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Christian hate & insanity
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<blockquote data-quote="Curious Atheist" data-source="post: 60363223" data-attributes="member: 291697"><p>Firstly I have two important questions, the first being why you need proof to disprove God first. I know you understand my point already but I dont think you have answered why you will believe in God until you are satisfied he does not exist and not the other way around? As I dont think they are equally reasonable arguments based on what we have discussed so far (whilst you have dismissed other beliefs without the same proof you expect to disprove the Christian God). </p><p> </p><p> The second is why do you base your beliefs on an assumption that a finite universe requires supernatural explanation? I am not going to attempt to rebuke any proposed theories like Hawkins radiation as I am not knowledgeable enough on the subject. However, considering there has never been a problem that has led to the supernatural as being the most likely explanation, why do you think it is most likely for this problem? Although as you mention that is one of many theories and indeed we could be part of a multi-verse, infinite parallel dimensions of space/time or a 4D universe with one dimension of lateral time etc so there really are many, many, things we do not know. But again filling these gaps in scientific understanding isnt narrowing down the truth, it is an assumption. I have crazy theories I think up to explain time, that I send to my brother who is in his fourth year of his physics degree. Thus far he hasnt understood what the dickens I am talking about, so I would be silly and a tad arrogant to just assume I am right until someone understand my ramblings and destroys their merit.</p><p> </p><p> From a different angle though my main point I would like to make is that even if the gaps in knowledge are indeed filled with God, your argument still doesnt hold. What I mean is, that you arguing for a supernatural force being the creator of the universe and almost the fabric that holds it all together, which some also describe as God <em>being</em> the universe. I cant dispute this although it is a less likely answer than other theories. But the main point is that there is a huge gap between the outside chance of a gap filled with God, and a being with a personal interest in our lives. If this creator is indeed controlling the entire universe and all of its billions of galaxies, what makes you think that it is a consciousness that seeks out intelligent life in order to pretend it doesnt exist, whilst guiding them through a tiny portion of time? If this being did indeed want to create life, it would not need an entire universe filled with very little other than burning gas dotted about would it? Or maybe it does, who knows (irony) but do you see the huge looming gap between an unexplained pre-universe question and a God that sent his son to Earth to die for our sins, who then changed his mind and decided not to be dead anymore? So inevitably you are basing your beliefs on the Bible, which with your education you can easily find flaws in. So then you cherry pick parts, but you could be doing this with the Koran if you were born in the middle-east or otherwise. So I know I have repeated many points, but I think they are valid ones.</p><p> </p><p> But anyway, I dont think either of us is going to change our minds on subjects we have both clearly put thought in to. So I in no way see us as being opposites, but have concluded things in different ways and probably conclude the other is less open-minded. But the real dangers I see in religion are those like the wonderful post you replied to (which I thought was an ironic joke!) which shows such ignorance it is cringe worthy. I dislike it when people blindly follow things and act on them based only on a lack of education and understanding, although stupidity can be found in every creed. Or base their morals on a 2000 year out-of-date rule book which is then consulted on subjects like stem cell research or cloning and only vague hints are followed (a timeless deity could have been a bit more specific). But anyway, if all of these things didnt affect anyone I wouldnt really mind, but when climate change and habitat destruction is ignored due to pig-headed rejection or major problems ignored because Jesus is returning soon, so who cares then I admit I really do wish religion would just disappear from the world and wish more people preferred education to wishful thinking.</p><p> </p><p> (ps here is an article I cant remember if I posted earlier, but very relevant to your post <a href="http://www.astrobio.net/pressrelease/4695/the-molecule-that-made-the-universe" target="_blank">Astrobiology Magazine</a>)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Curious Atheist, post: 60363223, member: 291697"] Firstly I have two important questions, the first being why you need proof to disprove God first. I know you understand my point already but I dont think you have answered why you will believe in God until you are satisfied he does not exist and not the other way around? As I dont think they are equally reasonable arguments based on what we have discussed so far (whilst you have dismissed other beliefs without the same proof you expect to disprove the Christian God). The second is why do you base your beliefs on an assumption that a finite universe requires supernatural explanation? I am not going to attempt to rebuke any proposed theories like Hawkins radiation as I am not knowledgeable enough on the subject. However, considering there has never been a problem that has led to the supernatural as being the most likely explanation, why do you think it is most likely for this problem? Although as you mention that is one of many theories and indeed we could be part of a multi-verse, infinite parallel dimensions of space/time or a 4D universe with one dimension of lateral time etc so there really are many, many, things we do not know. But again filling these gaps in scientific understanding isnt narrowing down the truth, it is an assumption. I have crazy theories I think up to explain time, that I send to my brother who is in his fourth year of his physics degree. Thus far he hasnt understood what the dickens I am talking about, so I would be silly and a tad arrogant to just assume I am right until someone understand my ramblings and destroys their merit. From a different angle though my main point I would like to make is that even if the gaps in knowledge are indeed filled with God, your argument still doesnt hold. What I mean is, that you arguing for a supernatural force being the creator of the universe and almost the fabric that holds it all together, which some also describe as God [I]being[/I] the universe. I cant dispute this although it is a less likely answer than other theories. But the main point is that there is a huge gap between the outside chance of a gap filled with God, and a being with a personal interest in our lives. If this creator is indeed controlling the entire universe and all of its billions of galaxies, what makes you think that it is a consciousness that seeks out intelligent life in order to pretend it doesnt exist, whilst guiding them through a tiny portion of time? If this being did indeed want to create life, it would not need an entire universe filled with very little other than burning gas dotted about would it? Or maybe it does, who knows (irony) but do you see the huge looming gap between an unexplained pre-universe question and a God that sent his son to Earth to die for our sins, who then changed his mind and decided not to be dead anymore? So inevitably you are basing your beliefs on the Bible, which with your education you can easily find flaws in. So then you cherry pick parts, but you could be doing this with the Koran if you were born in the middle-east or otherwise. So I know I have repeated many points, but I think they are valid ones. But anyway, I dont think either of us is going to change our minds on subjects we have both clearly put thought in to. So I in no way see us as being opposites, but have concluded things in different ways and probably conclude the other is less open-minded. But the real dangers I see in religion are those like the wonderful post you replied to (which I thought was an ironic joke!) which shows such ignorance it is cringe worthy. I dislike it when people blindly follow things and act on them based only on a lack of education and understanding, although stupidity can be found in every creed. Or base their morals on a 2000 year out-of-date rule book which is then consulted on subjects like stem cell research or cloning and only vague hints are followed (a timeless deity could have been a bit more specific). But anyway, if all of these things didnt affect anyone I wouldnt really mind, but when climate change and habitat destruction is ignored due to pig-headed rejection or major problems ignored because Jesus is returning soon, so who cares then I admit I really do wish religion would just disappear from the world and wish more people preferred education to wishful thinking. (ps here is an article I cant remember if I posted earlier, but very relevant to your post [url=http://www.astrobio.net/pressrelease/4695/the-molecule-that-made-the-universe]Astrobiology Magazine[/url]) [/QUOTE]
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