Beyonce in college?

[cow451]

There's a term for some of these. I think it's called basket weavin, but I sorta understand what you mean. I don't understand what liberal arts is though or what kind of job it can get you.

Wouldn't the tea party be better to have a class on though? Every time i see the occupy pie, I see self entitlement. I just figured that it died down because the gave up.

Are you kidding? The "Tea Party" people are so full of their own sense of entitlement, it's ridiculous. Now, having said that, one of the thin-skinned TP's will probably report me.

Seriously, the Beyonce success story is classic capitalism and shrewd business practices. I doubt anybody has worked harder or smarter.

 

[I Eat Pie]

Are you kidding? The "Tea Party" people are so full of their own sense of entitlement, it's ridiculous. Now, having said that, one of the thin-skinned TP's will probably report me.

Seriously, the Beyonce success story is classic capitalism and shrewd business practices. I doubt anybody has worked harder or smarter.

Lol. If I was semi-attractive and had nice hips, I would make it too.

There was actually a course at another college about Jay-Z. Unfortunately for the students, it was an actual business course, and not an easy A type of celebrity gossip course, and the students complained about it being "too hard", and that they "weren't prepared" for the material.

I think it's safe to assume that if this is an actual business related course, all the people who joined for the gossip and fashion are going to feel pretty dumb about all the money they threw down the toilet.

And if it is a business course, they why don't they include actual businessmen who made it far with real talent or hard work? What Beyonce does doesn't look like either. Not trying to bash her. Just saying that there's probably a million other people they could have picked to talk about, like maybe Oprah.

Or if it's one of those "women empowerment" kind of studies, why can't they have women who made a real difference in society like Rosa Parks?

 

[keith99]

There's a term for some of these. I think it's called basket weavin, but I sorta understand what you mean. I don't understand what liberal arts is though or what kind of job it can get you.

Wouldn't the tea party be better to have a class on though? Every time i see the occupy pie, I see self entitlement. I just figured that it died down because the gave up.

Liberal Arts means very different things depending on what it being applied to.

Very different. Occidental College is a Liberal Arts school. Yet my major was far from what meny think of. Geo-Physics. I started as either a Math of Physics major. I think officialy physics, but that meant the first 2 years of majors math.

Harvard, Yale, Stanford and Pomana college come to mind for me when I thnikof other Liberal Arts Schools.

Looking for a job means a technical school, not bad, but overall a poor education and one which may well leave you high andf dry if the market changes a bit. That is as opposed to true engineering or science schools Like Cal. Tech, MIT, Columbia or Harvey Mudd.

Oh and just for the record. When I ws at Oxy and Physics major could attend Oxy for 3 years anf then transfer to Cal Tech or Columbia for 2 more and get degrees from both schools. 2 four degrees in just 5 years.

But to me a major of "Liberal Arts" says someone who has not yet decided on their major. Fine if they are making headway in 3 or 3 areas and have not decided, not so good if just floundering. (Heck I could have picked any of 4 majors besides the one I picked as late as my Jr. year no problem. (Physic, Chemistry, Math or Geology).

 

[I Eat Pie]

So... Basically a degree for people who haven't picked a major?

 

[Tropical Wilds]

There's a term for some of these. I think it's called basket weavin, but I sorta understand what you mean. I don't understand what liberal arts is though or what kind of job it can get you.

Wouldn't the tea party be better to have a class on though? Every time i see the occupy pie, I see self entitlement. I just figured that it died down because the gave up.

Liberal Arts degrees can get you a variety of things to varying degrees of usefulness. It's popular degree for teachers around here. It can mean arts-based careers, curators, etc. Or it can mean a whole lot of nothing. Depends on how you choose to apply it.

I'm sure somewhere there's a class on the TP. And regardless on if you agree with the Occupy movement, I know I didn't, there is a lot to study there from a business and political standpoint. It seems like a course like that would be a Political Science major's dream.

Besides which, the point of the class most likely isn't a bash session, it's to learn about the origin of the movement and the effects it had. You don't need to agree with it, but there is a lot to be learned from it.

Lol. If I was semi-attractive and had nice hips, I would make it too.

Ignoring the sexist aspect of that comment... There are a lot of pretty women in the industry. There are a lot of prettier women who haven't made it. Her looks are all well and good, but she didn't get where she is based on how she looks. By all accounts, she is a shrewd businesswoman who has a remarkable eye for her brand and how to expand it. I suspect it's an interesting study.

There was actually a course at another college about Jay-Z. Unfortunately for the students, it was an actual business course, and not an easy A type of celebrity gossip course, and the students complained about it being "too hard", and that they "weren't prepared" for the material.

I think it's safe to assume that if this is an actual business related course, all the people who joined for the gossip and fashion are going to feel pretty dumb about all the money they threw down the toilet.

Maybe they will. Not sure how that matters to anything... Having done the whole college thing, I have to say you walk through the doors to 90% of your classes totally unsure of how they are or even what they are. I remember thinking that English Lit would kill me and Children's Lit would be a cakewalk. I got an A in English Comp and Lit while barely participating, and Children's Lit was absolutely BRUTAL.

And if it is a business course, they why don't they include actual businessmen who made it far with real talent or hard work? What Beyonce does doesn't look like either. Not trying to bash her. Just saying that there's probably a million other people they could have picked to talk about, like maybe Oprah.

Or if it's one of those "women empowerment" kind of studies, why can't they have women who made a real difference in society like Rosa Parks?

I'm not a Beyonce fan... I don't think I even have a song of hers or have downloaded a song of hers... Maybe years and years ago, but regardless, her music doesn't make an impression on me.

That said, the success of actual businessmen would have little relevance in a media/modern culture standpoint, which is what this class sounds like it is. Classes that refer to Oprah I'm sure exist, but she's not the powerhouse she once was. Beyonce is certainly a first of her kind, even in a way previous female artists haven't done. She's a brand. She's not a person, she is the first, real, self-made, living, breathing, brand. Again, there are degrees that would have merit in studying that.

Even from a female empowerment angle (not sure why you put that in quotes), she's still a better draw then, say, Rosa Parks, who's contribution (by her own admission) was accidental and largely fleeting, not to mention misunderstood. She was a woman on a bus who was tired and didn't want to give up her seat. She wasn't trying to start a movement, just keep her seat. A total contrast to Beyonce who's very carefully cultivated in everything she does.

To have a class on Beyonce doesn't degrade other icons, it just means there are things about her worth studying for certain degree fields.

 

[I Eat Pie]

Liberal Arts degrees can get you a variety of things to varying degrees of usefulness. It's popular degree for teachers around here. It can mean arts-based careers, curators, etc. Or it can mean a whole lot of nothing. Depends on how you choose to apply it.

I'm sure somewhere there's a class on the TP. And regardless on if you agree with the Occupy movement, I know I didn't, there is a lot to study there from a business and political standpoint. It seems like a course like that would be a Political Science major's dream.

Besides which, the point of the class most likely isn't a bash session, it's to learn about the origin of the movement and the effects it had. You don't need to agree with it, but there is a lot to be learned from it.



Ignoring the sexist aspect of that comment... There are a lot of pretty women in the industry. There are a lot of prettier women who haven't made it. Her looks are all well and good, but she didn't get where she is based on how she looks. By all accounts, she is a shrewd businesswoman who has a remarkable eye for her brand and how to expand it. I suspect it's an interesting study.



Maybe they will. Not sure how that matters to anything... Having done the whole college thing, I have to say you walk through the doors to 90% of your classes totally unsure of how they are or even what they are. I remember thinking that English Lit would kill me and Children's Lit would be a cakewalk. I got an A in English Comp and Lit while barely participating, and Children's Lit was absolutely BRUTAL.



I'm not a Beyonce fan... I don't think I even have a song of hers or have downloaded a song of hers... Maybe years and years ago, but regardless, her music doesn't make an impression on me.

That said, the success of actual businessmen would have little relevance in a media/modern culture standpoint, which is what this class sounds like it is. Classes that refer to Oprah I'm sure exist, but she's not the powerhouse she once was. Beyonce is certainly a first of her kind, even in a way previous female artists haven't done. She's a brand. She's not a person, she is the first, real, self-made, living, breathing, brand. Again, there are degrees that would have merit in studying that.

Even from a female empowerment angle (not sure why you put that in quotes), she's still a better draw then, say, Rosa Parks, who's contribution (by her own admission) was accidental and largely fleeting, not to mention misunderstood. She was a woman on a bus who was tired and didn't want to give up her seat. She wasn't trying to start a movement, just keep her seat. A total contrast to Beyonce who's very carefully cultivated in everything she does.

To have a class on Beyonce doesn't degrade other icons, it just means there are things about her worth studying for certain degree fields.

Well ok. I'll give what you said a chance, and keep following this story to see how it turns out. Like what the students say about the course. I might have to dig deep but I'm sure I can find some sort of review. It's just that this is all new to me. Growing up, I was taught that college was this sophisticated place where you gotta be super smart and hearing about pop culture classes was a first for me.

I grew watching MTV and all those music videos, so even though I enjoyed the music and the shows, I always had somewhat of a negative view on a lot of this pop culture.

And excuse the hips comment. Lets say.... Perfect abs and dashing good looks? Idk lol.

 

[Tomk80]

Well ok. I'll give what you said a chance, and keep following this story to see how it turns out. Like what the students say about the course. I might have to dig deep but I'm sure I can find some sort of review. It's just that this is all new to me. Growing up, I was taught that college was this sophisticated place where you gotta be super smart and hearing about pop culture classes was a first for me.

I grew watching MTV and all those music videos, so even though I enjoyed the music and the shows, I always had somewhat of a negative view on a lot of this pop culture.

And excuse the hips comment. Lets say.... Perfect abs and dashing good looks? Idk lol.

Even if you have a negative view on (a lot of) pop culture, it is still a dominant culture in current society. You purely from that perspective it is worth studying. I would go even further, for students who are doing a study that is cultural in set-up (i.e. gender studies, marketing or similar), spending time to analyze pop-culture and how it connects to it's predecessors is of vital importance.

Similar with a class on Beyonce. I can think of a whole range of items that you can hang up on this, depending on the study that the course is a part of that could lead to valuable insights. From the musical side (composition, lyrics), to the visual side (video clips), to larger aspects like branding, business model or the influence on culture.

You have to be aware that learning overall theory may be good, but learning how to apply this theory in practice is something else completely and using popular examples to study theory in depth can be a very good learning tool.

 

[cow451]

Lol. If I was semi-attractive and had nice hips, I would make it too.

And if it is a business course, they why don't they include actual businessmen who made it far with real talent or hard work? What Beyonce does doesn't look like either. Not trying to bash her. Just saying that there's probably a million other people they could have picked to talk about, like maybe Oprah.

You obviously have no idea how professional dancing requires tremendous work and conditioning. Think about the most strenuous workout you've ever done, double the time and repeat until you have done it perfectly. Then get back to us after you have also had a baby.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

At the risk of sounding very old...

My sister's family member went to film school and one of the first classes he took, I don't remember the class specifically, it some sort of screenwriting class... Anyway, the first day of the class, they watched the opening scene of "Saturday Night Fever." Iconic movie, for sure, but a study on film making? Maybe not so much.

But he said that it was the introduction to the perfect, most useful class he took in his college career. He explained that the start of that little, silly movie had one of the most genius slices of storytelling in modern (at the time) cinema. It seemed like nothing, but they ended up, in about one minute, using very little dialogue, and a well-chosen song, conveying an entire story about the main character. You knew he was about image, you knew he was a ladies man, but you knew he was a blue collar worker who was struggling and wanted out. No words. Just a song and a walk down the street. The teacher of the class said that the genius of it was it gave the story in such a way where the audience would know the message was a big deal and key to the plot, but they wouldn't notice that they were being told it. They were experiencing it, they weren't being told... And even now, it turns out that stupid walk down the street has become iconic for just that very reason. You experienced a story in a minute and it had a way different effect then if the audience had just been told "here's a kid who's broke but wants to get out" which is something that is heard in most movies, before and since.

Now, if you were to hear that a class at some college somewhere was teaching a class about "Saturday Night Fever," it'd sound ridiculous. But then you get the context, and suddenly not only does it make sense, it's pretty darn effective.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

You obviously have no idea how professional dancing requires tremendous work and conditioning. Think about the most strenuous workout you've ever done, double the time and repeat until you have done it perfectly. Then get back to us after you have also had a baby.

I'm going to agree with that. There's no denying that she's a mover. Having played my share of "Micheal Jackson: The Experience," I can say that dancing the types of dances that are a fraction of what she does, while trying to sing on key and hit your marks... It's not exactly easy. National Anthem debacle excluded, which to be fair wasn't her fault anyway, there is no denying that she is that pop package and that's not an easy thing to maintain.

 

[keith99]

You obviously have no idea how professional dancing requires tremendous work and conditioning. Think about the most strenuous workout you've ever done, double the time and repeat until you have done it perfectly. Then get back to us after you have also had a baby.

I'd hazzard the most strenous workout I've ever done is a bit beyond dancing.

BUT, I was a swimmer for a couple of decades. Not great, but good enough to be in the same workout as NAIA national champions. (Heck my freshman year I was leading the defending national champion in the 1000 for the first 400 yeads at league prelims) . Oh and at my AAU club I was allowed to leave the pool at any time during workouts. No one else, ever as far as I know. But then the caoch knew why, it was cookie losing time.

later I took up Rugby, ran myself into the emergency room twice. No injury, just too much work.

But that is all jsut leadin. I completely respect dancers as athletes and wanted to pointout one little thing you omitted. You are right top level dance is right up there. AND you have to make it look easy and smile the whole time. That last is not easy at all.

 

[cow451]

I'd hazzard the most strenous workout I've ever done is a bit beyond dancing.

BUT, I was a swimmer for a couple of decades. Not great, but good enough to be in the same workout as NAIA national champions. (Heck my freshman year I was leading the defending national champion in the 1000 for the first 400 yeads at league prelims) . Oh and at my AAU club I was allowed to leave the pool at any time during workouts. No one else, ever as far as I know. But then the caoch knew why, it was cookie losing time.

later I took up Rugby, ran myself into the emergency room twice. No injury, just too much work.

But that is all jsut leadin. I completely respect dancers as athletes and wanted to pointout one little thing you omitted. You are right top level dance is right up there. AND you have to make it look easy and smile the whole time. That last is not easy at all.

Doing synchronized swimming while singing Bootylicious might be a good comparison.

 

[apache1]

Doing synchronized swimming while singing Bootilicious might be a good comparison.

Myself, I like Sir Mix-a-lot's "Baby Got Back" better

 

[Tomk80]

I'd hazzard the most strenous workout I've ever done is a bit beyond dancing.

BUT, I was a swimmer for a couple of decades. Not great, but good enough to be in the same workout as NAIA national champions. (Heck my freshman year I was leading the defending national champion in the 1000 for the first 400 yeads at league prelims) . Oh and at my AAU club I was allowed to leave the pool at any time during workouts. No one else, ever as far as I know. But then the caoch knew why, it was cookie losing time.

later I took up Rugby, ran myself into the emergency room twice. No injury, just too much work.

But that is all jsut leadin. I completely respect dancers as athletes and wanted to pointout one little thing you omitted. You are right top level dance is right up there. AND you have to make it look easy and smile the whole time. That last is not easy at all.

They actually have studied this, and apparently dancing, especially the type Beyonce does at the level where Beyonce is doing it, is one of the most strenuous sports there is. More strenuous than many other sports. Now, I don't know where swimming ranks, but I would suggest that the assumption that swimming is more strenuous than dancing might turn out not to be true.

 

[seashale76]

At first, I thought this thread was about Beyonce going to college herself. I'm all for that. However, classes on pop-culture topics can have a place, it's just that they tend to be done poorly (more often than not).

 

[keith99]

They actually have studied this, and apparently dancing, especially the type Beyonce does at the level where Beyonce is doing it, is one of the most strenuous sports there is. More strenuous than many other sports. Now, I don't know where swimming ranks, but I would suggest that the assumption that swimming is more strenuous than dancing might turn out not to be true.

Who is the they?

And what level for both?

Years ago, decades actually I saw an article which gave the calories burned for various activities. Swimming was second to running at 800 vrs 900.

BUT the running pace was 5 minute miles. The swimming pace was 1/4 mile per hour. There are swimmers who can do a quarter mile in under 4 minutes! I can still do 1/4 mile in an hour without looking like I'm swimming!

Dancing is going to score very very high for just doing it. Not nearly as high (still right up there) when compared to racing activities at race pace.

 

[keith99]

At first, I thought this thread was about Beyonce going to college herself. I'm all for that. However, classes on pop-culture topics can have a place, it's just that they tend to be done poorly (more often than not).

Actually that varies a huge amount.

If the administration is pushing for 'culturally relevent' classes or looking to out 'bums in seats' this kind of a class is often junk.

It an instructor has a real interest and has to sell it to the administration they are often excellent classes. And also not an easy class at all, same sell often involves academic rigour.

 

[I Eat Pie]

Actually cow, I'm in labor for the fifth time as we speak

 

[Verv]

College to offer class on Beyonce | The Daily Caller


For anyone who didn't click it, some college is offering classes on Beyonce Studies, and the University of Columbia is offering classes on Occupy Wall Street Studies.

Is it really worth higher funding of colleges and universities if they make classes like these? I can't seem to come up with career fields who would accept these or even what degree you can get with this stuff.

Any opinions?

These classes are all electives, I assume, and the entire curriculum is geared at covering an absolutely massive idea.

When they're studying Beyonce they are also studying her overall role in, say, the market and what she means as a black female empowered by capitalist consumer music & culture, etc.

This is not as utterly asinine as it is portrayed by the media.

 

[keith99]

These classes are all electives, I assume, and the entire curriculum is geared at covering an absolutely massive idea.

When they're studying Beyonce they are also studying her overall role in, say, the market and what she means as a black female empowered by capitalist consumer music & culture, etc.

This is not as utterly asinine as it is portrayed by the media.

I'm not sure why, but yuor post inspired me to take a step back and one sideways and think a bit about jsut whatthe goals of college should be.

If the goal of college is to train workers for jobs then thsi kind of class is a waste.

It the goal of college is to teach people how to think and learn then this kind of class can be an excellent tool to accomplish just that.

In the real world it is not an either or situation and a good college accomplishes both. Which turns out a person who can think and has the skills to find a position where thinking is useful and fulfilling.

As my mind wandered I realized there is a Novella by Isaac Asimov that shows the huge problems of those who have been trained in 'stuff' but not in learning. For those interested I'd suggest reading it, the name is "Profession".

Side point to the story, by the end it puts a rather different light on the saying "Those who can't do teach".