Commentary from Sojourners

[zephcom]

I'm heading out in an hour or so and will be gone for the rest of the day, but I just came across this commentary:

James Dobson's Anti-Immigrant Rhetoric Is Dangerous

from the liberal evangelical publication Sojourners. It is one of the strongest commentaries about the current state of America and some Christian's support of that condition I've seen yet from a Christian organization.

-I- think the comments are important even if one does not believe them. I think people should contemplate whether Christianity may very possibly be on the wrong side of history...again.

 

[Carl Emerson]

This is a very important conversation to be had.

I think Prov 29:18 has something to say about this.

The KJV translated it thus... Where there is no vision, the people perish: but he that keepeth the law, happy is he.

Modern church leaders have used this translation as a 'go to scripture' to justify loyalty to their vision for the church.

But the original Hebrew carries a different meaning and it directly applies to this debate.

The word in the Hebrew means fence.

A fair rendering would be "Without a fence the people are unrestrained...

So how does this apply nationally and in the church.

The deeper conflict is between the absolutes of God's Word and relativism.

But this important message from God through Proverbs is stressing the need to hold on to Biblical absolutes and resisting the erosion of order.

That is exactly what we are seeing today.

This proverb on a grand scale rightly justifies Nationalism.

This proverb is saying it is fully OK to exclude those who have contempt for God's Law.

There is to be division to exclude the lawless.

This equally applied in the early church where Paul excludes the immoral.

We need to wake up to the false morality that demands the inclusion of lawlessness and tries to shame those who disagree.

 

[zephcom]

This is a very important conversation to be had.

I think Prov 29:18 has something to say about this.

The KJV translated it thus... Where there is no vision, the people perish: but he that keepeth the law, happy is he.

Modern church leaders have used this translation as a 'go to scripture' to justify loyalty to their vision for the church.

But the original Hebrew carries a different meaning and it directly applies to this debate.

The word in the Hebrew means fence.

A fair rendering would be "Without a fence the people are unrestrained...

So how does this apply nationally and in the church.

The deeper conflict is between the absolutes of God's Word and relativism.

But this important message from God through Proverbs is stressing the need to hold on to Biblical absolutes and resisting the erosion of order.

That is exactly what we are seeing today.

This proverb on a grand scale rightly justifies Nationalism.

This proverb is saying it is fully OK to exclude those who have contempt for God's Law.

There is to be division to exclude the lawless.

This equally applied in the early church where Paul excludes the immoral.

We need to wake up to the false morality that demands the inclusion of lawlessness and tries to shame those who disagree.

So we can count you as one who does not agree with the author?

 

[zephcom]

This is a very important conversation to be had.

I think Prov 29:18 has something to say about this.

The KJV translated it thus... Where there is no vision, the people perish: but he that keepeth the law, happy is he.

Modern church leaders have used this translation as a 'go to scripture' to justify loyalty to their vision for the church.

But the original Hebrew carries a different meaning and it directly applies to this debate.

The word in the Hebrew means fence.

A fair rendering would be "Without a fence the people are unrestrained...

So how does this apply nationally and in the church.

The deeper conflict is between the absolutes of God's Word and relativism.

But this important message from God through Proverbs is stressing the need to hold on to Biblical absolutes and resisting the erosion of order.

That is exactly what we are seeing today.

This proverb on a grand scale rightly justifies Nationalism.

This proverb is saying it is fully OK to exclude those who have contempt for God's Law.

There is to be division to exclude the lawless.

This equally applied in the early church where Paul excludes the immoral.

We need to wake up to the false morality that demands the inclusion of lawlessness and tries to shame those who disagree.

So I went to the Jewish place I use for understanding the Old Testament, Chabad.org.

They provide an English translation from the Hebrew as Jews understand it. And one can turn on commentary by Rashi.

Rashi - Wikipedia

It doesn't appear to me that the verse from Proverbs that you reference has anything at all to do with keeping people out of the country.

Here is how this site renders the passage:

18 Without vision the people become unrestrained, but he who keeps the Torah is fortunate.

Rashi's commentary:

Without vision the people become unrestrained: When Israel causes prophecy to withdraw from them by mocking the prophets, they will become unrestrained and will degenerate.

But, hey, maybe you do know more than Rashi and this Jewish website.

Oh, the site URL is:

Mishlei - Proverbs - Chapter 29

 

[Carl Emerson]

Let's see what other responses we get...

 

[Pommer]

-I- think the comments are important even if one does not believe them. I think people should contemplate whether Christianity may very possibly be on the wrong side of history...again.

I’m not seeing a “comments” section on that page.

 

[zephcom]

I’m not seeing a “comments” section on that page.

Sorry for not being more precise. In a commentary the opinions of the author can rightfully be referred to as comments.

This particular website used to allow a comments section but, like many comments section, they devolved into bickering so they got rid of that section and now just let people write things directly to the authors.

 

[Pommer]

Sorry for not being more precise. In a commentary the opinions of the author can rightfully be referred to as comments.

This particular website used to allow a comments section but, like many comments section, they devolved into bickering so they got rid of that section and now just let people write things directly to the authors.

Ah. I see.

 

[jayem]

You shall not wrong a stranger or oppress him, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt.
Exodus 22:21

The stranger who resides with you shall be to you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt; I am the LORD your God.
Leviticus 19:34