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Calvin silenced by James2:24

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I was looking on a calvinist page of Calvin's commentaries and his work Institutes, and looked up where they referenced James2:24. I was shocked at how much twisting and turning he did with that verse!

For those who need a refresher, here is James2:24
24 You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

For his Commentary on the book of James, I looked up Ch2, v24, but guess what, that verse wasnt even recognized as a verse! The commentary is set up in one-verse-at-a-time commentary, but v24 is missing! Look here, I know you could argue a mistype on the part of the web page makers, but on their page they say this work was proof read. Not to mention what are the odds that 2:24 is missing and not some other random verse?

Now from his Institutes its amazing he dances around the verse, refuses to accept what it says and even changes definitions to fit his agenda:
11. But they say that we have a still more serious business with James, who in express terms opposes us. For he asks, “Was not Abraham our father justified by works?” and adds “You see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only,” (James 2:21, 24). What then? Will they engage Paul in a quarrel with James? If they hold James to be a servant of Christ, his sentiments must be understood as not dissenting from Christ speaking by the mouth of Paul. By the mouth of Paul the Spirit declares that Abraham obtained justification by faith, not by works; we also teach that all are justified by faith without the works of the law. By James the same Spirit declares that both Abraham’s justification and ours consists of works, and not of faith only. It is certain that the Spirit cannot be at variance with himself. Where, then, will be the agreement? It is enough for our opponents, provided they can tear up that justification by faith which we regard as fixed by the deepest roots: to restore peace to the conscience is to them a matter of no great concern. Hence you may see, that though they indeed carp at the doctrine of justification by faith, they meanwhile point out no goal of righteousness at which the conscience may rest. Let them triumph then as they will, so long as the only victory they can boast of is, that they have deprived righteousness of all its certainty. This miserable victory they will indeed obtain when the light of truth is extinguished, and the Lord permits them to darken it with their lies. But wherever the truth of God stands they cannot prevail. I deny, then, that the passage of James which they are constantly holding up before us as if it were the shield of Achilles, gives them the slightest countenance. To make this plain, let us first attend to the scope of the Apostle, and then show wherein their hallucination consists. As at that time (and the evil has existed in the Church ever since) there were many who, while they gave manifest proof of their infidelity, by neglecting and omitting all the works peculiar to believers, ceased not falsely to glory in the name of faith, James here dissipates their vain confidence. His intention therefore is, not to derogate in any degree from the power of true faith, but to show how absurdly these triflers laid claim only to the empty name, and resting satisfied with it, felt secure in unrestrained indulgence in vice. This state of matters being understood, it will be easy to see where the error of our opponents lies. They fall into a double paralogism, the one in the term faith, the other in the term justifying. The Apostle, in giving the name of faith to an empty opinion altogether differing from true faith, makes a concession which derogates in no respect from his case. This he demonstrates at the outset by the words, “What does it profit, my brethren, though a man say he has faith, and have not works?” (James 2:14). He says not, “If a man have faith without works,” but “if he say that he has.” This becomes still clearer when a little after he derides this faith as worse than that of devils, and at last when he calls it “dead.” You may easily ascertain his meaning by the explanation, “Thou believest that there is one God.” Surely if all which is contained in that faith is a belief in the existence of God, there is no wonder that it does not justify. The denial of such a power to it cannot be supposed to derogate in any degree from Christian faith, which is of a very different description. ...

12. We have not made good our point until we dispose of the other paralogism: since James places a part of justification in works. If you would make James consistent with the other Scriptures and with himself, you must give the word justify, as used by him, a different meaning from what it has with Paul. In the sense of Paul we are said to be justified when the remembrance of our unrighteousness is obliterated and we are counted righteous. Had James had the same meaning it would have been absurd for him to quote the words of Moses, “Abraham believed God,” &c. The context runs thus: “Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the Scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness.” [James2:21] If it is absurd to say that the effect was prior to its cause, either Moses falsely declares in that passage that Abraham’s faith was imputed for righteousness or Abraham, by his obedience in offering up Isaac, did not merit righteousness. Before the existence of Ishmael, who was a grown youth at the birth of Isaac, Abraham was justified by his faith. How thee can we say that he obtained justification by an obedience which followed long after? Wherefore, either James erroneously inverts the proper order (this it were impious to suppose), or he meant not to say that he was justified, as if he deserved to be deemed just. What then? It appears certain that he is speaking of the manifestation, not of the imputation of righteousness, as if he had said, Those who are justified by true faith prove their justification by obedience and good works, not by a bare and imaginary semblance of faith. In one word, he is not discussing the mode of justification, but requiring that the justification of believers shall be operative. And as Paul contends that men are justified without the aid of works, so James will not allow any to be regarded as justified who are destitute of good works. Due attention to the scope will thus disentangle every doubt; for the error of our opponents lies chiefly in this, that they think James is defining the mode of justification, whereas his only object is to destroy the depraved security of those who vainly pretended faith as an excuse for their contempt of good works. Therefore, let them twist the words of James as they may, they will never extract out of them more than the two propositions: That an empty phantom of faith does not justify, and that the believer, not contented with such an imagination, manifests his justification by good works.

13. They gain nothing by quoting from Paul to the same effect, that “not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified,” (Rom. 2:13). I am unwilling to evade the difficulty by the solution of Ambrose, that Paul spoke thus because faith in Christ is the fulfillment of the law. This I regard as a mere subterfuge, and one too for which there is no occasion, as the explanation is perfectly obvious. The Apostle’s object is to suppress the absurd confidence of the Jews who gave out that they alone had a knowledge of the law, though at the very time they where its greatest despisers. That they might not plume themselves so much on a bare acquaintance with the law, he reminds them that when justification is sought by the law, the thing required is not the knowledge but the observance of it. We certainly mean not to dispute that the righteousness of the law consists in works, and not only so, but that justification consists in the dignity and merits of works. But this proves not that we are justified by works unless they can produce some one who has fulfilled the law. That Paul had no other meaning is abundantly obvious from the context.
Amazing how Calvin ignores verse24 the entire time and dances around the issue (eg tries to make Paul and James at odds), and even redefining terms like justification, even when Paul and James are talking about the same passage in Genesis with Abraham!
 

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kevken said:
Man is justified to the world that he is a Christian because of his works. He is justified before the Lord because of Christ's work. "all of our righteousness is as filthy rags"
Great point. Faith without works is dead, but works without faith are also dead.
 
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geocajun

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kevken said:
Man is justified to the world that he is a Christian because of his works. He is justified before the Lord because of Christ's work. "all of our righteousness is as filthy rags"
That can't be right, there are many folks held in high esteem by the world because of their works who are the farthest thing from Christians. Who wants to be justified before the world? not I.. but Jesus tells us that the greatest love is an act, not a thought or abstract, but the act of laying down ones life for a friend. In this same sense, the greatest faith is not understood as an abstract, or a thought, but of bringing the gospel to he world, brining men to know Jesus. These works do not impress the world, but they do aid in our salvation, because we were commisioned by God to do them. It is grace that moves us to good works, which are good because of grace, not because the world esteems them.
 
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rnmomof7

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Does James contradict Paul?

Excerpt from a sermon by John Piper

James' concern is with a kind of counterfeit faith that does not produce love. This faith cannot justify anybody. Verse 14: "What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him?" You see his concern. "Can that faith save him?" Such faith is not going to save. What kind of works is James interested in? The same kind Paul is - the works of love. Verses 15-16: "If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food, and one of you says to them, 'Go in peace, be warmed and be filled,' and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that?" So James' concern is that people have real saving faith, not counterfeit faith. And the difference is that the real faith produces loving behavior.

He has three ways of describing this counterfeit faith. First in verse 17, he says it is dead: "Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself." It is dead faith. If faith does not "work through love" as Paul said, it is dead. Second, in verse 19 he says, "You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder." There is a faith that even devils have, namely, belief in right doctrine. The faith that justifies and works through love is not simply belief in right doctrines like, "God is one." Devils can be orthodox at the intellectual level. They believe. But it doesn't save them. So there is dead faith and devil faith. Third, he says in verse 20, "But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless?" So there is useless, idle, ineffective, vain, empty faith.

So there are three ways in this passage that James talks about faith to show that the faith he says cannot justify is a faith that Paul would totally agree cannot justify - dead faith, devil faith, and useless faith -faith that has no vital life that works through love.

Abraham as an Example for Both Paul and James
Now how does James make his case from the life of Abraham - which was what we saw Paul doing in Romans 4? Well, he does it like this. He takes two events in the life of Abraham. The first (in James 2:22) is from Genesis 15:6. God promises Abraham a great host of descendants though his wife is barren. Verse 23 cites Abraham's faith from Genesis 15:6: "Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness." That is exactly what Paul does with that event and that verse (Romans 4:3). One thing is reckoned as righteousness: faith. Abraham believed God and it was reckoned as righteousness. Faith, not works, was reckoned as righteousness.

But then James notices that in Genesis 22:1 "God tested Abraham" by commanding him to offer up his son Isaac. What was God testing? He was testing his faith. What was he looking for? He was looking for the kind of obedience or works that shows Abraham's faith was not dead faith or devil faith or useless faith. So the issue in James 2:21 (where Abraham offers Isaac) is not the first act of justification that put Abraham in a right standing with God. The issue is the test: was Abraham's faith the living kind of faith that produces the "obedience of faith" or the dead kind that has no effect on life?

"Justification by Works" Defined by Paul and by James
So when James says in verse 21 that Abraham was "justified by works" he has a meaning in mind different from Paul's when Paul denies that a man is justified by works (Romans 3:28; 4:2; 4:5). James is answering the question: Does the ongoing and final reckoning of Abraham's righteousness depend on works as the necessary evidence of true and living faith? James' answer to that question is Yes. And Paul's answer is also Yes, in Galatians 5:6 (the only thing that counts is "faith working through love"). If you ask James and Paul, "How does an ungodly person get right with God and receive the righteousness of God in Christ as a gift?" both James and Paul would answer with the words of James 2:23: "Trust God (trust Christ) and that faith alone will be reckoned as righteousness."

But if you ask them, "Does justification as an ongoing and final right standing with God depend on the works of love?" Paul is going to say, "No, if by works you mean deeds done to show that you deserve God's ongoing blessing (the point of Romans 4:4)." And James is going to say, "Yes, if by works you mean the fruit and evidence of faith like Abraham's obedience on Mount Moriah." And Paul is going to say, "I agree with the James, based on his definitions." And James is going to say, "I agree with Paul, based on his definitions."

So when Paul renounces "justification by works" he renounces the view that anything we do along with faith is credited to us as righteousness. Only faith obtains the verdict, not guilty, when we become Christians. Works of any kind are not acceptable in the moment of initial justification. But when James affirms "justification by works" he means that works are absolutely necessary in the ongoing life of a Christian to confirm and prove the reality of the faith which justifies.

For Paul, "justification by works" (which he rejects) means "gaining right standing with God by the merit of works." For James, "justification by works" (which he accepts) means "maintaining a right standing with God by faith along with the necessary evidence of faith, namely, the works of love."

To put it yet another way: When Paul teaches in Romans 4:5 that we are justified by faith alone, he means that the only thing that unites us to Christ for righteousness is dependence on Christ. When James says in James 2:24 that we are not justified by faith alone he means that the faith which justifies does not remain alone. These two positions are not contradictory. Faith alone unites us to Christ for righteousness, and the faith that unites us to Christ for righteousness does not remain alone. It bears the fruit of love. It must do so or it is dead, demon, useless faith and does not justify.

The glory of Christ in the gospel is not merely that we are justified when we depend entirely on Christ, but also that depending entirely on Christ is the power that makes us new, loving people. Depending entirely on Christ is how we are justified and how we are sanctified. Paul struck the one note. James struck the other. Both are true and together they bring Christ the glory due his name.


http://www.desiringgod.org/library/sermons/99/080899.html
 
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kevken

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geocajun said:
That can't be right, there are many folks held in high esteem by the world because of their works who are the farthest thing from Christians. Who wants to be justified before the world? not I.. but Jesus tells us that the greatest love is an act, not a thought or abstract, but the act of laying down ones life for a friend. In this same sense, the greatest faith is not understood as an abstract, or a thought, but of bringing the gospel to he world, brining men to know Jesus. These works do not impress the world, but they do aid in our salvation, because we were commisioned by God to do them. It is grace that moves us to good works, which are good because of grace, not because the world esteems them.

I was making a point short hand. It seems a little more detail is necessary. Our works are a necessary side effect of salvation, however they do not save nor assist in saving. Christ said "If you love me keep my commandments" THis obedience however does not gain any merit in the sight of God. The only merit I could obtain in God's sight is if I loved God with all of my heart every moment of every second of every hour of every day and with my mind every moment of every day and with my soul every moment of every day, and with my strength every moment of every day; all of the above is coupled with external visible works. If my works are not coupled with the greatest commandment then my "works are as filthy rags."

Now if you or anyone for that matter tells me that they have loved GOd thoroughly and completely the very same quantity and quality as Christ (for the only way that Christ loves the Lord is loving Him with all of HIs heart soul mind and strength all the time) at any moment of any day coupled with a good work I think anyone reading this post will have to chuckle along with me.

Christ said "by their fruits you will know them." That is, His people. Those fruits are good works.
 
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thehayesman

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When Paul teaches in Romans 4:5 that we are justified by faith alone, he means that the only thing that unites us to Christ for righteousness is dependence on Christ. When James says in James 2:24 that we are not justified by faith alone he means that the faith which justifies does not remain alone. These two positions are not contradictory. Faith alone unites us to Christ for righteousness, and the faith that unites us to Christ for righteousness does not remain alone. It bears the fruit of love. It must do so or it is dead, demon, useless faith and does not justify

Christ said "by their fruits you will know them." That is, His people. Those fruits are good works.

Both wonderful pictures of the message in question. The heart of James is found in 1:26-27. the contrast between religious practices and confessions versus moral lives and obedience. Without both, our "faith" means nothing. The synergy of confession and obedience is the only way of "being" a son/daughter of God and gaining salvation.
 
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cygnusx1

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Most of these arguements about faith verses works would be reduced if we all recognised Grace saves ........... Sovereign Rich unmerited Grace.


Grace is God's work , He grants both faith and good works.

Faith is merely instrumental to salvation , and works are merely ''ornaments'' of Holiness ... It is By Grace we are saved.
 
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What Calvin Said in the Commentary:

"Why then does James say that it was fulfilled? Even because he intended to shew what sort of faith that was which justified Abraham; that is, that it was not idle or evanescent, but rendered him obedient to God, as also we find in Hebrews 11:8. The conclusion, which is immediately added, as it depends on this, has no other meaning. Man is not justified by faith alone, that is, by a bare and empty knowledge of God; he is justified by works, that is, his righteousness is known and proved by its fruits."

The verse reference to verse 24 is not in the text. However, this paragraph is separate from the one immediately prior to it in which Calvin addresses verse 23. In this paragraph, it is obvious that he does in fact address verse 24 beginning with "The conclusion, which is immediately added . . ." as noted above. Note what Calvin says plainly: "he is justified by works, that is, his righteousness is known and proved by its fruits."

This method is not uncommon to Calvin in his commentaries. The Institutes were written to be read prior to the commentaries. This is common knowledge and anyone who really wants to grasp Calvin's style can easily verify it. No one has to agree with him or his conclusions, but at least be fair if you are going to attempt a critical analysis.
 
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rnmomof7-

rnmomof7 said:
Does James contradict Paul?

Excerpt from a sermon by John Piper


James' concern is with a kind of counterfeit faith that does not produce love. This faith cannot justify anybody. Verse 14: "What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him?" You see his concern. "Can that faith save him?" Such faith is not going to save.
I agree thats why the teaching of FA is so unScriptural and illogical. How can a pastor tell his people they are saved by FA and yet at the same time have to look at their fruits? Hence, that justification becomes conditional and not sure. There is no more certainty of justification by FA if you must "prove" it later in the day.

What kind of works is James interested in? The same kind Paul is - the works of love. Verses 15-16: "If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food, and one of you says to them, 'Go in peace, be warmed and be filled,' and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that?" So James' concern is that people have real saving faith, not counterfeit faith. And the difference is that the real faith produces loving behavior.
I agree 100%, thats why FA is illogical and unBiblical. How does a person know they have real or "counterfeit" faith? They dont unless they get off their butt and do good works. There is no moment of complete and irrevocable justification which FA believes there is.

He has three ways of describing this counterfeit faith. First in verse 17, he says it is dead: "Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself." It is dead faith. If faith does not "work through love" as Paul said, it is dead. Second, in verse 19 he says, "You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder." There is a faith that even devils have, namely, belief in right doctrine. The faith that justifies and works through love is not simply belief in right doctrines like, "God is one." Devils can be orthodox at the intellectual level. They believe. But it doesn't save them. So there is dead faith and devil faith. Third, he says in verse 20, "But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless?" So there is useless, idle, ineffective, vain, empty faith.
I couldnt have said it better myself. One more testament for why FA is misleading and unBiblical.

So there are three ways in this passage that James talks about faith to show that the faith he says cannot justify is a faith that Paul would totally agree cannot justify - dead faith, devil faith, and useless faith -faith that has no vital life that works through love.
:clap:

Abraham as an Example for Both Paul and James
Now how does James make his case from the life of Abraham - which was what we saw Paul doing in Romans 4? Well, he does it like this. He takes two events in the life of Abraham. The first (in James 2:22) is from Genesis 15:6. God promises Abraham a great host of descendants though his wife is barren. Verse 23 cites Abraham's faith from Genesis 15:6: "Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness." That is exactly what Paul does with that event and that verse (Romans 4:3). One thing is reckoned as righteousness: faith. Abraham believed God and it was reckoned as righteousness. Faith, not works, was reckoned as righteousness.
The definition of "faith" here is important. As Heb11 explains:
8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. 9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: ... 17 By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son.
Faith is expressed in actions, not in some thought in the mind. Many people mistakenly think Faith happens one Sunday during a sermon and that person is justified suddenly, thats not what the Bible says.

But then James notices that in Genesis 22:1 "God tested Abraham" by commanding him to offer up his son Isaac. What was God testing? He was testing his faith. What was he looking for? He was looking for the kind of obedience or works that shows Abraham's faith was not dead faith or devil faith or useless faith. So the issue in James 2:21 (where Abraham offers Isaac) is not the first act of justification that put Abraham in a right standing with God. The issue is the test: was Abraham's faith the living kind of faith that produces the "obedience of faith" or the dead kind that has no effect on life?
I agree, the justification is conditional on works that follow faith. Also being justified is not a single moment in time, it starts at a single moment in time and is worked on the rest of life.

"Justification by Works" Defined by Paul and by James
So when James says in verse 21 that Abraham was "justified by works" he has a meaning in mind different from Paul's when Paul denies that a man is justified by works (Romans 3:28; 4:2; 4:5). James is answering the question: Does the ongoing and final reckoning of Abraham's righteousness depend on works as the necessary evidence of true and living faith? James' answer to that question is Yes. And Paul's answer is also Yes, in Galatians 5:6 (the only thing that counts is "faith working through love"). If you ask James and Paul, "How does an ungodly person get right with God and receive the righteousness of God in Christ as a gift?" both James and Paul would answer with the words of James 2:23: "Trust God (trust Christ) and that faith alone will be reckoned as righteousness."
It doesnt say faith alone, that is a major problem that needs to be stopped, that is adding to Scripture what it doesnt say. The only time "works" are deemed not part of salvation is when it involves the works of Law of Moses, which the context is always clear about.

But if you ask them, "Does justification as an ongoing and final right standing with God depend on the works of love?" Paul is going to say, "No, if by works you mean deeds done to show that you deserve God's ongoing blessing (the point of Romans 4:4)." And James is going to say, "Yes, if by works you mean the fruit and evidence of faith like Abraham's obedience on Mount Moriah." And Paul is going to say, "I agree with the James, based on his definitions." And James is going to say, "I agree with Paul, based on his definitions."
I agree, this is talking about the flip side of FA which is by works alone, which also is unBiblical.

So when Paul renounces "justification by works" he renounces the view that anything we do along with faith is credited to us as righteousness. Only faith obtains the verdict, not guilty, when we become Christians. Works of any kind are not acceptable in the moment of initial justification. But when James affirms "justification by works" he means that works are absolutely necessary in the ongoing life of a Christian to confirm and prove the reality of the faith which justifies.
Paul denounces both works of the Law and works alone, thats it. As for the "verdict" and "not guilty" talk, I dont know where the Bible talks like that, but the forgiveness of sins is clearly not related to faith alone, but to external acts done by faith like Baptism, which washes away sins and makes a person a Christian.
As far as James meaning works are there "to prove the reality of a faith that justifie" thats is not what he is saying, he was driving home the need for works as part of the justification process. It can be summed up as, not by faith nor by works alone, but faith "active with and completed by works" (james2:22).

For Paul, "justification by works" (which he rejects) means "gaining right standing with God by the merit of works." For James, "justification by works" (which he accepts) means "maintaining a right standing with God by faith along with the necessary evidence of faith, namely, the works of love."
Both rejected works alone, both rejected faith alone, both rejected works of the Law requirements.

To put it yet another way: When Paul teaches in Romans 4:5 that we are justified by faith alone, he means that the only thing that unites us to Christ for righteousness is dependence on Christ. When James says in James 2:24 that we are not justified by faith alone he means that the faith which justifies does not remain alone. These two positions are not contradictory. Faith alone unites us to Christ for righteousness, and the faith that unites us to Christ for righteousness does not remain alone. It bears the fruit of love. It must do so or it is dead, demon, useless faith and does not justify.
It is important to note what James said though "you see a man is JUSTIFIED BY WORKS and not by FA" v24. Works are part of justification and John Piper downplayed and ignored this fact.

The glory of Christ in the gospel is not merely that we are justified when we depend entirely on Christ, but also that depending entirely on Christ is the power that makes us new, loving people. Depending entirely on Christ is how we are justified and how we are sanctified. Paul struck the one note. James struck the other. Both are true and together they bring Christ the glory due his name.
I agree that both are true and neither contradict eachother. The problem was with Calvin when he knew full well what the passage said was forced to change the definitions of terms like justification depending on who spoke in order to hold onto unBiblical teachings. It is clear of his unBiblical and UnChristian position on salvation, totally at odds with what Christians have always believed. He says it himself:
If you would make James consistent with the other Scriptures and with himself, you must give the word justify, as used by him, a different meaning from what it has with Paul.
Look at this, no basis to do this, yet he does. He must change terms and definitions and ignore passages to fit his twisted views.
 
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Isaiah 53

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kevken said:
I was making a point short hand. It seems a little more detail is necessary. Our works are a necessary side effect of salvation, however they do not save nor assist in saving. Christ said "If you love me keep my commandments" THis obedience however does not gain any merit in the sight of God. The only merit I could obtain in God's sight is if I loved God with all of my heart every moment of every second of every hour of every day and with my mind every moment of every day and with my soul every moment of every day, and with my strength every moment of every day; all of the above is coupled with external visible works. If my works are not coupled with the greatest commandment then my "works are as filthy rags."

Now if you or anyone for that matter tells me that they have loved GOd thoroughly and completely the very same quantity and quality as Christ (for the only way that Christ loves the Lord is loving Him with all of HIs heart soul mind and strength all the time) at any moment of any day coupled with a good work I think anyone reading this post will have to chuckle along with me.

Christ said "by their fruits you will know them." That is, His people. Those fruits are good works.


So we agree! Faith and Works are necessary for Salvation! For you said I must DO something to be saved. That is LOVE; which is exactly what geocajun was saying! Love is not an abstract, but a conscious CHOICE we must do DAILY!

The Catholic (and others) postion has always been that BOTH are necessary; NOT ONE APART FROM THE OTHER!!! It seems to me that Calvanists (and other Protestants) insist that Catholics believe in works WITHOUT faith; which is not, nor has ever been, the case. Both are necessary as is clearly drawn out all throughout Scripture. St. James and St. Paul do NOT contradict--they are in perfect harmony.

PAX CHRISTI
 
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Catholic Dude said:
I was looking on a calvinist page of Calvin's commentaries and his work Institutes, and looked up where they referenced James2:24. I was shocked at how much twisting and turning he did with that verse!

For those who need a refresher, here is James2:24
24 You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

For his Commentary on the book of James, I looked up Ch2, v24, but guess what, that verse wasnt even recognized as a verse! The commentary is set up in one-verse-at-a-time commentary, but v24 is missing! Look here, I know you could argue a mistype on the part of the web page makers, but on their page they say this work was proof read. Not to mention what are the odds that 2:24 is missing and not some other random verse?



Now from his Institutes its amazing he dances around the verse, refuses to accept what it says and even changes definitions to fit his agenda:
11. But they say that we have a still more serious business with James, who in express terms opposes us. For he asks, “Was not Abraham our father justified by works?” and adds “You see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only,” (James 2:21, 24). What then? Will they engage Paul in a quarrel with James? If they hold James to be a servant of Christ, his sentiments must be understood as not dissenting from Christ speaking by the mouth of Paul. By the mouth of Paul the Spirit declares that Abraham obtained justification by faith, not by works; we also teach that all are justified by faith without the works of the law. By James the same Spirit declares that both Abraham’s justification and ours consists of works, and not of faith only. It is certain that the Spirit cannot be at variance with himself. Where, then, will be the agreement? It is enough for our opponents, provided they can tear up that justification by faith which we regard as fixed by the deepest roots: to restore peace to the conscience is to them a matter of no great concern. Hence you may see, that though they indeed carp at the doctrine of justification by faith, they meanwhile point out no goal of righteousness at which the conscience may rest. Let them triumph then as they will, so long as the only victory they can boast of is, that they have deprived righteousness of all its certainty. This miserable victory they will indeed obtain when the light of truth is extinguished, and the Lord permits them to darken it with their lies. But wherever the truth of God stands they cannot prevail. I deny, then, that the passage of James which they are constantly holding up before us as if it were the shield of Achilles, gives them the slightest countenance. To make this plain, let us first attend to the scope of the Apostle, and then show wherein their hallucination consists. As at that time (and the evil has existed in the Church ever since) there were many who, while they gave manifest proof of their infidelity, by neglecting and omitting all the works peculiar to believers, ceased not falsely to glory in the name of faith, James here dissipates their vain confidence. His intention therefore is, not to derogate in any degree from the power of true faith, but to show how absurdly these triflers laid claim only to the empty name, and resting satisfied with it, felt secure in unrestrained indulgence in vice. This state of matters being understood, it will be easy to see where the error of our opponents lies. They fall into a double paralogism, the one in the term faith, the other in the term justifying. The Apostle, in giving the name of faith to an empty opinion altogether differing from true faith, makes a concession which derogates in no respect from his case. This he demonstrates at the outset by the words, “What does it profit, my brethren, though a man say he has faith, and have not works?” (James 2:14). He says not, “If a man have faith without works,” but “if he say that he has.” This becomes still clearer when a little after he derides this faith as worse than that of devils, and at last when he calls it “dead.” You may easily ascertain his meaning by the explanation, “Thou believest that there is one God.” Surely if all which is contained in that faith is a belief in the existence of God, there is no wonder that it does not justify. The denial of such a power to it cannot be supposed to derogate in any degree from Christian faith, which is of a very different description. ...


12. We have not made good our point until we dispose of the other paralogism: since James places a part of justification in works. If you would make James consistent with the other Scriptures and with himself, you must give the word justify, as used by him, a different meaning from what it has with Paul. In the sense of Paul we are said to be justified when the remembrance of our unrighteousness is obliterated and we are counted righteous. Had James had the same meaning it would have been absurd for him to quote the words of Moses, “Abraham believed God,” &c. The context runs thus: “Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the Scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness.” [James2:21] If it is absurd to say that the effect was prior to its cause, either Moses falsely declares in that passage that Abraham’s faith was imputed for righteousness or Abraham, by his obedience in offering up Isaac, did not merit righteousness. Before the existence of Ishmael, who was a grown youth at the birth of Isaac, Abraham was justified by his faith. How thee can we say that he obtained justification by an obedience which followed long after? Wherefore, either James erroneously inverts the proper order (this it were impious to suppose), or he meant not to say that he was justified, as if he deserved to be deemed just. What then? It appears certain that he is speaking of the manifestation, not of the imputation of righteousness, as if he had said, Those who are justified by true faith prove their justification by obedience and good works, not by a bare and imaginary semblance of faith. In one word, he is not discussing the mode of justification, but requiring that the justification of believers shall be operative. And as Paul contends that men are justified without the aid of works, so James will not allow any to be regarded as justified who are destitute of good works. Due attention to the scope will thus disentangle every doubt; for the error of our opponents lies chiefly in this, that they think James is defining the mode of justification, whereas his only object is to destroy the depraved security of those who vainly pretended faith as an excuse for their contempt of good works. Therefore, let them twist the words of James as they may, they will never extract out of them more than the two propositions: That an empty phantom of faith does not justify, and that the believer, not contented with such an imagination, manifests his justification by good works.

13. They gain nothing by quoting from Paul to the same effect, that “not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified,” (Rom. 2:13). I am unwilling to evade the difficulty by the solution of Ambrose, that Paul spoke thus because faith in Christ is the fulfillment of the law. This I regard as a mere subterfuge, and one too for which there is no occasion, as the explanation is perfectly obvious. The Apostle’s object is to suppress the absurd confidence of the Jews who gave out that they alone had a knowledge of the law, though at the very time they where its greatest despisers. That they might not plume themselves so much on a bare acquaintance with the law, he reminds them that when justification is sought by the law, the thing required is not the knowledge but the observance of it. We certainly mean not to dispute that the righteousness of the law consists in works, and not only so, but that justification consists in the dignity and merits of works. But this proves not that we are justified by works unless they can produce some one who has fulfilled the law. That Paul had no other meaning is abundantly obvious from the context.

Amazing how Calvin ignores verse24 the entire time and dances around the issue (eg tries to make Paul and James at odds), and even redefining terms like justification, even when Paul and James are talking about the same passage in Genesis with Abraham!


Jam 2:24
Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith.

You are misunderstanding what James is saying in James Chapter 2. In the context James is Saying, genuine faith shows its self by a changed heart and life and changed attitudes toward others. The word justified dikaioō in this passage means here not "to make righteous but to show one to be righteous. James is not dealing with the means of salvation but the proof of salvation. He says before this in James 2:10:
Jam 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is become guilty of all.

NO one can keep the law it is weak through the flesh. We cannot live a good enough life to please God. the only way we can fullfill the law is with a changed heart filled with the love of Jesus Christ. But still we are not perfect. That is why Jesus came and bore the penality of our sin on the Cross. When We rcieve Christ by faith his righteousness is imputed to us. We who were not righteous are declared righteous.

God Bless
Greeker
 
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greeker57married-

Jam 2:24 Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith.

You are misunderstanding what James is saying in James Chapter 2. In the context James is Saying, genuine faith shows its self by a changed heart and life and changed attitudes toward others.
First I would ask that you list this "context" to the contrary of what I have said. Second of all you seem to be doing the same thing that Calvin and others keep doing is ignoring the verse and jumping around it. It says "justified by works" and "not by faith alone".

The word justified dikaioō in this passage means here not "to make righteous but to show one to be righteous.
The context of the verse v24 shows Abraham being justifed, which by the way was the same exact verse Paul used on Abraham.

James is not dealing with the means of salvation but the proof of salvation.
Thats not what it says at all. Your ignoring the text.

He says before this in James 2:10:
Jam 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is become guilty of all.
This is 14 verses away from the verse I was citing. Infact if you keep reading he is not talking about the Law at all, but everyday Christian good works. The times he cites Abraham and Rahab they werent concerning the Law at all.

NO one can keep the law it is weak through the flesh. We cannot live a good enough life to please God. the only way we can fullfill the law is with a changed heart filled with the love of Jesus Christ. But still we are not perfect. That is why Jesus came and bore the penality of our sin on the Cross. When We rcieve Christ by faith his righteousness is imputed to us. We who were not righteous are declared righteous.
Im dont know what to say, this is another post where the verse 24 itself is ignored as is its immediate context and side issues are started.

 
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JRP

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Hi mmomof7,

I know I'm a little late to this thread, so I'll make just a brief comment. Your post couldn't be more on the money. Excellent explanation and clarification of a widespread misunderstanding. There is absolutely no contradiction between James and Paul. They each merely emphasize one side of the same soteriological coin to fit the context of their respective points. There is a "reformation slogan" that summarizes and harmonizes Paul and James nicely. That is, we are saved by faith alone, but not by faith that is alone. In other words, works are the fruit and demonstration of true God given, heart changing, saving faith.
 
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