Can a person who doesn't believe Jesus literally rose be saved? (duplicate)

BrotherJJ · Dec 3, 2021

No without complete belief in Christ's physical resurrection there is NO salvation

Jesus Resurrection is the basis of a Christians hope

1 Cor 15:14, Heb 6:1-2 Our salvation & justification before God is based upon our belief in the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Rom 10:9 If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, & shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. Also see 1 Cor 15:14

Christ's resurrection the basis of our hope:
1 Cor 15:1-4, Matt 16:21, Jn 5:25, 28, 29; Acts 17:31; 23:6; 24:15; 26:6-8, Rom 6:3-5; 1 cor19-20; 1 Thes 4:13-14

The early church focused primarily on faith in the resurrection.

Acts 1:21, 22, 2:24, 29-32, 3:15, 26, 4:2, 33, 5:30, 31, 10:39-41; 17:2, 3, 18, 23:6, 26:6-8, 13:30-37, Rom 8:34, 1:4, 7:4, 1 Cor 15:14-15, Eph 1:20, 2 Tim 2:8, 1 Pet 1:21

The resurrection of Jesus Christ fulfills prophecy
Ps 16:10 (Acts 2:27; 13:35-37); Ps 22:21 Jn 20:17 Isa 53:10; Matt 12:40

It was predicted by Jesus Himself.
Matt 16:21 Mk 8:31
"From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things. & be killed, & raised again the third day."

Matt 12:38-40; 17:9, 22, 23; 20:18, 19; 26:32; 27:63 Mk 9:10, 31; 10:32-34,14:28, 58; Lk 9:22; Jn 2:19, 21, 22

Scripture gives definite proof that He was bodily resurrected (not just spiritually speaking)

Jn 2:19, 21 He spake of the temple of His body.

The tomb was empty. Matt 28:6 (Lk 24:1-3, 12; Jn 20:1-9, Mk 16:2-6)

He appeared visibly to many people. Acts 1:3 He showed Himself alive after His passion by infallible proofs.

Acts 13:30-31 Jn 20:14, 16, 18 Matt 28:9. Lk 24:34; 1 Cor 15:5.Lk 24:15. Lk 24:36-43; Jn 20:19-20. Jn 20:26-29. Matt 28:10,17. 1 Cor 15:6. Acts 1:1-4; 1 Cor 15:7.

He ate with them
Lk 24:30, 35, 41-43; Jn 21:12, 15; Acts 1:34; 10:39-41

They touched Him
Matt 28:9 Lk 24:39 Jn 20:27

Aussie Pete · Dec 3, 2021

JohnClay said:
edit:
Oops I realised that I posted a similar topic 2 years ago:
Being saved while believing in a non-physical resurrection?

No. Lord Jesus died as a man, not God. We were included in His death. When He was raised from the dead, we were included in His resurrection. His resurrection has to be physical or it would be ineffective for humanity.

TedT · Dec 3, 2021

JohnClay said:
...

1 Corinthians 15:20
But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.

Rom 8:23 Not only that, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies. 24 For in this hope we were saved;

Faith is an unproven hope, Heb 11:1, and part of our hope is our resurrection based on His resurrection.

Lukaris · Dec 3, 2021

A person cannot be Christian if one denies the resurrection ( 1 Corinthians 15:12-22, Matthew 22:31-33 etc.).

All you will have are your works in which no person can reassure another person is a safe option. This does not mean God will not be merciful but that is His judgment.

see: Matthew 12:31-33, Romans 2:11-16, John 5:22-30, Revelation 20:11-15 etc.

JohnClay · Dec 6, 2021

BTW there is another resurrection story in the gospels: (besides Lazarus, etc)
Mark 6:14-16

King Herod heard about this, for Jesus’ name had become well known. Some were saying, “John the Baptist has been raised from the dead, and that is why miraculous powers are at work in him.”
Others said, “He is Elijah.”
And still others claimed, “He is a prophet, like one of the prophets of long ago.”
But when Herod heard this, he said, “John, whom I beheaded, has been raised from the dead!”

chad kincham · Dec 6, 2021

JohnClay said:
I believe that Jesus lived I just don't believe that he literally rose from the dead. It seems liberal Christians like the Baptist minister Martin Luther King also didn't believe in a physical resurrection. My theory is that it could have involved mistaken identity e.g. like this example involving 6000 in the crowd:

V: Jesus in Nairobi, Kenya, 1988

Though 6000 people were involved I guess Christians would believe that it wasn't really Jesus based on the photos. But we don't have photos from the 500 person sighting.

In Mark 6:14 Herod thought that Jesus was John the Baptist back from the dead while others believed that Jesus was Elijah. That goes to show in the Bible that a person could be considered to be resurrected even if they looked different.

But I don't think I'm meant to be defending my beliefs which could be non-Christian.

You have to believe Jesus is the son of God, who literally rose from the dead, to be saved, per Romans 10:8-13.

chad kincham · Dec 6, 2021

JohnClay said:
BTW there is another resurrection story in the gospels: (besides Lazarus, etc)
Mark 6:14-16

King Herod heard about this, for Jesus’ name had become well known. Some were saying, “John the Baptist has been raised from the dead, and that is why miraculous powers are at work in him.”
Others said, “He is Elijah.”
And still others claimed, “He is a prophet, like one of the prophets of long ago.”
But when Herod heard this, he said, “John, whom I beheaded, has been raised from the dead!”

That was the king who said that, not God. The Bible is just quoting what the king said, and the king was mistaken.

JohnClay · Dec 6, 2021

chad kincham said:
That was the king who said that, not God. The Bible is just quoting what the king said, and the king was mistaken.

I just thought he had low standards of evidence to believe in the resurrection of the dead....

JohnClay · Dec 6, 2021

BTW in addition to the belief in Jesus being raised from the dead there's
Matthew 27:50-53

And when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, he gave up his spirit. At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split and the tombs broke open. The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. They came out of the tombs after Jesus’ resurrection and went into the holy city and appeared to many people.

I wonder what happened after that? In the case of Jesus he left by apparently rising up to the clouds....

SavedByGrace3 · Dec 6, 2021

JohnClay said:
edit:
Oops I realised that I posted a similar topic 2 years ago:
Being saved while believing in a non-physical resurrection?

Yes... it is pretty clear that the physical resurrection is a part of the Gospel:

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV
1. Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2. By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4. And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

chilehed · Dec 8, 2021

JohnClay said:
So some people who call themselves Christians don't believe in a literal physical resurrection...

They might call themselves that, but they might also call themselves Vegan whilst chowing down on a bacon cheeseburger.

James_Lai · Dec 8, 2021

JohnClay said:
edit:
Oops I realised that I posted a similar topic 2 years ago:
Being saved while believing in a non-physical resurrection?

what do you think is the contents, purpose and mechanism of salvation?

would mental assent of any information regulate salvation?

James_Lai · Dec 8, 2021

JohnClay said:
Can you question the Resurrection and still be a Christian?
I found this:

Did Jesus literally rise from the dead in a bodily resurrection, as many traditionalist and conservative Christians believe? Or was his rising a symbolic one, a restoration of his spirit of love and compassion to the world, as members of some more liberal brands of Christianity hold?

As Easter approaches, many Christians struggle with how to understand the Resurrection. How literally must one take the Gospel story of Jesus' triumph to be called a Christian? Can one understand the Resurrection as a metaphor -- perhaps not even believe it happened at all -- and still claim to be a follower of Christ?

So some people who call themselves Christians don't believe in a literal physical resurrection......

DNA has aging mechanism built-in: telomeres, methylation etc

Also one can’t breathe or maintain blood pressure or body temperature in outer space.

If Jesus resurrected in a normal human body, he would face aging and death again, also He wouldn’t be able to ascent above the clouds.

His resurrection should therefore be taken to mean something else, maybe an allegory of His deification.

JohnClay · Dec 8, 2021

James_Lai said:
what do you think is the contents, purpose and mechanism of salvation?

would mental assent of any information regulate salvation?

I currently don't really believe in salvation.... I think the Lord's supper has some spiritual significance though....

James_Lai · Dec 8, 2021

JohnClay said:
I currently don't really believe in salvation.... the Lord's supper might have some spiritual significance though....

bread and wine.

all religions seem to have some form of communal eating.

consuming food and drink is intaking energy and water that are fundamental for survival.

partaking of jesus to have life.

paul claims even wrong thoughts during the process can result in literal sickness and death..

JohnClay · Dec 8, 2021

James_Lai said:
bread and wine.

all religions seem to have some form of communal eating.

consuming food and drink is intaking energy and water that are fundamental for survival.

partaking of jesus to have life.

paul claims even wrong thoughts during the process can result in literal sickness and death..

Though at the church I sometimes go to they have crackers and grape juice....

James_Lai · Dec 8, 2021

JohnClay said:
Though at the church I sometimes go to they have crackers and grape juice....

also the Bible says you take one loaf of bread and break it into pieces. Flatbread i suppose, as it was a holiday of unleavened bread prior to Pesach

the Bible says one cup shared by all to symbolize the blood from one body of Jesus.

multiple separate crackers and small cuppies of juice may symbolize polytheism.

Probably fitting as the modern church could be worshipping the Bible, preachers, money, church traditions, Christian doctrines etc etc

Multiple Gods

Pulpless Juice instead of Wine is liquid pressed out of grapes instead of juice with pulp in Wine and minus the alcohol (10-15%of volume) to symbolize a stripped version of Christianity with many teachings of Jesus ignored and His Holy Spirit unrecognized

JohnClay · Dec 8, 2021

James_Lai said:
....multiple separate crackers and small cuppies of juice may symbolize polytheism....

At my church they have broken pieces of crackers. At the Lutheran church they had little white circle wafers with a crucifix on them....

James_Lai · Dec 8, 2021

JohnClay said:
At my church they have broken pieces of crackers. At the Lutheran church they had little white circle wafers with a crucifix on them....

they symbolize that they left one Jesus.

crucifix on a round wafer… little circle makes you think of sun or moon worship.. cross is the tool of murder of Jesus… not sure He would appreciate an image of His torture perpetually impressed into His body. It’s like tattooing a guillotine on Louis 16’s chest…

Maybe a picture of a Dove or Lamb could be more appropriate

Sketcher · Dec 10, 2021

Belief in the bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ is required.

Can a person who doesn't believe Jesus literally rose be saved? (duplicate)

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