• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Tellyontellyon

Well-Known Member
Jan 19, 2020
855
262
54
Wales
✟156,472.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Why do Christians meet in churches, in the NT, most of the teachings seem to be given in people's houses, or in the open... some were given in the synagogue, but it didn't seem a necessity.
Owning property and the accumulated wealth (or debt) that that entails seems to be a source of potential corruption.
Would churches function better if they avoided owning buildings and land?
It also seems more natural and human to meet together in the home...
Wouldn't it be better to do it that way?
 

Paidiske

Clara bonam audax
Site Supporter
Apr 25, 2016
36,236
20,448
46
Albury, Australia
Visit site
✟1,838,675.00
Country
Australia
Gender
Female
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
There are benefits and drawbacks to any model.

The main benefit of churches over private homes is that it allows us to gather in much greater numbers, and in spaces built to accommodate worship. (We have the remains of some very early churches which were converted houses, but, for example, a private bathtub is not so convenient for public baptism as a purpose-built baptistery).

Another benefit is that churches held in private homes tend to be dominated by the patron/host/benefactor, and that can lead to them being controlling of the group in ways that shared property does not facilitate. We have evidence of that in early accounts also.

Also, a purpose-built property is available exclusively for the purposes of ministry and mission, and can be used throughout the week for all kinds of good purposes which might be awkward, or indeed unsafe, from a private house. (Eg. My church runs a food bank, but it would not be safe for that to be done from a private home).
 
Upvote 0

GreekOrthodox

Psalti Chrysostom
Oct 25, 2010
4,120
4,200
Yorktown VA
✟198,952.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
The oldest surviving church was converted from a house in the mid 200s.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dura-Europos_church

So "house church" may have meant someone's house but used primarily for worship. Recently I visited a Russian monastery that had been converted from a house. The monks live upstairs, while the family room area is now a chapel.

https://virginiamonks.org/
 
  • Informative
Reactions: Lukaris
Upvote 0

Pavel Mosko

Arch-Dude of the Apostolic
Site Supporter
Oct 4, 2016
7,236
7,320
59
Boyertown, PA.
✟839,345.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Oriental Orthodox
Marital Status
Single
Why do Christians meet in churches, in the NT, most of the teachings seem to be given in people's houses, or in the open... some were given in the synagogue, but it didn't seem a necessity.
Owning property and the accumulated wealth (or debt) that that entails seems to be a source of potential corruption.
Would churches function better if they avoided owning buildings and land?
It also seems more natural and human to meet together in the home...
Wouldn't it be better to do it that way?

All true but you are forgetting or not realizing the early Christians believed they were "One Body" in Christ through the eucharist and that was expressed literally by one Church service where all the believers of a city or area met together. Sort of like the big meetings Jesus had (all the people that wanted to be his disciples met with him), and kind of like how the temple and tabernacle had ritual worship on behalf of the sins of all of Israel.
 
Upvote 0

Jeshu

Bought by His Blood
Site Supporter
Mar 25, 2005
15,422
7,574
66
One of the Greatest Places on Earth.
✟600,278.00
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Why do Christians meet in churches, in the NT, most of the teachings seem to be given in people's houses, or in the open... some were given in the synagogue, but it didn't seem a necessity.
Owning property and the accumulated wealth (or debt) that that entails seems to be a source of potential corruption.
Would churches function better if they avoided owning buildings and land?
It also seems more natural and human to meet together in the home...
Wouldn't it be better to do it that way?

i think you have excellent ideas that are very Scriptural as well.

Many believers base their faith on what religion teaches them, instead of simple faith in the Voice of God.

Believers in Christ know that He promises them that He would teach them Himself, but many still go to Church to be instructed, rather than by Him directly though the word on their bookshelves and his love in their hearts.

i think home gatherings are The Way to go forward. Leaving those buildings to rot and learning to love God and neighbour, caring for the poor, sick, hurting and needy instead.

The bible calls such good religion - not investing in property - but in human lives instead.

(just my thoughts on the matter.)

Peace.
 
Upvote 0

Maria Billingsley

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Oct 7, 2018
12,400
10,337
66
Martinez
✟1,312,050.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Why do Christians meet in churches, in the NT, most of the teachings seem to be given in people's houses, or in the open... some were given in the synagogue, but it didn't seem a necessity.
Owning property and the accumulated wealth (or debt) that that entails seems to be a source of potential corruption.
Would churches function better if they avoided owning buildings and land?
It also seems more natural and human to meet together in the home...
Wouldn't it be better to do it that way?
Unfortunately at some point congegations became corporations.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: 2PhiloVoid
Upvote 0

Albion

Facilitator
Dec 8, 2004
111,127
33,268
✟584,052.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
...and they meet in churches because the equipment needed for conducting worship and everything else associated with the congregation's activities almost cannot be had in an ordinary home--the altar, pulpit, seating for perhaps a hundred people, baptistry, communion ware, clothing, candles, hymnals, prayer books, and so much more--and then brought out for worship or whatever, every few days.

And when that kind of situation is needed, for one reason or another, it's almost certain to be done small scale or with portable versions of the "equipment." To set up and tear down such as all of this would be like setting up for an orchestra or roller derby, and then storing whatever is used, maybe a hundred or more times a year.
 
Upvote 0

1watchman

Overseer
Site Supporter
Oct 9, 2010
6,040
1,228
Washington State
✟358,418.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It is true that a 'House Meeting' cannot do the things a large building affords; but I know of many simple Bible-only 'House Meetings' that have grown so large they purchased or rented a building to accommodate the numbers. That in no way requires one to have all the equipment people like, to perform all the activities they choose. A Bible-only fellowship must be in accord with New Testament order as in the Epistles; where no such activities, stage shows, choir singing was utilized. A Bible-only Assembly needs to be patterned much as in the NT with the 'priesthood' of the redeemed souls. There, every saint sang unto the Lord and worshipped, and studied together as shown --a "holy" and "royal priesthood" (note 1 Peter 2:5 & 9-11). That has been my standard for years. -1watchman
 
Upvote 0

Sketcher

Born Imperishable
Feb 23, 2004
39,056
9,493
✟438,414.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
Why do Christians meet in churches, in the NT, most of the teachings seem to be given in people's houses, or in the open... some were given in the synagogue, but it didn't seem a necessity.
Owning property and the accumulated wealth (or debt) that that entails seems to be a source of potential corruption.
Would churches function better if they avoided owning buildings and land?
It also seems more natural and human to meet together in the home...
Wouldn't it be better to do it that way?
It became clear that the needs of the church outgrew homes by the time that Christians started renting basilicas to hold their services in. That renting of basilicas eventually turned into owning basilicas and building their own.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: jamiec
Upvote 0

ViaCrucis

Confessional Lutheran
Oct 2, 2011
40,478
30,251
Pacific Northwest
✟867,315.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
Why do Christians meet in churches, in the NT, most of the teachings seem to be given in people's houses, or in the open... some were given in the synagogue, but it didn't seem a necessity.

Churches today are what the homes which Christians met in the first few centuries. The meeting in homes doesn't mean it was just a social visit, they were doing liturgy there. Also, these homes were typically the property of an individual member of the congregation. We know what these house churches looked like because we have archeological examples.

One of the oldest of these is the house church discovered in Dura-Eurapos in Syria. It was a villa that had been refurbished to function as a church, it had a built-in baptismal font, an open space for worshipers to stand and gather in to pray, sing hymns, and hear the preacher read from the Scriptures and preach his homily. It was also decorated with frescoes of scenes from the Bible, such as this one which depicts the paralyzed man carrying his bed after Jesus heals him,
Fresque_Doura_Europos.jpg


These are the prototype of later churches built or repurposed from other buildings in centuries to come. Christian architecture began to install more symbolic elements, such as constructing buildings in the shape of the cross, or as an octagon (baptismal fonts are also historically octagonal).

Are buildings necessary for the liturgy? No, but they certainly help.

Owning property and the accumulated wealth (or debt) that that entails seems to be a source of potential corruption.

I would prefer church buildings be held as the public and corporately owned property of the Church, rather than belonging to specific individuals. And the Church ought to be a redistributer of wealth, not a hoarder of wealth. I maintain that when we enter into the church building we are entering into sacred, shared space--God owns that space. This is also why I reject having nationalistic symbols in what I believe to be an outpost of God's kingdom. Our crowns come off in that space.

Would churches function better if they avoided owning buildings and land?

I don't think buildings are going to play much a role in matters addressing ecclesiastical corruption.

It also seems more natural and human to meet together in the home...
Wouldn't it be better to do it that way?

Is it more natural? My general study into human history has shown that human beings seem to naturally gravitate toward designating certain spaces as sacred, and thus having a shared sacred space for the community. That's why people have been erecting shrines, temples, tabernacles, etc for a designated sacred space for millennia.

The spiritual role of the home still exists in Christianity. In the Lutheran tradition we say that a child's first pastor is their parents. Church happens in the home too, just differently than what happens in our meeting places. Church in the home is a family loving each other, serving each other, feeding one another, cleaning for one another.

-CryptoLutheran
 
  • Winner
Reactions: Radicchio
Upvote 0

Lukaris

Orthodox Christian
Site Supporter
Aug 3, 2007
9,413
3,551
Pennsylvania, USA
✟1,086,792.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Single
Christians originally did meet in synagogue but were ultimately rejected there. Although Saturday was the sabbath, clearly Sunday was a busy day too ( Acts of the Apostles 20:7). The risen Lord was worshiped first by women on this day ( Matthew 28:1-9) & Sunday was soon determined to be the Lord’s Day ( Revelation 1:10).

When persecution increased, Christians met in houses, catacombs etc.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

James_Lai

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2021
1,100
265
40
Ontario
✟24,480.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Why do Christians meet in churches, in the NT, most of the teachings seem to be given in people's houses, or in the open... some were given in the synagogue, but it didn't seem a necessity.
Owning property and the accumulated wealth (or debt) that that entails seems to be a source of potential corruption.
Would churches function better if they avoided owning buildings and land?
It also seems more natural and human to meet together in the home...
Wouldn't it be better to do it that way?

Probably another reason to do away grand and pompous church buildings how it becomes identical with all the pagan cults early Christianity decidedly opposed.
 
Upvote 0

1watchman

Overseer
Site Supporter
Oct 9, 2010
6,040
1,228
Washington State
✟358,418.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
One reason why we build Orthodox temples.


That picture shown, is perhaps a good example why such structures offend God; being a manmade palace to please the flesh, very much contrary to the simplicity of a Bible-only assembly as shown in our Bible Epistles ---mostly meeting in homes or rented buildings (until a larger meeting place is needed for the growth, where the assembly can be free like the private home. Our palace is truly in Heaven, and we are to be about the Gospel and simple Church truth as practiced in the Epistles. An ornate building is wasting funds which could serve better in the Gospel work and worldwide ministry to needy souls, I feel sure.
 
  • Like
Reactions: James_Lai
Upvote 0

James_Lai

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2021
1,100
265
40
Ontario
✟24,480.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Married
That picture shown, is perhaps a good example why such structures offend God; being a manmade palace to please the flesh, very much contrary to the simplicity of a Bible-only assembly as shown in our Bible Epistles ---mostly meeting in homes or rented buildings (until a larger meeting place is needed for the growth, where the assembly can be free like the private home. Our palace is truly in Heaven, and we are to be about the Gospel and simple Church truth as practiced in the Epistles. An ornate building is wasting funds which could serve better in the Gospel work and worldwide ministry to needy souls, I feel sure.

also it was in the capital, inaccessible to majority in the country
 
Upvote 0

GreekOrthodox

Psalti Chrysostom
Oct 25, 2010
4,120
4,200
Yorktown VA
✟198,952.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
That picture shown, is perhaps a good example why such structures offend God; being a manmade palace to please the flesh, very much contrary to the simplicity of a Bible-only assembly as shown in our Bible Epistles ---mostly meeting in homes or rented buildings (until a larger meeting place is needed for the growth, where the assembly can be free like the private home. Our palace is truly in Heaven, and we are to be about the Gospel and simple Church truth as practiced in the Epistles. An ornate building is wasting funds which could serve better in the Gospel work and worldwide ministry to needy souls, I feel sure.

The Rus converted to Christianity due to a delegation that attended that church in 988. When was the last time your church converted an entire nation with your services?

Two, did you LISTEN?
 
Upvote 0

James_Lai

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2021
1,100
265
40
Ontario
✟24,480.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Married
The Rus converted to Christianity due to a delegation that attended that church in 988. When was the last time your church converted an entire nation with your services?

Two, did you LISTEN?

It’s a beautiful legend. And why other nations did not get converted? Only one that needed to become a Byzantine ally for their help and protection…. How convenient. Why the entire nation of Turks were not converted, who then sacked Byzantine and converted Hagia Sophia into a Mosque? The building serves Islam longer than Christianity. And so instead of an actual choir recording, they pop balloons…

Also, too many Orthodox churches are named after Sophia. How about Jesus or Mary? Sophia is such an important saint? Or holy wisdom? Maybe used to be Pagan temple to goddess Sophia converted later after Constantine?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0