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Let me repeat. You did not ask whether I was an SDA pastor. The question as posed was designed to offend. If you picked up that type of questioning along the way you would be well advised to return it.ideas about faith and doctrine is so unlike an Adventist trained pastor. Thats why I asked if you are a SDA pastor. If I crossed lines I had no right to cross, I apologise.
AT
Unless you are suggesting the CF wrote his profile, your question calls into question his integrity. You've now stated that was not your intention - so water under the bridge - let's move on.And whats the cut? Can you ask a simple question around here? If he is or if he's not, whats so hard about that question? I honestly don't see what the problem is. So maybe one of you three quys can tell me.
AT
Let me repeat. You did not ask whether I was an SDA pastor.
Originally Posted by Adventtruth
This has become the nature of his posting....typical at the least.sentipente wrote:
I'm even having a hard time understanding how this person can be a Adventist pastor.
AT
Big deal. It just shows that your present understanding is lacking. No problem. We all have to grow.
Originally Posted by sentipente
Big deal. It just shows that your present understanding is lacking. No problem. We all have to grow.AT wrote:
Ok Pastor sentipente....please help me in my understanding of the two text...Eph 2:8 and John 3:16. How are they not saying the samething? OR are you not a pastor contrary to your profile?
The question as posed was designed to offend. If you picked up that type of questioning along the way you would be well advised to return it.
Eph. says we are saved by grace, John says we are saved by love. It is obvious they are referring to different experiences.
To simply latch on to words would miss the meaning.
Salvation is not an act of grace; it is an act of love.
Honor, position and prestige are acts of grace.
God had not choice but to save the human race. He could not refuse to do so. The love of God constrains both us and Him.
scripture clearly says you are saved by grace by faith, but that is not good enough for you. Why is that? There is not contradiction betwen Jesus and Paul. It means you just have not done your home work.Please explain what you believe is unreasonable.
If you believe Paul made no errors then you must know something Paul didn't. You may have the luxury of ignoring the meaning of terms; I don't.scripture clearly says you are saved by grace by faith, but that is not good enough for you. Why is that? There is not contradiction betwen Jesus and Paul. It means you just have not done your home work.
I bow out of this, I want no more of this conversation. it is unreasonable and ridiculouse. It is also off topicIf you believe Paul made no errors then you must know something Paul didn't. You may have the luxury of ignoring the meaning of terms; I don't.
Just say it's too big for you. No loss of face.I bow out of this, I want no more of this conversation. it is unreasonable and ridiculouse. It is also off topic
you aren't worth itJust say it's too big for you. No loss of face.
I mark my value by the price the Creator of the Universe was willing to pay for me. You have every right to disagree with Him.you aren't worth it
Grace does not automatically flow from love. Love does not require me to bestow unmerited favor on anyone nor does the bestowal of unmerited favor indicate a loving relationship.
Love dictates how I will relate to those I love.It leaves me no choice.
If I should refuse to rescue my child then I have failed to be a good parent. But I am under no obligation to buy him a car. That would be an act of grace.
I don't see how you can conclude that God being constrained by His love shifts the emphasis from Him to us. IAE, we are because of Him. We are His express image. When He loves us He is merely loving Himself.
don't we allI mark my value by the price the Creator of the Universe was willing to pay for me. You have every right to disagree with Him.
AT, what is a mere human? You seem to wish to define the Creator to fit with your dogma.
Grace does not automatically flow from love. Love does not require me to bestow unmerited favor on anyone nor does the bestowal of unmerited favor indicate a loving relationship.
Hence, you do not ask whether this view of the Creator is true but whether it will lead to a conclusion, i.e. universal salvation, that you refuse to accept.
God had not choice but to save the human race. He could not refuse to do so. The love of God constrains both us and Him.
Human salvation is not yours to give but you certainly have convinced yourself that you can define its terms and conditions.
because christians believe the story without questioning if the story is true... once internalized its next to impossible to believe otherwise.... christians recite the explanation that it was the "blood of Christ" and his sacrifice that saved us.... was there something magical about his blood? Was sin so devastating that Christ could not save us while living? Are we to believe that it took a God/human sacrifice to save humanity? Questions like those are likely to get one branded as all kinds of things, rather than being answered....Paul did not know the Creator better then I can. Thankfully he admitted that he only saw through a glass darkly. The advantage of using humans as an example in this discussion about the Creator is because we are capable of being less than He is and that is good for illustrative purposes. Humans are the center. We are the apple of His eye. He is willing to sacrifice His kingdom for us. How can you not be persuaded of how important the human race is. Matt. 1:20 declares we are all His people "for He shall save His people" from their sins.
I do find it curious that when Christians find two passages that give conflicting messages they prefer to use the one that works against the interest of the entire human race. Why do we exhibit so much self-hatred when the Creator has declared how much He loves the entire race?
why can't it be both?i would like to apeal to the mod to purge this thread. it is so off topic. the topic is changing the purpose of the forum. not a theological discussion
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