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But it is fun to be part of a counter-culture and go against the establishment of man.
Hi @James Lai,
Who said 'the whole book is clearly symbolic...' There are prophetic passages in which symbolism was used, such as living animals representing kingdoms. There are metaphorical passages such as God raising up Israel on wings of eagles. But that the whole book is so written, just isn't true.
The ending also uses symbolism and metaphor, but both in the ending and throughout the Scriptures, symbolism refers to a reality of life. The creatures that represented kingdoms were symbolistic, but it represents a reality that kingdoms would rise up for which those symbols refer to. It's not like, "Oh, it's all symbolistic and so it doesn't really mean anything." Similarly, in the end times writings there is a lot of symbolism, but those symbols, while we may not fully understand them as yet, will, for the believer who studies the Scriptures, be seen and understood as they unfold.
For example, the Left Behind series describes the end times as being a day in which all the believers will be raptured, but those who were left on the earth continue to live out the days of the great tribulation. I don't agree with that interpretation, but we won't really be able to say with any certainty who is right until that day comes and we live through the reality of what the Scriptures tell us is the future of things.
But don't be tempted to think that because the Scriptures use symbolism, what it is saying through the use of those symbols is not important and does not reflect a reality. However, for the most part, the old covenant and the new are historic to us. They tell and describe events upon the earth that the people of God have lived through since the beginning of this realm of God's creating. Probably about 10% of the entire Scriptures is prophetic, to us, but just as God has proven over and over again that what He foretells will come to pass...You can trust your life that the 10% will also be fulfilled just as God has told us it will.
God bless,
Ted
Hello.
From another thread, I came up with a question…
Could contradicting teachings cancel each other out in minds of believers and cause lack of passion or idleness? Or worse, cause destructive, counter-productive actions?
For example, I was thinking about
- “love your neighbour and preach the good news to all corners of the world”
- “this world is ending, perhaps any day now. there will be very few saved, the gate is narrow”
You are positively motivated for action only to be told your efforts might be all in vain as total global destruction is imminent.
You’re pushed and pulled at the same time.
Since we know that our mind is way more susceptible to the negatives than the positives, fear has stronger grip on us than love, could it be that such contradicting teachings best to be avoided?
For example, would you write to all churches in the world the following? “Stop teaching the end of the world Right Now! Start teaching possibly a 100,000 year future ahead of us! Every human being eventually hearing the true gospel by our hard work! The Christians one day comprising the 100% of the world’s population!”
Well, that would get you going, what do you think? Not that there isn’t verses that you can base this updated teaching on.
Not “it’s all going to burn” and “no matter what you do, a narrow gate is all we’ll have”… Such ideas are like killing the drive.
It’s like hiring an employee and telling them, “You’ll earn $100k a year but the tax man is arresting our accounts next Friday”… Would you be all hyped up about the $100k income labouring like a bee or rather sit on your hands pretending to be working till your next and only weekly paycheck?
So if we say in math terms.
———————-
Given:
Idea 1 = I1
Idea 2 = I2
I1 and I2 are natural numbers
Human Action = A
A = I1 + I2
Positive idea: + Ix > 0
Negative idea - Ix < 0
Neutral idea Ix = 0
where x ∈ {1,2}
Possible outcomes for A:
1) I1 and I2 both positive
A = + I1 + I2 > 0
Positive human action, its value is greater than each individual idea
2) I1 and I2 both negative
A = - I1 - I2 < 0
Negative human action, its value is lesser than each individual idea
3) I1 is positive and I2 is negative
there are two possible sub-outcomes:
a) If I1 > I2, then
A = + I1 - I2 > 0
Positive human action, its value is lesser than the positive idea I1
b) If I1 < I2
A = + I1 - I2 < 0
Negative human action, its value is greater than the negative idea I2
Okay thank you, I understand now.The governance of the Kingdom of God vs the governance (the establishment) of worldly man. (opposing cultures)
I understand. If the ending is symbolic, how can we interpret it? Why is it New Jerusalem, not New Beijing or New Johannesburg for example?
If we take the size to be literal, then we can calculate the maximum number of inhabitants to live there comfortably. It seems there’s no way such city could fit even half of all the people who ever lived… So again it speaks of a narrow gate with the absolute majority of humanity missing out…
If we take Homo Sapiens with their 2 billion years of history, or if we want to include earlier Hominins, then the number is even greater. Homo Erectus, Australopithecines, Neanderthals, Denisovans etc etc
Hello.
From another thread, I came up with a question…
Could contradicting teachings cancel each other out in minds of believers and cause lack of passion or idleness? Or worse, cause destructive, counter-productive actions?
It's not about changing all, it's about calling in the few.For example, I was thinking about
- “love your neighbour and preach the good news to all corners of the world”
- “this world is ending, perhaps any day now. there will be very few saved, the gate is narrow”
You are positively motivated for action only to be told your efforts might be all in vain as total global destruction is imminent.
You’re pushed and pulled at the same time.
Since we know that our mind is way more susceptible to the negatives than the positives, fear has stronger grip on us than love, could it be that such contradicting teachings best to be avoided?
For example, would you write to all churches in the world the following? “Stop teaching the end of the world Right Now! Start teaching possibly a 100,000 year future ahead of us! Every human being eventually hearing the true gospel by our hard work! The Christians one day comprising the 100% of the world’s population!”
Well, that would get you going, what do you think? Not that there isn’t verses that you can base this updated teaching on.
Not “it’s all going to burn” and “no matter what you do, a narrow gate is all we’ll have”… Such ideas are like killing the drive.
It’s like hiring an employee and telling them, “You’ll earn $100k a year but the tax man is arresting our accounts next Friday”… Would you be all hyped up about the $100k income labouring like a bee or rather sit on your hands pretending to be working till your next and only weekly paycheck?
So if we say in math terms.
———————-
Given:
Idea 1 = I1
Idea 2 = I2
I1 and I2 are natural numbers
Human Action = A
A = I1 + I2
Positive idea: + Ix > 0
Negative idea - Ix < 0
Neutral idea Ix = 0
where x ∈ {1,2}
Possible outcomes for A:
1) I1 and I2 both positive
A = + I1 + I2 > 0
Positive human action, its value is greater than each individual idea
2) I1 and I2 both negative
A = - I1 - I2 < 0
Negative human action, its value is lesser than each individual idea
3) I1 is positive and I2 is negative
there are two possible sub-outcomes:
a) If I1 > I2, then
A = + I1 - I2 > 0
Positive human action, its value is lesser than the positive idea I1
b) If I1 < I2
A = + I1 - I2 < 0
Negative human action, its value is greater than the negative idea I2
It's not about changing all, it's about calling in the few.
As long as there is one person left on the earth, the work still needs to be done to call him in.
And my point is the born again don't think and operate that wayI understand. My point is that the majority of people who accept contradicting teachings, will tend to obey the more powerful one, in this case the imminent doom, therefore becoming idle as it’s useless to even begin to perform a task which is known to fail.
If I expect it’s going to rain later tonight, I’m not going to water the lawn.
Of course, there are people who will go into some length to try and find reconciliation of contradicting teachings, but it’s not an easy mental task and the majority of people won’t go there.
And my point is the born again don't think and operate that way
It is in those who are in allegiance to it and have repented of the ways of man, seeing the error in focusing on self.
If urgency is coupled with the belief that a small portion is getting saved, it effectively cancels out the command to preach to all people. Why even bother? An impossible task. Like Cinderella picking out peas and lentils before going to the ball.
So my point is I’m not taking a single teaching, but a set of teachings that are related and can potentially cancel each other out.
In this case, urgency with a prediction of a grand failure…
Yes, the love of maths
what do you do?Meaning?
Just point out what makes us tick, how it creates all the problems we have, and offer the solution. It's really just a matter of stepping through the looking glass. But the world doesn't take kindly to being told or reminded it is backwards. Didn't work so well for Jesus or the Father.what do you do?
Just point out what makes us tick, how it creates all the problems we have, and offer the solution. It's really just a matter of stepping through the looking glass. But the world doesn't take kindly to being told or reminded it is backwards. Didn't work so well for Jesus or the Father.
Eventually a whole new world yes, without man putting our will ahead of the will of God. Can you not think of others instead of seeking gain for yourself at a cost of harming them? That is contrary to how this world made in our image works. Its a way of life, not some church or denominational movement.I think Jesus preached literal physical Kingdom on earth, and Himself as the King
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