Confused about something in Luke

[pescador]

As a matter of interest I learned some Greek from Prof. Blaiklock who helped to translate the NIV. He referred to 'Coptic Greek' not sure why...

"Coptic uses a writing system almost wholly derived from the Greek alphabet, with the addition of a number of letters that have their origins in Demotic Egyptian."

 

[Carl Emerson]

I remember him saying that coptic Greek was a trade language that covered all of the known world, and could carry the concepts necessary for biblical understanding, that is why the gospel spread so fast.

 

[icxn]

What are you talking about? The verse has something to do with being at a dinner. Your story about Saint Anthony has zero to do with what this verse means.

It was the best example I could think of. Christ also invites us to a dinner, if you recall the parable, and the cobbler placed himself at the extreme lowest place...

 

[pescador]

I remember him saying that coptic Greek was a trade language that covered all of the known world, and could carry the concepts necessary for biblical understanding, that is why the gospel spread so fast.

Interesting. Thanks for the info.

 

[pescador]

I remember him saying that coptic Greek was a trade language that covered all of the known world, and could carry the concepts necessary for biblical understanding, that is why the gospel spread so fast.

[duplicate post]

 

[com7fy8]

Well, it looks like Jesus is saying for me not to try to get more status than someone else. And I could do this by trying to get a higher seat at a feast, or I could seek status by inviting people of higher status to a party.

Instead, love anyone. Love anyone, including by sitting with someone who seems not important. But that person could be humble, too, doing what I am doing! And so, by sitting at the lowest seat, I could be sharing with someone the most able to be humble and to love.

And so, in a way I already am at the best seat. So, in an unspoken way the host can be saying, you are now at the best place by taking the lowest place; so know that you are at the best seat and enjoy. Just move your perception, then.

 

[ZNP]

What does this verse mean..?

Luke 14:10

But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when
he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher:
then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat
with thee.

It means we need to know Jesus. The banquet feast we are concerned with is His feast. He is the one that we want to call us "friend". Like Paul said "he was less than the least". That should be our attitude. It is counterproductive to seek glory of men. Our only concern should be are we faithful to the Lord, are we doing what He has told us to do?

 

[eleos1954]

What does this verse mean..?

Luke 14:10

But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when
he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher:
then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat
with thee.

Best to take the parable as a whole and seems to be teaching about humility. Read verse 11 ... completes the thought.

 

[pescador]

It means we need to know Jesus. The banquet feast we are concerned with is His feast. He is the one that we want to call us "friend". Like Paul said "he was less than the least". That should be our attitude. It is counterproductive to seek glory of men. Our only concern should be are we faithful to the Lord, are we doing what He has told us to do?

What do the words mean?

BTW, I disagree with your interpretation of the verse. It has nothing to do with knowing Jesus or anything else you may interpret it to mean.

The verse describes a banquet, the likes of which most, if not all, of us have ever been to. It is written in archaic, i.e., very old, English that must be translated in one's mind in order to understand it. An earlier post quoted the verse from the NIV: "But when you are invited, take the lowest place, so that when your host comes, he will say to you, ‘Friend, move up to a better place.’ Then you will be honored in the presence of all the other guests."

 

[ZNP]

What do the words mean?

BTW, I disagree with your interpretation of the verse. It has nothing to do with knowing Jesus or anything else you may interpret it to mean.

The verse describes a banquet, the likes of which most, if not all, of us have ever been to. It is written in archaic, i.e., very old, English that must be translated in one's mind in order to understand it. An earlier post quoted the verse from the NIV: "But when you are invited, take the lowest place, so that when your host comes, he will say to you, ‘Friend, move up to a better place.’ Then you will be honored in the presence of all the other guests."

Yes, but it certainly applies to being invited to the Lord's banquet. Everyone is focusing on the person who chose to sit in the seat, but he never would have been asked to move to a different seat had it not been for the host, Jesus. It is the relationship with Jesus that matters. Also, the context is that Jesus noticed how everyone was jockeying for position at this feast, so should that be your focus or should your focus be on your relationship with the Lord and being faithful to Him. In the end that is what will determine if He says "well done thou good and faithful servant".

 

[pescador]

Yes, but it certainly applies to being invited to the Lord's banquet. Everyone is focusing on the person who chose to sit in the seat, but he never would have been asked to move to a different seat had it not been for the host, Jesus. It is the relationship with Jesus that matters. Also, the context is that Jesus noticed how everyone was jockeying for position at this feast, so should that be your focus or should your focus be on your relationship with the Lord and being faithful to Him. In the end that is what will determine if He says "well done thou good and faithful servant".

There is nothing in this parable, either directly or by inference, that says that the host is Jesus. You're reading something into the Bible that isn't there.

BTW, the point of the post, which you unfortunately missed, is that the wording in the King James is confusing and must be translated into modern English to be understood.

 

[Radagast]

I remember him saying that coptic Greek was a trade language that covered all of the known world

There is no such thing as "Coptic Greek."

Do you mean Coptic, the language of the Egyptian pyramid-builders, still spoken by Egyptian Christians today, or Koine Greek, the ordinary language of people in the Western Mediterranean region around the time of Jesus?

 

[Radagast]

What does this verse mean..?

Luke 14:10

But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when
he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher:
then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat
with thee.

A modern translation would be far better. Take the CSB:

But when you are invited, go and sit in the lowest place, so that when the one who invited you comes, he will say to you, ‘Friend, move up higher.’ You will then be honored in the presence of all the other guests.

It seems pretty clear to me. It's a call to humility.

The Greek reads:

ἀλλ’ ὅταν κληθῇς (but when you are called/invited) πορευθεὶς ἀνάπεσε (go and recline [in the style of dinner guests of the time]) εἰς τὸν ἔσχατον τόπον (in the last place), ἵνα ὅταν ἔλθῃ ὁ κεκληκώς σε (so that when the one who called/invited you comes) ἐρεῖ σοι (he will say to you)· φίλε, προσανάβηθι ἀνώτερον (Friend, move up higher)· τότε ἔσται σοι δόξα (then there will be for you honour) ἐνώπιον πάντων τῶν συνανακειμένων σοι (before all those reclining together [in the style of dinner guests of the time]).

 

[Radagast]

BTW, the point of the post, which you unfortunately missed, is that the wording in the King James is confusing and must be translated into modern English to be understood.

Most of us take that as obvious.

And CF has people from all kinds of countries and denominations. Rhetorical questions don't work well here.

 

[Carl Emerson]

There is no such thing as "Coptic Greek."

Do you mean Coptic, the language of the Egyptian pyramid-builders, still spoken by Egyptian Christians today, or Koine Greek, the ordinary language of people in the Western Mediterranean region around the time of Jesus?

Well my tutor, a professor of classics who helped to translate the NIV, the late Prof Blaikloch spoke about Coptic Greek as a trade language that covered the known world in Jesus day. I suspect from comments made by others that this may have been a reference to script.

 

[Radagast]

Well my tutor, a professor of classics who helped to translate the NIV, the late Prof Blaikloch spoke about Coptic Greek as a trade language

I'd be willing to bet you a kiwiburger and a drink that he said "Koine Greek," and that you've misremembered.

A quick Google search will show that there is no such thing as "Coptic Greek." It's like saying "Swahili Russian" or "Maori Spanish."

I also note that, if you meant Edward M. Blaiklock, you've also misremembered his name (you're even older than I am, and it happens).

 

[Carl Emerson]

You may be right on both counts -

I used to live with his son's family, yes I misspelled his name.

Sorry for any confusion.

 

[Carl Emerson]

I did a google myself and the coptic script was used for both Greek and Egyptian, so I was right I think, as he was referring to the script and the NT was written in this script.

Yes ??

 

[Radagast]

I did a google myself and the coptic script was used for both Greek and Egyptian, so I was right I think, as he was referring to the script and the NT was written in this script.

The NT was originally written in capital Greek letters: Α Β Γ Δ Ε Ζ Η Θ Ι Κ Λ Μ Ν Ξ Ο Π Ρ Σ Τ Υ Φ Χ Ψ Ω

The Coptic alphabet contains variants of those letters, but also others letters like: Ϥ Ⳁ Ϣ Ϫ Ϯ, so that it looks like this:

The Coptic alphabet is only used for the Coptic language.

 

[Carl Emerson]

The Coptic language is the final stage of the ancient Egyptian language, but it is written in the Greek alphabet, except for seven letters.