Christian Preppers - a new forum!

[Jaxxi]

I would agree! Good post

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/allusions-in-revelation-from-old-testament.7588850/





.

How can one view the Old Testament as the New Testament concealed and the New Testament as the Old Testament revealed? What religion is that? Since the timeline is of 3400 years respectively, what is said by Jesus is not in the Old Testament, nor are the sacrificial practices of the Old Testament in the NewTestament. See what I get out of a lot of what is being done and why all comes back to Adam. I regret that the Book of Adam and Eve was removed from the Bible because so many questions are answered when reading it. The last shall be first and the first shall be last. Adam will be the last human soul to enter heaven at the end of the age and The Bible does not emphasize how much God loves Adam. Is it possible that we have it wrong because of Satan that Adam was the Son of God because He calls Jesus Son of Man. Jesus was born of the flesh but what about Adam? Him being the first man, was not HE the Son of God? I know what the Bible says...just think about that for a minute.

 

[pat34lee]

Pat, as a messianic believer I understand your cultural hold on the Old Testament. However, that covenant had one purpose, to show our inability earn our own righteousness through works. And it was given to one family, Israel, not the gentiles. Paul makes it clear in Romans that the law was given as a ministry of condemnation (5:16, 18 & 8:1)and the writer of Hebrews shows that the New Covenant was a better covenant.

Which brings me back to my earlier point in this thread. We should not look to justifying violence for self defence based upon the Old Testament as Christians. It was pointed out by another commentator that Jesus said that there was a time to sell your garments and buy swords (Luke 22:36), but he also said to Peter after he cut off the servant's ear, that those who live by the sword will die by the sword (Matt. 26:52). So my question remains, where is the line?

Finally, I find it annoying when people jump into a conversation without listening long enough to know what the topic is and comment on their favorite pet peeve. At least show that you know what the conversation is by commenting on that topic first, then toss in your pet peeve. I did not start this thread. The thread is on Prepping. I merely began a topic within that topic of the 2nd amendment and where does a Christian Prepper stand on the use of guns for prepping.

There is currently no new covenant, but that is a topic covered in other threads.

The line depends on who you think you are defending yourself from. There is no defense
if you are thinking government. God places all rulers for a purpose. Sometimes that
purpose is to deal judgment among the people, whether individually good or bad.

You should be prepared to defend your family and friends, but your first defense is always
God. If you are saved, it doesn't matter if you live or die. If you aren't saved, nothing you
do will help you.

Finally, I was responding to something needing to be corrected. If you type a nice post, yet
somewhere in it say the moon is green cheese, I'm going to skip the rest and go for the
problem area.

There is only one God from Genesis to Revelation, shown progressively as man needed to
learn more about him. God does not change. All that changes is how much we know of him.

 

[End Times Mama]

This could be very interesting. I have been following the preppers movement for a while and have done a small amount of preparation myself, such as getting a generator for power outages, composting for small farming and looking into getting a solar roof from elon musk. One of the issues I am debating is the fire arms. Many preppers are not necessarily Christian, but are patriots and big supporters of the 2nd amendment. I am still wrestling with this point because I read the teachings of Jesus to be one of non-resistance. I would love to hear about other believer's point of view on this matter.

I can understand that view and I think that patriotism and glorification of violence are inconsistent with Biblical teachings. However Christ did tell his disciples to sell what they had and buy swords, and Paul tells us as much as lies with us to leave peaceably with all men. All things are lawful after all, and there's a difference between keeping firearms for home security as you would pepper spray or an alarm system and stockpiling enough munitions to equip a small army. If we rely on the police we rely on firearms to protect us, and the 2nd amendment is about protecting the populace from tyranny which as much as I am not a patriot I can still appreciate

 

[D2wing]

This is a big question and has many aspects. I think we must each decide for ourselves. We know what is coming. Is it a sin to be a soldier? No, this is made clear when Jesus healed a Roman soldier and a Commander's daughter. Also there is a commandment for soldiers. In the US we are allowed to have guns for any purpose we want and were expected to for mutual defense by our founders. On the other hand some sects will not bear arms but depend totally on God's protection. Which is right, who protects who?
I was sworn to protect my country as a soldier. There is no end date. I made the decision to kill if needed long ago. But I am having second thoughts. I think either is ok depending on your point of view. I believe we protect each other this way. Either way is lawful. I am not afraid to die but so far I intend to defend myself, but depending on what happens I might surrender my life peacefully like our Egyptian brothers.

 

[Skycastle]

This could be very interesting. I have been following the preppers movement for a while and have done a small amount of preparation myself, such as getting a generator for power outages, composting for small farming and looking into getting a solar roof from elon musk. One of the issues I am debating is the fire arms. Many preppers are not necessarily Christian, but are patriots and big supporters of the 2nd amendment. I am still wrestling with this point because I read the teachings of Jesus to be one of non-resistance. I would love to hear about other believer's point of view on this matter.

I'm of the camp that doesn't believe the Bible requires us to be pacifists. Nehemiah used weapons to defend the city while the wall was being built. And Jesus said:
“But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.” (Luke 22:36)

Even C.S. Lewis, one of the most brilliant Christian apologists who ever lived, didn't believe that Christians need to be pacifists. So feel free to buy guns and ammo to defend your family in the dangerous times to come. I believe economic collapse and societal chaos are coming here to the USA, and Christians should prepare.

 

[AlexDTX]

I'm of the camp that doesn't believe the Bible requires us to be pacifists. Nehemiah used weapons to defend the city while the wall was being built. And Jesus said:
“But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.” (Luke 22:36)

Even C.S. Lewis, one of the most brilliant Christian apologists who ever lived, didn't believe that Christians need to be pacifists. So feel free to buy guns and ammo to defend your family in the dangerous times to come. I believe economic collapse and societal chaos are coming here to the USA, and Christians should prepare.

There are many who agree with you, Skycastle. And I certainly know the scriptures you quoted. However, my point of view is that we are to let the Lord defend us. That defence is determined by the leading His Spirit. The psalmist said that the horse is prepared for battle, but the battle belongs to the Lord. We have a responsibility on our part, even though we are still trusting God for the outcome of the battle. What the Lord will lead us to do will depend on our history. I have never owned a gun nor do I know how to shoot one. David, when facing Goliath, refused the armour of Saul because he had never used it before. Instead, he trusted God with what he did know how to use - slingshot and stones. However God defends me it will be according to my knowledge and ability.

Jesus also said if you live by the sword you will die by the sword. I think that is a statement of sowing and reaping. I never learned martial arts because I felt I would have to use it if I knew it. I don't want to die by gunshot. I think it would be worthwhile to define what a pacifist really is. Dictionaries are poor sources of definition because they only state how a word is used or has been used. I am thinking more in terms of the philosophy of pacifism.

Lastly, how much preparation is enough? That would be a good question for the prep forum.

 

[trailblazer50]

At the end of the age I believe the Lord has called us up to fight. We are to fight for our right to be Christians and not take it lying down. Thats why He says in Joel 3:10 " Beat your plowshares into swords and your pruning hooks into spears. Let the weakling say I am strong! Come quickly all you nations from every side and assemble there. Bring down your warriors O LORD!"
That is concerning The Day of the LORD. or Corintheans 2 10:4....(its not in front of me and i dare not misquote it) but the answer lies there too. And of course wear the Armor of God because those are the best weapons!!

the last days began at the time of jesus. paul talks in eph. 6:11 about putting on the full qarmor of god. first of all, this "whole aromor" is defined in the greek as "panoplia" and means" everything needed to win the fight". second, this is a spirtual battle. and there are precautions we can and should take to physically protect ourselves.

 

[Jaxxi]

the last days began at the time of jesus. paul talks in eph. 6:11 about putting on the full qarmor of god. first of all, this "whole aromor" is defined in the greek as "panoplia" and means" everything needed to win the fight". second, this is a spirtual battle. and there are precautions we can and should take to physically protect ourselves.

I fully agree and i believe Armageddon will be where the spiritual fight will meet the physical in a battle like the world has never known.

 

[David4223]

Okay everyone, please take this discussion to an appropriate forum -- the announcements forum is only for announcements

 

[AlexDTX]

Your wrestling will end when you follow >
Revelation 3:20
“Look! I have been standing at the door, and I am constantly knocking. If anyone hears me calling him and opens the door, I will come in and fellowship with him and he with me.

Have fellowship with Jesus and He will answer your specific question.
Remember Christ is a warrior also >
Revelation 19:12-14Living Bible (TLB)

12 His eyes were like flames, and on his head were many crowns... 13 He was clothed with garments dipped in blood, and his title was “The Word of God." 14 The armies of heaven.... followed him on white horses.

Arms to protect your life, arms to protect family...The question is should we all lay down in front of our enemies and the Lords enemies and allow the eradication of His Presence and Holy Spirit through us thereby allowing our enemy to conquer and win? If this is not allowed in the Spirit realm then why in the natural?

The question is do we trust in the arm of the flesh or in the Holy Spirit to defend us? The answer is somewhere in between since we are called to prepare the horse for battle, but the battle belongs to the Lord (Prov. 21:31).

 

[AlexDTX]

How can one view the Old Testament as the New Testament concealed and the New Testament as the Old Testament revealed? What religion is that? Since the timeline is of 3400 years respectively, what is said by Jesus is not in the Old Testament, nor are the sacrificial practices of the Old Testament in the NewTestament. See what I get out of a lot of what is being done and why all comes back to Adam. I regret that the Book of Adam and Eve was removed from the Bible because so many questions are answered when reading it. The last shall be first and the first shall be last. Adam will be the last human soul to enter heaven at the end of the age and The Bible does not emphasize how much God loves Adam. Is it possible that we have it wrong because of Satan that Adam was the Son of God because He calls Jesus Son of Man. Jesus was born of the flesh but what about Adam? Him being the first man, was not HE the Son of God? I know what the Bible says...just think about that for a minute.

The topic is preparation. Your comment is irrelevant to the topic.

 

[AlexDTX]

There is currently no new covenant, but that is a topic covered in other threads.

If the other threads conclude that only one covenant was made, i.e., a Messiah who would die for all our sins, then I agree.

The line depends on who you think you are defending yourself from. There is no defense
if you are thinking government. God places all rulers for a purpose. Sometimes that
purpose is to deal judgment among the people, whether individually good or bad.

Then Cory Ten Boom and Raul Wallenberg were wrong to rescue the Jews from Nazi Germany? I think not.

You should be prepared to defend your family and friends, but your first defense is always
God. If you are saved, it doesn't matter if you live or die. If you aren't saved, nothing you
do will help you.

My first defense is always God. Agreed.

Finally, I was responding to something needing to be corrected. If you type a nice post, yet
somewhere in it say the moon is green cheese, I'm going to skip the rest and go for the
problem area.

Who made you the "correction" police?

There is only one God from Genesis to Revelation, shown progressively as man needed to
learn more about him. God does not change. All that changes is how much we know of him.

Yes, God can not change, but how God has dealt with man did change. There was no law from Adam to Moses. The Mosaic law was given to a specific family, Israel, not the gentiles. God gives grace to Jew and Gentile through the death and resurrection of Christ. The changing factor is mankind.[/quote]

 

[AlexDTX]

Okay everyone, please take this discussion to an appropriate forum -- the announcements forum is only for announcements

I thought this was the Preppers forum. My apologies.

 

[David4223]

I thought this was the Preppers forum. My apologies.

No worries! The forum is located here -- http://www.christianforums.com/forums/christian-preppers.1230/

 

[Jaxxi]

The topic is preparation. Your comment is irrelevant to the topic.

My comment is relevant to what this person said...was it not?

 

[David4223]

My comment is relevant to what this person said...was it not?

Please read my message -- you can discuss it in the actual forum

 

[FreeinChrist]

Keep in mind that the Christian Prepper forum is not for discussing whether or not to prep. It is to discuss how to prep.

Keep in mind that this is about hurricanes, tornados, power grid failures and floods and things like that - it is not just about apocalypse, if at all

 

[pat34lee]

Who made you the "correction" police?

2 Timothy 4:1-3
1 I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom:
2 preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction.
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires.

Also, read about the duties of the watchman in Isaiah and Ezekiel.

Yes, God can not change, but how God has dealt with man did change. There was no law from Adam to Moses. The Mosaic law was given to a specific family, Israel, not the gentiles. God gives grace to Jew and Gentile through the death and resurrection of Christ. The changing factor is mankind.

No. God has been the same with us from the beginning. Adam knew the law. So did Noah.
Adam must have taught his children, who taught theirs, etc.

The Mosaic law was given to everyone, not just Israel. There was a mixed multitude there
to receive it right along with them. Several times in Exodus and Leviticus, we are told that
there is to be one law for Israel and for the stranger living with them. We are to observe
the feasts of the Lord (not Jewish feasts like some call them), rest on the Sabbath and eat
clean food.

Isaiah 66:17 is talking about the end times, and the destruction of those who do not
follow the law, including eating pork and other abominations.

 

[FreeinChrist]

MOD HAT

Folks, this is just an announcement forum and is not for theological debate.

I am closing this.