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Conservatives on Texas school board revising curriculum, change history

Beanieboy

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Conservatives on Texas school board revising curriculum, change history

Recently, the Texas school board has begun voting to actually revise history, including playing down Jefferson and the Founding Founders commitment to a purely secular government, presenting Joe McCarthy and his Red Scare in a positive light, etc.

This is powered by Christian Fundamentalists.

Is this lying? Difference of opinion? Good or bad for education?
 
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It is dishonest and bad for education.

Seriously, when you start writing Thomas Jefferson out of American history books, you know something stupid is going on.

We should all learn about history, and we should all learn the good with the bad. No country is perfect, we all have elements in our past that we might be embarassed by or ashamed (that is certainly the case for my country) - the point of history is to acknowledge the past and, in doing so, better prepare ourselves for the future.
 
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Verv

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Conservatives on Texas school board revising curriculum, change history

Recently, the Texas school board has begun voting to actually revise history, including playing down Jefferson and the Founding Founders commitment to a purely secular government, presenting Joe McCarthy and his Red Scare in a positive light, etc.

This is powered by Christian Fundamentalists.

Is this lying? Difference of opinion? Good or bad for education?

Well, we already know where you stand.

"Change history."

Can something that is already built on what largely amounts to idol worship and lies ever be changed?

First and foremost, there are entire books written about McCarthy that do their best to prove the huge issues that existed in America with the Communists.

You are the Righteous One, Beanie Boy?

You are the one that can say that these events in history WERE WRONG? OR WERE RIGHT? OR ARE NOT BEING GIVEN THEIR PROPER APPRAISAL?

This is why I dislike American education to begin with:

(1) Because it is not objective and Conservatives want to corrupt people by changing it.
(2) Because it is not objective and Liberals are ALREADY corrupting people with it.
(3) Because Beanie Boy wants to tell you what is right.

How about we teach both things?

How about WE GET A CURRICULUM THAT HAS NO OPINION?
 
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Aug 24, 2008
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Well, it's not actually changing history... just changing which parts you present.

Slightly less of an offense.

Not wanting to get too semantic here...

Technically history is the study of the events of the past, not the events of the past themselves, so yes, this is "changing history".

I don't think anyone has yet been able to change the events of the past themselves :thumbsup:
 
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Aug 24, 2008
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Well, we already know where you stand.

"Change history."

Can something that is already built on what largely amounts to idol worship and lies ever be changed?

First and foremost, there are entire books written about McCarthy that do their best to prove the huge issues that existed in America with the Communists.

You are the Righteous One, Beanie Boy?

You are the one that can say that these events in history WERE WRONG? OR WERE RIGHT? OR ARE NOT BEING GIVEN THEIR PROPER APPRAISAL?

This is why I dislike American education to begin with:

(1) Because it is not objective and Conservatives want to corrupt people by changing it.
(2) Because it is not objective and Liberals are ALREADY corrupting people with it.
(3) Because Beanie Boy wants to tell you what is right.

How about we teach both things?

How about WE GET A CURRICULUM THAT HAS NO OPINION?

I agree, curriculum should be balanced.

I don't think there is an historical event, person, concept, ideology or whatever other object we can think about that isn't interpreted in many different, legitimate, ways by historians who have provided sound evidence to back up their interpretations. The study of history should focus the student's attention on these disagreements of interpretation, the evidence used to back up the interpretation, and provide them with the tools to make their own decisions. Anything else is indoctrination, not education.

In my state in Australia efforts have been made to move away from learning history as simply rote learning of timelines and statistics to an understanding of the ways in which history is made, the ways in which we interpret past events and the ways in which we back up interpretations with different sorts of evidence. The assessment of students is therefore not about which interpretation of events a student decides is best, or indeed whether or not a student decides that there is one "true" interpretation at all, but about how they demonstrate their understanding of the processes behind our interpretation of the events. It is this kind of education which goes a long way to creating curious and critical citizens.
 
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jayem

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Why even bother teaching kids at all. Just set them in front of the internet and let them figure it out for themselves.

That could work. There's at least as much biased, inaccurate, deceptive, fallacious, untruthful, misleading, deceitful, fraudulent, and mendacious information on the internet as in the Texas history curriculum.
 
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Axioma

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That could work. There's at least as much biased, inaccurate, deceptive, fallacious, untruthful, misleading, deceitful, fraudulent, and mendacious information on the internet as in the Texas history curriculum.
Now, now, timecube isn't THAT bad...:cool:
 
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Bushido216

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Teach a complete history of the country and remove valuations. It's pretty obnoxious to me that, in academia, it's entirely possible to talk about a whole host of issues without the valuations attached, and everyone leaving happy. Why that isn't possible in schools is a mystery to me.
 
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Im_A

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Conservatives on Texas school board revising curriculum, change history

Recently, the Texas school board has begun voting to actually revise history, including playing down Jefferson and the Founding Founders commitment to a purely secular government, presenting Joe McCarthy and his Red Scare in a positive light, etc.

This is powered by Christian Fundamentalists.

Is this lying? Difference of opinion? Good or bad for education?

Its lying. Its also difference of opinion. Its bad for education.

If they wanted to have a 'fair and balanced' view of political history, then they need to make a conservative political class for government as well as a liberal political class for government. To revise history to suit conservative views is an atrocity...just as it is to revise history to suit liberal views. History is history.
 
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TheNihilodeterminist

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Why even bother teaching kids at all. Just set them in front of the internet and let them figure it out for themselves.
People collect the information they want. They stick with the forums they like, and read newspapers serving them the news as they wish to see the world. The net doesn't create more diversity and balanced opinion for each individual, even though it presents the best possibility of seeking out a balanced opinion. Cut this from a researcher in social sciences in a european newspaper last year.

I'd still prefer this way of learning to learning by being spoonfed by texan frauds.
 
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dies-l

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Could you highlight some of the lies for us please?

As much as I hate to say it, what I see in the article is not so much lying as it is selectively choosing which parts of the truth to tell. This is par for the course for history curriculum. History is an inherently subjective and biased topic. However, what seems to be most bothersome here is that that the board is so brazen about it.

When I was in college (elementary education), one of the books that we were required to read was A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn. The goal of this book was to present American History with a far left slant. This was seen, by the educational community of the time to counteract the far right slant that existed in mainstream education at the time. It seems now that the pendulum is again swinging back to the other extreme.
 
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oldbetang

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When I was in college (elementary education), one of the books that we were required to read was A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn. The goal of this book was to present American History with a far left slant. This was seen, by the educational community of the time to counteract the far right slant that existed in mainstream education at the time. It seems now that the pendulum is again swinging back to the other extreme.

The two cases are not comparable at all. Howard Zinn's tome is a far-left distortion of history. What in the new curriculum could be considered to be extreme?
 
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Robbie_James_Francis

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Liberals aren't already corrupting education. The fact of the matter is that it's phenomenally difficult to be conservative if you are intelligent and educated. Not because of the education system, but because of the nature of conservatism, which is no more than a glorified form of ignorance. If education has a liberal bias, it's because reality has a liberal bias.
 
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dies-l

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The two cases are not comparable at all. Howard Zinn's tome is a far-left distortion of history. What in the new curriculum could be considered to be extreme?

All accounts of history are distorted by the views of the person telling or writing it. The only difference between what Zinn is doing and what is done here is the political persuasion of the persons doing the distorting. The problem with both is that they want to dupe youth into believing that the version is the "true" version. But, you ask, what exactly is wrong with the Texas version. Let's evaluate some examples:

--Question the Founding Fathers' commitment to a purely secular government

Both the Texas position and the position of the article criticizing it are Half-truths. Some of the FFs were quite religious and saw America as founded on religious ideals. Others were areligious, deist, or otherwise non-Christian and resisted the idea of Christian spirituality in government. Others were from Christian minority groups (such as Baptists) and saw secularism as the best means of preserving religious liberty. The one thing that is clearly widley shared among the FFs was a commitment to religious liberty, both positively (the right to believe as you will) and negatively (the right to not be coerced by government to believe what you don't wish to believe). This is demonstrated by the very language of the 1st Amendment.

--Cover the Judeo-Christian influences of the nation's Founding Fathers, but not highlight the philosophical rationale for the separation of church and state.

Selective telling of history. Judeo-Christian influences are important, but so are secularist influences. To focus on one and not the other is a distortion of reality that promotes either an overly theocratic view of America's history or an over secularist view.

--Present Republican political philosophies and figures in a more positive light, including Joe McCarthy

If this charge is true, the criticism seems obvious. Both parties have had their successes and their blunders. McCarthyism is an obvious blunder in the view of anyone who believes that First Amendment is worth anything.

--Stress the superiority of American capitalism while eliminating the word "capitalism" from the text

Whether this is a "distortion" depends on your view of economics. Personally, I think that there is a lot good to be said about "American capitalism", not the least of which is that it is by no means true capitalism. Rather, what makes "American capitalism" great is that it is so heavily influenced by what is good about socialism without incorporating the evils of socialism. The only distortion I see here is to pretend that we live in an entirely "free market" system, rather than a regulated free market.

--Refer to the United States form of government as a "constitutional republic," rather than "democratic republic"

I have to give this one you. This doesn't strike me as that much of a distortion. We are a constitutional republic.

--Give Confederate president Jefferson Davis equal footing with Abraham Lincoln

I don't know what this means, so I cannot comment.

--Cut Thomas Jefferson from a list of figures whose writings inspired revolutions in the late 18th century and 19th century, replacing him with St. Thomas Aquinas and John Calvin (Jefferson is not well liked among conservatives on the board because he coined the term "separation between church and state")

Distortion in that it presents as influential those whose views most closely align with the ideologies of those presenting the history. To deny Jefferson's influence on revolutionary activity during the Enlightenment period is ignorant, if not outright dishonest. To suggest that Calvin and Aquinas were more influential in shaping this period of history is just wrong.

So, it is a mixed bag really. I could say the same about Howard Zinn. Frankly, I think it best to provide youth with more than one perspective on history so that they can sort through these things themselves. Most people end up accepting as truth a rough approximation of what they learned in school and those that don't go on to higher education often do not learn the art of critically evaluating what they are told. Critical analysis is a skill that is important for all people, regardless of what they end up doing with their career or how much education they have. Our schools should not be teaching kids to accept one biased version of reality without questioning it or comparing it to another perspective.
 
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