Conservatives and guns

[Creech]

And what is it about Western Christian Civilization that makes it so great? Honest question: Why, aside from the fact that you're a part of it, is it worth saving?

I believe it produced a unique and successful mode of civilization in the world, and I think it has benefited all of humanity in countless of ways. But I also think preserving all different kinds of cultures, traditions, and identities is important, not just my own. I just feel my civilization is the most currently under threat.

Indeed -- he keeps going off about "Western Christian Civilization." I was going to amend his label to say "White Western Christian Civilization" to see if he noticed... or cared if he did.

I wouldn't really care, it doesn't really alter the meaning. Western Christian Civilization necessitates a traditionally Western "White" population.

 

[TLK Valentine]

I believe it produced a unique and successful mode of civilization in the world, and I think it has benefited all of humanity in countless of ways.

No argument there. Now how did it manage to do that?

But I also think preserving all different kinds of cultures, traditions, and identities is important, not just my own. I just feel my civilization is the most currently under threat.

But can we save it from the threat without taking away what made it so special in the first place?

Bit of a double edged sword, that.

I wouldn't really care, it doesn't really alter the meaning. Western Christian Civilization necessitates a traditionally Western "White" population.

Not surprising.

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

I believe it produced a unique and successful mode of civilization in the world, and I think it has benefited all of humanity in countless of ways. But I also think preserving all different kinds of cultures, traditions, and identities is important, not just my own. I just feel my civilization is the most currently under threat.



I wouldn't really care, it doesn't really alter the meaning. Western Christian Civilization necessitates a traditionally Western "White" population.

Everyone's is under the ever marching greed of globalization with businesses.

 

[cow451]

I believe it produced a unique and successful mode of civilization in the world, and I think it has benefited all of humanity in countless of ways. But I also think preserving all different kinds of cultures, traditions, and identities is important, not just my own. I just feel my civilization is the most currently under threat.
I wouldn't really care, it doesn't really alter the meaning. Western Christian Civilization necessitates a traditionally Western "White" population.

Since you are not in favor of the US Constitution, any defense of one of its amendments is nonsensical.

 

[Calvinist Dark Lord]

They were retired; now they're employed by the school district; both paychecks ultimately come from the same source.

They went from one civil service job to another.

Perhaps. However, there are now laws that prevent 'double dipping' that is to say collecting two pensions from the same government. Some pension plans also have a cap that allows the recipient to earn only a certain amount per annum before the pension amount is reduced.

At any rate, i'd be more concerned about retired US Flag officers (Generals, Admirals) moving through the revolving door from the military into influence peddling with Department of Defence contractors. While a bit off the subject, one must consider how many federal dollars are involved with that scam in both pension payments, and procurement scams.

Ever wonder what the Federal government would have been able to do with the money spent on the military budget and almost 15 years of the War on Terror Freedom?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Perhaps. However, there are now laws that prevent 'double dipping' that is to say collecting two pensions from the same government. Some pension plans also have a cap that allows the recipient to earn only a certain amount per annum before the pension amount is reduced.

At any rate, i'd be more concerned about retired US Flag officers (Generals, Admirals) moving through the revolving door from the military into influence peddling with Department of Defence contractors. While a bit off the subject, one must consider how many federal dollars are involved with that scam in both pension payments, and procurement scams.

Agreed, but that's going from a government job to a private sector job -- here, we're talking about going from one government job to another.

Ever wonder what the Federal government would have been able to do with the money spent on the military budget and almost 15 years of the War on Terror Freedom?

I try not to think about it; our military is bloated beyond belief, but it's still the sacred cow that the Right Wing Dare not disturb.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Nope.

It doesn't need to be -- people just need to realize that like all amendments, it's not absolute.

 

[cow451]

It doesn't need to be -- people just need to realize that like all amendments, it's not absolute.

 

[Calvinist Dark Lord]

Agreed, but that's going from a government job to a private sector job -- here, we're talking about going from one government job to another.



I try not to think about it; our military is bloated beyond belief, but it's still the sacred cow that the Right Wing Dare not disturb.

One small correction TLK: The MILITARY budget is bloated beyond belief. Not necessarily the Defence budget.

After the end of the 'bad old days' of the Cold War, a certain US President declared a 'Peace Dividend' and cut the armed forces to 10 Army Combat Divisions, and Three Marine Corps Expeditionary Forces (Division plus augments). The Air Force and Navy were also proportionally cut. Of course neither the oceans nor the skies got any smaller. We just wore out ships and aircraft faster. There really was no dividend. The only cuts were in the number of available combat troops. Last i checked, we still pay more for defence every year (with some cuts from time to time, again in combat troops).

In the place of what Army or Marine support troops used to do, we used 'civilian contractors'. Take a guess about what they pay a 'civilian contractor' compared to what they paid an Army or Marine Private to do the job that has the same skill level as a 7/11 clerk...that's before (full) benefits. The peace dividend was a scam to pay off political contributors to the campaign of whoever is in office at the time (Cough, Haliburton; Cough, cough, KBR; Cough, cough, cough, Blackwater --whatever they call themselves this month).

Plenty of waste, and we need to take a look at how that money is being spent and put an end to it.

We both were acquainted with Col. Hackworth. He used to rail against this kind of waste. There IS a better way to do this without using up the nation's blood and treasure at rates we can't sustain. You'd think we'd have learned that lesson from the demise of the Soviet Union.

NOW TO GET BACK TO THE TOPIC:

i'm not a fan of federal money for local education. That should be obvious from my posted political party membership. HOWEVER, if one must take that money it would be nice if we're not mortgaging our grandchildren's lives for it. Protecting our children should not have to put us into more unsustainable debt on any level.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

The voices that are heard are the extreme ones on each side.

...that's the big one. 2 reasonable people on TV having a discussion doesn't draw the same kind of rating as watching Michael Moore and Teg Nugent spew cherry picked statistics at each other.

I happen to think firearms are under-regulated.

I might say I would partially agree with that.

I don't think we're under-regulated in terms of the number of regulations that are in place...I feel that the current regulations are under-enforced and are written in such a way that leaves them inadequate in terms of actually serving their purpose.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Do you know what is required to amend the Constitution?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_Five_of_the_United_States_Constitution

...or was that question intended for someone else?

 

[ThatRobGuy]

<Staff edit>

It's only happened once in our nation's history, and it was under some pretty extreme circumstances

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-first_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

The Twenty-first Amendment (Amendment XXI) to the United States Constitution repealed the Eighteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution, which had mandated nationwide Prohibition on alcohol on January 17, 1920. The Twenty-first Amendment was ratified on December 5, 1933. It is unique among the 27 amendments of the U.S. Constitution for being the only one to repeal a prior amendment and to have been ratified by state ratifying conventions.


It was repealing something that was tremendously (and nearly universally) unpopular, and that had only been in existence for a little over a decade.

The same can't be said about the 2nd amendment...it's much more of a split in terms of public opinion, and, we're talking about one of the amendments in the bill of rights...not an auxiliary amendment like the 18th.

First things first, you need 2/3 of both houses to even propose it (which, would be quite a task in itself), then if by some miracle you got that to happen, you'd then need 3/4 of the states to sign off on it...

If the gun control crowd & lobbyists in Washington thought that it was even a remotely viable possibility, they would've tried to have taken that approach years ago instead of pushing for extraneous laws.