Confederate Flag

praying · Feb 6, 2004

southron said:
Dear fellow Christians,
As a Southern Heritage activist I would like to add my 2 cents into this topic on the Confederate Flag. To what many might not believe they were not only White Confederates but they were Confederates from different races who fought and died defending there homes and families wearing the Grey of the Confederate States of America. I have attached two photos of Mr. HK Edgerton to this post. Mr. Edgerton's (a Black Man) ancesters just like my ancesters fought for the Confederate States of America. Just as I honor my ancesters cause so does he with his march across Dixie in defense of the Confederate Flag. Heritage Not Hate

God Bless,
Southron

No disrespect to you, but I think he nuts, no other way to say it.

southron · Feb 7, 2004

mhatten said:
No disrespect to you, but I think he nuts, no other way to say it.

mhatten,
None taken at all. Some feel that he is nuts some like myself think he is a true patriot to the south. Remember we live in the USA and we can believe whatever we want and disagree all we want and still get along (maybe )

Nice exchanging lines with ya.

God Bless America,
Southron

praying · Feb 7, 2004

southron said:
mhatten,
None taken at all. Some feel that he is nuts some like myself think he is a true patriot to the south. Remember we live in the USA and we can believe whatever we want and disagree all we want and still get along (maybe )

Nice exchanging lines with ya.

God Bless America,
Southron

Yes this is true, I said earlier on this same thread, I as an African American find it the flag offensive but would defend anyone's (the nut's included ) right to wave the confederate flag. I do draw the line on it being displayed on goverment buildings however.

DixieBelle · Feb 9, 2004

Two of my favorite sites that are loaded with information on the causes for the War of Northern Aggression, info about the flags, history of black confederates, differences between north & south, and all kinds of other information:

http://www.scvcamp469-nbf.com/

http://www.charlotte.infi.net/~jtuggle/dang.htm

Here's an interview with HK Edgerton.

http://www.ashevilletribune.com/the_man_behind_the_rebel_flag.htm

Oh, and FYI, the Stars & Bars is the First National Flag of the CSA, NOT the Confederate Battle Flag.

/\/eO · Feb 10, 2004

jayem said:
I'm a native southerner also, but the Confederate flag issue is a loser. Whether it's fair or not, the flag is just too closely associated with white supremacy....

I cannot believe you just wrote that. That is such a failure of logic it's astonishing. Ad hoc ergo propter hoc So following that logic, anytime the NAACP, anti Defamation League wants something to go away all they have do is show that it has been used in association with KKK activities. I guess then the robes they wear which are in essence what every Christian mainstream denominations choir wears needs to go as well.

And no the counter arguement of "Well it's a flag so it's different" doesn't hold up. Blacks simply need to move on and look to Christ. They need to forgive and remember that this country doesn't revolve around them and their wounded pride. Everyone who needed to go to Hell for their part in American slavery is in there and paying for eternity. But just like whites, the majority of blacks are just as secular and enjoy the spotlight of being the "oppressed victims" and the goodies it brings. Do you see Jews petitioning the Egyptian government for reperations for 400 years of the some of the worst slavery in recorded history?

praying · Feb 10, 2004

/\/eO said:
Blacks simply need to move on and look to Christ. They need to forgive and remember that this country doesn't revolve around them and their wounded pride. Everyone who needed to go to Hell for their part in American slavery is in there and paying for eternity. But just like whites, the majority of blacks are just as secular and enjoy the spotlight of being the "oppressed victims" and the goodies it brings. Do you see Jews petitioning the Egyptian government for reperations for 400 years of the some of the worst slavery in recorded history?

You are kidding right, we are so sorry that we find the flag and what it stood/stands for offensive. How dare we!!

Wounded pride indeed, the flag is a symbol of racism and is offensive!

Blessed75 · Feb 10, 2004

Inspired said:
What some people see when they see that flag is pride, pride in their southern heritage. What other people see when they look at that flag is a constant reminder of the torture and pain that they themselves or their family and loved ones endured. The "south" as it was no longer exists, unless we are staging another civil war. My question is, is your pride worth the pain you cause the other side?

Good post and one I agree with........

KyleSmith7117 · Feb 10, 2004

Here's a post for mhatten,

Looks like the american flag is a symbol of racism too then...

KyleSmith7117 · Feb 10, 2004

The point I been making is that the Confederate flag shouldn't be the only flag to be judge as a racist flag in America.

praying · Feb 10, 2004

KyleSmith7117 said:
Here's a post for mhatten,

Looks like the american flag is a symbol of racism too then...

I understand your point and yes the nuts and kooks of the brotherhood wave the American flag also, however I still think the confederate is symbolically tainted at this point and offensive.

DGenerate · Feb 12, 2004

Being from the south as well as being Irish... I show my pride by wearing a shamrock with the Confederate flag on the inside. Y'know, the Irish had regiments in the Civil War as well.

Tainted? Yes. But I don't care why some wear it... either to display hate or their heritage... I just do it the way I do it and leave it be. Banning it will only fuel fires that don't need to be fueled. I know for a fact that if someone told me flat out "You can't wear that shirt because it has the Confederate flag on it." , then I would more than likely come back with a huge Confederate flag on a pole waving it in the air with a marching band behind me.

ozanaki tori · Feb 12, 2004

Very touchey subject, considering a lot of people have a very, very misunderstanding view of the Civil War and the Confederate flag.

I have a necklace I wear sometimes, but once there was an african-american man at the post office and I could tell it bothered him, so I stopped wearing it for now.

I don't think it should be as much of a southern thing as people are making it. The War was about state rights, not just southern rights.

SUNDAE · Feb 12, 2004

ozanaki tori said:
Very touchey subject, considering a lot of people have a very, very misunderstanding view of the Civil War and the Confederate flag.

What we do know, is that people of colour were enslaved by the southern states, and they were willing to fight to maintain that slavery.

I don't think it should be as much of a southern thing as people are making it. The War was about state rights, not just southern rights.

Then forget about the confederate flag, and fly the state flag instead.

praying · Feb 12, 2004

DGenerate said:
Being from the south as well as being Irish... I show my pride by wearing a shamrock with the Confederate flag on the inside. Y'know, the Irish had regiments in the Civil War as well.

Tainted? Yes. But I don't care why some wear it... either to display hate or their heritage... I just do it the way I do it and leave it be. Banning it will only fuel fires that don't need to be fueled. I know for a fact that if someone told me flat out "You can't wear that shirt because it has the Confederate flag on it." , then I would more than likely come back with a huge Confederate flag on a pole waving it in the air with a marching band behind me.

I would never advocate you shouldn't wear it as a form of personal expression, for whatever reason. I draw the line on it being flown on gov't buildings and schools and such because of what it symbolizes.

DixieBelle · Feb 12, 2004

Here are some quotes from an article I found that I believe speak to the issue at hand:

For the complete article: http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/williams012600.asp

Excerpts:
"DURING OUR WAR OF 1861, ex-slave Frederick Douglass observed, "There are at the present moment, many colored men in the Confederate Army doing duty not only as cooks, servants and laborers, but as real soldiers, having muskets on their shoulders and bullets in their pockets, ready to shoot down ... and do all that soldiers may do to destroy the Federal government.""

"Horace Greeley, in pointing out some differences between the two warring armies said, "For more than two years, Negroes have been extensively employed in belligerent operations by the Confederacy. They have been embodied and drilled as rebel soldiers and had paraded with white troops at a time when this would not have been tolerated in the armies of the Union." General Nathan Bedford Forrest had both slaves and freemen serving in units under his command. After the war, General Forrest said of the black men who served under him "(T)hese boys stayed with me ... and better Confederates did not live.""

"It was not just Southern generals who owned slaves but northern generals owned them as well. General Ulysses Grant's slaves had to await the Thirteenth Amendment for freedom. When asked why he didn't free his slaves earlier, General Grant said, "Good help is so hard to come by these days.""

"The flap over the Confederate flag is not quite as simple as the nation's race experts make it. They want us to believe the flag is a symbol of racism. Yes, racists have used the Confederate flag, but racists have also used the Bible and the U.S. flag. Should we get rid of the Bible and lower the U.S. flag? Black civil rights activists and their white liberal supporters who're attacking the Confederate flag have committed a deep, despicable dishonor to our patriotic black ancestors who marched, fought and died to protect their homeland from what they saw as Northern aggression.
They don't deserve the dishonor."

ozanaki tori · Feb 12, 2004

The english enslaved africans, as well as the french, spanish, dutch, and Americans.
Some were able to stop using them, others remained relient on them. They were not enslaved because of their colour, but because they were readily available (sold by other africans, usually) and practically free.

I have no doubt that shortly after the War slavery would have been abolished anyway, due to the lack of need for slaves.

Do not be so quick to judge one peoples over another.

praying · Feb 12, 2004

ozanaki tori said:
The english enslaved africans, as well as the french, spanish, dutch, and Americans.
Some were able to stop using them, others remained relient on them. They were not enslaved because of their colour, but because they were readily available (sold by other africans, usually) and practically free.

I have no doubt that shortly after the War slavery would have been abolished anyway, due to the lack of need for slaves.

Do not be so quick to judge one peoples over another.

I think you need to read more non-reviosionist history books. We were enslaved becasue we were not European i.e white.

Slavery would not have ended unless forced, thus it took 100 years after slavery to pass the civil rights bill which affords equal protection under the law for regardless of race, creed, national origin, or sex.

ozanaki tori · Feb 12, 2004

I partially agree, and partially I disagree.

Africans were enslaved for many reasons. Skin colour was not one of them, nor nationality. Just as any sittuation where one nation is superior in weaponary and strategy and "civilised" (though i scoff at the term) and they meet up with primative natives, the european peoples took control. However, not all european nations were white. Furthermore, there is racism among white peoples against other white peoples, and especially back in those days.

Slavery was wrong, but it would have gone away sooner or later (sooner, probably).
There were many problems at stake besides slavery, that have not gone away nor will they ever, now.

southron · Feb 12, 2004

ozanaki tori said:
I have no doubt that shortly after the War slavery would have been abolished anyway, due to the lack of need for slaves.

No dought slavery would have been abolished after the Civil War was over. The south was in progress of doing away with slavery during the Civil War the North only beat the South to doing it.

Southron

southron · Feb 12, 2004

ozanaki tori said:
The english enslaved africans, as well as the french, spanish, dutch, and Americans.
Some were able to stop using them, others remained relient on them. They were not enslaved because of their colour, but because they were readily available (sold by other africans, usually) and practically free.

I have no doubt that shortly after the War slavery would have been abolished anyway, due to the lack of need for slaves.

Do not be so quick to judge one peoples over another.

I agree with your post.

Southron

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