Confused about babies going to heaven if they die

[Confusedconfusion]

I have no idea about this topic and the more I read and think about it the more confused I am

1.Let's assume babies go to heaven if they die
a) that makes death of baby not such bad event , yes the mother and father of such baby feel grief but it's actually better for baby to die than to survive on average , because most people will go to hell than to heaven

2 Esdras 8:3
“There be many created, but few shall be saved.”

Matthew 7:13-14 King James Version (KJV)
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

b) why is God allowing unbelievers grow up to begin with ? He could just have all unbelievers die as babies while allowing only these who would willingly believe in Him to grow , this way he would ensure 100% people going to heaven and would have none in hell while keeping large pool of ressurected people , because God wants more people , Jesus could be son of Adam and Eve and simply restore things back then but God prefered to have more people living in his creation , so this way he ensures most people he can get away with with most people believing in him and saved , saving everybody this way.

c) God has foreknowledge , so he knows for example what would Stalin do , he knew that Stalin would hate him , why let millions of people suffer because of Stalin when he grow up when he could just not be born or die as child , saving Stalin himself from hell and saving millions of other people deaths ?

d) Assuming that babies go to heaven when they die if we wanted to save as many people as possible we should just kill all babies , why risk one growing up and rejecting God if we can ensure person's salvation this way? This is what follows the logic caused by believing kids go to heaven when they die , even tho it sounds horrible to me and is against what I or any sane person would do or what moral values given us by God tell us to do.

2.Let's assume babies don't go to heaven when they die.
a) Why is innocent baby going to hell if it has not done anything ? He/she is literally suffering because of Adam and Eve sin and paying for what their ancestors sins.

b) If that is the cause then it makes sense to try to do everything for person to let it live and not die as child so protect such child by any means, that would line up with God wanting to ensure that these who would believe survive long enought untill they do

Hebrews 1:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Seems like ministering spirits or how we call them angels are sent to people who will inherit salvation , not for everybody.

c)And again , why is God allowing babies premature die ? He could simply let them just not be born to begin with and this way not have them endlessly tortured in hell. It's not surprise for Him when baby dies he knew it so why did he let him/her die ?
I understand he could let unbeliever be born because such unbeliever could be father of believer , but premature dying baby can't be anybody's father so why let it be born to begin with?

d) Assuming that babies go to hell if they die , that makes killing babies much more serious offence since such person is literally killing another person not just once but letting it to be tortured forever


So in the end Do babies go to Heaven or Hell when they die ? What do you guys think ?
At this point if somebody ask me about it , I literally have to say " don't know sorry" since Bible doesn't support any claim and logic in wrong in both ways disagreeing with moral values given to us by God himself

 

[Der Alte]

Romans 4:15 Romans 5:13

 

[Albion]

So in the end Do babies go to Heaven or Hell when they die ? What do you guys think ?
At this point if somebody ask me about it , I literally have to say " don't know sorry" since Bible doesn't support any claim and logic in wrong in both ways disagreeing with moral values given to us by God himself

Thank you!

The questions you asked and the reasoning you offered have been heard befo9re coming from a long line of thoughtful people.

But then you answered them! Yes, that is it...we do not know!

The Bible tells us what we need to know. When people begin to try to get inside God's mind and deduce how everything he will do makes sense to us, his creatures, we are making a fundamental mistake. We do not know the answers to all such questions and there is very little reason why we should know!

At times in history, the Christian churches have attempted to provide answers, but they are simply educated guesses.

Often, as with Limbo and Purgatory, they later are rescinded.

We do not know the answers to these things, and they are not covered in the Bible, just as you said. There's not much about that which should cause us to lose any sleep, either. What Christ HAS instructed us to do should be enough.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Best to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling and give the babies to God.

No matter what we think
God has the plan and we don't.

M

 

[Not David]

I have no idea about this topic and the more I read and think about it the more confused I am

1.Let's assume babies go to heaven if they die
a) that makes death of baby not such bad event , yes the mother and father of such baby feel grief but it's actually better for baby to die than to survive on average , because most people will go to hell than to heaven

2 Esdras 8:3
“There be many created, but few shall be saved.”

Matthew 7:13-14 King James Version (KJV)
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

b) why is God allowing unbelievers grow up to begin with ? He could just have all unbelievers die as babies while allowing only these who would willingly believe in Him to grow , this way he would ensure 100% people going to heaven and would have none in hell while keeping large pool of ressurected people , because God wants more people , Jesus could be son of Adam and Eve and simply restore things back then but God prefered to have more people living in his creation , so this way he ensures most people he can get away with with most people believing in him and saved , saving everybody this way.

c) God has foreknowledge , so he knows for example what would Stalin do , he knew that Stalin would hate him , why let millions of people suffer because of Stalin when he grow up when he could just not be born or die as child , saving Stalin himself from hell and saving millions of other people deaths ?

d) Assuming that babies go to heaven when they die if we wanted to save as many people as possible we should just kill all babies , why risk one growing up and rejecting God if we can ensure person's salvation this way? This is what follows the logic caused by believing kids go to heaven when they die , even tho it sounds horrible to me and is against what I or any sane person would do or what moral values given us by God tell us to do.

2.Let's assume babies don't go to heaven when they die.
a) Why is innocent baby going to hell if it has not done anything ? He/she is literally suffering because of Adam and Eve sin and paying for what their ancestors sins.

b) If that is the cause then it makes sense to try to do everything for person to let it live and not die as child so protect such child by any means, that would line up with God wanting to ensure that these who would believe survive long enought untill they do

Hebrews 1:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Seems like ministering spirits or how we call them angels are sent to people who will inherit salvation , not for everybody.

c)And again , why is God allowing babies premature die ? He could simply let them just not be born to begin with and this way not have them endlessly tortured in hell. It's not surprise for Him when baby dies he knew it so why did he let him/her die ?
I understand he could let unbeliever be born because such unbeliever could be father of believer , but premature dying baby can't be anybody's father so why let it be born to begin with?

d) Assuming that babies go to hell if they die , that makes killing babies much more serious offence since such person is literally killing another person not just once but letting it to be tortured forever


So in the end Do babies go to Heaven or Hell when they die ? What do you guys think ?
At this point if somebody ask me about it , I literally have to say " don't know sorry" since Bible doesn't support any claim and logic in wrong in both ways disagreeing with moral values given to us by God himself

Why do you think God's work is to control what people do?

 

[Not David]

Double Post.
Here is a Taylor Swift's song.

 

[JAL]

I have no idea about this topic and the more I read and think about it the more confused I am

1.Let's assume babies go to heaven if they die
a) that makes death of baby not such bad event , yes the mother and father of such baby feel grief but it's actually better for baby to die than to survive on average , because most people will go to hell than to heaven

2 Esdras 8:3
“There be many created, but few shall be saved.”

Matthew 7:13-14 King James Version (KJV)
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

b) why is God allowing unbelievers grow up to begin with ? He could just have all unbelievers die as babies while allowing only these who would willingly believe in Him to grow , this way he would ensure 100% people going to heaven and would have none in hell while keeping large pool of ressurected people , because God wants more people , Jesus could be son of Adam and Eve and simply restore things back then but God prefered to have more people living in his creation , so this way he ensures most people he can get away with with most people believing in him and saved , saving everybody this way.

c) God has foreknowledge , so he knows for example what would Stalin do , he knew that Stalin would hate him , why let millions of people suffer because of Stalin when he grow up when he could just not be born or die as child , saving Stalin himself from hell and saving millions of other people deaths ?

d) Assuming that babies go to heaven when they die if we wanted to save as many people as possible we should just kill all babies , why risk one growing up and rejecting God if we can ensure person's salvation this way? This is what follows the logic caused by believing kids go to heaven when they die , even tho it sounds horrible to me and is against what I or any sane person would do or what moral values given us by God tell us to do.

2.Let's assume babies don't go to heaven when they die.
a) Why is innocent baby going to hell if it has not done anything ? He/she is literally suffering because of Adam and Eve sin and paying for what their ancestors sins.

b) If that is the cause then it makes sense to try to do everything for person to let it live and not die as child so protect such child by any means, that would line up with God wanting to ensure that these who would believe survive long enought untill they do

Hebrews 1:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Seems like ministering spirits or how we call them angels are sent to people who will inherit salvation , not for everybody.

c)And again , why is God allowing babies premature die ? He could simply let them just not be born to begin with and this way not have them endlessly tortured in hell. It's not surprise for Him when baby dies he knew it so why did he let him/her die ?
I understand he could let unbeliever be born because such unbeliever could be father of believer , but premature dying baby can't be anybody's father so why let it be born to begin with?

d) Assuming that babies go to hell if they die , that makes killing babies much more serious offence since such person is literally killing another person not just once but letting it to be tortured forever


So in the end Do babies go to Heaven or Hell when they die ? What do you guys think ?
At this point if somebody ask me about it , I literally have to say " don't know sorry" since Bible doesn't support any claim and logic in wrong in both ways disagreeing with moral values given to us by God himself

Babies probably goto hell, with the (probably rare) exception of those to whom the Holy Spirit has already reached out to save (like John the Baptist was filled with the Holy Spirit from the mother's womb). Evidently babies are guilty in God's sight, of Original Sin (not necessarily defined in the traditional sense of Original Sin) because:
(1) God cursed the whole human race when Adam sinned (Gen 3)
(2) Paul said that all had sinned - when? Presumably in Adam.
(3) Fetuses suffer starvation in the womb. An infinitely kind God would not allow innocent fetuses to suffer in the womb.
(4) We seem to be born with a sinful nature. An infinitely kind God would not allow innocent fetuses to be born with a sinful nature.

Why are they guilty in Adam? My theory is that God only made one soul - one material soul - named Adam and, after he sinned, split it into separate individuals (us). Millard J. Erickson drew a similar conclusion:

"We were all physically present in Adam, so that we all sinned in his act."

 

[Der Alte]

Where do babies, children, mentally handicapped etc. go when they die?

Romans 4:15
15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
Romans 5:13
13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.​

 

[Confusedconfusion]

Why do you think God's work is to control what people do?

He has to sometimes ( or often I don't know ) to somehow put his plann of salvation into work , let's say he never appeared as burning bush to Moses , do you think that Moses would come up with all God wanted him to do on his own?

If God didn't need to controll events in world by appearing or changing outcomes of wars with angels ect. why did he do it in first place? Why is God punishing some nations with another nations? Or wiping city with angels? I think it's his work as judge to judge the world.

 

[Not David]

He has to sometimes ( or often I don't know ) to somehow put his plann of salvation into work , let's say he never appeared as burning bush to Moses , do you think that Moses would come up with all God wanted him to do on his own?

If God didn't need to controll events in world by appearing or changing outcomes of wars with angels ect. why did he do it in first place? Why is God punishing some nations with another nations? Or wiping city with angels? I think it's his work as judge to judge the world.

Those were specific events in a period of 2000 years

 

[Not David]

Babies probably goto hell, with the (probably rare) exception of those to whom the Holy Spirit has already reached out to save (like John the Baptist was filled with the Holy Spirit from the mother's womb). Evidently babies are guilty in God's sight, of Original Sin (not necessarily defined in the traditional sense of Original Sin) because:
(1) God cursed the whole human race when Adam sinned (Gen 3)
(2) Paul said that all had sinned - when? Presumably in Adam.
(3) Fetuses suffer starvation in the womb. An infinitely kind God would not allow innocent fetuses to suffer in the womb.
(4) We seem to be born with a sinful nature. An infinitely kind God would not allow innocent fetuses to be born with a sinful nature.

Why are they guilty in Adam? My theory is that God only made one soul - one material soul - named Adam and, after he sinned, split it into separate individuals (us). Millard J. Erickson drew a similar conclusion:

"We were all physically present in Adam, so that we all sinned in his act."

Babies don't sin.

 

[Cshuffle777]

As long as we're asking tough questions:

Babies don't go to Heaven when they die. No one does. The Bible plainly teaches that death is a sleep that lasts until the 1st resurrection at the 2nd coming of Christ, with the exception of certain situations.

Since the Bible obviously doesn't say much on the main subject of your question, some sanctified imagination can be useful, and even correct, even if not authoritative. I remember the absolute wonder I experienced the first time I encountered the "undo" feature/button of a graphics computer program. It was about 30 years ago but I remember it like it was yesterday.

Consider: How big and powerful is your God?

Could he "undo" the birth of a baby? If He created time, space, and matter, and we already know that He has manipulated matter according to His command as seen in various miracles throughout the Bible and history, couldn't He not as easily order things as though something which had been had, in fact, not been?

If it seems cruel to a mother or father to later undo the birth of a child, consider this: If He ordered things in a certain way as to undo something, how difficult would it be for Him to remove all recollection of the thing which has been undone from the consciousness of those who observed or experienced it? Isn't this precisely what takes place in Revelation 21:4:

And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

As to allowing believers or unbelievers to grow up or not, 99% of Christians have no idea how God judges Christians. This seems evident by the myriad of theories that are held. There is no real reason to believe that some type of human-devised pre-emptive action on God's part would alter the outcome of redemption in a positive way. In fact, there is every reason to beieve that the opposite is true, beginning with:

And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
(Romans 8:28)

 

[Cshuffle777]

Babies don't sin.

Yes, they do.

 

[Rachel20]

My proof text for an age of accountability -

For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died. Romans 7:9

 

[com7fy8]

1.Let's assume babies go to heaven if they die
a) that makes death of baby not such bad event , yes the mother and father of such baby feel grief but it's actually better for baby to die than to survive on average , because most people will go to hell than to heaven

People are not here on earth only to go to heaven or hell. God has people on earth so He can adopt children who will become "conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren." (in Romans 8:29)

And in the process of this, we minister to one another, to help each other become and love like Jesus. So, God would want a baby to live so he or she can become adopted and share with us in helping one another to become and love like Jesus.

Meanwhile, God uses what all the evil people do, turning things around to somehow help us . . . but while evil people can have a very bad time of it.

"Good understanding gains favor,
.But the way of the unfaithful is hard."
. . . . . . . . . . . . (Proverbs 13:15)

So, there is God's purpose even for unbelievers to be here, but without Jesus they are not benefiting like they could from how God works everything for His overall purpose of having children who are and love like Jesus.

 

[ClementofA]

Jesus replied, "Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again."

If endless punishment were true & victims of infanticide all go to heaven

 

[Cshuffle777]

One proof text for NO age of accountability:

And the priest shall make an atonement for all the congregation of the children of Israel, and it shall be forgiven them; for it is ignorance: and they shall bring their offering, a sacrifice made by fire unto the LORD, and their sin offering before the LORD, for their ignorance:
(Numbers 15:25)

 

[ClementofA]

Jesus replied, "Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again."

 

[Radagast]

I have no idea about this topic and the more I read and think about it the more confused I am

There are good reasons to say that the children of believers go to Heaven.

About other children, the Bible does not speak.

 

[com7fy8]

2.Let's assume babies don't go to heaven when they die.
a) Why is innocent baby going to hell if it has not done anything ? He/she is literally suffering because of Adam and Eve sin and paying for what their ancestors sins.

There are people who know for certain that all babies who die will go to Heaven.

And there are people who know that babies were born in sin and so they are not guaranteed Heaven.

And there are people who know that God would never have a cute charming dear little baby go to hell. After all, Jesus says children are of the kingdom of God.

And others know how even a tiny cute little charmer can already be very expert at getting one's own way, by various means of psychological terrorism holding people's lives and reputations hostage in order to get their demands met. Such are little seeds of what God knows they could become, if they were to grow up and not change from being mainly about their own selves.

And God knows what is really true, in any case He already is doing what is right, with each baby or unborn person who dies.

Our Apostle Paul says it would be so great for him to die and be with Jesus >

"Nevertheless to remain in the flesh is more needful for you." (Philippians 1:24)

So, he understood how it was better for him to stay here and suffer, so he could minister for us to become changed into the image of Jesus. And so, we who follow Paul's example also are pleased to obey by staying here so we can minister to one another and help each other.

Therefore, it would not be Biblical to kill a little angel so he or she could go right to Heaven. Because God has us stay here to bless each other. Plus, of course, Jesus who is God's own Son did not stay in Heaven where He had it so good, but Jesus came here to us, in order to reach us and save us and share God's own good with us. So, Jesus Himself certainly is not at all conceited; and so we also should not be conceited, just wanting to get out of here to be in Heaven, but welcome our time now to be here for each other > do not be conceited, trying to avoid ones God can use us to bless.

Ones know how the unborn and babies are without sin and are holy; but they maybe can not explain how such beautiful charming little creatures can become like Stalin and predophiles and charmers who turn out to be harmers after they marry them.

"'Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.'" (John 7:24)

"Charm is deceitful, and beauty is passing,"
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .(in Proverbs 31:30)

So, in any case, God will not be judging babies only by how they can act cute and charming while they are getting their way. But there are people who do evaluate babies and adults by how cute and charming they can act, and this is why they marry the ones they do.

So, how such people judge is not how God does things; and we are not His dictator, to say the least.