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Chirality

mark kennedy

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Please watch this video all the way through before commenting on it.

Go to Youtube and search for chirality and ppsimmons and watch the video all the way through before commenting.

Thank you, Challagar

I assume you can't post a link because you don't have enough posts yet.

The Devastation of Evolution - Chirality (Evolution is a "Catastrophic Failure") by ppsimmons

I get what he is saying but for clarification amino acids with specified complexity, including chirality, are the building blocks of life:

hgpdnaaminoacid.jpg

It's a great video though, I'll post it to the Resource Thread.

Grace and peace,
Mark
 
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CryptoLutheran

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Evolution describes the process of organic adaptation through mutation over many generations.

Evolution does not say, specifically, how life initially began. Evolution, as an explanation for the diversity of organisms on Earth and how those organisms have adapted to fill niches in a multitude of environments is a working, functioning and satisfactory theory.

For a scientific theory to work does not require that every question have a definite answer. In order for theories regarding the orbit of planets and the functions of gravity does not require every minute facet of the physics involved be fully understood in order for the theory to work. As long as a theory fits with the available data and observation--consistently--it is a working and functioning theory.

I am not a scientist. I am not an expert on biology, genetics or chemistry; but I like to think that I have a basic working knowledge of how science operates. The fatal flaw that I see in this video--without a wealth of information on the topic itself--is that it presumes that because without a working knowledge of the origins of life on earth therefore the theory of evolution fails. That demonstrates a defunct understanding of science and particularly on theory of evolution. How life began is not essential to the observable data that consistently demonstrates evolution as a working, natural and biological mechanism behind the diversity and adaptability of life on planet earth.

Swing.
And.
Miss.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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mark kennedy

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Thank you for your assistance. :)

For all who might watch that video, I also recommend tuning into ppsimmons' channel and watching more similar videos. I am in no way affiliated with ppsimmons. I just enjoy their videos and want to share them with others.

Will do, keep an eye on the resource thread and you'll start seeing his videos added when I get to it.

Grace and peace,
Mark
 
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Kennesaw42

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Evolution (shorthand here for "the neo-Darwinian theory of biological evolution by random mutation and natural selection") is a discredited, failed theory. If Darwin were alive today, he would be the first to admit that what we now know about just the cell, for example, completely demolishes his original theory.
Evolution does not explain how new functions, new kinds of tissue, new organs, or new abilities (such as a spider making a web for the first time, and on and on, ad nauseum) develop. Random mutation simply does not work, and front-line biologists know very well that it doesn't.
There are no "transitional species," of which Darwin said there should be an abundance, and evolution has no viable explanation as to why not.
If higher life forms kept emerging as a result of survival (of the fittest), then why do the forms from which they supposedly developed persist?
Evolution has no answer to the problem of mathematical probability: When you consider the millions of species, plant and animal, and how they flourish in dependence on each other, with flora replenishing the oxygen depleted by the respiration of fauna, with bees providing a pollination mechanism essential to many plants, etc., etc., etc., the probability that this all developed by chance, as a result of random mutation and "natural selection" (there's a rabbit out of the hat for you), is 1/N, where N is a super-astronomical number which is greater than the number of all the atoms in the universe!
Evolution doesn't even come close to having satisfactory answers to such questions as: How did gender develop? How did the wondrously complex and diverse forms of eyes develop? How did consciousness develop? How did what we nonchalantly call "instincts" (many of which are enormously complex, such as the honey bees dance to communicate where to go for nectar) develop? How did ageing and death come into the picture (particularly as longevity/immortality would seem to be crucial to "survival")? And how did man develop, with powers of reasoning and other abilities that are so far superior to those of any other creature as to make laughable the idea that this yawning gap could be accounted for by anything short of an infinite number of so-called missing links?
Nor can evolution account for the staggering improbability that we just lucked out to be on a planet with all of the myriads of properties necessary to sustain life, the lack of any one of which would have made life on earth untenable, that earth just happens to be in an ideal orbit around an ideal star, or that all of the physical constants (gravitational forces, nuclear forces, magnetic forces, speed of light, etc.) just happen to be precisely those required to sustain physical reality.
Now can evolution explain how it is supposedly able to fly in the face of the second law of thermodynamics, the scientific law that demands that the flow in any closed system is from order to chaos, with increasing entropy, not chaos to order.
Evolutionists cannot cite for us one single instance in what we blithely call "nature" where chaos (randomness) produced order (and not one clear case of where a random mutation was beneficial to the organism). (By the way, that moth business whereby English moths supposedly changed color to make them less visible to their natural predators (which would simply be a case of change within a species anyway) has been completely debunked, just as has the philosophically preposterous theory of recapitulation, still taught in schools despite the fact that no serious biologist has accepted this fanciful idea for over half a century.)
Evolution, while being the product of (albeit misguided, imo) rational thought, teaches that that very rationality on which it is purportedly based is itself merely a fortuitous transformation (over millions of years) of molecules in some primordial goop. In other words, give some goop enough time and eventually it will develop the ability to account for itself! Quite a feat.
Evolutionists are, in a way, romantics, though, holding that "time heals all wounds." In other words, no matter what the problem or objection or difficulty, just mix enough time into the equation and all is resolved.
But that's not only hopelessly "romantic," it's also hopelessly fanciful. Not only does it defy the second law of thermodynamics, but all of human experience too. Time is not a force, not a mechanism, not an engine, not a vehicle. Time doesn't do anything, except move inexorably on.
So, if time is t and chaos (disorder) is k, then, no matter the value of t, kt = k, and never never k + alpha.
So what is the engine that drives evolution? There simply is no such engine. Worms are happy being worms; they do not long to be salamanders. And molecules constituting primordial goop are "happy" with their unsynthesized, disorganized states. There simply is no force available in "nature" for sustaining any kind of tendency toward a higher level of organization.
You may say, "Well, okay, but it happened anyway, as all the evidence points, so we don't need any force or engine."
Sorry, but all the evidence does not so point, no matter how many times this incantation is made. Evolutionists are supposed to be scientists who "follow wherever the evidence leads." But is this what they really do? I don't think so. Evolutionists are human, subject to human emotion, subject to temptation. And I believe that the overwhelming temptation is to start from where they want the evidence to lead, and then work backwards, with eyes only for "evidence" thought convenient to their preconceived theory. I believe that the overwhelming temptation is for them to turn a blind eye to the overwhelming evidence that is inimical, not to say lethal, to their theory. And if they don't succumb to these temptations, then they run enormous risks of censure from their colleagues in the academic community who are adamantly indisposed to brook any heretical diversion from the accepted orthodoxy.
Which brings me (happily) to my final point: Evolution, as espoused today, the de rigour philosophy of academia, the media, the educational bureaucracy, has about it many aspects that cannot be called other than religious. Evolution is a religious dogma, capable of generating religious fervor in its adherents that is qualitatively no different that any other fundamentalist fervor.
 
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Challagar

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Evolution describes the process of organic adaptation through mutation over many generations.

Evolution does not say, specifically, how life initially began. Evolution, as an explanation for the diversity of organisms on Earth and how those organisms have adapted to fill niches in a multitude of environments is a working, functioning and satisfactory theory.

In truth, it is a satisfactory explanation for diversity of [correction: within, not "of"] species. But it is only satisfactory in explaining how groups of the same species adapted to their environment, not how one species sprang up from another species. For example, a wolf is adapted to the wilds, but it is still a dog. Many have bred dogs to develop certain characteristics, but the result is always a dog, never a cat or pig or horse.

For a scientific theory to work does not require that every question have a definite answer. In order for theories regarding the orbit of planets and the functions of gravity does not require every minute facet of the physics involved be fully understood in order for the theory to work. As long as a theory fits with the available data and observation--consistently--it is a working and functioning theory.
It is Interesting that you should mention consistency. The fact (and I dare say FACT because it is true) is that much evidence is not consistent with evolution, and much of what they consider to be consistent with their belief is only consistent because they say it is consistent.

For example, Ken Miller's "debunking" of Michael Behe's argument for irreducible complexity. His argument is totally off the wall since the example he uses of a "precursor" system that is functional without more than half the parts of the irreducibly complex system doesn't even have the same function, or even remotely similar function, to the system in question! His sole basis for calling it a precursor system is "similarity," nothing more.

A precursor system for a flagellum of a sperm cell would have the same function as the flagellum--to propel the sperm cell along its path to inseminate the egg. A "syringe" of a malicious virus has no such function. (I won't even mention that Ken totally misrepresents Behe's claims because it is irrelevent to the facts he presents, which fail on their own merits, or should I say "demerits?") [correction: I should have said: "I won't even discuss", not "I won't even mention"...I clearly did mention it but I meant that I wouldn't go into a lengthy explanation of his misrepresentation...there is plenty of documentation on the web about it and I would happily provide a link or two but I am unable to post links yet]

The origin of genders is also incompatible with the evolutionary concept. Not only is it also an irreducibly complex system, but it is also far less efficient than asexual reproduction. The whole idea behind evolution is survival of the fittest. Sexual reproduction, though clearly not impossible for survival, is resistant to survival.

There are so many things that can go wrong with it. It is a marvel that it has been as successful as it has.

First, the species must have an instinct to procreate. How can this instinct develop over generations? Without it, procreation is extremely unlikely. How many times must a male and female procreate accidentally before it becomes an inherited instinct? Of course, in the case of humans, we can say that they discovered the pleasure of sexual intercourse and encouraged their progeny to emulate them. However, many species go by instinct alone, pleasure having little to do with the act of copulation.

This also bring up another question? Why would it necessarily be a pleasurable experience? What about all the procreation that took place before the pleasurable aspect of sex came into play? When did pleasure and sex become practically synonymous?

Second, it is biologically intricate, on the most fundamental and irreducibly complex way. From the instinct to procreate to sexual desire to stimulation to lubrication to the stiffening of the penis to the process of [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] to the journey of the sperm on its way to inseminate the egg to the distribution of the genes to DNA replication through the process of DNA sequencing via the RNA molecule which has the primary purpose of recreating DNA base pairs one by one in a specific sequence to the development of the embryo to birth.

Sorry for such a long, awkward sentence, but I did it to make a point. The point is that developing this process over time is not only unlikely but impossible because of its extreme complexity. The male and female reproductive systems are separate and distinct yet completely dependent upon each other. (Even in the case of artificial insemination since sperm can only be produced one way and a sperm cell without an egg would be absurd.)

Third, it is much more inefficient than asexual reproduction. Is not survival of the fittest very much dependent upon the efficiency of procreation? In other words, if a system of reproduction were inefficient it would soon (relatively speaking) be replaced by a system that is far more efficient, and therefore more fit.

Yet, despite all these facts that are inconsistent with evolution, scientists continue to search for the "holy grail" of the origin of species. But the more they search the more stumbling blocks present themselves.

Another example is the existence of microbiological machinery in the cell. Scientists in Darwin's day understood the cell to be a simple construct of protoplasm, or more simply put, a blob of goo. Science has developed so much since then. We now know that the cell is extremely complex and is itself an irreducibly complex system in its own right.

If you doubt the irreducible complexity of it, just study it for yourself. You will find many molecular nano-machines that perform all the functions necessary for the cell's growth and maintenance. Each is dependent upon all the rest and if any system within the cell is absent then a breakdown of the whole cell would occur.

I am not a scientist. I am not an expert on biology, genetics or chemistry; but I like to think that I have a basic working knowledge of how science operates. The fatal flaw that I see in this video--without a wealth of information on the topic itself--is that it presumes that because without a working knowledge of the origins of life on earth therefore the theory of evolution fails. That demonstrates a defunct understanding of science and particularly on theory of evolution. How life began is not essential to the observable data that consistently demonstrates evolution as a working, natural and biological mechanism behind the diversity and adaptability of life on planet earth.
The evolutionary "bible," The Origin of Species, by Charles Darwin, has the very word "origin" in it. Many text books discuss the origin of life, or, more truthfully, preach the origin of life. They state it as fact, not theory.

You can hardly have a discussion about evolution without the origin of life eventually entering into it. If the origin of life is irrelevant to the study of evolution then why do so many scientists devote their time in trying to use evolutionary principles to discover an explanation for it. Or, worse, use it to state it as fact to our children.

I see no fatal flaw in the video. It was produced to address this concern of using evolution to explain the origin of life. Whereas evolution has its place in the perspective of changes within species, it finds itself on slippery ground when it tries to go beyond the adaptation and genetic variations of species.

---------
I could ramble on and on, but I believe that Kennesaw42 gave plenty of information to uphold my argument without me trying to add too much to it.
 
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Greg1234

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For example, Ken Miller's "debunking" of Michael Behe's argument for irreducible complexity. His argument is totally off the wall since the example he uses of a "precursor" system that is functional without more than half the parts of the irreducibly complex system doesn't even have the same function, or even remotely similar function, to the system in question! His sole basis for calling it a precursor system is "similarity," nothing more.
Indeed. The parts of the flagellum which were taken away did not have an effect on the functionality of the secondary system, but they were still irreducibly complex. Its similar to removing all the "non-essential parts" of a car and then say that the lights still work.. Creationwiki writes,
What now? Has Miller disproved Behe's notion of irreducible complexity? It sure seems like he has - at first glance anyway. However, what Miller seemingly fails to consider is that the function of flagellar motility is still irreducibly complex regardless of other subsystems functions are or are not maintained with various flagellar system reductions. Without a sizable number of specifically arranged protein parts the function of flagellar motility cannot exist. In fact, all systems of function are irreducibly complex. It doesn't matter if subsystem function is maintained. This is like arguing that the motility function of an automobile is not irreducibly complex because the lights still work even if the engine or tires or drive shaft are removed.

But seeing that the subsystems were functional, this was used as an outright refutation of irreducible complexity. What they actually did, by highlighting the interaction of systems and its subsystems, is show just how complex flagella are. When Behe advanced his mousetrap example, Miller et al, set out to show that they could make a four piece mousetrap a three piece mouse trap etc. But there are some fundamental, and quite blatant, inconsistencies with these examples. For one, they had to manipulate the function after it had been degraded which is an example of intelligent design. Another is the fact that manipulation would take place up-stream when the flagellum is being put together, not when it is beng taken apart. This is where the actual complexity is. Building a flagellum, not degrading an already made flagellum.

YouTube - The Mousetrap and Irreducible Complexity

Irreducible complexity doesn't stand on its own however, and represents only one scientific argument against Darwinism. In fact, it is not even as potent as the other arguments against Darwinism but Darwiin did make that quote. If he had any idea of how complex and functionally integrated biological systems were he may not have said it. Today, it is relatively easy to find an irreducibly complex system and it might be the sheer simplicity of showing irreducibly complex systems, which makes irreducible complexity "to good to be true".
 
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mark kennedy

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“If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ existed, which could not possibly have been formed by numerous, successive, slight modifications, my theory would absolutely break down.” (Darwin, On the Origin of Species)​

How about all of them, not just complex organs but basic cellular organells?

This is the one that I like, universal common ancestry would indicate that these two cells had a common ancestor. The trouble is that at major transitions the most basic parts of living systems are never accounted for. The theory of evolution need not explain how the information in DNA came into existence by naturalistic means. So out of nowhere and with no directly observed or demonstrated mechanism life emerges and that is where evolution begins. This population of single celled organisms develop the organells of the cell and develop an increasingly complex and high specific series of sequences. Then by some mysterious, presently unknown, molecular mechanism the basic cells of multicellular organisms develop into their highly specialized categories.

What could the common ancestor of these two highly specialize and very different cells have had in common?

hgpplantcell.jpg


300px-Average_prokaryote_cell-_en.svg.png


Ok, after that giant leap the cellular architecture of plants and bacteria develop in all their vast array. Then another, unaccounted for, giant leap in nature occurs with the emergence of the eukayrote cells that would again differentiate into the animalia cells

DWA%205%20eukaryote.jpg

No explanation, no molecular mechanism for this, no empirical evidence that it is even possible. Then by the same naturalistic process that is covered with the clutch phrase of natural selection (as opposed to divine fiat) the basic cells organize into the major phylum (thirty-five phyla of forty) and many new subphyla (between 32 and 48 of 56 total) within a 5 to 10 million year period, about 500 million years ago. Do note that's after 3 billion years of stasis (periods of no change).

To say that the fauna of the Cambrian period appeared in a geologically sudden manner also implies the absence of clear transitional intermediate forms connecting Cambrian animals with simpler pre-Cambrian forms. And, indeed, in almost all cases, the Cambrian animals have no clear morphological antecedents in earlier Vendian or Precambrian fauna (Miklos 1993, Erwin et al. 1997:132, Steiner & Reitner 2001, Conway Morris 2003b:510, Valentine et al. 2003:519-520).​

Intelligent Design: The Origin of Biological Information and the Higher Taxonomic Categories

This happens at every major transition at crucial levels of adaptive evolution. The real problem is the concept of DNA as information in 'specified complexity', a concept introduced by Francis Crick describing the DNA double helix. The DNA of single celled organisms are far simpler the the more developed higher taxonomic catagories:

Studies of modern animals suggest that the sponges that appeared in the late Precambrian, for example, would have required five cell types, whereas the more complex animals that appeared in the Cambrian (e.g., arthropods) would have required fifty or more cell types. Functionally more complex animals require more cell types to perform their more diverse functions. New cell types require many new and specialized proteins. New proteins, in turn, require new genetic information. Thus an increase in the number of cell types implies (at a minimum) a considerable increase in the amount of specified genetic information. Molecular biologists have recently estimated that a minimally complex single-celled organism would require between 318 and 562 kilobase pairs of DNA to produce the proteins necessary to maintain life (Koonin 2000). More complex single cells might require upward of a million base pairs.​

Creationists were the first to bring out the problems with the emergence of life and the Cambrian explosion. These days the Intelligent Design movement has managed to repeat and build on these arguments. For me the real problem with evolution, as a Bible believing Christian, is the evolution of man from apes. My problem with it has a lot to do with the fact that redemptive history has stood up to every test of authenticity applied to it.

While that is my main reason for remaining unconvinced of TOE as natural history there is another fundamental problem with it. The human brain had neither the time nor the means to have made the three fold expansion from that of apes.

nature01495-f2.2.jpg

There are some pretty basic reasons why this makes no sense. For instance, the directly observed and demonstrated effects of mutations in brain related cells and systems cause disease and disorder every single time.

When Mendel did his pea plant experiments that became the foundation for the Laws of Inheritance he was looking at things like, size, shape, texture...etc. When it comes to vital organs there are no molecular mechanisms capable of making the overhaul of the requite genes involved.

Again, this would have happened, very suddenly about 2.5 million years ago with the transition from Homo habilis (the mythical tool making apeman) and Homo erectus.

For us to have evolved from apes it would have required an accelerated evolution of brain related genes. The evolution of the human brain would have had to start it's accelerated evolution on a molecular basis some 2 million years ago and within Homo Erectus (considered human by most creationists) would have had a brain size twice that of the Austropihicene and early Hominids:

Early Ancestors:

A. Afarensis with a cranial capacity of ~430cc lived about 3.5 mya.
A. Africanus with a cranial capacity of ~480cc lived 3.3-2.5 mya.
P. aethiopicus with a cranial capacity of 410cc lived about 2.5 mya.
P. boisei with a cranial capacity of 490-530cc lived between 2.3-1.2 mya.
OH 5 'Zinj" with a cranial capacity of 530cc lived 1.8 mya.
KNM ER 406 with a cranial capacity of 510cc lived 1.7 million years ago.​

(Source: Smithsonian Human Family Tree)

Homo Erectus Skulls:

Hexian 412,000 years old had a cranial capacity of 1,025cc.
ZKD III (Skull E I) 423,000 years old had a cranial capacity of 915cc.
ZKD II (Skull D I) 585,000 years old had a cranial capacity of 1,020cc
ZKD X (Skull L I) 423,000 years ago had a cranial capacity of 1,225cc
ZKD XI (Skull L II) 423,000 years ago had a cranial capacity of 1,015cc
ZKD XII (Skull L III) 423,000 years ago had a cranial capacity of 1,030cc

Sm 3 >100,000 years ago had a cranial 917cc
KNM-WT 15000 (Turkana Boy) 1.5 million years ago had a cranial capacity of 880cc

(Source: Endocranial Cast of Hexian Homo erectus from South China, AMERICAN JOURNAL OF PHYSICAL ANTHROPOLOGY 2006)

Homo habilis that would have lived. 2.5–1.5 mya with a cranial capacity of ~600 cc. The next link would have been Homo erectus with a cranial capacity of ~1000cc. KNM-WT 15000 (Turkana Boy) would have lived 1.5 mya and the skeleton structure shows no real difference between anatomically modern humans. The skull while smaller then the average cranial capacity of humans but close to twice that of his ancestors of 2 mya.

That means for our ancestors to have evolved it would have required a dramatic adaptive evolution of the size just under 2 mya sandwiched between two long periods of relative stasis. One such gene would have been the HARf regulatory gene involved in the early development of the human neocortex from 7 to 19 gestational weeks. With only two substitutions allowed since the common ancestor of the of 310 mya the divergence between humans and chimpanzees indicates 18 substitutions as early as 2 mya. (Nature, vol. 443, no. 7108, pp. 167-172 September 14, 2006)

The next in the long line of evolutionary giant leaps are the Neanderthals who had a cranial capacity 10% greater then our own. The explanation seems obvious to me, the apes and humans were originally bigger and had genomes with far fewer mutations then modern ones. Evolutionists are simply taking prehistoric chimpanzees and passing them off as human ancestors because they are bigger and better developed then modern ones.

Think I'm exaggerating, consider this. The 6 million years of chimpanzee evolution is represented in the fossil record by three teeth and that's it. Human ancestors on the other hand have literally hundreds of fossils attributed to our lineage.

It's as simple as that, they simply assume naturalistic causes and no matter what the evidence is they organize it around their a priori assumption of universal common descent.

Darwinian evolution is either disproven or an unconditional a priori (without prior) assumption. My personal opinion, it's both.

Grace and peace,
Mark
 
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miamited

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Hi guys,

Hey I appreciate all the video links. As a believer who has long since concluded that, despite what the whole earth of people may believe, God created this entire realm of creation; all the planets, stars, plants and animals to provide a place for us to live, about 6,000 years ago from nothing. It just makes God all the more awesome in His love and mercy, when one considers the awesome power at His disposal and yet He delivered to us His very own Son that we might kill him in our place. What a God we serve.

God bless you all.
In Christ, Ted
 
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