Christian who commits suicide...

cg1970 · Nov 27, 2005

ChrisinMI said:
Where do they go? Heaven or Hell?? Is one sin more damning than another?? Isn't all sin bad regardless of how we 'rank' it in our society?

Once Saved, always saved?

Christians who commit suicide will go to heaven regardless. There is only one unforgivable sin.

AnthonyE1778 · Nov 27, 2005

based on the doctrine of Eternal Security it does not matter what sin the believer commits they are still going to heaven. If they are not saved they are going to hell. Simple as that.

JimfromOhio · Nov 27, 2005

Only question I have is that maybe this person was never saved in the first place. Maybe this person pretended to be a Christian. A Christian from the heart do not commit suicide. Apostasy always begins with the heart where a person is turning back which is deliberate and decisive. The heart of apostasy is whether a person was saved in the first place. In our hearts, are we in the world or in Christ. Slipping back into unbelief is very highly unlikely since Holy Spirit comes into our hearts and our faith begins in the heart which God have given us. Faith is a gift, whether a person actually "recieved" faith as a gift is the question. Anyway... that's just my thought on this issue.

Another thought is this, only GOD can judge who is truly a Christian so at this point, we leave this up to God alone.

seekingpurity047 · Nov 27, 2005

humbledbyhim said:
This is sinning, and denying yourself the right to repent in one shot. I think it's pretty clear that you dive straight into eternal damnation by committing suicide. Our lives are not ours to take remember. Christ owns them because he paid for each and every one of them... that was easy. Next question.

HumbledbyHim, do you know what repent means?

To the glory of God,

Randy

cwolf20 · Dec 1, 2005

Several years ago, a person that I always thought of as a strong Christian, a good example to others, and a happy person, committed suicide on Christmas Eve. She stuck a hose through the window of the car from the exhaust pipe. Her husband was at work at the time.

The family including the husband believes that suicide does not prevent a saved person from entering heaven.

Half of my home church believed otherwise though they talked about it in private.

The prayer I prayed after the funeral was "God. If it is true that Lee went to hell... then if it's possible, which with you all things are, please let her come back to life as a newborn baby. So she can have a second chance."

Actually the prayer was a little blunter than that... but that's what I meant. I felt a sense of peace after I prayed that.

I'm looking at a few possibilities. Keep in mind that I believe that she is ok.

1) She did go to heaven. God was just letting me know that I didn't have to have that conflict in my heart.

2) God answered my prayer.

of course, in both cases God answered my prayer. But you get my point on #2 *grin*

Some would call it blasphemous to believe #2. Yet, a prayer sent to God is a prayer sent to God. He listens.

the fact remains, that whether 1 or 2 is true, or 3 that she is in hell. I have faith that 1 or 2 came to pass. I don't need to have a conflict between them. The faith is there. God listens. I'll find out when I get to heaven which one of the two was the true action.

ScottBot · Dec 1, 2005

seekingpurity047 said:
And who declares what the mortal sins are? Well... according to the Roman Catholic Church, Thomas Aquinas defines to us the "7 deadly sins"... right....

There is only one sin that can send one to hell, and that's blaspheming the Holy Spirit (aka. the sin of Unbelief).

If a true believer in Jesus Christ committed suicide, he/she goes to heaven, HOWEVER, he/she does NOT get the great eternal rewards that he/she could have received had she persevered. For it is said:

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith, and this NOT of yourself, it is the gift of God, NOT of works, lest any man should boast. (Eph. 2:8-9)

It is also said in Romans 10:9

"... for if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

Our salvation is NOT based on works, EVER.

You say, as is the stance of the Roman Catholic church, that...

Salvation = faith + works

But this is incorrect, for according to scripture, the proper equation is....

faith = salvation + works

Read Phil. 2:12-13 to get my drift.

To the glory of God,

Randy

The Catholic Church correctly teaches that Salvation = an unmerited gift from God (also called grace). The church condemns those who teach that salvation is the fruit of good works.

ScottBot · Dec 1, 2005

The thought of taking one's own life is repugnant to anyone who has placed their faith and hope in Christ, because you realize that your life is not really yours, but rather a trust that God has temporarily given you to maintain stewardship of and you know that He expects you to take care of His property.

SPALATIN · Dec 1, 2005

QuantaCura said:
That was on justification, not salvation. John Paul II promulgated the catechism that specifically says those who die in a state of unrepented mortal sin go to Hell.

QC--

My cousin committed suicide almost 3 years-ago. He had been living a secret life where he was spending money that wasn't his, pretending to be wealthy when he wasn't. He was married and was taking trips with another woman. He had stolen money from a booster club that he ran to raise money for the football team he coached. Though we can't prove it we believe that he was living in a depression mode for quite some time and was unable to see the reality of his situation until it all came crashing in around him and he saw an opportunity and hung himself at a storage bin.

He was given a Christian burial in the Catholic church, even though he had committed suicide. Martin Luther did not condemn those who committed suicide because a vast majority of suicides are the result of depression.

My wife suffers from depression and if she goes for too long without her medication she is an emotional mess. Very few people commit suicide being of sound mind.

SPALATIN · Dec 1, 2005

JimfromOhio said:
Only question I have is that maybe this person was never saved in the first place. Maybe this person pretended to be a Christian. A Christian from the heart do not commit suicide. Apostasy always begins with the heart where a person is turning back which is deliberate and decisive. The heart of apostasy is whether a person was saved in the first place. In our hearts, are we in the world or in Christ. Slipping back into unbelief is very highly unlikely since Holy Spirit comes into our hearts and our faith begins in the heart which God have given us. Faith is a gift, whether a person actually "recieved" faith as a gift is the question. Anyway... that's just my thought on this issue.

Another thought is this, only GOD can judge who is truly a Christian so at this point, we leave this up to God alone.

Sorry Jim, I just don't buy it. Have you ever suffered from depression? Are you a Christian? To suppose that they were never a Christian in the first place puts you in a position of assuming what's in their heart. Apostasy is merely a human decision to reject God. It is the only decision we make in regards to spiritual matters.

You can't judge a person by the action of Suicide. Only God can. As Christians, we are simultaneously Saint and Sinner. Everyday we fall short of God's glory by our own merits. But thanks be to Christ for he died for those sins and forgives you when you confess the sin and ask for his forgiveness. true the person who kills himself can not repent here, but they will face judgement just the same as you and I and how do we know that God will not allow hime to ask forgiveness there.

Don't make assumptions about people and salvation. It is a dangerous practice and can lead to some theologically dangerous flaws.

artybloke · Dec 1, 2005

People who commit suicide usually do so because of long and sustained mental illness. Mental illness is a condition which affects many people, and they are not responsible for it, any more than they would be responsible for cancer. Why would anybody be condemned for something that is not their fault?

Some mental illness is curable, of course; but not all of it. It's a dangerous and life-threatening illness, not a sin.

Yusuf Evans · Dec 1, 2005

OK, from what I have seen so far on this thread, is that it's pretty much split between those who say they will burn in the lake of fire, and those that say the Lord will forgive them. Let me give you an incident of suicide that ought to trigger your thoughts, and let me know if you still stand behind your decisions.

"I'm leading my squad of Marines on patrol one day. Our point man, PFC Knucklehead, spots a platoon of the enemy ahead. We splilt up and set up an ambush for them. Once they are in range, we open fire on them. Next to me are my radio man, navigation man, and the corpsmen. All of a sudden, a grenade rolls into our area. The Navigator jumps on the grenade, thereby committing suicide in the act, but saves 3 other people from death. Will God send him to Hell for such a "damning" act, even this was suicide, and he made the decision to kill himself?"

No, I do not believe the Lord will send someone to Hell, simply because they committed suicide. Not one verse in the Bible says that one sin after repentence will be unforgiveable, nor is it any indication of that. So, if you are having sex outside of marriage and you have a heart attack and die, do you go to hell, simply because you were engaged in a sinful act, one of which is to bring self pleasure and is not in keeping with the Law of the 10 Commandments? Just a little food for thought.

ScottBot · Dec 1, 2005

christianmarine said:
OK, from what I have seen so far on this thread, is that it's pretty much split between those who say they will burn in the lake of fire, and those that say the Lord will forgive them. Let me give you an incident of suicide that ought to trigger your thoughts, and let me know if you still stand behind your decisions.

"I'm leading my squad of Marines on patrol one day. Our point man, PFC Knucklehead, spots a platoon of the enemy ahead. We splilt up and set up an ambush for them. Once they are in range, we open fire on them. Next to me are my radio man, navigation man, and the corpsmen. All of a sudden, a grenade rolls into our area. The Navigator jumps on the grenade, thereby committing suicide in the act, but saves 3 other people from death. Will God send him to Hell for such a "damning" act, even this was suicide, and he made the decision to kill himself?"

No, I do not believe the Lord will send someone to Hell, simply because they committed suicide. Not one verse in the Bible says that one sin after repentence will be unforgiveable, nor is it any indication of that. So, if you are having sex outside of marriage and you have a heart attack and die, do you go to hell, simply because you were engaged in a sinful act, one of which is to bring self pleasure and is not in keeping with the Law of the 10 Commandments? Just a little food for thought.

I sincerely hope not. The person's action was not to intentionally take his life, but rather to protect the lives of those around him. Christ said, "Noone has greater love than this, that he is willing to lay down his life for his friends."

I was a corpsman for 15 years, and Navy Hospital Corpman have more Metals of Honor than any other group because we were willing to do this very thing for our patients, fellow sailors, and Marines.

Yusuf Evans · Dec 1, 2005

Scott_LaFrance said:
I sincerely hope not. The person's action was not to intentionally take his life, but rather to protect the lives of those around him. Christ said, "Noone has greater love than this, that he is willing to lay down his life for his friends."

I was a corpsman for 15 years, and Navy Hospital Corpman have more Metals of Honor than any other group because we were willing to do this very thing for our patients, fellow sailors, and Marines.

Yep, you guys are a life saver, but I love the fix-all method for pain-Moultrin.

ScottBot · Dec 1, 2005

christianmarine said:
Yep, you guys are a life saver, but I love the fix-all method for pain-Moultrin.

We call it vitamin M for short.

billwald · Dec 1, 2005

Christians who commit suicide want to be with Jesus more than they want to live this life. Others fight like hell to keep from going to be with Jesus

Yusuf Evans · Dec 1, 2005

Scott_LaFrance said:
We call it vitamin M for short.

LOL 800mg, that's all it takes

ScottBot · Dec 1, 2005

billwald said:
Christians who commit suicide want to be with Jesus more than they want to live this life. Others fight like hell to keep from going to be with Jesus

Been reading the account of the Albigensians, haven't you?

cwolf20 · Dec 1, 2005

who?

Scott_LaFrance said:
Been reading the account of the Albigensians, haven't you?

Affinity · Dec 1, 2005

QuantaCura said:
That was on justification, not salvation. John Paul II promulgated the catechism that specifically says those who die in a state of unrepented mortal sin go to Hell.

Justification is part of salvation, along with sactification and glorification.

Affinity · Dec 1, 2005

ChrisinMI said:
Where do they go? Heaven or Hell?? Is one sin more damning than another?? Isn't all sin bad regardless of how we 'rank' it in our society?

Once Saved, always saved?

Jesus said you will know a tree by it's friuts. Personally, I think that suicide is a fairly strong example of bad fruit. And bad fruit means bad tree. Also, take a look at some examples from scripture. An example of a fairly bad tree that commited suicide would be Judas, and I think that scripture makes it pretty clear where he went, as Peter put it "He went to be with his father, the devil". Saul more or less commited suicide. Elijah wanted to die, but didn't go so far as to actually even attempt killing himself. So to sum up, my opinion would be that suicide is a fairly clear, if not totally 100% clear, indication of a person being lost.

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