church's view (non-denominational) on the mentally ill

[looking4joy]

So what do you guys think of the severely mentally ill in your community, church, or family?

1. Do you believe they are evil manipulators, or that they need love and grace and kindness showed to them? Do you believe they a. are demonic, b. possessed by demons, or c. oppressed by demons? Why?

2. How does your church view them? Is your church involved with any special groups to support them? Is there special counseling involved? Is there a difference in the way you treat a severely mentally ill believer and a severely mentally ill lost person? Do you understand that a person with severe mental illness may struggle with their perception of reality and initially reject the gospel because of this?

3. How does your community respond to them? Are they supportive or do they turn their backs on them? Are there local groups that support the lives of the severely mentally ill person?

4. How well educated is the church, community, or yourself with the symptoms, causes, and struggles of the severely mentally ill person? Do you know mental illness is a result of mostly genetics and/or trauma and stress?

IMPORTANT!! Answer these questions as honestly as possible. Even though you think a group "ought" to respond a certain way, answer honestly as it really is.

"Severe" mental illness is not the blues, sadness, crying, excited, happy or otherwise. Severe mental illness is a diagnosed condition of clinical depression, bipolar, personality disorders, schizophrenia and other serious mental illnesses.

 

[looking4joy]

This is really sad to know nobody wants to comment on something of this nature. It shows the church's stigma and lack of interest in the weakest of the weak.

 

[WretchedGoat]

Topics of this sort are hard to talk about. The people that suffer from them *raises hand* don't advertise the condition because of the stigma attached to it, and it's hard for people to offer help even when they know of it because...what can they really say?

In the majority of churches I have been in, a person is in a much better position to have help from the congregation if they are destitute or an ex-felon rather than someone who depends on anti-depressant and anti-psychotic meds *raises hand again* to keep their personality in check.

Wish I could be of more help OP, but it's just not an easy topic for anyone to talk about.

 

[BeStill&Know]

So what do you guys think of the severely mentally ill in your community, church, or family?

1. Do you believe they are evil manipulators, or that they need love and grace and kindness showed to them? Do you believe they a. are demonic, b. possessed by demons, or c. oppressed by demons? Why?

2. How does your church view them? Is your church involved with any special groups to support them? Is there special counseling involved? Is there a difference in the way you treat a severely mentally ill believer and a severely mentally ill lost person? Do you understand that a person with severe mental illness may struggle with their perception of reality and initially reject the gospel because of this?

3. How does your community respond to them? Are they supportive or do they turn their backs on them? Are there local groups that support the lives of the severely mentally ill person?

4. How well educated is the church, community, or yourself with the symptoms, causes, and struggles of the severely mentally ill person? Do you know mental illness is a result of mostly genetics and/or trauma and stress?

IMPORTANT!! Answer these questions as honestly as possible. Even though you think a group "ought" to respond a certain way, answer honestly as it really is.

"Severe" mental illness is not the blues, sadness, crying, excited, happy or otherwise. Severe mental illness is a diagnosed condition of clinical depression, bipolar, personality disorders, schizophrenia and other serious mental illnesses.

This is really sad to know nobody wants to comment on something of this nature. It shows the church's stigma and lack of interest in the weakest of the weak.

Topics of this sort are hard to talk about. The people that suffer from them *raises hand* don't advertise the condition because of the stigma attached to it, and it's hard for people to offer help even when they know of it because...what can they really say?

In the majority of churches I have been in, a person is in a much better position to have help from the congregation if they are destitute or an ex-felon rather than someone who depends on anti-depressant and anti-psychotic meds *raises hand again* to keep their personality in check.

Wish I could be of more help OP, but it's just not an easy topic for anyone to talk about.

• Yes, very good topic. I agree with both of you.
• There is little to no references in church preaching or teaching, dealing on this topic.
• Most people are ignorant unless they deal with this illness themselves or live with one who does.
• Most everyone else only hears the various crimes including murder, often reported on the daily newscast.
• I believe there is more sympathy and mercy within the church dealt to drug addicts, alcoholics, sexual addicts, etc. Even though there is a hugh difference here: people who are mentally ill have not made the choice to be so where as all these other did make a choice and/or continuing to choose that lifestyle.
• Our only option is to seek the Lord, for His mercy, towards us and pray for the healing He only has for us. Not to depend on a building full of people with other handicaps, to accept the mentally ill.

 

[jargew]

Looking for joy, great topic!

1. The non-denominational church as a whole (not all...) has started reaching out to those with mental illness.
Over 20% of Americans may have a clinical mental illness. This is a serious societal problem.
This has little to do with demons. Most mental illness is no different than needing eye glasses, it is a medical problem (often genetic).
A smaller proportion of mental illness may reflect the misguided goals, and detachment of our society in general, from other people, and the guiding principals of Christ, leading to depression etc.

2. My church sees addressing mental illness as a means to start a conversation with a huge group of people who need help, both spiritual and medical, and hopefully help facilitate healing.
We regularly have members of our congregation (our church has between 500-700 in attendance) get on stage and speak about their struggles with mental illness and give hope to others because with God's strength and proper medical treatment, life can be much, much better.

3. In my church - SUPPORTIVE of those with mental health! Praise God for His church.
- Society as a whole - definitely not supportive of the mentally ill.

4. People are poorly educated, myself included. But having members of the congregation, and elders of the church, talk about their struggles, and the the struggles of their family members, is a terrific educational tool.

 

[dayhiker]

I don't know that my church has a designed program for those with mental illnesses.
I've always felt very limited because of how little I understand about these things. The answers I have heard feel very limited in
their understanding as well. It feels to me like most mental health training comes from trial and error. They have found a lot of things that work/help
but to me they still don't seem to be answers.
I don't feel calling these things evil is helpful. Just as we have physical things that don't work with out body, we don't call those things evil, I don't feel we should call problems with our spiritual/soul evil. If a weakness of any type in us allows a demon to express its personality thru a person then it should be cast out. But that person needs a lot of love and care to find healing for the weakness that allowed that situation. Jesus loved everyone. If they needed healing He healed them, if they needed a demon cast out He cast it out. He didn't heap guilt and condemnation on their head. He didn't accuse them of not having faith if they weren't healed.

 

[looking4joy]

Thanks for your answers guys. I have been diagnosed with bipolar schizoaffective. It's treatable with Lithium and a few other add on meds.

There are a couple of things I struggle with since I do have that brain chemistry. The first is that although I have been a professing Christian for over 20 years, I psyche myself out spiritually. I don't try to do that, but it just happens. Therefore I question whether I have ever been a Christian, or just someone learning about Christianity. When it gets to the nitty gritty of faith, I depend on Christ Jesus to lead/guide me and to ultimately save me - but seeking His face isn't easy and doesn't always come to fruition. I feel like He's angry at me more times than not. And since bipolar disorder is a mood disorder, feelings and emotions, part of the soul that is often ignored in church today, fluctuate wildly, and are able to deceive me easily into believing things that aren't necessarily so, like that since God "is angry with me" I must be under His wrath and not His grace. So you have the bipolar victim who has schizophrenic tendencies to believe in fixed false beliefs, even though the evidence is right in front of him that he's safe and on the right side of the fence.. that's me.

The second thing is that as a common link to bipolar is that I am hypersexual. Look on google for the relationship yourself if you don't believe me. One antidepressant called Wellbutrin actually can make a bipolar hypersexual person more so. They've pinpointed the chemicals in the brain that cause sexual arousal, also related to moods and emotions. So I struggle with porn and masturbation on an accelerated level in that my bipolar tendency to be hypersexual increases my struggle with the addiction. Plus, I was on Wellbutrin for a good number of years, while my Christian counselor is just like, "Just stop! [the porn addiction] Just say no!" It's not that easy.

My pastor has been really graceful with me, although he doesn't have anything set up at church to facilitate the severely mentally ill. But he has talked with me so many times, while I struggle with and in my faith, and the sexual sin.

Actually, I've discontinued Wellbutrin - went off of it myself. I was only taking a minimum dosage, so the doctor doesn't mind. If I am anywhere, I am here: my need for a Savior, whom I have in Jesus Christ, has escalated into my awareness many times over in the last several months. When I get overtaken by hypersexual thoughts, I am not so tempted to act out anymore, although I wouldn't put it past me at some point.. but I feel the need for my Savior in my heart - I ache for love to be poured into my heart by the Holy Spirit. It's like the pain of a poor relationship with God is aching to be met a new way - by grace instead of sin.

In dealing with the condemnation, Satan has his tactics. Right now he is accusing me as I wrestle with anger. I am angry, trying not to sin, and he says my anger is proof I've never been a Christian because I've stuffed this anger since I first called out to God 20 years ago. Somehow that "disqualifies" me.

I'd like to continue discussing this topic with whoever will. Thanks.

 

[JoeP222w]

So what do you guys think of the severely mentally ill in your community, church, or family?

1. Do you believe they are evil manipulators, or that they need love and grace and kindness showed to them? Do you believe they a. are demonic, b. possessed by demons, or c. oppressed by demons? Why?

2. How does your church view them? Is your church involved with any special groups to support them? Is there special counseling involved? Is there a difference in the way you treat a severely mentally ill believer and a severely mentally ill lost person? Do you understand that a person with severe mental illness may struggle with their perception of reality and initially reject the gospel because of this?

3. How does your community respond to them? Are they supportive or do they turn their backs on them? Are there local groups that support the lives of the severely mentally ill person?

4. How well educated is the church, community, or yourself with the symptoms, causes, and struggles of the severely mentally ill person? Do you know mental illness is a result of mostly genetics and/or trauma and stress?

IMPORTANT!! Answer these questions as honestly as possible. Even though you think a group "ought" to respond a certain way, answer honestly as it really is.

"Severe" mental illness is not the blues, sadness, crying, excited, happy or otherwise. Severe mental illness is a diagnosed condition of clinical depression, bipolar, personality disorders, schizophrenia and other serious mental illnesses.

1. Evil manipulators: No
They need grace and kindness: Yes, by all means.
Demonic etc: Not by default. But demonic influence can effect mental health.

2. [View]:Like all people, sinners in the need of God's grace and mercy in Jesus Christ.
[Groups]: Not at this time
[Counseling]: Depends
[treat]: Hopefully not, because God commands us to love one another, regardless of mental status, regardless of salvation status.
[rejection]: God is sovereign and God is the one who saves. I trust that the just Judge of the universe will do what is right.

3. [Community] Church community or local community (secular and faith)?: (I will assume church): Hard to say, but mostly in love and grace.
[Supportive]: Yes
[Local groups]: I don't know

4. [Educated]: Hard to say for sure.
[genetics/trauma/stress]: I wouldn't agree that this is "mostly" due to those things, although they certainly can be.

 

[jargew]

Looking4Joy,

Thanks for your honesty and openness. The church needs this sort of openness. Sharing our shortcomings and sin, instead of trying to hide them, helps us grow spiritually.
James 5:16 - "Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed.
The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective."

I will respond to the comments and concerns of your previous post point by point. Hopefully some of this will help or be of interest, but I am not a medical doctor or a pastor....
A member of my church has schizophrenia (albeit a fairly mild form, but still serious), but with God's help and proper medication (perhaps the Holy Spirit helps medication work more effectively sometimes...) this man actually served as a missionary in Africa for 7 years.

#1. Regarding psyching yourself out spiritually : A very wise pastor once said "Being tempted and having doubts about our salvation is temptation from the devil. In fact, this should reassure us concerning our salvation, because the devil would not bother to tempt the unsaved."

#2. It sounds like you are a part of a supportive church and it's great that your pastor takes the time for consultations and to help you as much as possible. Give praise to God for His church. The body of Christ is awesome and impactful on our world.

#3. Anger : I too struggle with anger. I have absolutely no reason or excuse to be angry in my life but sometimes i get riled up over trivial things. I don't even understand why I do. It's simply the flesh controlling my spirit.

What to do? Read relevant biblical passages about anger. Clearly nothing beneficial comes from anger. Pray for the holy spirit to dwell within us that we may have peace and that it will overcome the flesh such that we are "slow to anger". I would say my answer for every difficult situation in life is "read the bible and pray". Christ wanted us all to live holy and righteous lives. He didn't want the route to this life to be complicated, so He kept it simple,
A) Accept Christ B) Pray C) Read Bible

#4. Sexual Sin - A lot of people struggle with this, you're not alone. How to overcome this? Not sure, but two things might help. 1) Remember, Christ is with us at ALL times. We are never alone, nothing is unseen. When people watch porn, the Holy Spirit is there.
2) Remember, we should ask the Holy Spirit for strength to do things which are edifying and beneficial. Nothing, and I mean nothing, good, or wholesome or beneficial will ever come from watching porn. It is a purely destructive force.

#5. It's great that you have proper medical care and are taking medication. Keep it up!
Regarding the Wellbutrin, be careful when you stop medication. If you feel frequently depressed or anxious you may want to go back on the drug. Also, if you stay off for a period of time, you should tell your doctor you are no longer taking this med , but feel no adverse effects from not taking it.

#6. Even if you stumble and fall, don't give up! Get back up and keep trying to live a Godly life. If you stumble again, get up and keep going. It will get better. Faith is the most important aspect of our lives. Never give it up.

#7. There is a mental health forum here that might be helpful.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Mental illness is not really talked about in Christianity. I think for the longest time no one wanted to even think of a Christian not being happy or being depressed or anxious (medically tested and diagnosed depression and anxiety) not just people who say they feel down or anxious, but those with a real mental illness.

It seems anti-Christian because (in my opinion) Christ is all a person needs and is to fulfill one's life. Somehow people see mental illness as lacking God or not having that fullness, but I can testify that it is HARDER to be a Christian with a mental illness. And we have AT LEAST as much faith if not way more faith, because we have battled some gut wrenching conditions in our mind and come out of it in faith.

I believe that people do not understand, nor will they probably ever understand if they do not experience it. It is like being poor. A rich person that has never not had food, or a place to live or had their electricity turned off and sat in the dark, cannot understand it fully. They say 'boy that would suck if that happened' and then on they go with their lives.

Interesting enough I had a conversation with someone who has never respected my medically diagnosed depression or anxiety disorder talk with me this morning. Telling me about how their mother, very advanced in age and in a wheelchair is very depressed because she thinks she is going to not get any better. The FIRST time in 30 years I have ever heard that word 'depression' come out of their mouth and they hesitated before saying it. I was shocked.

I pray for each of us with mental illness and I still say that being a Christian and staying in faith through it all takes MORE faith than other believers.

 

[thesunisout]

Thanks for your answers guys. I have been diagnosed with bipolar schizoaffective. It's treatable with Lithium and a few other add on meds

In dealing with the condemnation, Satan has his tactics. Right now he is accusing me as I wrestle with anger. I am angry, trying not to sin, and he says my anger is proof I've never been a Christian because I've stuffed this anger since I first called out to God 20 years ago. Somehow that "disqualifies" me.

I'd like to continue discussing this topic with whoever will. Thanks.

My wife has bipolar schitzoeffective disorder so I know somewhat what you're going through from the outside. I know that my wifes brain works differently than the average brain. So, when people come alongside you maybe a few of them had no idea of the struggle you go through and tried to advise you like someone who didn't have mental illness. We shouldn't try to pretend it isn't there either, but rather work through it with and in the Lord.

Do you believe you have the Holy Spirit living inside of you? If you do then you are saved and belong to Him. God bless brother, be sure to ask God to give you a sound mind like He promised to do in 2 Timothy 1:7

 

[ToBeLoved]

The problem with mental illness is you do not see it. By that I mean if someone lost a leg or lost their hair due to cancer or couldn't walk, you know they are sick. Or if they have a cold and their eyes are all bloodshot and their coughinig. Or if someone has down syndrome or whatever. When people can see it, they are more empathetic. But mentally ill people look like everyone else and shame causes people to hide it because it is not socially acceptable.

 

[jargew]

The problem with mental illness is you do not see it. By that I mean if someone lost a leg or lost their hair due to cancer or couldn't walk, you know they are sick. Or if they have a cold and their eyes are all bloodshot and their coughinig. Or if someone has down syndrome or whatever. When people can see it, they are more empathetic. But mentally ill people look like everyone else and shame causes people to hide it because it is not socially acceptable.

- Yes, this is something we really need to change in the church. People should petition their pastors/elders to discuss mental illness in the church.

 

[ToBeLoved]

- Yes, this is something we really need to change in the church. People should petition their pastors/elders to discuss mental illness in the church.

 

[Denisse]

I was diagnosticated with depression, generalized anxiety, PTSD and panic attacks. I opened up to the church and there was almost no support . Some think that is all demonic and that it is my fault that I am not set free once for all or that I don't maintain my freedom; some think that I am weird and a freak (they actually say that) and some just think that it is an exaggeration and for a long time I was convinced that it is and I was actually tormented by anxiety and depression because I ignored them until I began having panic attacks, insomnia and eating disorders that were developed to stop the pain I was feeling. I began to believe that because I was dealing with this I wasn't save and the thought that I am going to hell made all things worse. And the thought that I was dissapointing God because of suffering of these illnesses was creating so much condemnation and grief....I began having problems with breathing, I still have many days in which breathing is so hard for me and I always have the feeling that I am suffocating, even during the night.

Now I am trying to recover, I actually got into therapy and I am just trying to renew my mind, to ask Jesus to help me in all this and to walk with Him even in all this. I know so well now that He is really my only Hope and even in the worse days and nights when sometimes I feel so overwhelmed by all I feel and by all the thaughts bombarding me,I just try to gather strenght to speak the name of Jesus..I know this seems stupid and like an invention, but sadly this is how I felt a big part of my life and I hope one day I will be actually able to live the life Jesus spoke of in John 10 and that I will overcome this and be able to have a testimony of how God took me out of this...

 

[ToBeLoved]

I was diagnosticated with depression, generalized anxiety, PTSD and panic attacks. I opened up to the church and there was almost no support . Some think that is all demonic and that it is my fault that I am not set free once for all or that I don't maintain my freedom; some think that I am weird and a freak (they actually say that) and some just think that it is an exaggeration and for a long time I was convinced that it is and I was actually tormented by anxiety and depression because I ignored them until I began having panic attacks, insomnia and eating disorders that were developed to stop the pain I was feeling. I began to believe that because I was dealing with this I wasn't save and the thought that I am going to hell made all things worse. And the thought that I was dissapointing God because of suffering of these illnesses was creating so much condemnation and grief....I began having problems with breathing, I still have many days in which breathing is so hard for me and I always have the feeling that I am suffocating, even during the night.

Now I am trying to recover, I actually got into therapy and I am just trying to renew my mind, to ask Jesus to help me in all this and to walk with Him even in all this. I know so well now that He is really my only Hope and even in the worse days and nights when sometimes I feel so overwhelmed by all I feel and by all the thaughts bombarding me,I just try to gather strenght to speak the name of Jesus..I know this seems stupid and like an invention, but sadly this is how I felt a big part of my life and I hope one day I will be actually able to live the life Jesus spoke of in John 10 and that I will overcome this and be able to have a testimony of how God took me out of this...

You have been through something terrible at your church. May I ask, is it a rumor (what I mean by this did you tell a few people and they spread it) or did you come out to your church pastor and all? The reason I am asking is because if this is a rumor (w/o Pators knowledge) you may want to talk to him and see if he does not set things straight. However, if your pastor knows and has not made a point of stopping all this, then LEAVE this church! Right away. We are all servants of God and your pastor should want to protect the flock and sheep that Christ has put him over. Remember Jesus words in "if one sheep is lost, I leave the flock and go search for that one sheep until it is found". That is what a good shepherd does and your pastor is the shepherd over the church flock given to him by Christ for a time.

God wants you to have fellowship and support in church. Not that everyone will understand, because some will not. But you should at least be able to be in fellowship with some saints at your church and be edified by the church. Pick those people well that you confide in. In conversation (BEFORE) you tell them, do a little investigating. Bring up in casual conversation that you would like prayer for your mother who is depressed with PTSD and see how they react. Say it has been so hard and she has struggled so much, so continued prayer is needed and you request that from the person. See what they say. Watch both what they say and non-verbal que's. You can even go further by saying that 'some may think it is demonic, but it's proven that it is endorphins that are not made and released automatically by the body and VERY REAL. If they show no compassion or anything, I would not say anything. A normal person would feel something, some compassion for someone struggling.

You have the knowledge now on how some people will react and what they will think. Knowing this, seek out only kind, loving, compassionate people. Put them to the test BEFORE letting them in your heart.

God bless you sweetie. Feel free to start a conversation with me (although I think you need 10 posts, so reply to me and a few other people in this thread to get your count up)