Comedy and Culture

[ThatRobGuy]

Something interesting I've been thinking about...

Culture (in terms of how people end up lining up politically) has a way of being downstream of Comedy (in particular, stand-up comedy)


I remember a few years back, conservative comedians (apart from the late Norm MacDonald) were known as "lame & tame". It was the stuff that really wasn't all that funny, it was almost clean to a fault, etc...

Over the past few years, some of the most popular stand-up comedians, in terms of being a monetary draw) have been ones that have expressed viewpoints that some would see as "right wing" even if they have other views that are left-leaning...
(Dave Chappelle, Tony Hinchcliffe, Bill Burr, Louis CK, Whitney Cummings, Shane Gillis, Adam Ray, Jim Norton) --noting most of the aforementioned list have been regulars on the Kill Tony show. And then stand-up comedy staples like Jerry Seinfeld have called some people out on the carpet as well.


Stand-up comedians make their living off of "saying the quiet part out loud" in ways that make people uncomfortable sometimes.

There's an old saying "tyrants hate laugher because it's involuntary" (meaning it'll expose whether or not people really like certain ideas or think ideas are stupid).

Should the notable shift in where people stand have been an indicator that "the wind changed directions" a bit?

 

[Chesterton]

It was the stuff that really wasn't all that funny, it was almost clean to a fault, etc...

Long story short, I found out early in life as a musician, it's about the so-called "law of averages". Liberal people are much more likely to seek careers in stuff like showbiz, rather than seeking regular jobs. So more of them get successful.

Should the notable shift in where people stand have been an indicator that "the wind changed directions" a bit?

It's a lagging indicator. They should have been doing it when Norm MacDonald was doing it.

 

[Fantine]

I have noticed some comedians being more careful. I attribute it to Trump's threats to jail his media enemies. Or maybe the stations they work for have been threatened with lawsuits and they have been told to tone things down.
SNL has been much more low key than in previous years. I'm sure that they haven't changed. I respect them too much to believe that. But I understand that bullying and intimidation are powerful motivators.
Jimmy Kimmel was brave enough to say what they are all thinking: "if I'm not in jail..."

 

[zippy2006]

There's an old saying "tyrants hate laugher because it's involuntary" (meaning it'll expose whether or not people really like certain ideas or think ideas are stupid).

What's at play may be the simple fact that comedians hate censors, and the left has become the censorship group. We see classical liberals like Rogan and Musk moving right for similar reasons.

 

[Nithavela]

I think it has a lot to do with political comedy naturally going for the ruling party. During the last Trump term, there was a lot of political comedy from the right. Now we had 4 years of democratic presidency, so of course that wellspring dried up. Personally, I'm looking forward to four more years of Trump giving left wing political stand up new material.

My personal favorite from the last Trump term was Stephen Colbert's opening monologue after Anthony Scaramucci got fired after 10 days of firing other people, missing the birth of his son, being divorced and making some ill-advised statements.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I think it has a lot to do with political comedy naturally going for the ruling party. During the last Trump term, there was a lot of political comedy from the right. Now we had 4 years of democratic presidency, so of course that wellspring dried up. Personally, I'm looking forward to four more years of Trump giving left wing political stand up new material.

Which stand-up comedians will they be?

It would seem as if "political correctness" is the dividing line here. As long as one faction is considered to be the "you can't say XYZ if it'll offend someone from one of these groups" team, then it seems like Comedians will stay on their current trend.


And it's not even just the dirty comedians who've turned against some of the PC stuff

Seinfeld for instance has been firing back against it

And I remember a recent clip from a Chappelle stand up set (can't link it due to language) where a heckler yells out "What are you going do now that Trump got elected!?!?!"

"What am I gonna do? Brotha (he didn't say "brotha" lol) I'm prolly gonna get a significant tax break"


Now there are some comedians who poke fun at people on the right, but the hiccup is going to be, the funny ones are some of the same comedians who also go hard on the left as well, and I suspect for the young progressive crowd, giving equal time to both parties isn't going to pass their "ideological purity sniff test"


For instance, Tony Hinchliffe (the dirty stand-up insult comic who caught all the heat for his performance a Trump rally) has people on who like to make fun of some folks on the right, and it's pretty funny when they come on to do their impressions:

For instance, I thought the fake "RFK Jr." bit was pretty funny (and yes I checked them to make sure they were "clean" clips)

But if it's anything like it was in 2021, the younger progressives don't want someone who "spares no one and makes fun of everyone", they want someone who just exclusively makes fun of right and nothing else.

 

[Fantine]

Trump may not throw comedians in jail, but there us another possible weapon. The oligarchs will try to get companies to stop advertising with those they disapprove of.
I have not heard many right wing comics, and they haven't been very funny.
That's because all good comedy is based on truth and sadly the current administration creates an alternative reality so bizarre and ridiculous it's easy to disbelieve.
Sometimes I listen or read looking for a truth or two. I couldn't find a single one at the Capitol One rally.
I'm not too fussy. I just want my representatives to have some decency and honesty.
My state is all Republican, but there is one representative, Sen. Boozman, who has those characteristics. So kudos to you, Senator B. You are a wildflower in the weeds.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I have not heard many right wing comics, and they haven't been very funny.

If you look at the top 10 grossing stand up comics of 2024, the list includes several names that are in the "circle of friends" with the Kill Tony crew.

Tony Hinchcliffe has been helping a lot of people in that craft get exposure who would otherwise be stuck working the Chuckle Hut in Toledo.

I personally wouldn't call them "right-wing", but I would say they at least are willing to make fun of the "sacred cows" of the left. (which means the left would call them "right wing"... but then again, they call Joe Rogan right wing)


Example, he had on a Transgender comic last month. Let's just say it was a rather large Transwoman, they appeared to be about 6'1" and 260LBS.

They came on stage, introduced themselves, and told the joke "and my pronouns are fee-fi/fo-fum", it was funny, it got an excellent pop from the crowd, and the panel loved their set.

Another mustachioed & large gay comic on the show told the joke "I know, I look like Freddie Mercury if he'd been born after prep pills were available", again... the way they delivered the line was funny.

The next week, people were griping on social media about "it's problematic that LGBTQ+ people have to be self-deprecating or say thing insulting about their own community in order to gain acceptance in the world of stand-up comedy" -- oh, you mean like Black and Jewish stand-up comics have been doing since -- forever?

Being self-deprecating is a comedic device that a lot of comedians leverage in their act, the very fact that some progressives were upset about the fact trans and gay comics do it means they're the ones "treating them as something different" in that particular space.

That's because all good comedy is based on truth and sadly the current administration creates an alternative reality so bizarre and ridiculous it's easy to disbelieve.

That's not always true... if you look at comics like Dimitri Martin, Mitch Hedberg, and Zach Galifianakis, theirs were more clever word play gimmicks. Heck, Gallager's entire schtick was telling corny one-liners and smashing produce with a mallet, and Carrot Top did prop comedy.

For the more "intellectually stimulating" stand-up comedy we'll call it...
Comedy "exposes the absurdity of certain things" would be a more accurate depiction, to say it's "based on truth" would be stretch. Most of those comedians are telling stories that didn't actually happen, or they're exaggerating certain things for effect.

 

[iluvatar5150]

I have not heard many right wing comics, and they haven't been very funny.

This has been changing recently.

That said, I wouldn't necessarily equate associating with Tony Hinchliffe as being "right wing". What I've heard of Shane Gillis, for example, has been more "woke" on some subjects than one would assume from the company he keeps.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

This has been changing recently.

That said, I wouldn't necessarily equate associating with Tony Hinchliffe as being "right wing". What I've heard of Shane Gillis, for example, has been more "woke" on some subjects than one would assume from the company he keeps.

That's what I was referencing in my previous post... for some, "far-right" just means "someone who's willing to make fun of things some of the left deems untouchable".

Tony Hinchcliffe himself isn't even right wing (in a traditional sense)

He hasn't expressed any views on his economic preferences, but for whatever it's worth Jon Stewart vouched for him.

 

[Nithavela]

Which stand-up comedians will they be?

It would seem as if "political correctness" is the dividing line here. As long as one faction is considered to be the "you can't say XYZ if it'll offend someone from one of these groups" team, then it seems like Comedians will stay on their current trend.


And it's not even just the dirty comedians who've turned against some of the PC stuff

Seinfeld for instance has been firing back against it

And I remember a recent clip from a Chappelle stand up set (can't link it due to language) where a heckler yells out "What are you going do now that Trump got elected!?!?!"

"What am I gonna do? Brotha (he didn't say "brotha" lol) I'm prolly gonna get a significant tax break"


Now there are some comedians who poke fun at people on the right, but the hiccup is going to be, the funny ones are some of the same comedians who also go hard on the left as well, and I suspect for the young progressive crowd, giving equal time to both parties isn't going to pass their "ideological purity sniff test"


For instance, Tony Hinchliffe (the dirty stand-up insult comic who caught all the heat for his performance a Trump rally) has people on who like to make fun of some folks on the right, and it's pretty funny when they come on to do their impressions:

For instance, I thought the fake "RFK Jr." bit was pretty funny (and yes I checked them to make sure they were "clean" clips)

But if it's anything like it was in 2021, the younger progressives don't want someone who "spares no one and makes fun of everyone", they want someone who just exclusively makes fun of right and nothing else.

Yes, yes, both sides are guilty. Thank you.

 

[A2SG]

Nah, it's just the younger libs who are the emotional jellyfish...

The older liberals are fine lol.


But nice try at re-hashing an unoriginal rebuttal that the same 4 or 5 people use constantly.
View attachment 360042


Speaking of jokes and originality, do you know any good OJ Simpson or Monical Lewinski jokes? Those would be super new & original and "not at all played-out" as well.

Hey, I know the only known Leon Klinghoffer joke. Anyone wanna hear it?

-- A2SG, and the stampede to Google begins....

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Hey, I know the only known Leon Klinghoffer joke. Anyone wanna hear it?

-- A2SG, and the stampede to Google begins....

Let's hear it.

He was one of the guys who was on the plane during that incident where Iranians hijacked a TWA flight from the 1980's, correct?
(or am I getting him confused with someone else?)

 

[A2SG]

Let's hear it.

He was one of the guys who was on the plane during that incident where Iranians hijacked a TWA flight from the 1980's, correct?
(or am I getting him confused with someone else?)

Close, but not quite.

So a guy walks into a bar and orders a Leon Klinghoffer. Bartender gives him two shots and a splash.

For an encore, anyone wanna dust off some Christa MacAuliffe jokes?

-- A2SG, just a fountain of inappropriate humor....

 

[durangodawood]

Something interesting I've been thinking about...

Culture (in terms of how people end up lining up politically) has a way of being downstream of Comedy (in particular, stand-up comedy)


I remember a few years back, conservative comedians (apart from the late Norm MacDonald) were known as "lame & tame". It was the stuff that really wasn't all that funny, it was almost clean to a fault, etc...

Over the past few years, some of the most popular stand-up comedians, in terms of being a monetary draw) have been ones that have expressed viewpoints that some would see as "right wing" even if they have other views that are left-leaning...
(Dave Chappelle, Tony Hinchcliffe, Bill Burr, Louis CK, Whitney Cummings, Shane Gillis, Adam Ray, Jim Norton) --noting most of the aforementioned list have been regulars on the Kill Tony show. And then stand-up comedy staples like Jerry Seinfeld have called some people out on the carpet as well.


Stand-up comedians make their living off of "saying the quiet part out loud" in ways that make people uncomfortable sometimes.

There's an old saying "tyrants hate laugher because it's involuntary" (meaning it'll expose whether or not people really like certain ideas or think ideas are stupid).

Should the notable shift in where people stand have been an indicator that "the wind changed directions" a bit?

All of sudden a lot of their new anti-left material becomes far less relevant as the news cycle will be dominated by various right wing absurdities emerging from the new president and congress.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

All of sudden a lot of their new anti-left material becomes far less relevant as the news cycle will be dominated by various right wing absurdities emerging from the new president and congress.

I don't think it even has to be considered "anti-left" so much as it's a case where there's backlash against the idea of "these are the groups you're not allowed to tell jokes about"

So whichever faction is the ones suggesting that there's jokes that should be "off-limits" will be the ones who get railed against.

I'm sure they'll be a plethora of Trump jokes as well, but not sure how much of it will come across as "original".

Another aspect of comedy is "newness", there's a reason why some themes/concepts get "played out"

There's only so many times a person can do a
"Trump said this stupid thing"
"Here's an impression of one of his supporters with a southern accent"
etc etc

...before it gets stale. I think the reason SNL is able to get by with it is largely due to the fact that the guy they have playing Trump does a spot-on voice impression, and a good impression has some staying power.


Meanwhile. on the other side of the fence, there's been a treasure trove of new material they've probably been building up (but didn't want to use out of fear of getting cancelled or blackballed for the last decade) that they'll be able to tap into for a while.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

(staff edit)

They are, but those folks aren't the types that would frequently attending comedy clubs or be seeking out the "dirty" stand-up comedy specials on streaming services, as stand-up comedy (long known for using "bad words") is a medium that they've likely avoided for quite some time.

Going drinking and hitting the comedy cellar at 11:30pm for a 1-hour set is a "young man's game"


Much like, if there were some issue with things that were getting said at gun ranges, I wouldn't expect younger progressives to be complaining about that very much, as they'll likely not even aware of it since that's not a venue where they'd normally hang out.

 

[durangodawood]

I don't think it even has to be considered "anti-left" so much as it's a case where there's backlash against the idea of "these are the groups you're not allowed to tell jokes about"

This would have had a lot more relevance had Harris won and the pushback against DEI wasnt underway.

I'm sure they'll be a plethora of Trump jokes as well, but not sure how much of it will come across as "original".

Theres a whole new interesting cast of characters in his orbit to make fun of. Just look at Elon for example.

Meanwhile. on the other side of the fence, there's been a treasure trove of new material they've probably been building up (but didn't want to use out of fear of getting cancelled or blackballed for the last decade) that they'll be able to tap into for a while.

Unfortunately for them, this is just the time when that material will feel dated, as the news cycles are filled with stuff of a different flavor. It will sound like a grudge.

 

[Landon Caeli]

Something interesting I've been thinking about...

Culture (in terms of how people end up lining up politically) has a way of being downstream of Comedy (in particular, stand-up comedy)


I remember a few years back, conservative comedians (apart from the late Norm MacDonald) were known as "lame & tame". It was the stuff that really wasn't all that funny, it was almost clean to a fault, etc...

Over the past few years, some of the most popular stand-up comedians, in terms of being a monetary draw) have been ones that have expressed viewpoints that some would see as "right wing" even if they have other views that are left-leaning...
(Dave Chappelle, Tony Hinchcliffe, Bill Burr, Louis CK, Whitney Cummings, Shane Gillis, Adam Ray, Jim Norton) --noting most of the aforementioned list have been regulars on the Kill Tony show. And then stand-up comedy staples like Jerry Seinfeld have called some people out on the carpet as well.


Stand-up comedians make their living off of "saying the quiet part out loud" in ways that make people uncomfortable sometimes.

There's an old saying "tyrants hate laugher because it's involuntary" (meaning it'll expose whether or not people really like certain ideas or think ideas are stupid).

Should the notable shift in where people stand have been an indicator that "the wind changed directions" a bit?

Thank you for this great contribution for topic. I hope to see more led zeppelin, pink Floyd style musicians re-enter the culture after the death of woke. I want our white American outlaws back, that have long been canceled by woke hollywood elites. IMO!

 

[iluvatar5150]

They are, but those folks aren't the types that would frequently attending comedy clubs or be seeking out the "dirty" stand-up comedy specials on streaming services, as stand-up comedy (long known for using "bad words") is a medium that they've likely avoided for quite some time.

Going drinking and hitting the comedy cellar at 11:30pm for a 1-hour set is a "young man's game"

idk what kind of clubs you're attending, but while you're correct about the set times, IME, everybody is there for raunchy humor, regardless of age. The biggest comedy club near me (cap somewhere around 300 with tables) is in the burbs, has weekend shows around 7:00 and 9:30, and it is absolutely an older crowd. I'd put myself and my usual crew of late 30's/early 40's dads on the younger side of median age. Sam Jay is playing in a few weeks. Kelsey Cook was there a few months ago.

Regarding whether or not conservatives show up to those shows - my buddies brought me to see Jimmy Dore there last year and the place was packed (and he's coming back in a few months). I didn't know who Jimmy Dore was at the time (i have a low bar for accepting invitations), so I was a bit surprised at the whole experience. Conservatives like raunchy humor if it's directed at the "right" people (e.g. Nancy Pelosi, Joe Biden, Anthony Fauci, etc). I mean, "Let's Go Brandon" originated from a profane chant at a supposedly family-friendly NASCAR event.