Christians under martial law???

[Incariol]

If a wicked man came into your home and attempted to rape your wife, would you passively turn the other cheek? If someone came into your home and tried to kidnap your children would you sit there idle and allow it to happen? There are many great resources and books that have been written down through the years that discuss this topic. Passivism is non-Biblical IMO. There was a reason that Jesus did not retaliate. He was on a mission to endure the cross. He had to die. Christians must defend themselves and they must defend life. Self-defense is not a violation of the command not to kill. This falls under the category of Just War. It is silly to think that Christians should not fight and defend themselves.

You're right, what was I thinking, believing Jesus and the early Christian martyrs should be examples of Christian behavior. That would interfere with the exciting apocalyptic Left Behind fantasy of me becoming some super-cool resistance fighter and sending minions of Satan to eternal hellfire.

 

[kellyfritz]

I tend to follow after the positions of Augustine and others like him. At least I am in good company. Christianity Today put out an article, ironically only days before 9/11 that discussed these views briefly. I don't have enough posts to provide the link but you can find it by doing a search on Christianity Today for "Time for war".

Or add the URL to this: christianitytoday.com/ct/2001/septemberweb-only/9-17-55.0.html?start=1

Calvin held a view of Just War that was derived from Augustine and you can find his discussions in the Institutes.

The Chicago Statement of Biblical Application also has a section on War that might be helpful.

I personally prefer Augustine's views on the topic. Nevertheless, this is an absolute last resort. I believe that if you can flee, flee. Hope that is more helpful.

 

[Harry3142]

The U.S. military takes an oath to defend the U.S. Constitution against all enemies, both foreign and domestic. The problem anyone would have who seriously attempted to become a dictator would be undermining the military itself so that it couldn't promptly depose him.

As for the military itself being Christian, we need to comprehend what this verse is saying:

"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God." (Matthew 5:9)

Note that the title is 'peacemakers', not 'peacekeepers'. A person can sit in his room, or even hide under his bed, and still be called a peacekeeper. But in order to qualify as a peacemaker, the person must take action to either prevent hostilities or end those hostilities. This puts that title squarely in the area of law enforcement and military. We can't sit on our hands while condemning others for attempting to save us and be called a peacemaker; it's the people who are trying to save us that have earned the title of peacemaker.

BTW: When Jesus talked of turning the other cheek, he was speaking to fellow Jews who also sincerely believed in keeping the law. If an argument between them led to one's slapping the other, it could end in two ways. Either the one slapped could draw a weapon in order to strike down his opponent, or he could take his opponent to rabbinical court, in which case a fit of pique could literally cost him everything he had. Jesus gave them a third option, which in effect permitted both of them to take a time out, with no harm done. But his words are in no way meant to be seen as a 'green light' for those who would deliberately forsake those laws.

 

[drjean]

Martial law? It couldn't be just for Christians..right? Martial law is when citizens take law into their own hands, at the government's approval... like they do after a natural disaster.

After Hurricane Andrew... it was all up to us to protect ourselves and our neighbors etc. Trust me, the National Guard drove around in jeeps with guns and NO ammo...and picked up any body (literally "body") that happened to have been shot or was otherwise dead...no questions asked.

Martial law is not against particulars...


However, if the law of the land is to be changed under the socialist government being ushered in... I will not live long... I am elderly and disabled. Mr Obama and his followers (Pelosi, Reed, etc) have already boldly stated that people like me need to quit taking from society and go home and die. Hmmm. (But what closet did I put that AK in.... ?

 

[youngdisciplectl3]

I thought about the American Revolution as well, and it looks like it was sinful for that to be done. I wonder if any of the founding fathers ever thought about it this way.

I'm not sure but I do not think they thought of it as sinful because there are great quotes from guys like Mayhew saying, "Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God."

I just found a good link I'm going to read into about this matter. It speaks of Romans 13 and how this scripture fits into the scenario.

 

[youngdisciplectl3]

If a wicked man came into your home and attempted to rape your wife, would you passively turn the other cheek? If someone came into your home and tried to kidnap your children would you sit there idle and allow it to happen? There are many great resources and books that have been written down through the years that discuss this topic. Pacifism is non-Biblical IMO. There was a reason that Jesus did not retaliate. He was on a mission to endure the cross. He had to die. Christians must defend themselves and they must defend life. Self-defense is not a violation of the command not to kill. This falls under the category of Just War. It is silly to think that Christians should not fight and defend themselves.

I agree. Jesus let them take him into custody because it was his purpose to lay down his life on the cross for our sins.

 

[youngdisciplectl3]

The U.S. military takes an oath to defend the U.S. Constitution against all enemies, both foreign and domestic. The problem anyone would have who seriously attempted to become a dictator would be undermining the military itself so that it couldn't promptly depose him.

As for the military itself being Christian, we need to comprehend what this verse is saying:

"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God." (Matthew 5:9)

Note that the title is 'peacemakers', not 'peacekeepers'. A person can sit in his room, or even hide under his bed, and still be called a peacekeeper. But in order to qualify as a peacemaker, the person must take action to either prevent hostilities or end those hostilities. This puts that title squarely in the area of law enforcement and military. We can't sit on our hands while condemning others for attempting to save us and be called a peacemaker; it's the people who are trying to save us that have earned the title of peacemaker.

BTW: When Jesus talked of turning the other cheek, he was speaking to fellow Jews who also sincerely believed in keeping the law. If an argument between them led to one's slapping the other, it could end in two ways. Either the one slapped could draw a weapon in order to strike down his opponent, or he could take his opponent to rabbinical court, in which case a fit of pique could literally cost him everything he had. Jesus gave them a third option, which in effect permitted both of them to take a time out, with no harm done. But his words are in no way meant to be seen as a 'green light' for those who would deliberately forsake those laws.

Thanks for your reply. Yeah a lot of people take that oath but how many take it seriously? Not near as many as I'd like. Just think of the military who confiscated everyone's guns down where Katrina hit. That was not constitutional in my opinion, but hey, they did it, and they got away with it.

 

[youngdisciplectl3]

Martial law? It couldn't be just for Christians..right? Martial law is when citizens take law into their own hands, at the government's approval... like they do after a natural disaster.

After Hurricane Andrew... it was all up to us to protect ourselves and our neighbors etc. Trust me, the National Guard drove around in jeeps with guns and NO ammo...and picked up any body (literally "body") that happened to have been shot or was otherwise dead...no questions asked.

Martial law is not against particulars...


However, if the law of the land is to be changed under the socialist government being ushered in... I will not live long... I am elderly and disabled. Mr Obama and his followers (Pelosi, Reed, etc) have already boldly stated that people like me need to quit taking from society and go home and die. Hmmm. (But what closet did I put that AK in.... ?

I hear ya. Look at what they did during Hurrican Katrina> took everyone's guns down there (atleast they gave them back I hear). Military went door to door and took their guns!!! Oh and they took so good care of the people they sent to Fema centers. Just about starved them to death and very unsanitary relocation. Just proved to me with the way they handled the victims of Katrina that I do not want the government "taking care of me."

 

[youngdisciplectl3]

drjean its sad whats going on in this country and the way our seniors are being treated.

 

[listed]

I have been very confused about what to do if America is ever faced with martial law and/or an oppressive dictatorship to where you can easily be labeled an enemy of the state and sought after to be indefinetly detained or killed.

Would it be a sin to protect myself and my family from unlawful arrest or being killed by a corrupted military under a dictatorship?

I know we are to obey authority but America isn't like Rome was. Our ultimate authority beside God is the constitution. And for there to be a dictator in America is to go against the supreme law of the land. Therefore to me, to disobey a dictator in America would be to obey the law of the land which is the constitution which states we have threats both foreign and domestic and forbids a dictatorship but gives us a division in powers, etc...

So lets say they start sending people off to camps like they did in the Holocaust, would it be wrong for me to pick up arms to protect me and my family from possible death, torture, rape, etc?

Now, perhaps I shouldn't bear arms if it becomes illegal to be a Christian, but rather flee into the wilderness, and if caught then surrender and assume it was God's will that I be found to be a martyr? Or once found, protect myself and my family by bearing arms even if they are seeking my arrest and death for being a Christian?

But if it has nothing to do with my religion, then am I ok to protect my life?

I take this very seriously and don't want to be wrong and be guilty of a great sin. Thank you all for your time. God bless.

I would give my life for Jesus. I'm not willing to give my life for what goes on in most churches these days.

I personally don't think Christians will see those days. Could be wrong though. I think I might change my mind about those things should I live when Muslim law becomes the law in the USA. It is projected to happen by 2035 if not sooner.

 

[Armistead14]

If killing others is showing them love and mercy, what would hating them be like?

Luke 6:27 (NASB)
27 "But I say to you who hear, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,

It's not a matter of hate, it's a matter of justice and protecting innocent.

If someone came in and was going to kill your family, would you show love why your kids were being killed?

God ordered mass killings in the OT and will eventually place billions of people in everlasting hell, is that love and mercy.......? There is a time for love and mercy and a time for justice.

 

[dollarsbill]

It's not a matter of hate, it's a matter of justice and protecting innocent.

If someone came in and was going to kill your family, would you show love why your kids were being killed?

Are you saying that God can't be trusted to protect us?

God ordered mass killings in the OT and will eventually place billions of people in everlasting hell, is that love and mercy.......? There is a time for love and mercy and a time for justice.

I agree, but God will be the one who decides justice. We cannot. We can only show mercy to the undeservling, as God has done to us.

 

[youngdisciplectl3]

I would give my life for Jesus. I'm not willing to give my life for what goes on in most churches these days.

I personally don't think Christians will see those days. Could be wrong though. I think I might change my mind about those things should I live when Muslim law becomes the law in the USA. It is projected to happen by 2035 if not sooner.

Yeah its hard to tell what the future will hold. I was taken by surprise when 9/11 happened thats for sure. Life is full of surprises. God is in control though.