Catholicism wrong?

[Llauralin]

Thsi is pretty interesting - it's always splendid to see threads where people can seek commonalities and understanding and not bicker about everything!

The more I talk to all of y'all, the less difference I see. Do you know that we also do not depend on Sola Scriptura? We are an independent church meaning we have no affiliation with say the Southern Baptist Convention. Our little church rules itself. However, on a much smaller scale, there is a similar accountability in our church that you have in the entirety of Catholicism. For example, if our pastor were to begin preaching a strange gospel, we have the power to eject him. Same goes with anyone else in the church. A good example would be a member who went to our pastor and confessed that he was gay. Our pastor talked to him at great length but the guy was unrepentant. He said that he was going to continue in his lifestyle that up until that moment he had kept hidden. Our pastor told him that he had no choice but to remove him from the membership of our church.

Do you know you pretty much just described excommunication?

 

[Lisa0315]

Thsi is pretty interesting - it's always splendid to see threads where people can seek commonalities and understanding and not bicker about everything!


Do you know you pretty much just described excommunication?

Yes, sort of. We have restoration as well. Like if this same guy had come back and repented, he would have been received back. Likely, my pastor would have asked him to go before the whole church and confess his sin. We would have then lined up and one by one shook hands with him or hugged him to receive him back. That did not happen in this case, but it has happened before. There was a guy who cheated on his wife. When he got caught, he realized just how far sin had taken him. His wife would not take him back. So, the guy would come and sit in the very back of the church. He was as faithful as could be. He demonstrated in any way that he could that he was truly sorry including getting up in front of the whole church. Eventually, his wife forgave them and they are back together now.

 

[WarriorAngel]

I think y'all are Baptist and don't know it!

Of course, I prefer real, but I have real every single day. He is in my heart.

Let me ask you something. What would happen if I went to a Catholic church and received the Eucharist? Would I automatically be allowed to do this? Or do I have to be Catholic first? (Assuming I have the guts to walk into a Catholic church without having a clue what to do)

I dont wish to presume, but it seems to me that God is leading you to Catholicism, by alot that you have said.

Anyway, as I said previously, we commit damnation upon ourselves by receiving Communion unworthily.

And it is not just that you are protestant, but we need instruction b4 we can receive.
EVEN kids who are preparing to receive for the first time are instructed.

Someone who wishes to fully participate must fully be in membership to the Church so they fully comprehand the Eucharist.

And you can attend Mass any time you like. Most likely no one will question you, maybe not even notice you....and just follow what everyone else does, like kneeling or standing or sitting.

You do not have to sing if you do not like, or say the prayers...[which are beneficial so why wouldnt anyone?]

You can do everything BUT receive Communion.
Which you can receive if you are Catholic.

IT is that IMPORTANT.

IT is the Lord.

And it seems He is calling you.....and is leading you. So perhaps go and see.

Peace!!

 

[Lisa0315]

I dont wish to presume, but it seems to me that God is leading you to Catholicism, by alot that you have said.

Anyway, as I said previously, we commit damnation upon ourselves by receiving Communion unworthily.

And it is not just that you are protestant, but we need instruction b4 we can receive.
EVEN kids who are preparing to receive for the first time are instructed.

Someone who wishes to fully participate must fully be in membership to the Church so they fully comprehand the Eucharist.

And you can attend Mass any time you like. Most likely no one will question you, maybe not even notice you....and just follow what everyone else does, like kneeling or standing or sitting.

You do not have to sing if you do not like, or say the prayers...[which are beneficial so why wouldnt anyone?]

You can do everything BUT receive Communion.
Which you can receive if you are Catholic.

IT is that IMPORTANT.

IT is the Lord.

And it seems He is calling you.....and is leading you. So perhaps go and see.

Peace!!

No, I am not being called to be Catholic. Mainly because of the doctrine of infallibility. It would have been only to satisfy my curiosity which I have an infinite supply.

Anyway, thanks for everything. I have really enjoyed talking to all of you..

Lisa

 

[WarriorAngel]

No, I am not being called to be Catholic. Mainly because of the doctrine of infallibility. It would have been only to satisfy my curiosity which I have an infinite supply.

Anyway, thanks for everything. I have really enjoyed talking to all of you..

Lisa

Curious, why is it that Jesus leaving a leader who He would keep from erring a bad thing?

And I enjoyed talking with you as well.

 

[Lisa0315]

Curious, why is it that Jesus leaving a leader who He would keep from erring a bad thing?

And I enjoyed talking with you as well.

I didn't say it was a bad thing. I just said that I didn't believe in it. Peter did make mistakes, you know. They are well documented. However, it was my understanding that it was not the pope who was infallible, but doctrine.

 

[Carrye]

However, it was my understanding that it was not the pope who was infallible, but doctrine.

Correct. If a person were infallible, he/she would be without sin.

 

[GQ Chris]

so let me get this straight, if I'm not mistaken the official vatican statement of beliefs declare that the pope is infallible?

 

[Carrye]

so let me get this straight, if I'm not mistaken the official vatican statement of beliefs declare that the pope is infallible?

You are mistaken. The pope himself is not infallible. The pope can, under certain circumstances, speak infallibly on issues of faith and morals.

 

[GQ Chris]

When I asked my father about being a Catholic or Protestant Christian, he said that Catholics don't do right in following the Bible and what the Lord has commanded of us.

Reasons:

- They use rosary beads in their worship, and in the Bible God frobids that. He used the golden calf as an example, and said that God expects us to worship him through out heart and souls alone.

- The priest they call father that you confess to he was also talkinga bout, and how once Jesus came that whole structure was abolished with priests and clergy, so there's another thing that isn't right.

- Another big thing he said was that no where in the Bible does it say to pray to Blessed Virgin Mary, yet they do.

Does his arguments he presented to me have any validity?

The Bible commands us as Christians to honor our parents and obey them. Your father sounds like a good man, if I were his son, I would obey him.

 

[GQ Chris]

You are mistaken. The pope himself is not infallible. The pope can, under certain circumstances, speak infallibly on issues of faith and morals.

So when he "speaks" he is infallible, that seems to imply that if he can do that, he is infallible in other ways...

 

[Carrye]

So when he "speaks" he is infallible, that seems to imply that if he can do that, he is infallible in other ways...

When he speaks he is not infallible. He can, under limited conditions, speak infallibly (what he speaks is infallible, not the man himself).

 

[ScottBot]

So when he "speaks" he is infallible, that seems to imply that if he can do that, he is infallible in other ways...

The charism of infallibility is very narrow in application and only applies to dogmatic proclamations of faith or morals when speaking as the head of the Church, period. He is not a prognosticator, nor is he incapable of grave immorality. He is just prevented by an intercessory act of the Holy Spirit from actively teaching error with regard to the Gospel.

 

[Skripper]

***Moderator Post***

Well, I was really trying very hard to not have to put on my "moderator hat," so to speak. But, apparently I must, at least briefly.

We (staff) have extended a certain leniency in this thread to our visitor, Lisa. But please, don't mistake the leniency that has been extended as a sort of "general invitation" for non-Catholics to come into OBOB and attempt to debate/debunk Catholic teaching. Because that's not the case, and it will not be permitted. Just because we have opted to extend this leniency to Lisa, who has been exemplary in her posting style and questioning of certain Catholic teachings, please don't get the wrong impression and interpret this thread as some sort of general invitation for a free-for-all where non-Catholics will be permitted to enter and make this a wholesale debate on Catholic teachings by non-Catholics . . . . because that will not be permitted. So . . . we can continue as we have been . . . or, we can tighten things up a bit and take a more narrow view of the rules . . . the choice is yours. Personally, I'd prefer option one.

 

[WarriorAngel]

I didn't say it was a bad thing. I just said that I didn't believe in it. Peter did make mistakes, you know. They are well documented. However, it was my understanding that it was not the pope who was infallible, but doctrine.

AS I said b4, and has been mentioned again, the Pope himself is not perfect. Just as Peter was a sinner, so are the Popes.
BUT in order for the Church to remain in truth, the Holy Spirit keeps the Pope from teaching in error.

IF the Pope were to teach in error, then we would all lose truth.
WHICH cannot happen, because then the gates of hell would prevail.

See, it is unity of the Church built by Christ and the Holy Spirit that works in the doctrines so we maintain truth.

We need a leader, and in order for them to lead without erring, the Pope keeps Tradition as it always was, with respect to 'outlining' it for the faithful without passing on error.

Does this help??

 

[Lisa0315]

AS I said b4, and has been mentioned again, the Pope himself is not perfect. Just as Peter was a sinner, so are the Popes.
BUT in order for the Church to remain in truth, the Holy Spirit keeps the Pope from teaching in error.

IF the Pope were to teach in error, then we would all lose truth.
WHICH cannot happen, because then the gates of hell would prevail.

See, it is unity of the Church built by Christ and the Holy Spirit that works in the doctrines so we maintain truth.

We need a leader, and in order for them to lead without erring, the Pope keeps Tradition as it always was, with respect to 'outlining' it for the faithful without passing on error.

Does this help??

Yes it does help. Everything you have written has helped. I think you will find me an ally from now on, still Baptist, but definitely a Catholic ally.

 

[Carrye]

I think you will find me an ally from now on, still Baptist, but definitely a Catholic ally.

Understanding, not agreement, sister. That's always the goal.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Yes it does help. Everything you have written has helped. I think you will find me an ally from now on, still Baptist, but definitely a Catholic ally.

That's really cool. Thanks for taking the time to really listen.

 

[Lisa0315]

Understanding, not agreement, sister. That's always the goal.

Yep, and I owe you a big hug too! You were great in your answers as well.

See y'all around.

Lisa

 

[EllenMoran]

Yes, sort of. We have restoration as well. Like if this same guy had come back and repented, he would have been received back. Likely, my pastor would have asked him to go before the whole church and confess his sin. We would have then lined up and one by one shook hands with him or hugged him to receive him back. That did not happen in this case, but it has happened before. There was a guy who cheated on his wife. When he got caught, he realized just how far sin had taken him. His wife would not take him back. So, the guy would come and sit in the very back of the church. He was as faithful as could be. He demonstrated in any way that he could that he was truly sorry including getting up in front of the whole church. Eventually, his wife forgave them and they are back together now.

Lisa-


It didn't look like anyone else touched on this - I just wanted to clarify that this is another point of similarity. Excommunication is a call to repentance, and if that person does repent, they can be received back into communion with the Church.

Glad you've found this thread helpful!