who call on the name of the Lord will be saved'. Acts 2:21 Cults don't believe that.
 
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hannabanana

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Thank you Sherri for the scriptures. It has been a real inspiration to read them and I have jotted down all of the verses for me mediatation on them when I go back and read in the Bible later today.

You are absolutely correct when you say that there should be nothing between us and God and with The Twelve Tribes community they did just that. They put what the Leader said he was getting from God himself to the other community leaders and that is what was taught. It was so hard to go against that because being told it was coming from God it is hard to deny that.

Also placing God first. Although in the Community it did seem that God was the center of all things and it was taught to us that this is why we do all things for the Glory of God we also served the leaders and especially the women and girls served the other males in the community.
 
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LJSGM

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I left a cult like church when I was twenty, but I was only there for a few years. I still have strong feelings for them, like they were my family, and I still miss them, even after eight years. I believe they seperated from the main world wide group after a huge number of us just shuddenly left, they took it as a sign from God I think. So, I was still in contact with them sometimes.

May God bless you in your journey, you are not alone. He will keep you.
 
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hannabanana

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I left a cult like church when I was twenty, but I was only there for a few years. I still have strong feelings for them, like they were my family, and I still miss them, even after eight years. I believe they seperated from the main world wide group after a huge number of us just shuddenly left, they took it as a sign from God I think. So, I was still in contact with them sometimes.

May God bless you in your journey, you are not alone. He will keep you.
Thank You, I do know that it will be a long journey. There isn't a day that goes by that I don't think about heading back. Pretty much it is all I know of and all my friends are there and also my parents.
 
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LJSGM

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Thank You, I do know that it will be a long journey. There isn't a day that goes by that I don't think about heading back. Pretty much it is all I know of and all my friends are there and also my parents.

You could head back, if you have the strength and courage and if you can keep them from trying to control you, but if it wouldn't be peaceful for them or you, then it might take some time before you should think about doing that...

Unless they kicked you out?
 
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UnitynLove

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I left a cult like church when I was twenty, but I was only there for a few years. I still have strong feelings for them, like they were my family, and I still miss them, even after eight years. I believe they seperated from the main world wide group after a huge number of us just shuddenly left, they took it as a sign from God I think. So, I was still in contact with them sometimes.

May God bless you in your journey, you are not alone. He will keep you.

What a great avantar
 
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BlessEwe

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You could head back, if you have the strength and courage and if you can keep them from trying to control you, but if it wouldn't be peaceful for them or you, then it might take some time before you should think about doing that...

Unless they kicked you out?



It sounds as though these cults had control over your mind , just as drugs and alcohol had over me. I would never put myself back into any situation situation I was in. Being distant is the best thing for now and maybe perhaps in time she can see her family with the support of a strong friend there.
I can understand how your Grandma is protecting you right now, this is wonderful. Does she belong to a church? I can understand your concern of going, but just as bluelime2 said you can tell when Christ isn't first in the congregation.
Maybe read some inspiring books, like The Shack. Or great christian music.
We are so glad you are here
 
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The Mighty Sword

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I was born into The Twelve Tribes community which after I left I have really come to know as a cult. I left shortly after I turned 18 leaving all of my friends that I grew up with in the community and also my parents. Even though I know that some of the practices that went on in the community are not right and some of the ways of living were not right I still struggle everyday. First, leaving my parents there is really tugging on my heart. I feel like I have disappointed them in so many ways. I still love them so much. Also since being out from the Twelve Tribe community I have been living with my grandparents who have really been guarding me closely because well up to a year and a few months ago I have never experience much in the world. This has left me with hardly any friends.

Even though I doubt I will ever return to the community I still feel convicted everyday of leaving. It was my entire life for 18 years. All I ask for is prayer that God will lead me in the right direct and give me wisdom for what is in store for me in the future.

Thank You, Hanna


Your friends who truly Love You, will never leave you.

Christ say's I will never leave you nor forsake you, And neither will true Christians.
 
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the.Sheepdog

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I was born into The Twelve Tribes community which after I left I have really come to know as a cult. I left shortly after I turned 18 leaving all of my friends that I grew up with in the community and also my parents. Even though I know that some of the practices that went on in the community are not right and some of the ways of living were not right I still struggle everyday. First, leaving my parents there is really tugging on my heart. I feel like I have disappointed them in so many ways. I still love them so much. Also since being out from the Twelve Tribe community I have been living with my grandparents who have really been guarding me closely because well up to a year and a few months ago I have never experience much in the world. This has left me with hardly any friends.

Even though I doubt I will ever return to the community I still feel convicted everyday of leaving. It was my entire life for 18 years. All I ask for is prayer that God will lead me in the right direct and give me wisdom for what is in store for me in the future.

Thank You, Hanna


You have plenty of friends sweetie. Please count me as one. You managed to learn the truth and escape and all you can think of is the others. That makes you special in my book. God will indeed lead you and I would say He already is doing so. God is good, it is religion that is bad when it imposes rules on you that never came from Him.
 
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hannabanana

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You could head back, if you have the strength and courage and if you can keep them from trying to control you, but if it wouldn't be peaceful for them or you, then it might take some time before you should think about doing that...

Unless they kicked you out?
No, I left shortly after I turned 18.

It sounds as though these cults had control over your mind , just as drugs and alcohol had over me. I would never put myself back into any situation situation I was in. Being distant is the best thing for now and maybe perhaps in time she can see her family with the support of a strong friend there.
I can understand how your Grandma is protecting you right now, this is wonderful. Does she belong to a church? I can understand your concern of going, but just as bluelime2 said you can tell when Christ isn't first in the congregation.
Maybe read some inspiring books, like The Shack. Or great christian music.
We are so glad you are here
Thank You for the books to look into. Yes, it was controlling in someways, but also comforting as well. I love that my grandparents have taken me in and they have giving me a lot of insight on where there daughter(my mom) and son in law(my dad) got involved with the group before I was born. They are being protective of me because technically I have only been in the real world for just over 1 year now and I appreciate that. Yes I do miss my friends that I grew up with and the love we shared for one another and I miss my Mom & Dad so very much. My grandparents are of the Catholic Faith, but don't seem to attend services regularly.

Your friends who truly Love You, will never leave you.

Christ say's I will never leave you nor forsake you, And neither will true Christians.
Thank You. I do know this to be true.

You have plenty of friends sweetie. Please count me as one. You managed to learn the truth and escape and all you can think of is the others. That makes you special in my book. God will indeed lead you and I would say He already is doing so. God is good, it is religion that is bad when it imposes rules on you that never came from Him.
Thank You so much. Each day is a journey for me and I am so glad I can come herea feel so loved by so many. Thank You all.
 
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LJSGM

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It sounds as though these cults had control over your mind , just as drugs and alcohol had over me. I would never put myself back into any situation situation I was in. Being distant is the best thing for now and maybe perhaps in time she can see her family with the support of a strong friend there.
I can understand how your Grandma is protecting you right now, this is wonderful. Does she belong to a church? I can understand your concern of going, but just as bluelime2 said you can tell when Christ isn't first in the congregation.
Maybe read some inspiring books, like The Shack. Or great christian music.
We are so glad you are here

Only she knows the situation and her own strength in it.

They are still her relatives and will probably have to reconcile in some way sooner or later.
 
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hannabanana

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From an outsiders or visitors perspective of this community everything may seem to be very joyful, spirtual , and loving and in someways they are. I do not doubt that any member that I lived with would sacrifice themselves for my well being. They are a really loving community for the most part. What people on the outside do not see however is the manipulation that the leaders use on you. Now in my case being born into this community I pretty much didn't have to give up anything at first, but those who joined later in life like my parents well they gave up their home, land, jobs, and any other possession they had to the church community. This was told to me by my grandparents. Secondly, the head leader of this community Mr. Spriggs is said to have a direct line to God. This means that any interpretation of the Bible that comes from him to the other teaching leaders is directly from God. This makes it extremely hard to dispute any teachings that went on in the community. If there was a dispute of any kind there was also punishment that followed. Most of this punishment comes in the form of confinement from the group and fasting. This is to have time to cleanse your spirit. I myself never saw any account of physical(other than spankings) or sexualy abuse in anyway. The abuse came in the form of labor which now as I look back on it was like slave labor. Starting around the age of 11 girls, boys would work harvesting crops, selling crops, and other things we made for money for the church. Sometimes working over 12 hours per day with no compensation at all.
You also mentioned seclusiveness. I live in this community for 18 years of my life and those are the boundaries that I saw for 18 years of my life. Some of the leaders and elected adults would leave the community to sell the harvest or other goods we made, but myself no. When finally leaving I was taken to the entrance where my Uncle and Grandfather were waiting. This was several miles away from the actually area in which I lived all my life.
Also another thing was the way that women and girls were treated as sub standard to everyone else. For example: we had no say in any discussions or Bible studies. We were there to take in all the wisdom, but never to speak. We pretty much had to do as any male would have us do with hesitation. I remember my mother being told by a boy 12 years old that she had to dig this hole and it had to be done a certain way. Also females who were on their periods were only allowed at service to sit in the dirt because they were unclean.

The teachings as far as base beliefs seemed to be on par with what the Bible said. To be saved you must understand that Jesus was sent as Flesh to this earth, he walked the earth and shed his blood for our sins. Now that seems to be on par, but here is how it went wrong. Because Mr. Spriggs had a direct line to God things were added by God to him. Such as you had to be a part of The Twelve Tribes community or you would not receive salvation. Big difference from what is in the Bible, but since it is coming from the mouth of God to His chosen it is believed. There is so much more I could go into, so on the outside looking in it does look like a really spiritually friendly community who Love God and everyone in the community and I don't doubt they do, but there is also the things that visitors do not see. Hope that helps a bit.
 
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hannabanana

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Only she knows the situation and her own strength in it.

They are still her relatives and will probably have to reconcile in some way sooner or later.
That is what I am truly afraid of. Will I ever get that chance to reconcile with my Mom & Dad. Will I be able to tell them I love them again. Right now it seems the only way I can do that is to go back voluntarily and be with the community. That is the hardest thing I struggle with each and everyday. Also being out in the real world for over a year I have heard things about cults now that really scare me, like mass suicides with the end times coming. I don't think this will occur because I have never heard any talk of suicide when the end is upon us, but the church has preached the end times being near and we must prepare ourselves..
 
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LJSGM

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That is what I am truly afraid of. Will I ever get that chance to reconcile with my Mom & Dad. Will I be able to tell them I love them again. Right now it seems the only way I can do that is to go back voluntarily and be with the community. That is the hardest thing I struggle with each and everyday. Also being out in the real world for over a year I have heard things about cults now that really scare me, like mass suicides with the end times coming. I don't think this will occur because I have never heard any talk of suicide when the end is upon us, but the church has preached the end times being near and we must prepare ourselves..

Have you thought about writing them a letter or email?
 
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brinny

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I grew up in a church that had what many would describe as some 'culty' thinking and God has brought some scriptures to my attention regarding it that might be of help you.

Matt 12:46-49 While Jesus was still talking to the crowd, his mother and brothers stood outside, wanting to speak to him. Someone told him, "Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you." He replied to him, "Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?" Pointing to his disciples, he said, "Here are my mother and my brothers.

And also in conjunction with Matt 10:35-37 For I have come to turn " 'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law- "Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me;

One of the attributes that people often use to describe 'cults' is a structure set up that causes people to 'follow' christ through them. That they alone know how to interpret the bible 'correctly' before God, and if you don't agree with their interpretation, you're a heretic and rejected by God himself.

That's a very dangerous attitude to have as a christian, and yet a suprising amount of christian groups carry it to some degree or other. It comes from submitting to an authority figure before submitting to God himself. So someone has placed themselves directly between you and God to interpret him to you (and consequently sort of 'own' you in the process.)

The bible also says in Matt 23:8-10 "But you are not to be called 'Rabbi,' for you have only one Master and you are all brothers. And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. Nor are you to be called 'teacher,' for you have one Teacher, the Christ.

In otherwords don't do this. Don't allow a human being to be between you and God in a spiritual teacher/master/father sense (the word Rabbi in the original means master/great one.)

So no one is supposed to have that place in our life - only God himself.

There definatly is a place for authority, spiritual teaching and fathering/mentoring within christianity, but it is never BETWEEN God and us.

And to be honest I've struggled over where the line is on this one myself for years.

I think the problem behind it all, is that the modern day church at large isn't based on the structure given in the new testament. Whenever people choose to ignore Gods instructions and example in a matter, theres going to be consequences.

Hope that helps.

God also challenged me recently (that's the beauty of making God alone your master and giving him your life to follow him directly - you get a two-way relationship with him through his holy spirit that you cant' get any other way) on my loyalty to family over loyalty to my spiritual family. The example christ gave us was that our loyalty to God himself and his family comes first. However when you've been told that one group and one group alone are that spiritual family then this sort of thing can become confusing. But that isn't what God himself says in the bible. And his opinion is the only one that matters in the end. To reject that is to disobey him.

Love him first and you can't go wrong. But forgiveness is essential in getting free from any hold and emotional damage done to us through other christians and family (again speaking from my own experience) - and that's regardless of how genuine and well meaning they might have been.

We all sin and we all make mistakes. If someone runs over you with a truck, you're still dead whether they meant to do it or not. We need to forgive everyone who's hurt us, in any way, shape or form or the bible tells us that God won't forgive us our own sins (Matt 18)

And also - something I've also gotten revelation on recently, is that following a human being before God through our own fear or desire for love and acceptance is actually idolatry (and something I've certainly been very guilty of in my life at times).
God isn't a hard taskmaster, he tells us that his 'yoke is easy and his burden is light' and it truly is. But he does have to be first in our lives and we need to be following him personally before we truly are a 'christian'.

God bless and all the best with your journey into healing. No christian group is perfect, but the more one ignores the actual instructions given in the bible, the more twisted and damaging it can be - even when it's filled with some of the most genuine, and well meaning people you know.

People can be genuine but still genuinely wrong. Realising that really helped me in my healing process.

All the best with it


Sherri



PS. Another scripture I found really helpful in understanding 'culty' sort of thinking is 'all who call on the name of the Lord will be saved'. Acts 2:21 Cults don't believe that.

Excellent post. God's clarity, which is what i MOST pray for, is like a LIGHT shining in darkness. Praise Him, that He will shine light smack in the middle of murky darkness and confusion, piercing it and casting it asunder. He prompts us to look JUST to Him. He will be our Good Shepherd and guide us and be a Lamp unto our feet and a Light unto our path.

Praying for you Hanna, and you, Sherri. God bless both of you, sisters in Christ, and daughters of the Most High God.


(((((hug)))))
 
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hannabanana

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Have you thought about writing them a letter or email?
I am not aware of an e-mail address and I could write a letter, but I doubt it would get into the hands I would want it to.

Wow....... just, wow.

Something hasta be done about this. Don't know if I can stand by and let a creep like that get over on good folks. Gonna hafta dig a little deeper.

What would be the most natural way for a traveling stranger, in need of a family, to gain access to them? To become a member?

Might be a 13th. tribe secretly scootin into their house real soon. (-:




-
I really couldn't help you there. All I can tell you is that there are a lot of Twelve Tribes communities throughout the world. Also if you came in as a visitor you would be a guest of the community. Our homes were always open. When you actually become a member is when the work would start and if you would rebel they would probably catch on that you are not there for the right intentions. Also to become a member you must give up all your possession and if you are not willing to do that then they will have you as a visitor, but not a member. I highly doubt that one person could make an impact of shutting down since there have been actually raids that have not shut the community down.

Excellent post. God's clarity, which is what i MOST pray for, is like a LIGHT shining in darkness. Praise Him, that He will shine light smack in the middle of murky darkness and confusion, piercing it and casting it asunder. He prompts us to look JUST to Him. He will be our Good Shepherd and guide us and be a Lamp unto our feet and a Light unto our path.

Praying for you Hanna, and you, Sherri. God bless both of you, sisters in Christ, and daughters of the Most High God.


(((((hug)))))
Thank You so much, Brinny.
 
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LJSGM

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I am not aware of an e-mail address and I could write a letter, but I doubt it would get into the hands I would want it to.

Could you make a phone call? Or just visit your parents? They wouldn't force you to stay physcially, would they? Would that cause them to do anything to you if you were to go over there, like try and manipulate you through guilt tripping and anger or physical force, or the rest of the community? I can't tell how bad it is... maybe you could take your grandma and pa or someone you trust to see them.

I really couldn't help you there. All I can tell you is that there are a lot of Twelve Tribes communities throughout the world. Also if you came in as a visitor you would be a guest of the community. Our homes were always open. When you actually become a member is when the work would start and if you would rebel they would probably catch on that you are not there for the right intentions. Also to become a member you must give up all your possession and if you are not willing to do that then they will have you as a visitor, but not a member. I highly doubt that one person could make an impact of shutting down since there have been actually raids that have not shut the community down.

Thank You so much, Brinny.

Sounds similar, the old bait and switch manipulation that goes down in cults. That happened to me to a lesser degree.
 
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