Can you explain?

[isshinwhat]

Yes, JS. There is a Consecration at every Mass but the Good Friday Liturgy. Even at that one, though, we share Communion that was consecrated at the Holy Thursday Mass.

Catholic theology doesn't say with any certainty that any particular interpretation of Revelation is the right one. All it does say is the Church will undergo a great trial in the future, and there will be an anti-Christ who will be overcome at Christ's glorious return. That being said, we do believe that the book of Revelation is both Apopolyptic and Liturgical in scope. We believe it speaks of both a literal end of days, and the Eucharistic celebration that has been carried on for ages. Thus each Consecration is a coming of the Lord that we are to celebrate, but it is not the Great Second Coming where he will take his faithful to himself.

God Bless,

Neal

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Today at 02:14 PM isshinwhat said this in Post #21 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=665389#post665389)

Yes, JS. There is a Consecration at every Mass but the Good Friday Liturgy. Even at that one, though, we share Communion that was consecrated at the Holy Thursday Mass.

Catholic theology doesn't say with any certainty that any particular interpretation of Revelation is the right one. All it does say is the Church will undergo a great trial in the future, and there will be an anti-Christ who will be overcome at Christ's glorious return. That being said, we do believe that the book of Revelation is both Apopolyptic and Liturgical in scope. We believe it speaks of both a literal end of days, and the Eucharistic celebration that has been carried on for ages. Thus each Consecration is a coming of the Lord that we are to celebrate, but it is not the Great Second Coming where he will take his faithful to himself.

God Bless,

Neal

Neal-

So there is actual teaching on a "Great Second Coming" by the Church?

 

[isshinwhat]

Yep.

673. "Since the Ascension Christ's coming in glory has been imminent,[Cf. Rev 22:20.] even though 'it is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has fixed by his own authority.'[Acts 1:7 ; Cf. Mk 13:32 .]. This eschatological coming could be accomplished at any moment, even if both it and the final trial that will precede it are 'delayed'.[Cf. Mt 24:44 ; 1 Th 5:2 ; 2 Th 2:3-12 .]"

674. "The glorious Messiah's coming is suspended at every moment of history until his recognition by 'all Israel', for 'a hardening has come upon part of Israel' in their 'unbelief' toward Jesus.[Rom I 1:20-26 ; cf. Mt 23:39 .] St. Peter says to the Jews of Jerusalem after Pentecost: 'Repent therefore, and turn again, that your sins may be blotted out, that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, and that he may send the Christ appointed for you, Jesus, whom heaven must receive until the time for establishing all that God spoke by the mouth of his holy prophets from of old.'[Acts 3:19-21 .] St. Paul echoes him: 'For if their rejection means the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead?'[Rom 11:15 .] The 'full inclusion' of the Jews in the Messiah's salvation, in the wake of 'the full number of the Gentiles',[Rom 11:12, 25 ; cf. Lk 21:24 .] will enable the People of God to achieve 'the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ', in which 'God may be all in all'.[Eph 4:13 ; 1 Cor 15:28 .]"

675. "Before Christ's second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers.[Cf. Lk 18:8 ; Mt 24:12 .] The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth[Cf. Lk 21:12 ; Jn 15:19-20 .] will unveil the 'mystery of iniquity' in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth. The supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist, a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of his Messiah come in the flesh.[Cf. 2 Th 2:4-12 ; 1 Th 5:2-3 ; 2Jn 7 ; 1Jn 2:1 8, 22 .]"

676. "The Antichrist's deception already begins to take shape in the world every time the claim is made to realize within history that messianic hope which can only be realized beyond history through the eschatological judgement. The Church has rejected even modified forms of this falsification of the kingdom to come under the name of millenarianism,[Cf. DS 3839.] especially the 'intrinsically perverse' political form of a secular messianism.[Pius XI, Divini Redemptoris, condemning the 'false mysticism' of this 'counterfeit of the redemption of the lowly'; cf. GS 20-21.]"

God Bless,

Neal

 

[JesusServant]

I have moved this thread to the appropriate forum. Please feel free to continue the discussion.

 

[JesusServant]

Thanks for explaining that Neal. I knew the RCC did not have a full preterist viewpoint and that's something I definitely agree with their doctrine on.

 

[Rize]

Today at 11:13 AM Chris†opher Paul said this in Post #1

Jesus made three prophecies about his second coming in Matthew:

1. That the Apostles should not have gone over the cities of Israel till the Son of Man returns. (Matthew 10:23)

2. That some standing there should not taste death till they saw the Son of Man coming in His kingdom. (Matthew 16:28)

3. That before that generation passed away all these things would be fulfilled. (Matthew 24:34)

If you think Revelation is describing something in our future, could you please explain these sayings?

Why don't you read the end of the book of John?

Maybe John is still alive

Also, have you ever heard of a near/far prophecy?  It is a prophecy that is fulfilled more than one time (once in the near future, and once in the far future).

 

 

[Rize]

Today at 12:26 PM Chris†opher Paul said this in Post #10

I see Him everytime I go to Mass, don't know about you though.

New Heaven and new Earth, huh? This is figurative for the New Covenant.

What? This is irrelevant. Gathering his elect is not necessarily removing them, is it?

As if the Lord doesn't work through natural means? Heh, read Old Testament much?

That because you have never read Josephus' account of the siege.

Christopher Paul, answer us this.

If all of the Old Testament prophecies concerning Jesus coming were fulfilled in a completely literal sense, why should we expect all of the prophecy concerning his second coming to be fulfilled in a figurative sense?  Or any of them for that matter?

 

[RevKidd]

Can you explain what Jesus said?

Yes and No.  Yes, I believe that Christ is referring to events that woud and did take place in AD 70. 

No, becuase I don't believe that anyone has hit the nail on the head reguarding eschatology.  Everyone has good and bad points.

I love to read and study what people believe and teach regarding eschatology, but frankly, I have to remember that the bible says my life is but a vapor, then I realize that I am more concerned with going to Christ, then Christ coming to me.  The death rate is 1 to 1, and if the Lord tarries, we will all see death one day....

GOD BLESS

 

[sbbqb7n16]

20th February 2003 at 11:13 AM Chris†opher Paul said this in Post #1

Jesus made three prophecies about his second coming in Matthew:

1. That the Apostles should not have gone over the cities of Israel till the Son of Man returns. (Matthew 10:23)

They didn't did they? Or if they did, where is that at?

2. That some standing there should not taste death till they saw the Son of Man coming in His kingdom. (Matthew 16:28)

"But if I drive out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you." -Matthew 12:25

Read Revelation 19:11 and following(which was written after Jesus ascended to heaven, right? The Kingdom was there in Matt 16:28, but this was talking about something still to come.. how could that be unless they are two different things?) You say all things have happened right? Where is the new Jerusalem? I'd like to go there... Where is the tree of life? (Rev 22:14) I would like to eat...

Oh and about "time of distress" Dan 12:1, Matt 24:21... which was worse... Rome or Hitler? If Hitler then was worse, how could there be the clause "and never to be equaled again" Matt 24:21? There wasn't even a nation of Isreal until 1948...

the 7 trumpets of Revelation 8-9? when were a 1/3 of the earth killed burned, etc ? Sorry I haven't heard of these things yet. So even though some of the events happened, they also double as end-time prophecies

3. That before that generation passed away all these things would be fulfilled. (Matthew 24:34)

Do you even look to make sure that the words are translated right? "generation" is the word "genea" which means "race, family, or generation" Has the Jewish race died out? hmmm... Every family that was there died out yet? hmmm .... what if you read that verse in context with the word generation... could it mean the generation that sees the "fig tree" -(symbolic of nation of Isreal by the way)- begin to bloom... meaning the generation that sees all these things come together will not die out? Why do you say then that it could ONLY be for that generation? There are multiple applications for that one word...

If you think Revelation is describing something in our future, could you please explain these sayings?

Maybe that will explain some of it... Unless you can bring me a date for when the "heavens were rolled back like a scroll" ... and all the other prophecies of Revelation, understand that Jesus is still on His way and therefore we still have time to infrom people to believe in Jesus Christ.