Beware of wrong teaching

[marke]

I have talked to some Christians about there involment in politics on boards like this one, but many see nothing wrong with it, in fact some think its our duty to do so. My advice to you is leave them alone if they refuse to listen, they will find out sooner or later.​

That's great advice. But how do you not call out to someone standing on the highway in front of a bus not to move out of the way.

Nothing I have ever read in the NT tells people to involve themselves in issues of the world and is in fact the very thing that can destroy their soul.

Thanks for the advise.

God Bless.

 

[marke]

Hebrews 5:12-14
For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat. For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

1 Corinthians 6:1-3
Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?
Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world?
And if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
Know ye not that we shall judge angels?
How much more things that pertain to this life?


On that point we agree....


Irrelevant to the arguement at hand...
(ref: wiki - Logical Falacies, #3 "No True Scottsman...")
A more than common Faux Pas, made by a person who is debating on shaky grounds.


...which is what I have done.
I quote scriptures, while you espouse your personal opinions.


John 5:39-47
<Words of Jesus>
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. I receive not honour from men. But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?
Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Excellent post, Wisdom's Child. Thank you.

You are correct. Around that area in I or II Cor you'll also find where we are told to discern and judge within the church and that God is the judge without the church.

Here is where the problem is. Christians are being told to condemn those outside the church instead of inside the church and all that does is condemn themselves.

And I really like your ending paragraph. This is what the OT is all about. Proving who the Christ is, but as I mentioned in another post, I was called to Jesus with a "Fire Bible" without the OT. The NT stood on its own.

I do try and quote scripture rather than opinion. Thank you for reminding me to keep to the facts.

God bless.

 

[marke]

No one said we have to join political parties...and we are most certainly told to make the world a better place..
1. By spreading the Gospel
2. By caring for those in need physically

Nothing limits us from entering politics or any other industry. What we do there is the important issue.

Like in IRAQ right.

That action really pulled in the souls for Jesus didn't it?

What a shame. He could have done so much good and instead chose the darkness.

God bless.

 

[mont974x4]

Actually I fully support the Iraq front in the war on terror. You know what kind of love is shown when we sacrifice so much for a breath of freedom for other people? Fighting for them to have an environment that allows the Gospel to be preached? I really don't understand how Christians can be against this. It's seems selfish and hypocritical to me for people to gladly accept freedom that most of them didn't fight for but want to deny other people freedom because it may cost them something.

 

[imaniingod]

God Bless Each And Everyone And I Will Be Praying For You.

 

[imaniingod]

Go ye into all the world, winning souls for Christ! Being that one voice crying in the wilderness, prepare ye the way of the Lord.

 

[RonnyRulz]

Fighting for them to have an environment that allows the Gospel to be preached? I really don't understand how Christians can be against this.

Tell that to the innocent citizens who died. To fight a war to give freedom to a people? What people? Definitely not all the people.

Anyways, you don't have to fight man with the sword to have an environment where the gospel will be preached. God is fully capable of sending out people, fully protected by Him, to preach the gospel. God is not powerless that He can't preach the gospel in certain areas because it's "too dangeous." It's more of He can't preach the gospel in certain areas because people think it's too dangerous and don't have enough faith in God to follow God's Will. God keeps those in His Will safe from harms way.

To fight a war with the sword, to give others freedom, is to take away the freedom of others. Whether guilty or innocent, people die in wars. How can you justify taking the life of one man to give freedom to another?

If you had to kill Innocent Citizen Joe to give freedom to Innocent Citizen Bill, is it just? Who are you, who is the US Military, to decide who gets to live with freedom and who gets to die?

War is Hell, that's a fact. My question is, how could any Christian ever support Hell? Be in favor of Hell? Support, and even participate in, the creation of Hell? I thought Hell was suppose to be what Christians stray from and try to keep people out of, not something they create.

 

[Brian1040]

That's great advice. But how do you not call out to someone standing on the highway in front of a bus not to move out of the way.

Nothing I have ever read in the NT tells people to involve themselves in issues of the world and is in fact the very thing that can destroy their soul.

Thanks for the advise.

God Bless.

Do what you can without forcing it down there throut..so to speak.

 

[liveandlove]

In response to OP.....I was surprised to see this thread. Pastor Joel is my pastor. He does not tell us how to vote and whom to vote for. He tells us to vote because we are Christians and that we can influence the world with our biblical view through our voting.

Dr. Hunter is a man of God. He is humble and he loves the Lord. Maybe he makes mistakes, but don't we all? He lives his Christianity. His wife and his whole family are humble and his sons serve in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. We belong to a wealthy congregation but Pastor Joel lives in humility and has always given his whole life in service unlike these rich pastors jetting around and are living it up. Pastor Joel deserves love and respect. He is a man of God.

Your stance is dangerous. We ARE in this world and we are the salt of the world. If we lose our saltiness what good are we for? You cannot take yourself out of the world because you are Christian. That is called self-righteousness. We are to be fishers of men and to tell them of the love and forgiveness of Christ. We are not to be holier than thou and ineffective. We all need mercy because we are all sinners - not one is righteous.

 

[marke]

In response to OP.....I was surprised to see this thread. Pastor Joel is my pastor. He does not tell us how to vote and whom to vote for. He tells us to vote because we are Christians and that we can influence the world with our biblical view through our voting.

Dr. Hunter is a man of God. He is humble and he loves the Lord. Maybe he makes mistakes, but don't we all? He lives his Christianity. His wife and his whole family are humble and his sons serve in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. We belong to a wealthy congregation but Pastor Joel lives in humility and has always given his whole life in service unlike these rich pastors jetting around and are living it up. Pastor Joel deserves love and respect. He is a man of God.

Your stance is dangerous. We ARE in this world and we are the salt of the world. If we lose our saltiness what good are we for? You cannot take yourself out of the world because you are Christian. That is called self-righteousness. We are to be fishers of men and to tell them of the love and forgiveness of Christ. We are not to be holier than thou and ineffective. We all need mercy because we are all sinners - not one is righteous.

Would you please cite NT scripture to support your position that you should involve yourself in the world. Where anywhere are you encouraged to get yourself elected, fight anybody, or strive.

I don't know Pastor Joel, I do know his position and it is incorrect according to NT scripture. I however am not without fault and I do accept correction, so please show me the scripture you base this belief upon.

We Christians, according to NT scripture, may judge others within the church (you wouldn't want to hang around a bunch of divorced people inside a church would you!), but outside God is the judge and you only condemn yourself (divorced people for example) by condemning those outside the church (gay people for example) which is what your Pastor wants you to do. It's wrong.

Your Pastor may be the nicest person around, but if he is leading people astray according to NT scripture, then he is leading people astray.

Let's seek the truth. Can you post your supporting scripture please.

God bless.

 

[holo]

What is "the world" anyway? A night club? A library? Attitudes? Culture?

We're not to be like the world or be tainted by it. That probably means a lot of things, but I'm thinking "let's not be judgmental like the world. Let's not be religious like the world. Let's not struggle for good appearances like the world."

Not conforming to this world isn't about outer stuff like going to a movie theatre or being involved with politics. It's much deeper than that.

 

[deshadow]

this is a fantastic idea....

is there a website that lists bad preachers and bad churches. the stakes are obviously too high and there should be some sort of easily accessible internet site that lists preachers and congregations that are in danger of sending to people to hell.

 

[Always in His Presence]

this is a fantastic idea....

is there a website that lists bad preachers and bad churches. the stakes are obviously too high and there should be some sort of easily accessible internet site that lists preachers and congregations that are in danger of sending to people to hell.

Bad according to whom?

The difficulty is that there are lots of Christians that find cause for division for just about anything.

Who would you trust enough that it would be accurate?

 

[Starcrystal]

this is a fantastic idea....

is there a website that lists bad preachers and bad churches. the stakes are obviously too high and there should be some sort of easily accessible internet site that lists preachers and congregations that are in danger of sending to people to hell.

Sorry, bad idea I think.
Protestants would list Catholics. Catholics would list Protestants. Baptists would list pentecostals because some baptists believe the "gifts of the spirit" if manifest today are of the devil. Pentecostals would list baptists for denying the gifts! See where I'm going with this.

The only way such a website would be feaseable is if someone could list churches in an unbiased way and tell a little about what was being taught in an unjudgmental way. Then people could seek God to lead them by the Spirit and show where truth was and where error was.

 

[marke]

this is a fantastic idea....

is there a website that lists bad preachers and bad churches. the stakes are obviously too high and there should be some sort of easily accessible internet site that lists preachers and congregations that are in danger of sending to people to hell.

That's not a good idea at all. Talk about asking judgement to come upon you.

I have a better idea. Seek the truth in NT scripture and call peoples attention to the fact that there are people starving all around the world and this isn't the time for churches and preachers to be flying around in private jets, driving fancy cars and preaching wrong teaching.

These are however, the things to look for to see whom is serving themselves and whom is serving the poor.

Take the question "Where did jesus give His followers permission to kill?" The answer is no where. Over 1000 people looked at that thread and not a single line of NT scripture was presented in favor. Instead we found line after line of scripture speaking against it so where does this wrong teaching come from? The transgressors who want to believe what they want to believe and twist the word to suit their beliefs rather than conform their beliefs to the scripture.

Now it is time to stand up for Jesus. Take this information regarding killing into your churches and let them know the huge misconception that Christians can kill is very wrong teaching. If they argue, ask them to find you the scripture supporting their view. Since there is none, you have the choice of staying at that church where you know they are more interested in believing what they want to believe or find a church that is receptive to correction or already recognizes the truth.

Anyway, let's bring forth the truth and those who wish to move forward in their spiritual walk can do so. There is a reason many are called, but few are chosen. Let's strive to be among the chosen following NT scripture rather than be among the lost following fairy tales.

God Bless.

 

[Always in His Presence]

How about if we don't turn our churches into political venues at all?

How about if the churches just do what they were designed to do?

Eph 4:11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; 14 that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting,

15 but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ— 16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love.

 

[Brian1040]

Not conforming to this world isn't about outer stuff like going to a movie theatre or being involved with politics. It's much deeper than that.

It is true that not conforming to this world is more than being involved in politics, but being involved in politics is becoming apart of this world.

Who does the Bible says is the God of this world? Who are the ones that are under the sway of Satan? Who is the responsible for setting up and removing kings/leaders, or even exalting and toppling nation? What did Jesus said about His kingdom, and what His servant would do if others wanted to harm Him? What did Satan said to Jesus when he took Him up on a high mountain? What example could one give to prove that it is fine for Christians to be involved in politics? Is it fine for Christians to be involved in any government, or are there some that they should not be involved in? How do you know which one when they are all corrupt? They all violate the rights of citizens one way or another, including the United States of America. They all knowingly violated laws (international) that they sighed and swore to obey and enforce. What is the propose for Christians involment in politics?

 

[imaniingod]

Praying for everyone here. Get about the Business of the Father. Fulfilling the Great Commission, Go ye in all the world declaring the Good News of THE Lord! He lives and He Reigns!

 

[holo]

I'm glad Martin Luther King and Nelson Mandela got involved in politics and didn't leave it up to only corrupt people.

 

[Brian1040]

I'm glad Martin Luther King and Nelson Mandela got involved in politics and didn't leave it up to only corrupt people.

Martin Luther King and Nelson Mandela did not eliminate oppression and racism. Racism and oppression still exist in the U.S. and South Africa. Instead of discriminating in the open, they do it behind the person's back, and the one who was discriminated against usually does not know.

Only the kingdom of God, which Jesus will set up at His second coming will mankind truly learn to love and respect each other.