Can Christians live as enemies of the cross?

[ByTheSpirit]

‭Philippians 3:18-19 BSB‬
[18] For as I have often told you before, and now say again even with tears: Many live as enemies of the cross of Christ. [19] Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and their glory is in their shame. Their minds are set on earthly things.

For some time I read this passage as referring to those outside of the faith, but over time my understanding of this scripture has shifted. I now believe Paul is referring to believers, or people associated with the church, in this passage.

I guess my question for discussion here is:

What exactly is meant by "their minds are set on earthly things?" and how can we avoid that so as to not live as enemies ourselves?

Is he possibly referring to things Jesus Himself referred to in Matthew 6:25-34? Worrying about food, clothing, basic necessities of living.

Or is it referring to fleshly living? Such as found in Galatians:

‭Galatians 5:19-21 BSB‬
[19] The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery; [20] idolatry and sorcery; hatred, discord, jealousy, and rage; rivalries, divisions, factions, [21] and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Clearly I think it's the latter.

I think it goes right along with the call for Christians to live holy and godly lives. Flying in the face of the "hyper grace" crowd or any other sect of Christianity that claims we can live how we want because God's grace covers us.

Don't get me wrong, I dont believe its saying we have to live 100% sin free. But I do think there's an urging here to resist sin at every turn and if it happens, turn away from it immediately and return to the cross and the death of self.

But anyway, my mindless rambling is over, what do you think? Can Christians live as enemies of the cross?

 

[Bobber]

‭Philippians 3:18-19 BSB‬
[18] For as I have often told you before, and now say again even with tears: Many live as enemies of the cross of Christ. [19] Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and their glory is in their shame. Their minds are set on earthly things.

For some time I read this passage as referring to those outside of the faith, but over time my understanding of this scripture has shifted. I now believe Paul is referring to believers, or people associated with the church, in this passage.

I guess my question for discussion here is:

What exactly is meant by "their minds are set on earthly things?" and how can we avoid that so as to not live as enemies ourselves?

Is he possibly referring to things Jesus Himself referred to in Matthew 6:25-34? Worrying about food, clothing, basic necessities of living.

Or is it referring to fleshly living? Such as found in Galatians:

‭Galatians 5:19-21 BSB‬
[19] The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery; [20] idolatry and sorcery; hatred, discord, jealousy, and rage; rivalries, divisions, factions, [21] and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Clearly I think it's the latter.

I think it goes right along with the call for Christians to live holy and godly lives. Flying in the face of the "hyper grace" crowd or any other sect of Christianity that claims we can live how we want because God's grace covers us.

Don't get me wrong, I dont believe its saying we have to live 100% sin free. But I do think there's an urging here to resist sin at every turn and if it happens, turn away from it immediately and return to the cross and the death of self.

But anyway, my mindless rambling is over, what do you think? Can Christians live as enemies of the cross?

Great post by the way.

So what does having one's mind set on earthly things mean? I think it can mean all of the above of the things you've stated. It can also mean wanting and desiring worldly acclaim and recognition with social prestige in the world. It means too living your life like the natural realm our 80 to 100 years if we live that long is all there is......and we don't look at the bigger picture the Kingdom of God.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

‭Philippians 3:18-19 BSB‬
[18] For as I have often told you before, and now say again even with tears: Many live as enemies of the cross of Christ. [19] Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and their glory is in their shame. Their minds are set on earthly things.

For some time I read this passage as referring to those outside of the faith, but over time my understanding of this scripture has shifted. I now believe Paul is referring to believers, or people associated with the church, in this passage.

I guess my question for discussion here is:

What exactly is meant by "their minds are set on earthly things?" and how can we avoid that so as to not live as enemies ourselves?

Is he possibly referring to things Jesus Himself referred to in Matthew 6:25-34? Worrying about food, clothing, basic necessities of living.

Or is it referring to fleshly living? Such as found in Galatians:

‭Galatians 5:19-21 BSB‬
[19] The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery; [20] idolatry and sorcery; hatred, discord, jealousy, and rage; rivalries, divisions, factions, [21] and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Clearly I think it's the latter.

I think it goes right along with the call for Christians to live holy and godly lives. Flying in the face of the "hyper grace" crowd or any other sect of Christianity that claims we can live how we want because God's grace covers us.

Don't get me wrong, I dont believe its saying we have to live 100% sin free. But I do think there's an urging here to resist sin at every turn and if it happens, turn away from it immediately and return to the cross and the death of self.

But anyway, my mindless rambling is over, what do you think? Can Christians live as enemies of the cross?

Those who are " anti- Christ" are enemies of the cross. They are not Christians but are intermingled among us used as a tool for deception.
Be blessed.
1 John 2
18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Those who are " anti- Christ" are enemies of the cross. They are not Christians but are intermingled among us used as a tool for deception.
Be blessed.
1 John 2
18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.

Would you agree that perhaps outwardly, these people may pass as Christian? Tares among wheat type deal?

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Great post by the way.

So what does having one's mind set on earthly things mean? I think it can mean all of the above of the things you've stated. It can also mean wanting and desiring worldly acclaim and recognition with social prestige in the world. It means too living your life like the natural realm our 80 to 100 years if we live that long is all there is......and we don't look at the bigger picture the Kingdom of God.

I definitely think there's an aspect of what you mention.

I've thought A LOT about this here lately: Jesus came just to die.

Obviously that's no big shocker, and certain not some new truth I stumbled upon. But the thought of that. The Maker of the Universe, came not to receive recognition or acclaim (in the fleshly sense), but to die. So when He said, "I am the way... the truth... the life. No one comes to the Father but by me." That's what He is referring to, the death of self and all that comes with that.

And yeah, I think that having my mind set of things of the earth, or earthly things such as social prestige or influence puts me squarely in that category because that's self.

IMHO good thoughts

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Would you agree that perhaps outwardly, these people may pass as Christian? Tares among wheat type deal?

Yes!

 

[Soyeong]

‭Philippians 3:18-19 BSB‬
[18] For as I have often told you before, and now say again even with tears: Many live as enemies of the cross of Christ. [19] Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and their glory is in their shame. Their minds are set on earthly things.

For some time I read this passage as referring to those outside of the faith, but over time my understanding of this scripture has shifted. I now believe Paul is referring to believers, or people associated with the church, in this passage.

I guess my question for discussion here is:

What exactly is meant by "their minds are set on earthly things?" and how can we avoid that so as to not live as enemies ourselves?

Is he possibly referring to things Jesus Himself referred to in Matthew 6:25-34? Worrying about food, clothing, basic necessities of living.

Or is it referring to fleshly living? Such as found in Galatians:

‭Galatians 5:19-21 BSB‬
[19] The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery; [20] idolatry and sorcery; hatred, discord, jealousy, and rage; rivalries, divisions, factions, [21] and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Clearly I think it's the latter.

I think it goes right along with the call for Christians to live holy and godly lives. Flying in the face of the "hyper grace" crowd or any other sect of Christianity that claims we can live how we want because God's grace covers us.

Don't get me wrong, I dont believe its saying we have to live 100% sin free. But I do think there's an urging here to resist sin at every turn and if it happens, turn away from it immediately and return to the cross and the death of self.

But anyway, my mindless rambling is over, what do you think? Can Christians live as enemies of the cross?

In Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what he accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20), which would mean that the enemies of the cross are those who are doing the reverse by leading people away from obeying God's law.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

In Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what he accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20), which would mean that the enemies of the cross are those who are doing the reverse by leading people away from obeying God's law.

I'm sure that's part of it. But the immediate context of the scripture implies a personal/individual aspect as well.

Paul tells the Church to watch those who do the right thing and emulate them, because there are those who love as enemies of the cross, by serving themselves (paraphrase).

The way of the cross is death to self, and all that entails.

Everything else falls into the category of this discussion I think. Would you agree?

 

[ARBITER01]

The cross of Christ was His death to self, death to the flesh, hence the phrase "take up your cross."

Carnal Christians is what Paul is referring to here. They are born again Christians, but do not see any importance in Spiritual things, only social activities, fleshly churchianity. They are not striving for any close relationship with Jesus, just going about being busy in church activities in His name.

Nice topic btw.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

The cross of Christ was His death to self, death to the flesh, hence the phrase "take up your cross."

Carnal Christians is what Paul is referring to here. They are born again Christians, but do not see any importance in Spiritual things, only social activities, fleshly churchianity. They are not striving for any close relationship with Jesus, just going about being busy in church activities in His name.

Nice topic btw.

Yup, that's kind of my thought here. To not just do just to do, but do out of love for others. To deny myself and do the uncomfortable and/or inconvenient thing because Jesus would want me to.

It's a sobering reminder to me to not take Father's grace for granted.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I think it is about accepting our own crosses. "Take up your cross and follow me." Peter was saved by Jesus when he was sinking in the water but he was still martyred. The prosperity Gospel spoils us. Our faith is not in being spared from worldly woes but in the power of God's love through all of them.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

I think it is about accepting our own crosses. "Take up your cross and follow me." Peter was saved by Jesus when he was sinking in the water but he was still martyred. The prosperity Gospel spoils us. Our faith is not in being spared from worldly woes but in the power of God's love through all of them.

Do you think if a processing Christian denies the cross assigned to them and instead embraces their life that they "living as enemies"?

So instead of (as you say) taking up their cross, they continue in their own way instead. Not denying but embracing themselves?

 

[Simon_Templar]

‭Philippians 3:18-19 BSB‬
[18] For as I have often told you before, and now say again even with tears: Many live as enemies of the cross of Christ. [19] Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and their glory is in their shame. Their minds are set on earthly things.

For some time I read this passage as referring to those outside of the faith, but over time my understanding of this scripture has shifted. I now believe Paul is referring to believers, or people associated with the church, in this passage.

I guess my question for discussion here is:

What exactly is meant by "their minds are set on earthly things?" and how can we avoid that so as to not live as enemies ourselves?

Is he possibly referring to things Jesus Himself referred to in Matthew 6:25-34? Worrying about food, clothing, basic necessities of living.

Or is it referring to fleshly living? Such as found in Galatians:

‭Galatians 5:19-21 BSB‬
[19] The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery; [20] idolatry and sorcery; hatred, discord, jealousy, and rage; rivalries, divisions, factions, [21] and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Clearly I think it's the latter.

I think it goes right along with the call for Christians to live holy and godly lives. Flying in the face of the "hyper grace" crowd or any other sect of Christianity that claims we can live how we want because God's grace covers us.

Don't get me wrong, I dont believe its saying we have to live 100% sin free. But I do think there's an urging here to resist sin at every turn and if it happens, turn away from it immediately and return to the cross and the death of self.

But anyway, my mindless rambling is over, what do you think? Can Christians live as enemies of the cross?

He is talking about people who are in the Christian community and have professed to be Christians.

Consider especially that "their god is their belly and their glory is in their shame."

He is talking here about people who proudly live contrary to Christ. Things that God considers to be shameful, like the things you quote from Galatians 5, they are proud of those things and glory in doing them. These are not people who are struggling with sin, these are people who have embraced sin and deny that it is sin.

He contrasts "Their minds are set on earthly things" with the next verse "But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,"

This implies that they are focused only on this life and enjoying this life. But it also implies that they don't understand the things of heaven. Their minds are focused on earthly things, so they don't know God. Our minds are set on Heavenly things, the things of God, and thus we are oriented to knowing Jesus.
God's things, his Truth, his Wisdom, his goodness, his beauty, his love, do not enter into their minds.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

He is talking about people who are in the Christian community and have professed to be Christians.

Consider especially that "their god is their belly and their glory is in their shame."

He is talking here about people who proudly live contrary to Christ. Things that God considers to be shameful, like the things you quote from Galatians 5, they are proud of those things and glory in doing them. These are not people who are struggling with sin, these are people who have embraced sin and deny that it is sin.

He contrasts "Their minds are set on earthly things" with the next verse "But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,"

This implies that they are focused only on this life and enjoying this life. But it also implies that they don't understand the things of heaven. Their minds are focused on earthly things, so they don't know God. Our minds are set on Heavenly things, the things of God, and thus we are oriented to knowing Jesus.
God's things, his Truth, his Wisdom, his goodness, his beauty, his love, do not enter into their minds.

excellent, EXCELLENT response thank you