Chained to the melody

[chriscomplex]

I can't just make that guess! .. We should be able to figure it out though.

You said that you found my response to be unexpected. Why is it that you don't understand why you found it to be unexpected? Did you expect my response to be somewhat different? If so, can you explain how my response was different to your expectation?

I don't know why you were breaking out in prayer.

 

[Serving Zion]

I don't know why you were breaking out in prayer.

What do you remember about the thoughts you were referring to when you wrote Post #9?

 

[chriscomplex]

What do you remember about the thoughts you were referring to when you wrote Post #9?

Total mental breakdown! Actually I was recalling the memories of my old faith and my mind was playing tricks on me.

 

[Serving Zion]

Total mental breakdown! Actually I was recalling the memories of my old faith and my mind was playing tricks on me.

Why does it surprise you that a Christian should pray for you at that time? Is it more about the content of the prayer that was unexpected? If so, can you quote those pieces?

 

[chriscomplex]

Why does it surprise you that a Christian should pray for you at that time? Is it more about the content of the prayer that was unexpected? If so, can you quote those pieces?

Do you really need this, it was a fine prayer. But after reading it, the scripture (Bible verse)

"Be not like the hypocrites, who pray on the streets to be heard by men"

Popped into my head, and I had to fight it off for fear of posting it in the room and offending you.

 

[Serving Zion]

Do you really need this, it was a fine prayer. But after reading it, the scripture (Bible verse)

"Be not like the hypocrites, who pray on the streets to be heard by men"

Popped into my head, and I had to fight it off for fear of posting it in the room and offending you.

Nawww man, that came from my heart for you, awwww so sad... why did you read it and apply that judgement to it? Why did you not read it as coming from my heart for you?

 

[Serving Zion]

Do you really need this, it was a fine prayer. But after reading it, the scripture (Bible verse)

"Be not like the hypocrites, who pray on the streets to be heard by men"

Popped into my head, and I had to fight it off for fear of posting it in the room and offending you.

Do you know what I see in this? Two counts that you really do not know love:

1. Fear of praying in public, because it breaks the rules. But there is no fear in love.
2. Love is not easily offended.

This leads me to further observe: He who doesn't know love doesn't know God, for God is love.

 

[chriscomplex]

Nawww man, that came from my heart for you, awwww so sad... why did you read it and apply that judgement to it? Why did you not read it as coming from my heart for you?

Old hold over beliefs.

 

[chriscomplex]

Do you know what I see in this? Two counts that you really do not know love:

1. Fear of praying in public, because it breaks the rules. But there is no fear in love.
2. Love is not easily offended.

This leads me to further observe: He who doesn't know love doesn't know God, for God is love.

I love just fine.

 

[Serving Zion]

Old hold over beliefs.

Have you recovered from your break down? Is there a risk of recurrence? Would it benefit to talk details of that?

 

[chriscomplex]

Have you recovered from your break down? Is there a risk of recurrence? Would it benefit to talk details of that?

There's heaps of things I'd like to talk about, but I would most likely be banned for discussing them.

 

[Serving Zion]

I love just fine.

This is not true though, and you have deceived yourself by believing it. If you were loving just fine then you would be cooperating with me to find the reason that you cannot accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior so that you can contribute toward the world a greater knowledge of the truth regarding His campaign.

Rather, you are giving incomplete and vague answers as refusal to reveal what is really in your heart, and your response to a prayer that is given in love was to assume that it was given of pride.

You continue to operate on this forum in pretence - posing as one who is asking with sincere intent, but really you are goading Christians to engage with you and having no intention to cooperate with us to achieve what we are intending to achieve with you. In this way, you are using deceit as a means to make fun of people who genuinely care about you.

Real love is when you do to others as you would have done to you. We would like you to support us in our pursuit to increase faith and knowledge of truth, and to be honest and contrite regarding a topic that involves the shedding of blood.

 

[Serving Zion]

There's heaps of things I'd like to talk about, but I would most likely be banned for discussing them.

I am sure you would not be banned for posting a list of topics. I would quite like to know what you had in mind. Thank you!

 

[chriscomplex]

This is not true though, and you have deceived yourself by believing it. If you were loving just fine then you would be cooperating with me to find the reason that you cannot accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior so that you can contribute toward the world a greater knowledge of the truth regarding His campaign.

Rather, you are giving incomplete and vague answers as refusal to reveal what is really in your heart, and your response to a prayer that is given in love was to assume that it was given of pride.

You continue to operate on this forum in pretence - posing as one who is asking with sincere intent, but really you are goading Christians to engage with you and having no intention to cooperate with us to achieve what we are intending to achieve with you. In this way, you are using deceit as a means to make fun of people who genuinely care about you.

Real love is when you do to others as you would have done to you. We would like you to support us in our pursuit to increase faith and knowledge of truth, and to be honest and contrite regarding a topic that involves the shedding of blood.

I love just fine in a non Christian related way.

It's not something I'm deluding myself into, other people notice it. Not that it matters, but it's nice to know.

 

[chriscomplex]

There's heaps of things I'd like to talk about, but I would most likely be banned for discussing them.

My next thread will be

"Can someone love others without Jesus?"

 

[food4thought]

I know that when people come to the foot of the cross, it's usually because they know they are broken. They realize that they are sick, and hurting.
But when does that change? I'm asking this because I see so many Christians still hurting and confused, and they still remain sick and broken.

Why doesn't it seem that their new faith has made them whole? They say they are free, but they are still in chains.

Hi Chris. When someone realizes they are broken and comes to the cross, a transaction takes place where their sins are forgiven them by God, and God now sees them as perfectly righteous before Him. Yet the consequences of their past sins still remain on earth. As the Scripture says: "Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap." (Galatians 6:7) But after salvation that person has an opportunity to sow to the Spirit, and avoid future consequences for their future sins.

Also, salvation occurs in a moment, but takes a lifetime to work out in time. People go through the process called sanctification, where their old nature is slowly (usually) changed into a new nature in the image of Christ through the work of the Holy Spirit within them. Even Paul took years to become the great missionary to the gentiles that we all have heard about. Some things will change immediately if there is a true conversion, but many things must be worked out in time. This is how a Christian eventually becomes whole.

Hope this helps;
Mike

 

[chriscomplex]

Hi Chris. When someone realizes they are broken and comes to the cross, a transaction takes place where their sins are forgiven them by God, and God now sees them as perfectly righteous before Him. Yet the consequences of their past sins still remain on earth. As the Scripture says: "Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap." (Galatians 6:7) But after salvation that person has an opportunity to sow to the Spirit, and avoid future consequences for their future sins.

Also, salvation occurs in a moment, but takes a lifetime to work out in time. People go through the process called sanctification, where their old nature is slowly (usually) changed into a new nature in the image of Christ through the work of the Holy Spirit within them. Even Paul took years to become the great missionary to the gentiles that we all have heard about. Some things will change immediately if there is a true conversion, but many things must be worked out in time. This is how a Christian eventually becomes whole.

Hope this helps;
Mike

It's fine, but it doesn't answer the question to why Christian can't become whole by their faith. And why they still struggle with issues they should have conquered through the deliverance process.

 

[food4thought]

It's fine, but it doesn't answer the question to why Christian can't become whole by their faith. And why they still struggle with issues they should have conquered through the deliverance process.

Faith is not magic "easy button" that makes all your troubles go away. As I said, these things take time for most people.

 

[aiki]

It's their faith that makes them whole right? So do these Christians not have real faith in Jesus? He only said a tiny amount of faith would cure you, so I'd expect that lots of Christians would be made whole.

It's our faith that makes us whole? No. It's what our faith is in that makes us whole. Having faith in a rock, or a mound of dirt, or some bread mold to make me whole isn't going to work. Only those in Scripture who had faith, who trusted, in Christ were made spiritually - and sometimes physically - whole.

Do Christians not have real faith in Jesus? Many of them don't. Perhaps a majority. That's because most of them merely exercise intellectual assent, rather than saving faith, in Christ. What's the difference? The apostle James explains,

James 2:19-20
19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe--and tremble!
20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?

Real, saving faith expects, or aims at, a corresponding effect in behaviour. It's one thing to agree that wearing a life-jacket can save you from drowning when out boating; it's another to believe it will save you and then actually put the life-jacket on even when its hot, and looks a bit goofy, and all those around you are using their life-jackets as seat cushions. Simply agreeing to the truth of the life-jacket's effectiveness in saving you from drowning is intellectual assent; going beyond acknowledgement of this truth to taking action based on that truth is, according to the apostle James, "saving faith." The majority of "Christians" acknowledge that Jesus is God and the Saviour of all men (and women), but precious few of them shape their lives in accord with this truth. They hold a belief about Jesus, but they have no intention of fully conforming their lives to it. They want heaven by-and-by, but not Christ as Saviour and Lord over them right now. As James points out, such belief is no more than what demons possess.

He only said a tiny amount of faith would cure you, so I'd expect that lots of Christians would be made whole.

A tiny amount of the right kind of faith, in the right thing (that would be Jesus) can reconcile a rebellious, wayward sinner to God. Many Christians these days, though, have been encouraged into what has come to be called "easy believe-ism." Simply pray a prayer of acceptance of Jesus and you're in God's family. And many have. But there is no confession of, and repentance from, sin; no counting the cost of taking up the cross of Self-sacrifice in emulation of Christ and then doing so; no understanding of the new life in Jesus; no surrender to God; no love of God, only a desire for the eternal life He offers. But this isn't the Gospel of Salvation that the Bible teaches; such a prayer ignorant and/or careless of these other things does not obtain salvation for anyone.

Selah.

 

[Serving Zion]

I love just fine in a non Christian related way.

It's not something I'm deluding myself into, other people notice it. Not that it matters, but it's nice to know.

You can not approach Jesus though, until you have learned to love in a Christian way, and that demands forgiveness (Matthew 6:14-15).

At this stage, I will not press harder toward you but I would like to give for a second reading, the wisdom that you did briefly receive in post #6:

"Also it can be said that the time that we depart from The Holy Spirit and begin resisting the truth, over time that spirit destroys our character and corrupts our knowledge. This ties in well with John 10:10."